IRC log of mobile-a11y on 2014-08-21

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:36:29 [RRSAgent]: RRSAgent has joined #mobile-a11y
14:36:29 [RRSAgent]: logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/08/21-mobile-a11y-irc
14:36:31 [trackbot]: RRSAgent, make logs public
14:36:31 [Zakim]: Zakim has joined #mobile-a11y
14:36:33 [trackbot]: Zakim, this will be WAI_MATF
14:36:33 [Zakim]: ok, trackbot; I see WAI_MATF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 24 minutes
14:36:34 [trackbot]: Meeting: Mobile Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
14:36:34 [trackbot]: Date: 21 August 2014
14:36:52 [KimPatch]: chair: Kimberly_Patch
14:37:37 [KimPatch]: agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Aug/0017.html
14:37:54 [KimPatch]: agenda?
14:38:11 [KimPatch]: Agenda+ Techniques resources review: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Techniques_Resources
14:38:12 [KimPatch]: Agenda+ Looking at the first techniques examples: G10, G88…
14:38:14 [KimPatch]: Agenda+ Techniques assignments
14:38:15 [KimPatch]: Agenda+ Next Steps – the next meeting will be Thursday, August 28 at 11 AM Eastern
14:51:56 [Detlev]: Detlev has joined #mobile-a11y
14:55:27 [Zakim]: WAI_MATF()11:00AM has now started
14:55:34 [Zakim]: +Kim_Patch
14:59:57 [KimPatch]: Regrets+ Jan_Richards, Alan_Smith, Tom_Babinszki
15:00:41 [Zakim]: +Detlev
15:01:09 [jon_avila]: jon_avila has joined #mobile-a11y
15:02:11 [Zakim]: +Jeanne
15:04:25 [Zakim]: +??P9
15:04:38 [jon_avila]: zakim, I am p9
15:04:38 [Zakim]: sorry, jon_avila, I do not see a party named 'p9'
15:04:44 [jon_avila]: zakim, I am ??P9
15:04:44 [Zakim]: +jon_avila; got it
15:07:32 [KimPatch]: take up next
15:07:51 [KimPatch]: zakim, take up next
15:07:51 [Zakim]: agendum 1. "Techniques resources review: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Techniques_Resources" taken up [from KimPatch]
15:10:42 [jeanne]: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Technique_Development_Assignments
15:20:41 [KimPatch]: Talking about procedure, make changes clear on the changes page. On the technique development assignments page, fill in unassigned with your name, and when they are ready, change "incomplete" to "unchanged" or "complete".
15:21:49 [KimPatch]: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G10
15:25:01 [KimPatch]: Jeanne going through G10, which needed a new example – turned out to be more complicated than it looked
15:25:49 [KimPatch]: Detlev: example seems quite technical, for everyone but an iOS programmer it might not mean much
15:26:09 [KimPatch]: Jeanne: good feedback – really it needs completely different example
15:27:35 [KimPatch]: Detlev: need to know that coded so ActiveX controls pass on name role state whatever to API. So we need some example that replicates that idea in the mobile space – this might not be the best one. I'm not sure about environments for test on mobile phones.
15:28:01 [jeanne]: ... needs to refer to accessibility test tools that the user could use
15:29:11 [KimPatch]: Detlev: I think it would have to refer to tools – I'm not quite sure about whether the techniques would cover mobile web as much as native development, and this is a bit unclear to me so far. I think we aim to cover both but focus on the mobile web, but for this technique I wouldn't quite know what example to pick – maybe throw to other people
15:30:28 [jeanne]: RESOLUTION: Reject this proposed example and delay this Technique until we gain more experience. There are complex technical issues
15:30:46 [KimPatch]: Detlev: There are toolboxes where you can create things quickly, they might not work properly with the mobile APIs in question – that would be a good thing to check. But someone else is the phrase that are find a good example for that
15:31:25 [jon_avila]: q+
15:33:17 [KimPatch]: Jon: even if we were to come up with another example, say for iOS, custom control – the really isn't quite a one to one relationship between the desktop world and the mobile world. Flash is available on some android devices, but it's really going away. The closest thing as a hybrid app, but it would be confusing to use that.
15:34:11 [KimPatch]: Detlev: the existing examples here are positive examples, written in line with existing APIs. If it's a positive example may be some app that's written in line with Apple accessibility guidelines for mobile apps and that's it – don't know whether the technique means necessarily means only components which are embedded in, say web technologies or whether we can talk about say native...
15:34:12 [KimPatch]: ...constructs whic
15:34:14 [KimPatch]: h are written according to the accessibility API, but that may be redundant – I'm not sure that that makes sense
15:34:53 [KimPatch]: Jon: to me it seems like it really is talking about the user agent running it, and I'm not sure we really have a good example that exposes platform level API to a user agent. Maybe something like PDF
15:35:30 [KimPatch]: Detlev: wwould it be good example to have browsers passing on names, roles, states of active elements
15:35:58 [KimPatch]: Jon: until we can find an example where works correctly, I don't think we should imply that there might be one – may be just it's not supported on mobile at this time
15:36:29 [KimPatch]: next step is to find an example?
15:40:49 [KimPatch]: Jon: mobile task force is exploring finding techniques – is there such a thing. Might be good to ask more widely as an exploratory information gathering
15:41:17 [KimPatch]: Jon: I can ask around
15:42:08 [jeanne]: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G88
15:46:41 [KimPatch]: Detlev: could be other examples where there's a rewriting of a title so you replace short title with long version, whether it's reordered in the Dom, you could also change the title if you want to. The example should probably show a range of options and think about the case where a website is constrained to a very narrow viewport and the solutions may be manifold, maybe change title for a...
15:46:43 [KimPatch]: ...dedicated mobile version, maybe a title that suffers truncated and well, maybe a rewritten title – those are examples that come to mind
15:48:05 [KimPatch]: Detlev: also with the example if it's a the dedicated mobile site that should be clear, so it's specific content and specifically to a narrow viewport, if that's what you mean. So for that just pick a short title and that's it. If you have responsive web design you might do something else
15:49:16 [KimPatch]: Detlev: I wonder for a general technique if it's going to far down into technologies – too specific for a general technique, I'm worried about that. so maybe the way you put it is good – maybe everything else is down to more specific HTML or scripting techniques.
15:49:31 [KimPatch]: Jeanne: would you put a reference to a more detailed technique
15:49:54 [KimPatch]: Detlev: yes – could be other techniques like a scripting technique for detecting a breakpoint and changing the page title. There may be even other techniques which fit the bill
15:50:44 [KimPatch]: Detlev: need to research how people do titles and responsive web design
15:50:50 [jon_avila]: * I have to go pick up my children from camp -- so I need to jump off.
15:51:20 [Zakim]: -jon_avila
15:51:22 [KimPatch]: Jeanne: how are we going to track these things that need more work later
15:52:17 [KimPatch]: Detlev: we could pencil them in and have other people comment whether there are existing examples – a rough title draft and put it in there and see whether anyone thinks it's something we need to pick up and work out
15:54:52 [jeanne]: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/New_WCAG_2.0_Techniques
15:56:59 [jeanne]: The proposed new techniques need short names so they are easier to read.
16:03:15 [Zakim]: -Detlev
16:13:48 [jeanne]: q- jeanne
16:13:53 [jeanne]: q- jon
16:13:59 [jeanne]: rrsagent, make minutes
16:13:59 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/21-mobile-a11y-minutes.html jeanne
16:14:39 [KimPatch]: present:
16:14:50 [KimPatch]: present:
16:15:18 [jeanne]: present: Detlev, Jeanne, Jon, Kim
16:15:26 [jeanne]: Chair: Kim
16:15:49 [Zakim]: -Kim_Patch
16:15:53 [Zakim]: -Jeanne
16:15:54 [Zakim]: WAI_MATF()11:00AM has ended
16:15:54 [Zakim]: Attendees were Kim_Patch, Detlev, Jeanne, jon_avila
16:16:42 [KimPatch]: rrsagent, bye
16:16:42 [RRSAgent]: I see no action items