IRC log of svg on 2014-05-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

12:58:01 [RRSAgent]

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/05/08-svg-irc

12:58:03 [trackbot]

RRSAgent, make logs public

12:58:03 [Zakim]

Zakim has joined #svg

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Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG

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ok, trackbot; I see GA_SVGWG()9:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes

12:58:06 [trackbot]

Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference

12:58:06 [trackbot]

Date: 08 May 2014

12:58:18 [ed]

Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2014May/0003.html

12:58:21 [ed]

chair: ed

12:58:50 [Zakim]

GA_SVGWG()9:00AM has now started

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+[IPcaller]

12:59:06 [cabanier]

zakim, IPcaller is me

12:59:06 [Zakim]

+cabanier; got it

12:59:12 [Zakim]

+[IPcaller]

12:59:36 [Zakim]

+Rich_Schwerdtfeger

12:59:45 [ed]

Zakim, [IP is me

12:59:45 [Zakim]

+ed; got it

13:00:24 [Zakim]

+??P3

13:02:20 [Zakim]

+krit

13:02:54 [stakagi]

zakim ??P3 is me

13:03:06 [stakagi]

zakim, ??P3 is me

13:03:07 [Zakim]

+stakagi; got it

13:03:12 [Zakim]

+??P7

13:03:27 [nikos]

Zakim, ??P7 is me

13:03:27 [Zakim]

+nikos; got it

13:05:02 [richardschwerdtfeger]

scribe: Rich

13:05:15 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Topic: SVG2 User Agent Implementation Guide

13:05:29 [ed]

scribeNick: richardschwerdtfeger

13:05:47 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Core Accessibility API Mappings

13:05:55 [richardschwerdtfeger]

SVG2 Accessibility API Mappings

13:06:04 [richardschwerdtfeger]

HTML5 Accessibility API Mappings

13:08:19 [ed]

richardschwerdtfeger: does anyone have concerns with the names of the specifications?

13:08:26 [ed]

(none heard)

13:09:14 [richardschwerdtfeger]

scribe: Rich

13:09:25 [ed]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2013Jun/0071.html

13:09:35 [richardschwerdtfeger]

TOPIC: should we remove tref from SVG2?

13:10:17 [richardschwerdtfeger]

erik: It is not implemented in Firefox. There is not much use in blink. People are looking to remove it if possible.

13:10:24 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Rich: Is it implemented in IE?

13:10:42 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: Not implemented in IE11

13:11:04 [richardschwerdtfeger]

erik: You can use the <use> element instead so not much loss of functionality

13:11:41 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: if <use> satisifes those then we will be ok

13:12:17 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: tref can be used inside a text element. but use you would use outside but you can mostly do the same thing

13:12:35 [nikos]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2013Jun/0075.html

13:12:37 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: There was some comment about it breaking air traffic control software

13:13:01 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: it was a little bit vauge

13:13:06 [richardschwerdtfeger]

s/vauge/vague/

13:13:32 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: If it is not really implemented in browsers anyway …

13:13:53 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: there were a lot of quirks with it so I would like to remove it. It makes things more complicated for implementation

13:14:28 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: If you have script you can do anything with it but there is not always the opportunity to use script

13:14:55 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: I propose that we try to drop it with the next publication of the spec.

13:15:17 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: hearing no objections

13:15:28 [richardschwerdtfeger]

RESOLUTION: Remove TREF from the SVG 2 spec.

13:16:07 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Topic: Deprecate pixelUnitToMillimeterX, pixelUnitToMillimeterY,

13:16:07 [richardschwerdtfeger]

screenPixelToMillimeterX, screenPixelToMillimeterY in SVG2

13:16:56 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: Do we want to continue having these functions that simply return constants? They are really not needed any more.

13:17:16 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: can we at least deprecate them?

13:17:50 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: So, these contants are easy to get from other APIs or this is basically what the web does more or less

13:17:59 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: Can we get these values from CSS?

13:18:10 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: No, I don’t think so

13:18:29 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: I have not seen these used so I am not that concerned. I think we should deprecate them.

13:18:54 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: hearing no objections to deprecate them.

13:19:25 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Action: Dirk deprecate Deprecate pixelUnitToMillimeterX, pixelUnitToMillimeterY, screenPixelToMillimeterX, screenPixelToMillimeterY in the spec.

13:19:26 [trackbot]

Created ACTION-3623 - Deprecate deprecate pixelunittomillimeterx, pixelunittomillimetery, screenpixeltomillimeterx, screenpixeltomillimetery in the spec. [on Dirk Schulze - due 2014-05-15].

13:19:57 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Topic: Should we use unrestricted double for SVGLength, SVGNumber, SVGAngle and

13:19:58 [richardschwerdtfeger]

all attributes?

13:20:24 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: You can pass none.

13:20:35 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: should we restict the API or should we make it unrestricted?

13:21:07 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: they will all have unrstricted doubles

13:21:19 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: It just makes sense to make it unrestricted.

13:21:39 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: ok let’s do that

13:22:04 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Topic: All presentation attributes (even the new presentation attributes like

13:22:04 [richardschwerdtfeger]

width and height) should allow global CSS keywords like inherit and

13:22:05 [richardschwerdtfeger]

initial.

13:22:12 [ed]

s/ok let’s do that/ok let’s postpone the discussion until heycam is present/

13:22:33 [richardschwerdtfeger]

krit: I think we should not add new cases and we should follow CSS as much as possible.

13:22:45 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: this does post some consistency issues

13:23:12 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: … svglength for example. So, that is the reason for not allowing it for the elements that are presentation attributes

13:24:32 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: the object models would produce computed styles. This is something we decided 2 years ago.

13:24:33 [ed]

<g transform="inherit"> ... and then gElm.baseVal.transform.getItem(0), what does it return?

13:25:17 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: the base values would be computed?

13:25:26 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: you would get the computed styles

13:25:40 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: we should move to the CSS object model where possible

13:25:58 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: you could use the get attributes if you wanted to get whatever was written

13:26:01 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: that makes sense

13:26:17 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: that would mean that I would go change the spec.

13:26:30 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: you would not disallow the new units from CSS

13:27:00 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: you are are nto restricting it to the character message length

13:27:36 [richardschwerdtfeger]

action: ed modify the sentence in the spec. to allow the globall css keywords like inherit and initial

13:27:36 [trackbot]

Created ACTION-3624 - Modify the sentence in the spec. to allow the globall css keywords like inherit and initial [on Erik Dahlström - due 2014-05-15].

13:28:12 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Topic: Event attributes on graphics and container elements why not SVGElement

13:28:13 [richardschwerdtfeger]

in general, just like HTMLElement does?

13:28:26 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: It would make sense to make it for SVG elements in general

13:28:40 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: script elements, style elements, etc.

13:28:52 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: the scripting chapter in the spec.?

13:29:02 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: it is out of date and should be updated.

13:29:20 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: these are more or less the standard events

13:30:04 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: we just map all event attributes to svg elements as well.

13:30:11 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: should be fine.

13:31:23 [richardschwerdtfeger]

Action: ed Event attributes on graphics and container elements added to SVGElement just like HTMLElement does

13:31:23 [trackbot]

Created ACTION-3625 - Event attributes on graphics and container elements added to svgelement just like htmlelement does [on Erik Dahlström - due 2014-05-15].

13:31:37 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: the next call is May 22

13:31:48 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: I may not be available as well

13:31:53 [richardschwerdtfeger]

nikos: my regrets

13:32:15 [richardschwerdtfeger]

ed: meeting adjouned

13:32:16 [Zakim]

-cabanier

13:32:17 [Zakim]

-ed

13:32:17 [Zakim]

-krit

13:32:19 [Zakim]

-stakagi

13:32:19 [richardschwerdtfeger]

zakim, bye

13:32:19 [Zakim]

leaving. As of this point the attendees were cabanier, [IPcaller], Rich_Schwerdtfeger, ed, krit, stakagi, nikos

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13:32:35 [richardschwerdtfeger]

RRSAGent, make log public

13:32:44 [nikos]

s/nikos: my regrets/krit: my regrets

13:32:45 [richardschwerdtfeger]

RRSAgent, make minutes

13:32:45 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/08-svg-minutes.html richardschwerdtfeger

13:32:56 [nikos]

wonder if I got that in in time ;)

13:33:42 [richardschwerdtfeger]

RRSAgent, make minutes

13:33:42 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/05/08-svg-minutes.html richardschwerdtfeger

13:36:03 [richardschwerdtfeger]

@krit: I added it to the post to the list of the mintues.

13:36:36 [krit]

richardschwerdtfeger: thanks

13:36:41 [richardschwerdtfeger]

yw

14:01:00 [richardschwerdtfeger]

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