Cognitive Accessibility Task Force

03 Feb 2014


See also: IRC log


+1.508.856.aaaa, Michel_Fitos, +1.301.367.aabb, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Michael_Cooper, John_Rochford, Elle_Waters, Katie_Haritos-Shea


<Barry> I am the 301-367 number (Barry Johnson)

Scribe (Elle volunteers)


Liddy: In Australia, interested in how to contribute to this conversation, particularly in the use of limited language


<Lisa_Seeman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2014Feb/0005.html

Lisa: Quick review of my comments and Neil's comments on top of that?

<Barry> Sure that would be great

Lisa: Difficult to do, asked to review something quite comprehensive, a bit early to jump in with group recommendations. Do we want to discuss this in more detail or shall I write it up and send it to the list?

Liddy: I think it would be interesting to hear you explain.

Lisa: Guideline 3.1 was to help users avoid unnecessary messages. Felt it was open to misinterpresentation (advertisers would argue that their messaging was hugely important). Recommended change: low-priority messages to the user or not critical to the use case
... We can use the queue if needed, if there's no one in it, open questions are fine

John: Common problem with people with cognitive disabilities is that there's no consistent navigation, would be terrific if we could suggest the use of a universal help symbol, that consistency would be great for people with cognitive disabilities and great for everyone

Lisa: Mentioned in the email about the use of a question mark icon

John: Saw that, wasn't sure if that was true across languages

Lisa: Certainly we want to get there, somewhere that we may end up, but not sure that we can include it for this

Suzanne: Essential theme, the idea of what's important and what's essential to the task. Initial point was messages, now content, being able to show what's in the main landmark vs. a complementary landmark

Lisa: Bit of a change in how landmarks are used, main isn't necessarily task focus, might want to suggest a change or additional role
... Next comment was about helping users avoid issues correcting mistakes, need to be able to get back to the information that you put in before as a user... so, if it's too much to fill in within the span of a day, can go back. Neil added that users should be able to go back a step without losing what they've entered so far. Often CD users have low confidence in what they've done. The ability to be able to go back and check your work, I couldn't ag[CUT]
... When you add features, almost hoping that users select them by mistake... if someone is moved away from the original offering to an alternative, it should be very clear and the original offering should be the same size, positioned next to or above the alternative offering
... Neil added that the original choice should be selected by default and not the item that they want to up sell. I agree with that as well, although made it softer that it should be clear, can get back to it easily. Neil suggests that it should be the default even if it's easy to get back to it.

<NeilMilliken> Q

Elle: Just curious about how to enforce that

Neil: The reason why I think it should stay on the default, if you're clicking on a link, it should take you to what's been advertised. AVG is a good example of how confusing this is.

Elle: That's the exact example I was thinking of, too.

<Barry> And they use a link to go back but a Button to go forward...

Neil: I think that's pernicious, that despite you're getting the information, the product still appears to be free, more likely to catch out people with cognitive disabilities.

@Barry - This is a tough sell, though, for design teams, especially when trying to define UX best practices and make that agreeable to marketing teams.

<Barry> @Elle - That is the hard part for us I guess

Suzanne: We can't really require specific design, but we can require a tag (ex. "This was your original offer.") with a visual indicator like a blue outline.

Lisa: Difficult to put this into this review, as they're in Last Call status, perhaps in semantics UI where we could see this put into place, but we're not there yet
... Maybe we can say "if semantics become available, we can use that to identify it"
... 1st suggestion is to have the original offering as big and positioned before the alternative 2nd suggestion is Neil's proposal is to keep the original offering as the default choice and 3rd suggestion is Suzanne's to handle it via semantics
... Put forward proposal that we suggest Neil's, another option is Lisa's, and Suzanne's when that option becomes available

<NeilMilliken> Agree


Lisa: Context sensitive (easy to see) help more useful for people than hiding it inside a menu or on a large page of content
... Suggested use of tool tips on all icons, jargon and abbreviations, aids with limited working memory, less disoriented than going to a new screen

John: All great suggestions



<NeilMilliken> tool tips also have an impact on Dragon users

Great point, Neil

Tool tips (if too large) may have an impact on low-vision users, too

Katie: layered help - instant feedback "Save" and then you can go into a deeper dive, more information than what initially comes up, one way to implement this

Lisa: Would like to propose that tool tips used like layered help, short and concise (similiar to or with title attribute) and then more information available

<JohnRochford> Agreed


<NeilMilliken> Agree with Elle that tooltips should be succint

<NeilMilliken> agreed

<Barry> Agreed

<Michel> agreed

<scribe> Agenda: Questions and issues for making user scenarios

Lisa: Is everyone comfortable with posting items on the Wiki before members in their group have seen it?

<NeilMilliken> I am happy and have already posted a straw man gap analysis

Lisa: We can use it as a scratch pad

<Barry> If we can use it as a "white board" for others to "cross out" or edit, I think it is a great idea

Lisa: Going to assume people are comfortable with what they're doing with the gap analysis. We'll actually start going through what others have, when ready to be reviewed by the group, let me know.

<NeilMilliken> I hope to be ready for a tear down by next week


aging and dementia

Elle: Will work with our group to coordinate a plan for finishing publishing to get it ready for review

<NeilMilliken> John I am happy to discuss with you - I also have access to a lot of users

John: Connections in Mass to many individuals we could utilize in testing. How to use them? Will come up with suggestions for the group by next meeting.

<JohnRochford> ok Neil, thank you

<Barry> Have to go to another meeting. Bye everyone!

Lisa: Thanks, everybody, will pick this up next call!

<Liddy> bye

<Barry> Thanks Elle!

Summary of Action Items

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Present: +1.508.856.aaaa Michel_Fitos +1.301.367.aabb Rich_Schwerdtfeger Michael_Cooper John_Rochford Elle_Waters Katie_Haritos-Shea
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2014Feb/0001.html
Got date from IRC log name: 03 Feb 2014
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/02/03-coga-minutes.html
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