12:50:47 RRSAgent has joined #ld4lt 12:50:47 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-irc 12:51:02 chair: Dave lewis 12:51:08 present+ DaveLewis 12:51:38 Meeting: LD4LT community group call 12:51:50 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ld4lt/2014Jul/0028.html 12:54:02 present+ fsasaki 12:55:04 present+ tlfati 12:55:07 present+ tflati 12:55:17 present- tlfati 12:58:47 Ali_h_vahid has joined #ld4lt 13:00:04 jgracia has joined #ld4lt 13:00:48 chriLi has joined #ld4lt 13:00:48 pennyl has joined #ld4lt 13:00:53 Tcarrasco has joined #ld4lt 13:00:59 rnavigli has joined #ld4lt 13:01:57 present+ chriLi 13:02:21 Victor has joined #ld4lt 13:03:05 tflati has joined #ld4lt 13:03:07 present+ Ali_H_Vahid 13:03:38 renat has joined #ld4lt 13:03:40 present+ renat 13:03:45 present+ rnavigli 13:03:46 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ld4lt/2014Jul/0028.html 13:03:49 present+ tflati 13:03:51 topic: call intro 13:04:04 scribe: tflati 13:04:31 topic: actions 13:04:38 tflati_ has joined #ld4lt 13:04:40 action-11? 13:04:40 action-11 -- David Lewis to Gather info on how to provide more detailed mapping from meta-share to dcat -- due 2014-07-24 -- OPEN 13:04:40 http://www.w3.org/community/ld4lt/track/actions/11 13:04:52 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ld4lt/2014Jul/0033.html 13:04:52 present+ tflati 13:04:55 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 13:05:13 present+ jgacia 13:05:28 http://www.w3.org/TR/vocab-dcat/#vocabulary-overview 13:05:34 Dave: there are still 3 points left to discuss from the META-SHARE metamodel 13:05:46 present+ victor, serge 13:06:00 present+ penny 13:06:14 present+ Tcarrasco 13:06:32 https://www.w3.org/community/ld4lt/wiki/DCAT_MetaShare_Mapping#Make_LanguageResource_a_DCAT_Dataset 13:06:33 dave: dataset corresponds closely with language resource 13:06:38 present+ martha 13:06:41 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 13:07:11 dave: some of some metashare properties could be replaced by some dcat properties 13:07:38 geographic coverage, time coverage, etc. they all have a corresponding property 13:07:58 penny: about making the language resource 13:08:45 penny: ms already have a distribution module 13:09:30 penny: for example the download URL, etc. 13:10:41 dave: how deep should the separation be made? Are you trying to encourage more than just separation? 13:11:06 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 13:11:21 q+ 13:11:27 penny: at the conceptual level, i think that usually there are different forms with different licenses 13:11:41 Zakim has joined #ld4lt 13:11:47 q+ Tcarrasco 13:11:51 penny: frequently diferent distributions in MS are simply same resource under different licensees 13:12:10 victor: but they should both allow for distribution 13:13:29 penny: at least now there is a mix up with dublin core etc. 13:15:35 dave: we covered both the two points about DCAT 13:17:12 Data access: record vs. database - URI local vs. remote (file and http schemes) 13:18:11 penny: i never used SKOS concepts, but I have it like for any classification schema 13:18:26 not sure how SKOS deals with different dimensions of classification 13:19:13 we had also a discussion with Marta about subclasses of Corpus and there is no consensus about lexicon or other things, depending several criteria 13:19:29 the linguality dimension (mono-, bi-, multi-lingual) 13:19:42 the media type of Corpus (audio, text, etc.) 13:19:57 one could end up with different taxonomies depending on the used criteria 13:20:35 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ld4lt/2014Jul/0024.html 13:21:32 dave: there is not a good model of what a schema should be. Hard to say in a definitive way what is a subclass of what. 13:22:05 roberto: when we encoded babelnet, we had the issue to see various options. For us SKOS is okay, up to a certain extent 13:22:16 if you're interested in just a taxonomy SKOS is okay 13:22:44 otherwise if you want better relations, SKOS might be limited 13:24:13 we just decided to reduce the granularity of the relations 13:24:33 we kept the narrower and broader properties for the taxonomic aspect 13:24:42 and related for all other properties 13:25:15 jgracia: I think that META-SHARE does not need more expressive properties than those 13:25:28 Roberto: in this way we also limit variability 13:25:44 penny: SKOS should be okay 13:26:38 dave: moving this forward, do we want to separate 13:27:07 penny: text type, genre, video type would be perfect for the SKOS schema, we could add to them 13:27:31 dave: yes, i agree. it is part of the issue. There is an involving consensus for the definition of the core 13:27:53 action: penny to capture list of parameters that may be relevant for a skos classification 13:27:53 Created ACTION-12 - Capture list of parameters that may be relevant for a skos classification [on Penny Labropoulou - due 2014-08-07]. 13:29:09 jgracia: the added value of using SKOS rather than OWL? 13:29:15 dave: you can use both 13:29:16 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 13:30:22 sometimes one is not sure whether something is strictly a subclass of what 13:30:51 action: pennyl to identify which properties and classes could move to a skos-based conceptual schema 13:30:51 Error finding 'pennyl'. You can review and register nicknames at . 13:30:58 jorge: narrower could be interpreted in a more loose sense, without being that strict 13:31:11 present+ pennyl 13:31:25 so more flexibility in SKOS not commiting to OWL semantics 13:31:29 topic: meta-share discussion 13:32:04 ack T 13:32:32 thomas: the access of a record vs. the whole database 13:32:45 and also the aspect of the access to the schema 13:33:16 these two aspects have to be considered, also 13:33:25 dave: this should be included in the distribution module 13:33:43 because it depends on the media type you are using 13:34:08 for example if you have a TM you could use a fragment identifier to make the work easily 13:35:33 thomas: if data can be downloaded, the distribution aspect breaks up because from the application point of view everything is a URI 13:36:11 penny: this also connects to waht i was discussing with Marta: language resource taxonomy 13:36:34 the 4 classes of Corpus 13:36:56 and also a second dimension: the media of resource types 13:37:10 to MS these are not really subclasses, rather they are parts of a corpus 13:37:18 that is the reason we called text corpus 13:37:44 the idea is that you try to put information that describes better the dimension of the corpus into a text file 13:38:23 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 13:38:59 we might add another class, multilingualcorpus 13:39:13 the relation subclass should be ispartof, actually 13:39:35 should be "contains" 13:39:53 dave: in DCAT you have a Dataset which can have multiple distributions 13:40:09 We should use the Media Types terminology http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/media-types.xhtml 13:40:12 a dataset if a collection of one or more resources 13:40:38 we might need to use "contains" or "collection" 13:40:44 of the dcterms collection 13:40:56 for container of different resources 13:41:22 marta: it was not my fault to introduce these classes 13:42:11 the parts should not be seen as collection, but just as a model of having different media types 13:42:18 not different files 13:43:20 Multilingual Dataset Format (muset) - http://dragoman.org/muset 13:43:29 the corpus is something, how you physically store it is another thing 13:43:45 this has nothing to do with the implementation/format of your dataset 13:44:25 dave: terminology is important, one could easily misunderstanf 13:45:15 thomas: we should use the existing media type terminology 13:45:23 for example text would be "plain" 13:45:54 otherwise we have to reinvent it 13:45:54 I have to leave ... 13:46:45 we should build on top of IANA 13:47:07 penny: text is "text", not "plain" 13:47:28 in the upper level 13:50:13 according to http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/media-types.xhtm is "plain text" called "plain" - 13:50:35 "text" is a whole category - http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/media-types.xhtml#text 13:52:50 I have problems in my internet connection, could you scribe at my place for the next few moments, please? 13:55:27 marta: describes strategy on mapping elements of original meta-share schema into RDF 13:55:49 in http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5147 is called "text/plain" 13:56:16 .. in response to vistors question on whther to include 'flat' license attributes in current model, or structure these in ODRL 13:57:45 jorge: this is slightly different from victors questions, since ODRL can represent rules that cannot be represented from the current properties 13:58:01 marta: asks difference between cc model and odrl 13:58:06 I am back, thanks dave 13:58:39 victor: odrl is more expressive and extensible 13:59:19 scribe: tflati 13:59:37 victor: maybe not complete, but extensible and flexible for sure 14:01:08 you have a nice example of ODRL & MS here https://www.w3.org/community/ld4lt/wiki/Licensing_information 14:01:36 victor: the same resource could have different permissions, depending on the distribution media 14:02:35 jorge: as for me it is complicated to represent this in ODRL (but only for the machine) and can be done only once 14:02:43 victor: i completely agree 14:03:38 but with content negotiation you can reach the simple readable information for humans 14:04:23 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 14:04:28 topic: aob 14:04:48 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ld4lt/2014Jul/0034.html 14:06:16 dave: just one issue: thanks Tiziano and Roberto for the report on the META-SHARE through the group 14:07:52 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 14:07:57 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:07:57 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html daveL 14:08:22 adjourned 14:08:23 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/31-ld4lt-minutes.html fsasaki 15:35:03 Zakim has left #ld4lt