IRC log of bpmlod on 2014-05-22

Timestamps are in UTC.

08:04:06 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #bpmlod
08:04:06 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/05/22-bpmlod-irc
08:04:23 [daveL]
scribe: daveL
08:05:00 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #bpmlod
08:05:02 [labra]
labra has joined #bpmlod
08:05:03 [daveL]
agenda: https://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/wiki/Teleconference,_7/03/2014#Agenda
08:05:08 [chaals]
zakim, this is bpmlod
08:05:08 [Zakim]
ok, chaals; that matches I18N_BPMLOD()4:00AM
08:05:14 [chaals]
zakim, who is here?
08:05:14 [Zakim]
On the phone I see [IPcaller], ??P1, [IPcaller.a], [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], [IPcaller.aaaa]
08:05:16 [Zakim]
On IRC I see labra, Zakim, RRSAgent, chaals, daveL, MTCarrasco, jgracia, rnavigli, flati, trackbot
08:05:26 [rnavigli]
present+ Roberto Navigli
08:05:29 [chaals]
zakim, [ipcaller.aaaa] is chaals
08:05:29 [Zakim]
+chaals; got it
08:06:13 [chaals]
zakim, who is speaking?
08:06:27 [Zakim]
chaals, listening for 13 seconds I heard sound from the following: [IPcaller.a] (22%), [IPcaller.aa] (58%), [IPcaller.aaa] (36%)
08:06:48 [MTCarrasco]
+MTCarrasco
08:06:57 [Zakim]
+ +49.521.106.1.aaaa
08:06:59 [jgracia]
agenda: https://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/wiki/Teleconference,_22/05/2014#Agenda
08:07:03 [daveL]
roberto asks: how to contribute to wiki
08:07:13 [jgracia]
present+ philipp
08:07:23 [jgracia]
present+ jorge
08:07:26 [daveL]
jose: log in with w3c account then your are free to edit
08:07:27 [jgracia]
present+ lupe
08:07:39 [MTCarrasco]
zakim, ??P1 is me
08:07:39 [Zakim]
+MTCarrasco; got it
08:07:50 [jmccrae]
jmccrae has joined #bpmlod
08:08:52 [daveL]
jorge: split call into two parts
08:09:16 [daveL]
... first review list of patterns for describing multilingual information
08:09:47 [daveL]
.. second guidelines on the generation of ML resources in linked data
08:10:49 [daveL]
... including migration of existing ML resources to linked data
08:12:49 [jgracia]
https://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/wiki/Best_practises_-_previous_notes#Patterns_for_Textual_information
08:12:50 [jmccrae]
Scribe: jmccrae
08:12:58 [daveL]
Topic: patterns for textual information
08:13:32 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller.aaaa]
08:13:57 [daveL]
jose: review patterns documented on wiki
08:14:08 [Zakim]
-MTCarrasco
08:15:23 [daveL]
jorge: label everything pattern, seem generally useful
08:15:41 [daveL]
philip asks: are these rdf labels, or labels in any vocabulary
08:16:03 [chaals]
q+
08:16:28 [daveL]
jose: agrees perhaps be specific to rdf labels
08:17:11 [daveL]
philip: suggest best practice is RDF labels, and then add other labes, e.g. skos, as preferred, but minimum should be RDF labels
08:18:15 [daveL]
philipp: issue is that tool can easily explode labels, so readers don't know which to look for
08:18:34 [daveL]
... to specify rdf label as minimum
08:19:09 [daveL]
jose: agrees
08:19:30 [daveL]
chaals: benefit of using rdf label is any tool will pick it up
08:19:50 [daveL]
... so use rdfs labal or something specifically subclassed from rdfs
08:20:20 [daveL]
... but not your own label name.
08:20:27 [labra]
subproperty instead of subclass
08:21:11 [daveL]
... people using their own should be subproperty of rdfs label
08:21:42 [jmccrae]
http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/NOTE-ld-bp-20140109/#multilingual-vocabularies
08:21:52 [daveL]
jmccrea: points to existing w3c guidleines on use of label in ML vocabs
08:22:23 [daveL]
jorge: suggest rdfs labels should be specified here as the best practice
08:23:07 [labra]
possible name: use rdfs:label for everything
08:23:14 [jgracia]
action: jose to update p2.1 for including rdfs labelling
08:23:14 [trackbot]
Error finding 'jose'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/track/users>.
08:23:38 [daveL]
action: labra to update p2.1 for including rdfs labelling
08:23:38 [trackbot]
Error finding 'labra'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/track/users>.
08:24:22 [daveL]
action: jlabraga to update p2.1 for including rdfs labelling
08:24:22 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1 - Update p2.1 for including rdfs labelling [on Jose Emilio Labra Gayo - due 2014-05-29].
08:24:25 [labra]
jlabraga ?
08:25:11 [daveL]
topic: pattern p2.2, multilingual labels
08:26:10 [daveL]
jose: not enough to add labels, but also need language tag
08:26:15 [labra]
SELECT * WHERE { ?x ex:position "Professor" . }
08:26:34 [jgracia]
jose: a drawback for using lang tags is that sparql need to know the language
08:26:35 [daveL]
john: this sounds more like an anti patterns?
08:27:51 [daveL]
john: applications that are language dependent should be specifying language anyway
08:27:54 [labra]
this can be solved as: SELECT * WHERE { ?x :position ?p . FILTER ( str(?p)="Professor" ) }
08:28:42 [daveL]
john: should express it as an anti pattern not to use language tags
08:29:18 [jgracia]
p2.3
08:29:22 [labra]
next pattern could be that anti-apttern
08:29:34 [daveL]
jose: agrees
08:30:12 [daveL]
jorge: but you are discussing P2.3, as an anti pattern
08:30:48 [daveL]
chaals: if you don't specify language of literal do you not get the string
08:31:24 [daveL]
john: the language tag makes the literal different so it won't be matched directly as a literal
08:31:50 [daveL]
... but you can search without language tag using FILTER
08:32:40 [jgracia]
rrsagent, draft minutes
08:32:40 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/22-bpmlod-minutes.html jgracia
08:32:55 [jgracia]
rrsagent, make log public
08:33:56 [daveL]
chaals: the problems with calling this an 'anti pattern' which is it matches behaviour of nieve user
08:35:02 [jgracia]
present+ chaals
08:35:16 [jgracia]
present+ flati
08:35:35 [daveL]
... so need some more guidance on the type of sparql query to use to deal with how people do the 'wrong' thing
08:36:13 [daveL]
... so need to be more explicit on why we need this anti pattern
08:36:19 [jgracia]
present+ labra
08:37:37 [daveL]
... happy to remove if we can show this isn't common bad practice
08:37:37 [labra]
a new pattern on how to do sparql queries on multilingual linked data?
08:38:13 [daveL]
jorge: suggest perhaps we don't need anti pattern and just promote good practice
08:39:01 [daveL]
jose: should be clearer of what is not best practice
08:39:31 [jgracia]
I suggest to add the "how to do sparql" in a "guidelines" document (not the "patterns" one)
08:39:39 [daveL]
... and include patterns on how consumer deal with poor practice in sparql queries
08:40:28 [daveL]
jorge: suggests such consumption guidelines on use of sparql could be in a spearate document
08:41:00 [jgracia]
https://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/wiki/Teleconference,_22/05/2014#Agenda
08:41:29 [daveL]
jorge: finish topic on patterns here and continue in later call
08:41:59 [daveL]
topic: series of guidelines generation of ML Language Resources
08:42:34 [daveL]
jorge: elaborate guidelines for generating ML language resources
08:42:55 [daveL]
... such as corpora, terminologies etc
08:43:29 [daveL]
... this can build on work by john and others
08:43:37 [daveL]
... but capturing best practice
08:44:19 [daveL]
jorge: now discuss a proposed template for such reports
08:45:51 [daveL]
... see ToC on agenda
08:47:29 [daveL]
tiziano: have just sent guidelines on converting babelnet to linguistic linked data
08:47:40 [daveL]
https://docs.google.com/document/d/184C_AjY7_PYBSc8SnAFghGLyTo1v312N34dsP9QZokI/edit#
08:47:41 [jgracia]
john: document what to do after publishing (versioning, etc)
08:48:09 [daveL]
roberto: versioning are important
08:49:09 [daveL]
... better to start with specific reports, then produce more generalised guidelines
08:49:41 [jgracia]
bottom-up approach
08:50:01 [daveL]
... we can restructure the draft above to your ToC
08:50:55 [daveL]
jorge: propose create reports and collect who is interested in contributing to which ones
08:52:34 [daveL]
dave: asks about alignment with ld4lt work on a LR meta-data onto based on META-SHARE
08:52:56 [daveL]
jorge: ld4lt should develop this model and this group develops the guidelines to use it
08:54:27 [daveL]
dave; asks about using w3c report templates
08:54:37 [daveL]
jorge: is exploring this
08:55:28 [daveL]
jose: w3c report template, just involves editing a HTML template
08:55:30 [labra]
http://bpmlod.github.io/report/
08:55:35 [flati]
w3c html version like this: http://bpmlod.github.io/report/ ? Seems like duplicated information as in https://www.w3.org/community/bpmlod/wiki/Best_practises_-_previous_notes
08:56:19 [daveL]
roberto: happy to move current doc to this w3c format
08:56:49 [jgracia]
Resource types:
08:57:00 [jgracia]
- wordnet
08:57:04 [jgracia]
- babelnet
08:57:07 [daveL]
dave: volunteers to look at translation memory/parallel text
08:57:48 [jgracia]
- bilingual dictionaries
08:58:43 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller]
08:59:00 [jgracia]
- corpora
08:59:39 [daveL]
sorry, I've lost connection, can someone else scribe while I try and reconnect
09:02:30 [Zakim]
- +49.521.106.1.aaaa
09:02:32 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller.aaa]
09:02:33 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller.aaaa]
09:02:37 [Zakim]
-chaals
09:02:38 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller.a]
09:02:42 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller.aa]
09:02:44 [Zakim]
I18N_BPMLOD()4:00AM has ended
09:02:44 [Zakim]
Attendees were [IPcaller], chaals, +49.521.106.1.aaaa, MTCarrasco
09:02:53 [daveL]
zakim is telling me the 'call centre is restricted at this time' and refusing to connect me
09:03:10 [chaals]
[adjourned]
09:03:24 [chaals]
rrsagent, draft minutes
09:03:24 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/22-bpmlod-minutes.html chaals
09:03:38 [daveL]
rrsagent, generate minutes
09:03:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/22-bpmlod-minutes.html daveL
09:03:49 [chaals]
Chair: Labra
09:04:10 [chaals]
Meeting: Best Practices - Mulitlingual Linked Open Data
09:04:28 [chaals]
s/Mulitlingual/Multilingual/
09:05:09 [chaals]
s/ jlabraga ?//
09:05:43 [chaals]
s/zakim is telling me the 'call centre is restricted at this time' and refusing to connect me//
09:05:52 [chaals]
s/sorry, I've lost connection, can someone else scribe while I try and reconnect//
09:06:23 [chaals]
s/scribe: jmccrae//
09:06:27 [chaals]
rrsagent, draft minutes
09:06:27 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/22-bpmlod-minutes.html chaals
09:07:57 [chaals]
s/Scribe: jmccrae//
09:08:13 [chaals]
rrsagent, draft minutes
09:08:13 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/22-bpmlod-minutes.html chaals
11:28:19 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #bpmlod