IRC log of webapps on 2014-05-20

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:59:14 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #webapps
15:59:14 [RRSAgent]
logging to
15:59:21 [ArtB]
Scribe: Art
15:59:26 [ArtB]
ScribeNick: ArtB
15:59:27 [xiaoqian]
ScribeNick: ArtB
15:59:43 [ArtB]
Meeting: WebApps / Web Components
15:59:48 [ArtB]
Chair: Dimitri
15:59:50 [xiaoqian]
Scribe: Art
16:00:03 [ArtB]
16:01:04 [Zakim]
RWC_WAPI()12:00PM has now started
16:01:11 [Zakim]
+ +1.650.214.aaaa
16:01:29 [Zakim]
16:01:42 [ArtB]
zakim, aaaa is Dimitri
16:01:43 [Zakim]
+Dimitri; got it
16:02:21 [dglazkov]
Agenda items:
16:02:26 [ArtB] -> Scribe cheat sheet
16:02:43 [dglazkov]
* Shadow DOM survey result:
16:02:52 [lmclister]
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16:02:56 [ArtB]
Topic: Agenda bashing
16:03:05 [xiaoqian_]
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16:03:09 [ArtB]
Scribe+ Dimitri
16:03:18 [ArtB]
ScribeNick+ dglazkov
16:03:47 [dglazkov]
* Shadow DOM survey results: ttps://
16:03:49 [Zakim]
16:04:02 [Domenic]
Zakim, Domenic_ is me
16:04:02 [Zakim]
+Domenic; got it
16:04:04 [dglazkov]
* Cusotm Elements ES6 update:
16:04:31 [ArtB]
Present: Domenic, Dimitri, Art
16:04:35 [dglazkov]
16:04:43 [Zakim]
+ +1.206.612.aabb
16:05:53 [ArtB]
zakim, aabb is Deen
16:05:54 [Zakim]
+Deen; got it
16:05:58 [ArtB]
Present+ Deen
16:06:00 [xiaoqian_]
zakim, call xiaoqian-mobile
16:06:00 [Zakim]
ok, xiaoqian_; the call is being made
16:06:01 [Zakim]
16:06:50 [xiaoqian_]
Scribe: Dimitri
16:07:01 [xiaoqian_]
ScribeNick: dglazkov
16:07:59 [ArtB]
RRSAgent, make minutes
16:07:59 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate ArtB
16:08:22 [dglazkov]
Present+ Domenic
16:08:41 [dglazkov]
Present+ Deen
16:08:47 [ArtB]
RRSAgent, make log Public
16:08:47 [dglazkov]
Present+ dglazkov
16:09:18 [dglazkov]
Let's get started?
16:09:30 [dglazkov]
First up: Shadow DOM survey
16:10:05 [ArtB]
ScribeNick: ArtB
16:10:11 [ArtB]
Topic: Shadow DOM survey
16:10:13 [ArtB]
16:10:17 [ArtB]
… 20 responses
16:10:27 [skddc]
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16:10:36 [ArtB]
… want to get feedback from those actually using Shadow DOM
16:10:47 [ArtB]
… not sure how trustworthy the results are
16:10:57 [ArtB]
… but the top 4-5 have the most weight
16:11:12 [ArtB]
… first item is significant
16:11:44 [ArtB]
… closed shadow trees was very low vote even though we talked about it; thus, it appears developers don't care much about it
16:12:05 [ArtB]
DG: results are
16:12:37 [ArtB]
DD: need to clarify some definitions
16:13:02 [richt]
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16:13:37 [Domenic]
In particular, wondering about shadow as function
16:13:41 [dglazkov]
16:13:47 [ArtB]
… that is, need clarification on "shadow-as-function"
16:14:08 [ArtB]
DG: currently, older shadow is one participant
16:14:20 [ArtB]
… how distributed elements interact
16:14:50 [ArtB]
… shadow-as-function give special argument style where contents is distributed into shadow tree
16:15:11 [ArtB]
DD: related to imperative API?
16:15:17 [ArtB]
DG: no, this about distribution
16:15:42 [ArtB]
… imperative API is ranked #6 in the survey
16:15:57 [ArtB]
… I would like to work on that but not a high priority for devs based on the survey
16:16:07 [ArtB]
… so I think I'll focus on the other items
16:16:31 [ArtB]
DD: encapsulation is important to encapsulate video tag (for Servo)
16:16:50 [ArtB]
DG: yeah, the devs and implementers have diff priorities
16:16:59 [ArtB]
… this survey was targeted at devs
16:17:18 [ArtB]
DD: some of the stuff in the middle is more conceptual
16:17:32 [ArtB]
… and thus isn't necessarily a high prio for devs or implementers
16:17:58 [ArtB]
… clear theming support is the highest prio
16:18:15 [ArtB]
DG: think surveys like this can be helpful for other topics
16:18:23 [ArtB]
… pleased to see 20 responses
16:18:41 [ArtB]
… if there were only 5 or less, I'd be concerned
16:19:01 [ArtB]
… if too small a sample, it raises questions on validity
16:19:38 [ArtB]
AB: nice to see this survey
16:19:47 [ArtB]
… this was the first time we used one
16:19:53 [ArtB]
DD: yes agree the survey was good
16:20:09 [ArtB]
Topic: ES6 and Custom Elements
16:20:23 [ArtB]
DG: did some work with Arv re ES6 and Custom Elements
16:20:23 [dksmith]
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16:20:24 [Domenic]
16:20:46 [dksmith]
Found a mobile IRC client... Woot!
16:20:50 [ArtB]
DG: spec now is more ES5 but would like to change it to be more aligned with ES6
16:20:50 [dglazkov]
16:21:13 [ArtB]
DG: algorithms in ES6 are much more clear
16:21:23 [dksmith]
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16:21:23 [ArtB]
… f.ex. throw for some errors
16:21:38 [ArtB]
… can now specify things I used to `hand wave` before
16:21:52 [ArtB]
… can eliminate a lot of prose
16:22:01 [ArtB]
DD: really glad to hear this
16:22:20 [ArtB]
… think more Web specs should follow this more precise way to write specs
16:22:31 [ArtB]
DG: at one point I thought I should just write JS ;-)
16:22:37 [ArtB]
[ laughs … ]
16:23:04 [ArtB]
DD: with Promises spec and Streams spec I'm using this same rigor
16:23:37 [ArtB]
DG: docRegisterElement in ES6 returns value you gave to it
16:23:55 [ArtB]
… this is different behavior; not sure how many people noticed this
16:24:13 [ArtB]
DD: how does this fit with class syntax?
16:24:22 [ArtB]
DG: fine/ok
16:24:28 [ArtB]
… just works
16:24:57 [ArtB]
Topic: AoB or Other Agenda Items
16:25:02 [ArtB]
DG: anything else?
16:26:20 [dksmith]
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16:27:03 [ArtB]
AB: there is lots of flexibility re the structure of the meeting
16:27:12 [ArtB]
… some meetings can be very bug fixed
16:27:18 [ArtB]
DG: yes, I like that
16:27:32 [ArtB]
DD: also good to have an opp to understand the bigger picture
16:27:57 [ArtB]
AB: I agree Domenic
16:28:33 [ArtB]
DKS: would also be helpful to get a review of important bugs
16:28:49 [ArtB]
DG: yes, can structure the first part re more general topics
16:28:57 [ArtB]
… and then the second part is detailed bugs
16:29:30 [ArtB]
DG: one issue is the Shadow DOM Editor and the time of this call
16:29:36 [ArtB]
… can we alternate the calls?
16:29:56 [ArtB]
… f.ex. one time friendly to US and another friendly to Asia
16:30:03 [ArtB]
AB: yes, we can make that happen
16:30:21 [ArtB]
DG: another Q/Issue is to get more Web devs to participate
16:30:49 [ArtB]
… I was hoping some non-browser people would participate
16:32:27 [Zakim]
16:32:33 [Zakim]
16:32:33 [ArtB]
AB: I think the meeting can be organized to facilitate devs participation
16:32:45 [ArtB]
… we just need to be careful about the provenance of the contribution
16:33:16 [ArtB]
DG: meeting adjourned
16:33:22 [Zakim]
16:33:23 [ArtB]
RRSAgent, make minutes
16:33:23 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate ArtB
16:33:23 [Zakim]
16:33:27 [dglazkov]
16:33:30 [Zakim]
16:33:31 [Zakim]
RWC_WAPI()12:00PM has ended
16:33:31 [Zakim]
Attendees were +1.650.214.aaaa, Art_Barstow, Dimitri, Domenic, +1.206.612.aabb, Deen, Xiaoqian
16:33:33 [dglazkov]
thank you guys for participating!
16:33:40 [ArtB]
RRSAgent, make minutes
16:33:40 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate ArtB
16:35:30 [ArtB]
Present: Dimitri, Art, Domenic_Denicola, Cindy, Deen
16:35:35 [ArtB]
RRSAgent, make minutes
16:35:35 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate ArtB
16:36:08 [ArtB]
zakim, bye
16:36:08 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #webapps
16:43:55 [ArtB]
RRSAgent, bye
16:43:55 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items