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13:58:46 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/20-ldp-irc
13:58:48 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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13:58:50 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be LDP
13:58:50 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
13:58:51 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference
13:58:51 <trackbot> Date: 20 October 2014
13:59:24 <Ashok> Ashok has joined #ldp
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14:00:31 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started
14:00:38 <Zakim> +Arnaud
14:00:40 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
14:00:58 <TallTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
14:00:58 <Zakim> +TallTed; got it
14:01:15 <TallTed> Zakim, mute me
14:01:15 <Zakim> TallTed should now be muted
14:01:34 <MiguelAraCo> MiguelAraCo has joined #ldp
14:02:02 <Zakim> +Ashok_Malhotra
14:02:13 <Zakim> +[IBM]
14:02:14 <Zakim> +JohnArwe
14:02:18 <SteveS> zakim, [IBM] is me
14:02:18 <Zakim> +SteveS; got it
14:03:49 <JohnArwe> regrets: azaroth, nandana, alexandre, andrei
14:05:26 <Zakim> +Roger
14:05:51 <TallTed> Zakim, unmute me
14:05:51 <Zakim> TallTed should no longer be muted
14:05:57 <roger> roger has joined #ldp
14:06:19 <TallTed> Zakim, unmute me
14:06:19 <Zakim> TallTed was not muted, TallTed
14:06:40 <Ashok> scribenick:  Ashok
14:06:54 <Ashok> scribe:  Ashok
14:07:09 <Arnaud> agenda: https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2014.10.20
14:07:26 <SteveS> JohnArwe, ok
14:07:34 <Ashok> Topic:  Approval of last weeks meeting
14:08:11 <Ashok> http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-10-13
14:08:37 <Zakim> +ericP
14:11:06 <Ashok> No objection.  Minutes approved.
14:11:11 <codyburleson> codyburleson has joined #ldp
14:11:16 <Ashok> Topic:  Next meeting
14:11:22 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:11:31 <codyburleson> Zakim, IPcaller is me.
14:11:31 <Zakim> +codyburleson; got it
14:11:43 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Let us skip next Monday due to TPAC.
14:11:52 <Ashok> ... next meeting Nov 3
14:12:31 <Ashok> Topic:  LDP Spec
14:12:47 <Ashok> Arnaud:  We have made progress on implementations
14:12:58 <Ashok> ... new report from Nandana
14:13:44 <Ashok> ... we have enough implementations of Basic and Direct Containers.
14:14:07 <Ashok> ... we have implementations of Indirect Container but all tests are not passed
14:14:20 <Ashok> Steve:  Those are manual tests
14:15:01 <Ashok> Arnaud:  I think we can proceed ...
14:15:36 <Ashok> Steve:  We need people to contribute tests ... esp. for Indirect Containers
14:15:59 <SteveS> Needs to be approved: http://w3c.github.io/ldp-testsuite/manifest/#tobeapproved
14:16:01 <Ashok> ... there is one test that has not been approved.  We shd approve that
14:17:08 <SteveS> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/raw-file/default/tests/reports/ldp.html#directcontainer-must
14:17:53 <Ashok> Shows 3 implementations passing this ... I think carbon will pass it also
14:18:09 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Let's approve this test
14:18:11 <Arnaud> Proposed: approve http://w3c.github.io/ldp-testsuite/manifest/#testActAsIfInsertedContentRelationTripleExists
14:18:17 <SteveS> +1
14:18:21 <roger> +1
14:18:23 <Ashok> +1
14:18:24 <TallTed> +1
14:18:31 <MiguelAraCo> +1
14:18:44 <Arnaud> Resolved: approve http://w3c.github.io/ldp-testsuite/manifest/#testActAsIfInsertedContentRelationTripleExists
14:19:07 <Ashok> RESOLVED:  Test approved ... pl. add to report
14:19:20 <Ashok> s/carbon/Carbon/
14:20:07 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Miguel pl. talk about the untested tests ... any progress
14:20:42 <Ashok> Miguel:  Working on it
14:20:47 <pchampin> pchampin has joined #ldp
14:21:13 <Arnaud> PROPOSED: move LDP spec to Proposed Recommendation
14:21:23 <SteveS> +1
14:21:24 <JohnArwe> +1
14:21:24 <codyburleson> +1
14:21:31 <TallTed> +1
14:21:33 <MiguelAraCo> +1
14:21:38 <Ashok> +1
14:21:57 <ericP> +1
14:22:23 <Arnaud> RESOLVED: move LDP spec to Proposed Recommendation
14:22:23 <Ashok> Arnaud:  We do not pull out Indirect Container which was marked "at risk"
14:22:25 <Zakim> +??P17
14:22:31 <JohnArwe> list from CR spec: The following features are At Risk:
14:22:31 <JohnArwe>     The HTTP Accept-Post header, that allows clients to determine which media types a server accepts on POST requests.
14:22:31 <JohnArwe>     The requirement that LDP clients be paging-aware.
14:22:31 <JohnArwe>     JSON-LD as a required response representation and new member representation.
14:22:32 <JohnArwe>     Support for indirect containers.
14:23:18 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Do we have 2 implementations of Accept-Post
14:23:29 <Ashok> Steve:  Yes, we do
14:23:40 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Accept-Post is in
14:23:56 <Ashok> ... Paging Aware?
14:25:17 <Ashok> Steve:  We says server cannot nitiate paging unless clients are paging aware
14:25:44 <Ashok> s/nitiate/initiate/
14:26:07 <Ashok> Arnaud:  It puts a normative reference on the Paging Spec
14:27:10 <Ashok> Discussion of referencing a spec that is a step behind
14:28:39 <Arnaud> PROPOSED: drop feature at risk section 4.3.1.14
14:28:46 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Remove section 4.3.1.14 ?
14:28:55 <SteveS> +1
14:29:02 <roger> +1
14:29:08 <JohnArwe> +1 decouple them KISS
14:29:11 <Arnaud> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/raw-file/default/ldp.html#atrisk-paging
14:29:39 <Ashok> +1
14:29:42 <pchampin> +1
14:29:49 <Arnaud> ericP: +1
14:29:56 <codyburleson> 0
14:30:04 <Arnaud> RESOLVED: drop feature at risk section 4.3.1.14
14:30:21 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Next is JSON-LD
14:30:30 <Ashok> Steve:  We have 2 implementations
14:31:14 <Ashok> Arnaud:  So no problem
14:31:24 <MiguelAraCo> q+
14:31:35 <Ashok> EricP:  Asks about details of JSON-LD support
14:31:49 <Arnaud> ack MiguelAraCo
14:32:21 <Zakim> + +33.6.47.14.aaaa
14:32:43 <bblfish> zakim, aaaa is me
14:32:43 <Zakim> +bblfish; got it
14:34:15 <codyburleson>  4.3.2.2 LDP servers should respond with a text/turtle representation of the requested LDP-RS whenever the Accept request header is absent [turtle].
14:34:21 <MiguelAraCo> Miguel: We would like to have JSON-LD as the default format (when an Accept header is missing)
14:35:09 <codyburleson> Got it - SHOULD. We're OK then. Thanks.
14:36:04 <Ashok> Arnaud:  We have decided to move the LDP spec to PR
14:36:17 <JohnArwe>             and this is reflected in the language of the bullets.  If an implementation were to extend LDP by allowing the
14:36:17 <JohnArwe>                 interaction model to vary after creation, that is viewed as a compatible extension to LDP and the statements
14:36:17 <JohnArwe>                 above would constrain the default interaction model rather than saying that no other behavior is possib
14:37:33 <SteveS> http://www.w3.org/2013/TurtleReports/index.html
14:37:58 <Ashok> Steve:  The test suite says unofficial draft
14:38:09 <MiguelAraCo> @JohnArwe Yeah I think that would work for us.
14:38:36 <codyburleson> Steve, in 4.3.2.2, why is "should" not in upper case as usual?
14:38:44 <bblfish> there is the official Turtle recommondation here http://www.w3.org/TR/turtle/
14:38:55 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Remove Unofficial Report
14:38:56 <Zakim> -ericP
14:39:21 <Zakim> +ericP
14:39:23 <codyburleson> Nevermind, Steve.
14:39:54 <Arnaud> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp/2014Oct/0002.html
14:40:05 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Talks about disposition of comments ... comment from Reto Gmur
14:40:43 <Ashok> ... need to fix the document
14:42:05 <bblfish> q+
14:42:20 <Ashok> Topic:  Paging
14:43:02 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Discusses comments on Paging spec
14:44:02 <Ashok> ... is it fair to say no active objections
14:45:13 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
14:46:08 <Ashok> Henry:  How to do a PUT on a file that does not exist ... section 4.4.6
14:46:23 <Ashok> ... conditional PUTs to CREATE
14:46:50 <Ashok> John:  HTTP discusses this so we do not
14:47:13 <Ashok> Henry:  If there is an obvious answer we should add it.
14:47:33 <Arnaud>  PROPOSED: Move LDP Paging spec to Candidate Recommendation
14:47:41 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Perhaps in Best Practices ... Henry pl. send mail to list
14:47:49 <codyburleson> 0
14:48:00 <JohnArwe> +1
14:48:02 <SteveS> +1
14:48:06 <pchampin> 0
14:48:12 <Ashok> 0
14:48:16 <ericP> +1
14:48:20 <TallTed> +0
14:48:39 <Arnaud> RESOLVED: Move LDP Paging spec to Candidate Recommendation
14:48:58 <Ashok> q+
14:49:15 <Arnaud> ack Ashok
14:51:02 <SteveS> q+
14:51:12 <Arnaud> ack SteveS
14:51:44 <Ashok> Oracle specs all use client-based paging
14:52:19 <Ashok> Steve:  We have one implementation
14:52:32 <codyburleson> Position from Carbon team: We haven't "lost" interest in paging so much as - we just haven't had time to get to it yet. We've been frying what we perceive to be as "bigger fish".
14:53:00 <SteveS> We already have an implementation that I know of, we plan to work on test stuite and ref impls
14:53:24 <Ashok> Topic:  Rechartering
14:53:25 <SteveS> codyburleson, guess the “bigger fish” isn’t big enough to need to be paged ;)
14:53:48 <Ashok> Arnaud:  WG Charter expires Dec 1 ... we should create a new charter
14:53:58 <Arnaud> https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/LDPNext2015_Charter
14:54:10 <Ashok> ... here is a draft
14:55:25 <SteveS> “7. How can a client specify the size of a page when paging?” is already covered by ldp-paging spec
14:55:42 <Ashok> Please look at scope and comment
14:57:18 <SteveS> Need to fix names: “Linked Data Paging” -> “Linked Data Platform Paging”
14:58:41 <SteveS> q+
14:59:35 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Proposal is for a new WG to start dec/jan for 2 years
14:59:42 <Arnaud> ack SteveS
15:00:27 <Ashok> Steve:  Perhaps a new kind of container?
15:01:45 <Ashok> Arnaud:  Discussion about producing "mini-specs"
15:01:59 <Ashok> ... please send comments to the list
15:02:17 <Zakim> -Roger
15:02:19 <Zakim> -TallTed
15:02:19 <Zakim> -bblfish
15:02:21 <Zakim> -codyburleson
15:02:21 <Zakim> -SteveS
15:02:22 <Zakim> -JohnArwe
15:02:22 <Zakim> -Arnaud
15:02:32 <Zakim> -ericP
15:02:39 <Ashok> Congratulations on moving LDP Spec to PR ... only 6 months behind schedule :-)
15:02:45 <Zakim> -Ashok_Malhotra
15:35:01 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, pchampin, in SW_LDP()10:00AM
15:35:02 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended
15:35:02 <Zakim> Attendees were Arnaud, TallTed, Ashok_Malhotra, JohnArwe, SteveS, Roger, ericP, codyburleson, pchampin, +33.6.47.14.aaaa, bblfish
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