15:49:19 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #mobile-a11y
15:49:19 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/11/20-mobile-a11y-irc
15:49:21 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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15:49:23 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAI_MATF
15:49:23 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_MATF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 11 minutes
15:49:24 <trackbot> Meeting: Mobile Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
15:49:24 <trackbot> Date: 20 November 2014
15:49:56 <Kim> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Nov/0010.html
15:50:25 <Kim> chair: Kimberly_Patch
15:51:52 <Kim> regrets+  Kathleen_Wahlbin, Tom_Babinszki, Gavin_Evans
15:56:06 <Kim> Agenda+ Q&A Note assignments / status
15:56:07 <Kim> Agenda+  Note framework – how it's shaping up so far
15:56:09 <Kim> Agenda+ Next Steps
15:59:00 <Zakim> WAI_MATF()11:00AM has now started
15:59:07 <Zakim> +Alan_Smith
15:59:15 <jeanne> jeanne has joined #mobile-a11y
15:59:23 <Zakim> +Kim_Patch
16:00:05 <Zakim> +Jeanne
16:01:14 <Jan> Jan has joined #mobile-a11y
16:02:17 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:03:07 <jon_avila> jon_avila has joined #mobile-a11y
16:03:23 <Zakim> -Alan_Smith
16:04:11 <Zakim> + +1.703.637.aaaa
16:04:23 <jon_avila> zakim, I am aaaa
16:04:23 <Zakim> +jon_avila; got it
16:04:51 <Zakim> +Alan_Smith
16:05:09 <Kim> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Note:_WCAG_2.0_and_Mobile#Resources
16:05:19 <Jan> zakim, [IPcaller] is really Jan
16:05:19 <Zakim> +Jan; got it
16:06:21 <jon_avila> scribe: jon_avila
16:06:37 <jon_avila> zakim, take up next
16:06:37 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Q&A Note assignments / status" taken up [from Kim]
16:07:02 <jon_avila> kp:  Are there any questions about the note and writing it in sections.
16:07:09 <jon_avila> alan: asked about purpose
16:07:52 <jon_avila> kp: Purpose is so instead of handing WCAG one piece -- we hand them our thinking in entirety of what is missing - this is the forest rather than an tree.  A better way to start.
16:08:17 <jon_avila> kp: It's a little more causal and explanatory.  Techniques would come out of this.  This will allow us to move forward faster.
16:09:00 <jon_avila> jan:  Question about perspective.  You say it will spot gaps.  The audience isn't WG members.  Instead this document is for mobile developers who want guidance and who don't see work mobile in title
16:09:37 <jon_avila> jan: This note says WCAG applies and  the principles apply and here is the explanation and that will lead WCAG WG to then build techniques into their document.
16:09:57 <jon_avila> kp: This would be a stand alone document that developers could use before its carried over into WCAG.
16:10:26 <jon_avila> jeanne: We actually do write techniques and associate them with this document and that will avoid some of the structural problems with fitting them into WCAG
16:11:06 <jon_avila> jeanne: Those structures have been constraining us.  E.g. This issue of sufficient or advisory.  I don't want all of our techniques to be labeled advisory which people see as optional just because there is not some place to plug them into WCAG.
16:11:35 <jon_avila> jeanne: WCAG WG is making their own progress in updating their documents.  Later our stuff can be rolled in WCAG documents.
16:12:00 <jon_avila> kp: wanted to point out resources on the WCAG note page under current work at top of main wiki page.
16:12:43 <jon_avila> kp: Discussion notes are ones we had before we started.  These map to survey and the survey number and how to link to the discussion notes.
16:13:12 <jon_avila> kp: If you are writing one of these sections and you want to go back and look at the discussions.
16:13:48 <jon_avila> kp: last link is survey we had on the mobile technique and gap analysis
16:14:39 <jon_avila> jeanne:  wrote introduction and added routine W3C things like abstract and status.
16:14:57 <jon_avila> jeanne: used WCAG ICT document as guideline
16:15:34 <jon_avila> jeanne: would like to position this document o mobile app even though WCAG only directly applies to web.  the WCAG ICT doc dealt with non-web things so we could use similar language
16:16:52 <jon_avila> jeanne: key things is 3rd paragraph.  Also discussed mobile web best practice documents.
16:17:14 <Zakim> -Alan_Smith
16:17:32 <jon_avila> jeanne: added UAAG applies to mobile also.  In particular the UAAG mobile examples document.  Will provide link.
16:18:01 <jon_avila> jeanne: This document talks about how these are informative not normative.
16:18:38 <jon_avila> jeanne: happy to have comments/edit, etc.
16:19:34 <jon_avila> kp: put comment at bottom of section with your name and date if you want to comment
16:19:39 <jon_avila> +1
16:20:24 <Zakim> +Alan_Smith
16:22:07 <jon_avila> jan: Worked on perceivable section.  Talked about small screen size.  e.g. adapting link text, etc. Might have 3 to 5 discussion areas under the principles.  We don't want to dilute what we are trying to say.
16:22:33 <jon_avila> jan: Add touch target size and keyboard control on mobile devices under operability.
16:23:23 <jon_avila> jan: Trying to call out WCAG SC when relevant in each place.  Also added changing screen orientation will go under perceivable.
16:23:36 <jon_avila> alan: looks good.
16:24:05 <jon_avila> jan: UAAG shows up a lot -- perhaps they could be combined.
16:24:15 <jon_avila> kp: Should we have references to WCAG and UAAG at teh bottom of each section?
16:24:48 <jon_avila> jan: Do like the idea of grounding what we are saying in these discussions.  Danger is that some that don't have SC will stand out more.
16:25:55 <jon_avila> jeanne: if we put reference directly in without a separate section it doesn't draw so much attend to places where we don't have a reference.
16:26:01 <jon_avila> kp: make references linked.
16:26:37 <Zakim> -Alan_Smith
16:27:00 <jon_avila> kp: Is there a way to open links in different window?
16:28:32 <jon_avila> kp: Like use of @@
16:29:22 <jon_avila> jeanne: Add idea of appendix for WCAG sc that apply.
16:29:25 <jon_avila> kp: Is at bottom
16:30:32 <jon_avila> kp: right now it points to the document that we did before for techniques that apply without changes.  Some changes may apply to make them more applicable.
16:31:16 <jon_avila> jeanne: allows us to show our work without being tied to WCAG publishing deadlines
16:31:19 <Tim> Tim has joined #mobile-a11y
16:31:51 <jon_avila> jeanne: like to be able to adapt the WCAG work to create the document.
16:32:16 <jon_avila> jan: concern is that when you click that link you get this big list.  Maybe flip question about what is not relevant.
16:32:41 <jon_avila> jan: some techniques numbers aren't in use.
16:33:07 <jon_avila> jeanne: agreed -- we want to think about appendix and success criteria and applicable links to techniques to avoid numbering issues.
16:33:21 <jon_avila> kp: mental map would be good with coding
16:34:31 <jon_avila> jan: also leery of saying something doesn't apply.
16:34:54 <jon_avila> jan: e.g. skip over links is not listed.
16:35:10 <jon_avila> kp: any other questions?
16:36:03 <jon_avila> kp: going forward with small changes.  Next time there will be more to talk about.  We will go down both tracks.
16:38:29 <jon_avila> kp: end meeting early.  Use time to work on doc.  Remember to use edit link right by your section to not tie up whole document for editing.
16:38:38 <jon_avila> zakim, list attendees
16:38:38 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Alan_Smith, Kim_Patch, Jeanne, +1.703.637.aaaa, jon_avila, Jan
16:38:48 <Zakim> -Jan
16:38:55 <jon_avila> rrsagent, make minutes
16:38:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/11/20-mobile-a11y-minutes.html jon_avila
16:38:57 <Zakim> -Jeanne
16:39:08 <jon_avila> kp: see you in two weeks
16:39:12 <Zakim> -Kim_Patch
16:39:24 <jon_avila> rrsagent, make minutes public
16:39:24 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minutes public', jon_avila.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
16:39:33 <jon_avila> rrsagent, make logs public
16:41:41 <jon_avila> zakim, bye
16:41:41 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were Alan_Smith, Kim_Patch, Jeanne, +1.703.637.aaaa, jon_avila, Jan
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