15:20:24 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #coga
15:20:24 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/08/11-coga-irc
15:20:32 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, this will be  WAI_CogTF
15:20:32 <Zakim> ok, Lisa_Seeman; I see WAI_CogTF()12:00PM scheduled to start in 40 minutes
15:23:19 <Lisa_Seeman> regrets: Joseph K O'Connor,Kinshuk, Barry Johnson
15:25:04 <Lisa_Seeman>  agenda: this
15:25:05 <Lisa_Seeman>    agenda+ TPAC: http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/
15:25:07 <Lisa_Seeman>    agenda+ update on first editors draft of gap analysis : https://w3c.github.io/wcag/coga/gap-analysis.html
15:25:08 <Lisa_Seeman>    agenda+ Check if extra "to do"  items are needed  to integrate that specific research. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2014Jul/0071.html
15:25:10 <Lisa_Seeman>    agenda+ Review open action
15:25:11 <Lisa_Seeman>    agenda+ Decide on what extra pieces will go into second editors draft of the gap analysis
15:25:13 <Lisa_Seeman>    agenda+ be done
15:52:36 <Zakim> WAI_CogTF()12:00PM has now started
15:52:43 <Zakim> +??P4
15:54:35 <JohnRochford> JohnRochford has joined #coga
15:54:50 <EA> EA has joined #coga
15:55:14 <Zakim> +JohnRochford
15:55:52 <KateDeibel> KateDeibel has joined #coga
15:55:53 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, ??P4 is me
15:55:53 <Zakim> +Lisa_Seeman; got it
15:56:38 <richardschwerdtfeger> richardschwerdtfeger has joined #coga
15:57:05 <Lisa_Seeman> regrets: Steve Lee
15:57:44 <Zakim> +??P0
15:57:47 <KateDeibel> zakim, ??P0
15:57:47 <Zakim> I don't understand '??P0', KateDeibel
15:57:54 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:57:56 <Lisa_Seeman> regrets: Deborah Dahl
15:58:02 <KateDeibel> zakim, P0
15:58:02 <Zakim> I don't understand 'P0', KateDeibel
15:58:10 <Zakim> +Rich_Schwerdtfeger
15:58:12 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, ??P0 is KateDeibel
15:58:12 <Zakim> +KateDeibel; got it
15:58:15 <KateDeibel> zakim, ??P0 is me
15:58:15 <Zakim> I already had ??P0 as KateDeibel, KateDeibel
15:58:44 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, +[IPcaller] is EA
15:58:44 <Zakim> sorry, Lisa_Seeman, I do not recognize a party named '+[IPcaller]'
15:59:15 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, [IPcaller] is EA
15:59:15 <Zakim> +EA; got it
16:00:13 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, next item
16:00:13 <Zakim> agendum 1. "TPAC: http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/" taken up [from Lisa_Seeman]
16:00:15 <janina> zakim, call janina-mobile
16:00:15 <Zakim> ok, janina; the call is being made
16:00:16 <Zakim> +Janina
16:01:06 <janina> zakim, mute me
16:01:06 <Zakim> Janina should now be muted
16:01:22 <janina> zakim, mute me
16:01:22 <Zakim> Janina was already muted, janina
16:01:29 <Zakim> +Cooper
16:01:34 <Lisa_Seeman> scribe: KateDeibel
16:02:18 <Lisa_Seeman> http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/
16:03:31 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, next item
16:03:31 <Zakim> agendum 2. "update on first editors draft of gap analysis : https://w3c.github.io/wcag/coga/gap-analysis.html" taken up [from Lisa_Seeman]
16:03:41 <KateDeibel> Lisa reminded folks of going to TPAC if they can
16:03:53 <KateDeibel> http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/
16:04:39 <Lisa_Seeman> https://w3c.github.io/wcag/coga/gap-analysis.html
16:04:40 <KateDeibel> MichaelC discusses comments on first editors draft.
16:04:54 <KateDeibel> We generated 100 pages, but is it achieving the right goal
16:05:11 <Zakim> +Susann_Keohane
16:05:24 <Lisa_Seeman> https://w3c.github.io/wcag/coga/gap-analysis.html
16:05:38 <KateDeibel> We might need to change the document, break into multiple documents, search for overlap, etc.
16:05:46 <Lisa_Seeman> q+
16:06:06 <Susann_Keohane> Susann_Keohane has joined #coga
16:06:43 <KateDeibel> Some references are cited, some are further reading. We might need to filter. (Different section refs have not been consolidated).
16:08:14 <KateDeibel> Our document is deepy structured (too deep in headings)
16:08:40 <EA> It seems to have the original versions of Aphasia and non-vocal rather than the combined document - this thankfully could reduce it a bit!!  I have to say it is very long and repetitive.
16:09:30 <KateDeibel> JohnRochford: Expecting lots of redundances will be removed once the weeding is done
16:10:02 <Zakim> +NeilMilliken
16:10:14 <EA> Yes I agree we should all follow a common template
16:10:20 <richardschwerdtfeger> q+
16:10:21 <EA> ditto
16:10:35 <neilmilliken> neilmilliken has joined #coga
16:10:39 <KateDeibel> MichaelC: Template was deviated. Wants permission to be an editor and restructure.
16:11:27 <simpleirc1> simpleirc1 has joined #coga
16:12:19 <Tony_Doran> Tony_Doran has joined #coga
16:12:43 <Tony_Doran> Apologies for being tardy - headset not working. Still no audio.
16:13:10 <EA> Big difference between use cases and user groups... which one do you want?
16:14:57 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:15:31 <EA> Are they all medical?  Dyslexia does not fit that title - more functional?
16:16:42 <KateDeibel> richardschwe...: this draft lacks a gap analysis... is more of a coverage of medical conditions. backgrounds may need to move to a separate document/appendix
16:18:22 <KateDeibel> EA: concerns about medical term... it's not a fully appropriate as the terminology does not readily apply to functional conditions.
16:18:24 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:19:18 <KateDeibel> q+
16:20:23 <KateDeibel> lisa: suggests that if we want to eventually restructure to focus more on table of cognitive issue / access issue, then we may not need to worry too much on restructuring this draft now
16:20:33 <MichaelC> q+ to talk about how to edit from here
16:20:42 <KateDeibel> lisa: ADD section/executive not yet approved by WG
16:20:59 <KateDeibel> lisa: vision document is not yet in
16:21:05 <Zakim> +??P2
16:21:12 <Zakim> -Cooper
16:22:52 <KateDeibel> michael: getting references into right format is required for this draft
16:24:54 <KateDeibel> michael: super huge appendix is a problem
16:25:19 <KateDeibel> richard...: make this a research document and do gap analysis elsewhere?
16:26:28 <richardschwerdtfeger> q?
16:26:33 <richardschwerdtfeger> ack richardschwerdtfeger
16:26:34 <Lisa_Seeman> aka lisa
16:26:38 <Lisa_Seeman> aka kate
16:26:48 <Lisa_Seeman> aka rich
16:27:26 <MichaelC> q+ to say big research dod is ok; gap analysis that leads to guidelines proposals should be more digestible
16:27:28 <MichaelC> ack l
16:27:30 <MichaelC> ack k
16:27:32 <MichaelC> ack r
16:30:27 <KateDeibel> KateDeibel: concerns about functions and their interactions, what does it bring into consumable bits (too simplified concerns).
16:31:57 <KateDeibel> Lisa: summary of kate's comments: people do not know this user group and we need to fight that
16:31:57 <MichaelC> q+ to talk about realistic expectations of audience
16:32:23 <Tim> Tim has joined #coga
16:33:10 <KateDeibel> lisa: suggestion: for now, make the table. summary of user groups, gap analysis, then background research. avoid getting them lost in the research
16:33:24 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:34:04 <Zakim> +Tim_Boland
16:34:13 <Lisa_Seeman> http://accessibility.athena-ict.com/cognativefunction.shtml
16:36:01 <KateDeibel> michaelc: we might still need to break into separate comments
16:36:49 <KateDeibel> michaelc: people are not going to read a book and this is currently a book. put the easier digestible first
16:36:52 <EA> I really do agree with what Michael is saying - no developer is going to last the course with this one!!! :>))
16:37:25 <neilmilliken> They are less interested in the reasons why than what guidance we can give
16:37:29 <Zakim> +Tony_Doran
16:38:07 <Tony_Doran> Tony_Doran has joined #coga
16:38:27 <EA> agree
16:38:33 <neilmilliken> Agree
16:38:41 <JohnRochford> agree
16:38:42 <Tim> +1
16:38:45 <Lisa_Seeman> proposal: move reserch section after proposals sections
16:39:13 <KateDeibel> lisa: proposal move research section after gap analysis.
16:39:35 <Lisa_Seeman> resrve the right to move it to serate doc later
16:41:35 <KateDeibel> michael: make a TOC first, continue editing/futzing, or do restructuring now (or some combo thereof)
16:43:42 <KateDeibel> Lisa's suggestion: lisa will write TOC and send to group while Michael does his edit round
16:44:06 <Lisa_Seeman> action : lisa to write toc for editors draft
16:44:06 <trackbot> Created ACTION-32 - Write toc for editors draft [on Lisa Seeman - due 2014-08-18].
16:45:46 <KateDeibel> michael: logistics editing question: porting over a new thing is easier, but if an edit occurs, then those edits are tricky. wiki editing/w3c document editing are hard to keep in parallel
16:46:35 <neilmilliken> q+
16:46:44 <janina> janina has joined #coga
16:47:16 <MichaelC> ack me
16:47:16 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to talk about how to edit from here and to say big research dod is ok; gap analysis that leads to guidelines proposals should be more digestible and to talk
16:47:19 <Zakim> ... about realistic expectations of audience
16:47:22 <Zakim> +??P5
16:47:34 <janina> zakim, ??P5 is me
16:47:34 <Zakim> +janina; got it
16:47:41 <Lisa_Seeman> ack neil
16:47:49 <janina> zakim, drop janina-mobile
16:47:49 <Zakim> sorry, janina, I do not see a party named 'janina-mobile'
16:48:08 <janina> zakim, who's on the phone?
16:48:08 <Zakim> On the phone I see Lisa_Seeman, JohnRochford, KateDeibel, EA, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Janina (muted), Susann_Keohane, NeilMilliken, Michael_Cooper, Tim_Boland, Tony_Doran, janina
16:48:58 <janina> zakim, drop Janina
16:48:58 <Zakim> 'Janina' is ambiguous, janina
16:51:22 <KateDeibel> lisa: proposal: we have people tell us when they have edits to sections in the W3C document, but wiki is fine for new sections
16:51:29 <Zakim> -Janina
16:51:46 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:51:54 <Zakim> -JohnRochford
16:53:45 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:54:15 <KateDeibel> lisa: who can write the table?
16:54:44 <Lisa_Seeman> well , once we have agreed that we need it we will ask for a voleteer
16:54:59 <Lisa_Seeman> (if not i can make it)
16:56:26 <KateDeibel> richard...: we will need cognitive issue and solutions... needs to be very concrete for developers to use
16:57:19 <EA> Please can I say they may not be solutions but strategies
16:57:31 <neilmilliken> the gap analysis comes first
16:57:45 <KateDeibel> lisa: is gap analysis about identifying gaps or identifying solutions?
16:57:54 <neilmilliken> then you address the gaps with specifications and recommendations
16:58:25 <Lisa_Seeman> Q?
16:58:42 <KateDeibel> rich...: suggestions/recs for filling gaps or where do we need to create a new standard, but we need to provide a starting strategy
16:59:26 <KateDeibel> lisa: we need to look at current technologies and do reviews
16:59:51 <Lisa_Seeman> q?
16:59:56 <janina> +1 to considering all W3C emerging specs, i.e. IndieUI
17:00:03 <Zakim> -Rich_Schwerdtfeger
17:00:22 <KateDeibel> lisa: we need volunteers for those tech reviews
17:00:37 <janina> janina has left #coga
17:00:44 <Zakim> -janina
17:00:49 <Zakim> -Michael_Cooper
17:01:04 <KateDeibel> lisa: will ping ADD group
17:01:18 <Zakim> -Susann_Keohane
17:01:21 <Zakim> -NeilMilliken
17:01:22 <Zakim> -Tim_Boland
17:01:34 <EA> thank you.. have to go..
17:01:45 <Lisa_Seeman> rrsagent, make logs public
17:01:53 <Lisa_Seeman> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:01:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/11-coga-minutes.html Lisa_Seeman
17:01:54 <Zakim> -EA
17:02:01 <Lisa_Seeman> zakim, please part
17:02:01 <Zakim> Zakim has left #coga
17:02:01 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were JohnRochford, Lisa_Seeman, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, KateDeibel, EA, Janina, Cooper, Susann_Keohane, NeilMilliken, Michael_Cooper,
17:02:01 <Zakim> ... Tim_Boland, Tony_Doran
17:02:07 <Lisa_Seeman> rrsagent, please part
17:02:07 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/11-coga-actions.rdf :
17:02:07 <RRSAgent> ACTION: lisa to write toc for editors draft [1]
17:02:07 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/11-coga-irc#T16-44-06