edit

XHTML2 Working Group Teleconference

Minutes of 19 November 2008

Agenda
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Nov/0012.html
Seen
Alessio Cartocci, Gregory Rosmaita, Mark Birbeck, Roland Merrick, Shane McCarron, Steven Pemberton, Tina Holmboe, Unknown _alessio
Regrets
Steven Pemberton
Chair
Roland Merrick
Scribe
Gregory Rosmaita
IRC Log
Original
Resolutions

None.

Topics

There are some format problems with the chatlog. Please correct them and reload this page. They are labeled on this page in a red box, like this message.

It may be helpful to

14:37:52 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc

14:37:54 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public

14:37:56 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be IA_XHTML2

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be IA_XHTML2

14:37:56 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes

14:37:57 <trackbot> Meeting: XHTML2 Working Group Teleconference
14:37:57 <trackbot> Date: 19 November 2008
14:38:44 <Roland> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Nov/0012.html
14:39:05 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes

Roland Merrick: rrsagent, make minutes

14:39:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html Roland

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html Roland

14:39:14 <Roland> rrsagent, make log public

Roland Merrick: rrsagent, make log public

14:39:50 <Roland> Chair: Roland
14:41:18 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started

Zakim IRC Bot: IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started

14:41:25 <Zakim> +Roland

Zakim IRC Bot: +Roland

14:42:29 <Zakim> + +04670855aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: + +04670855aaaa

14:42:58 <Roland> Zakim, aaaa is Tina

Roland Merrick: Zakim, aaaa is Tina

14:42:58 <Zakim> +Tina; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +Tina; got it

14:44:05 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmaita

Zakim IRC Bot: +Gregory_Rosmaita

14:45:09 <oedipus> Scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita

(Scribe set to Gregory Rosmaita)

14:45:13 <Roland> Regrets: Steven
14:45:14 <oedipus> ScribeNick: oedipus
14:45:27 <oedipus> RS: regrets from Steven who is sick

Roland Merrick: regrets from Steven who is sick

14:45:32 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes

Roland Merrick: rrsagent, make minutes

14:45:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html Roland

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html Roland

14:46:19 <oedipus> TOPIC: Agenda Review, News and New Items

1. Agenda Review, News and New Items

14:47:15 <markbirbeck> on my way...just be a minute...

Mark Birbeck: on my way...just be a minute...

14:47:22 <Zakim> +ShaneM

Zakim IRC Bot: +ShaneM

14:47:27 <alessio> hi all :)

Alessio Cartocci: hi all :)

14:47:55 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/agenda

http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/agenda

14:48:15 <oedipus> SM: disposition of comments for Access and Role are done and are up - just updated today

Shane McCarron: disposition of comments for Access and Role are done and are up - just updated today

14:48:23 <oedipus> RM: all necessary to move forward

Roland Merrick: all necessary to move forward

14:48:35 <oedipus> SM: for Access and Role, yes; CURIEs already in process

Shane McCarron: for Access and Role, yes; CURIEs already in process

14:48:58 <oedipus> TOPIC: State of Documents/Deliverables

2. State of Documents/Deliverables

14:49:16 <alessio> Tina, I'm just writing a post for italian community about your XHTML article on "The Developer’s Archive"

Alessio Cartocci: Tina, I'm just writing a post for italian community about your XHTML article on "The Developer’s Archive"

14:49:25 <oedipus> RM: SP sent transition requests; nothing scheduled yet as for publication; waiting for commm team

Roland Merrick: SP sent transition requests; nothing scheduled yet as for publication; waiting for commm team

14:49:28 <Tina> alessio: excellent. Thank you.

Alessio Cartocci: excellent. Thank you. [ Scribe Assist by Tina Holmboe ]

14:49:55 <Zakim> +??P22

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P22

14:50:04 <oedipus> RM: Role and Access Modules in same state; WG voted to forward; drafts ready and disposition of comments are also ready

Roland Merrick: Role and Access Modules in same state; WG voted to forward; drafts ready and disposition of comments are also ready

14:50:06 <alessio> zakim, ??P22 is Alessio

Alessio Cartocci: zakim, ??P22 is Alessio

14:50:06 <Zakim> +Alessio; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +Alessio; got it

14:50:23 <oedipus> ACTION: Steven - request CR Transition for Role Module

ACTION: Steven - request CR Transition for Role Module

14:50:23 <trackbot> Created ACTION-30 - - request CR Transition for Role Module [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-26].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-30 - - request CR Transition for Role Module [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-26].

14:50:39 <oedipus> ACTION: Steven - request CR transition for Access Module

ACTION: Steven - request CR transition for Access Module

14:50:40 <trackbot> Created ACTION-31 - - request CR transition for Access Module [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-26].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-31 - - request CR transition for Access Module [on Steven Pemberton - due 2008-11-26].

14:50:45 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minute

rrsagent, make minute

14:50:45 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minute', oedipus.  Try /msg RRSAgent help

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minute', oedipus. Try /msg RRSAgent help

14:50:47 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

14:50:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

14:51:13 <oedipus> Topic: XML Events 2 progress towards last call

3. XML Events 2 progress towards last call

14:51:21 <oedipus> zakim, who is here?

zakim, who is here?

14:51:21 <Zakim> On the phone I see Roland, Tina, Gregory_Rosmaita, ShaneM, Alessio

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Roland, Tina, Gregory_Rosmaita, ShaneM, Alessio

14:51:22 <Zakim> On IRC I see alessio, rpgfan3233, oedipus, markbirbeck, Zakim, RRSAgent, Roland, ShaneM, Tina, trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see alessio, rpgfan3233, oedipus, markbirbeck, Zakim, RRSAgent, Roland, ShaneM, Tina, trackbot

14:51:49 <oedipus> RM: WG voted to send XML Events 2 to LC

Roland Merrick: WG voted to send XML Events 2 to LC

14:51:59 <oedipus> RM: any comments on Events document?

Roland Merrick: any comments on Events document?

14:52:33 <oedipus> RM: do we need to resolve outstanding actions?

Roland Merrick: do we need to resolve outstanding actions?

14:52:48 <oedipus> RM: Action 1 is first: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/1

Roland Merrick: ACTION-1 is first: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/1

14:52:49 <Roland> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/1

Roland Merrick: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/1

14:52:50 <markbirbeck> zakim, codes?

Mark Birbeck: zakim, codes?

14:52:50 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, markbirbeck.

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand your question, markbirbeck.

14:53:02 <markbirbeck> zakim, code?

Mark Birbeck: zakim, code?

14:53:02 <Zakim> the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck

14:53:06 <ShaneM> ACTION: Shane to update XML Events 2 draft so it has a diff mark to previous public working draft AND to the previous recommendation

ACTION: Shane to update XML Events 2 draft so it has a diff mark to previous public working draft AND to the previous recommendation

14:53:06 <trackbot> Created ACTION-32 - Update XML Events 2 draft so it has a diff mark to previous public working draft AND to the previous recommendation [on Shane McCarron - due 2008-11-26].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-32 - Update XML Events 2 draft so it has a diff mark to previous public working draft AND to the previous recommendation [on Shane McCarron - due 2008-11-26].

14:53:31 <Zakim> +??P20

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P20

14:53:36 <oedipus> RM: only way can write need to be done before any other event fired - does it make significant difference for last call?

Roland Merrick: only way can write need to be done before any other event fired - does it make significant difference for last call?

14:53:38 <markbirbeck> zakim, i am ??

Mark Birbeck: zakim, i am ??

14:53:38 <Zakim> +markbirbeck; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markbirbeck; got it

14:54:04 <oedipus> SM: be ok to put in comment perhaps -- not an open issue - not from reviewer -- WG not sure if on right track

Shane McCarron: be ok to put in comment perhaps -- not an open issue - not from reviewer -- WG not sure if on right track

14:54:20 <oedipus> RM: could put in as comment that welcome feedback on that particular statement

Roland Merrick: could put in as comment that welcome feedback on that particular statement

14:54:24 <oedipus> AC: agree

Alessio Cartocci: agree

14:54:49 <oedipus> RM: reviewing actions on me: action 1 "- write to DOM3 guys on when registration will occur and when events can be fired; coordinate deeper discussion"

Roland Merrick: reviewing actions on me: ACTION-1 "- write to DOM3 guys on when registration will occur and when events can be fired; coordinate deeper discussion"

14:55:13 <oedipus> RM: can we put comment into spec saying welcome feedback on timing or do we need something more definitive

Roland Merrick: can we put comment into spec saying welcome feedback on timing or do we need something more definitive

14:55:29 <oedipus> MB: something we raised ourselves;

Mark Birbeck: something we raised ourselves;

14:55:46 <oedipus> RM: action on me was to open dialog on subject with DOM3 people

Roland Merrick: action on me was to open dialog on subject with DOM3 people

14:56:21 <oedipus> RM: another topic - DOM3 going to LC by end of first quarter of next year; should re-examine to ensure XML Events work in DOM2 and DOM3

Roland Merrick: another topic - DOM3 going to LC by end of first quarter of next year; should re-examine to ensure XML Events work in DOM2 and DOM3

14:56:47 <oedipus> SM: isn't that the issue: we need qnames, and if so, we need DOM3 Events?

Shane McCarron: isn't that the issue: we need qnames, and if so, we need DOM3 Events?

14:57:05 <oedipus> MB: could do mapping at implementation layer; DOM2 doesn't have qnames, but layer on top could

Mark Birbeck: could do mapping at implementation layer; DOM2 doesn't have qnames, but layer on top could

14:57:20 <oedipus> RM: do we need qnames - if have event with qnames, can use, if not, then don't use

Roland Merrick: do we need qnames - if have event with qnames, can use, if not, then don't use

14:57:38 <oedipus> SM: do you believe that DOM2 events permit the definition of arbitrary events

Shane McCarron: do you believe that DOM2 events permit the definition of arbitrary events

14:57:42 <oedipus> MB: those with colon?

Mark Birbeck: those with colon?

14:57:55 <oedipus> SM: in general - defined collection of event tokens that can't be extended

Shane McCarron: in general - defined collection of event tokens that can't be extended

14:58:03 <oedipus> RM: did that with XML Events 1

Roland Merrick: did that with XML Events 1

14:58:20 <oedipus> SM: can you put colon in name - i say no because is a token

Shane McCarron: can you put colon in name - i say no because is a token

14:58:59 <oedipus> MB: one way to go is to follow RM's lead - depends on architecture which to use; if use DOM2, qnames not supported (should be explicitly stated)

Mark Birbeck: one way to go is to follow RM's lead - depends on architecture which to use; if use DOM2, qnames not supported (should be explicitly stated)

14:59:11 <oedipus> SM: needed to write portable documents

Shane McCarron: needed to write portable documents

14:59:38 <oedipus> MB: could map it

Mark Birbeck: could map it

14:59:42 <oedipus> SM: how would approach?

Shane McCarron: how would approach?

15:00:25 <oedipus> MB: XML Events 2 layer is goig to have to have sub-code written to have calls made to DOM2 or DOM3 -- something underneath, core code, will have to do registration of events

Mark Birbeck: XML Events 2 layer is goig to have to have sub-code written to have calls made to DOM2 or DOM3 -- something underneath, core code, will have to do registration of events

15:00:46 <oedipus> MB: given system self-contained xyz:event mapped to xyz_event no one would be any the wiser

Mark Birbeck: given system self-contained xyz:event mapped to xyz_event no one would be any the wiser

15:00:48 <oedipus> SM: ok

Shane McCarron: ok

15:01:25 <oedipus> MB: self-contained system; weak point - XForms has xforms-submit but can't have xf:submit then

Mark Birbeck: self-contained system; weak point - XForms has xforms-submit but can't have xf:submit then

15:02:00 <oedipus> SM: MB's approach clean - have to put in normative requirement on DOM2 events, and no normative req on DOM3 events; problem of timing; can't rely on DOM3

Shane McCarron: MB's approach clean - have to put in normative requirement on DOM2 events, and no normative req on DOM3 events; problem of timing; can't rely on DOM3

15:02:13 <oedipus> MB: we don't have to do mapping; implementation does it

Mark Birbeck: we don't have to do mapping; implementation does it

15:02:23 <oedipus> SM: "must behave as if..." is all that is needed

Shane McCarron: "must behave as if..." is all that is needed

15:02:50 <oedipus> SM: implementations based on DOM2 events MUST behave as if specified by qnames; the exact method is implementation-defined

Shane McCarron: implementations based on DOM2 events MUST behave as if specified by qnames; the exact method is implementation-defined

15:02:58 <oedipus> MB: ok

Mark Birbeck: ok

15:03:05 <oedipus> SM: where in spec to put comment?

Shane McCarron: where in spec to put comment?

15:03:20 <oedipus> SM: think needs to be in definition of event attribute

Shane McCarron: think needs to be in definition of event attribute

15:03:33 <oedipus> RM: agree - in Events part of spec

Roland Merrick: agree - in Events part of spec

15:03:42 <alessio> +1

Alessio Cartocci: +1

15:03:45 <oedipus> SM: listener elements and DOM3 Event Mutation

Shane McCarron: listener elements and DOM3 Event Mutation

15:04:27 <oedipus> SM: does DOM3 have all interfaces we are exposing?  all subjects in handler module and bubbling stuff - default target, etc. -- 4 potential phases in DOM2 - have to clarify situation vis a vis DOM3

Shane McCarron: does DOM3 have all interfaces we are exposing? all subjects in handler module and bubbling stuff - default target, etc. -- 4 potential phases in DOM2 - have to clarify situation vis a vis DOM3

15:04:57 <oedipus> SM: phases is ok -- we define what each term means in the spec

Shane McCarron: phases is ok -- we define what each term means in the spec

15:05:13 <oedipus> MB: one level up events are ok

Mark Birbeck: one level up events are ok

15:05:46 <oedipus> SM: others of interests: DispatchEvents, etc. - those are our definitions; style propagation and prevent default already in DOM2

Shane McCarron: others of interests: DispatchEvents, etc. - those are our definitions; style propagation and prevent default already in DOM2

15:06:09 <oedipus> MB: on DOM3 question, are they still considering using qnames?

Mark Birbeck: on DOM3 question, are they still considering using qnames?

15:06:41 <oedipus> RM: yes, although faction oppose

Roland Merrick: yes, although faction oppose

15:07:02 <oedipus> SM: interestingly, the last draft of DOM3 Events, from 2007, doesn't contain term qname

Shane McCarron: interestingly, the last draft of DOM3 Events, from 2007, doesn't contain term qname

15:07:21 <oedipus> SM: does have NamespaceURI as attribute

Shane McCarron: does have NamespaceURI as attribute

15:07:28 <oedipus> SM: don't use qualified name either

Shane McCarron: don't use qualified name either

15:07:44 <ShaneM> http://www.w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-3-Events/events.html#Events-Event

Shane McCarron: http://www.w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-3-Events/events.html#Events-Event

15:08:23 <oedipus> SM: events interface in DOM3 defines addEventListener and addEventListenerNS - that is interesting and shows way towards mapping; if interface like this, no mapping needed, if not, know what to do

Shane McCarron: events interface in DOM3 defines addEventListener and addEventListenerNS - that is interesting and shows way towards mapping; if interface like this, no mapping needed, if not, know what to do

15:09:01 <oedipus> MB: by spliting namespace out into seperate property and not using qnames, trying to ensure baackwards compatibility -- use local name, may not be namespace present

Mark Birbeck: by spliting namespace out into seperate property and not using qnames, trying to ensure baackwards compatibility -- use local name, may not be namespace present

15:09:09 <oedipus> MB: should we be doing the same

Mark Birbeck: should we be doing the same

15:09:18 <oedipus> SM: not needed for our users

Shane McCarron: not needed for our users

15:09:41 <oedipus> MB: assuming that using qnames is more convenient than using 2 attributes, one with namespace and one with type

Mark Birbeck: assuming that using qnames is more convenient than using 2 attributes, one with namespace and one with type

15:10:02 <oedipus> SM: namespace prefix going may be used hundreds of times -- burden on author

Shane McCarron: namespace prefix going may be used hundreds of times -- burden on author

15:10:10 <oedipus> SM: foo:bar implies a namespace

Shane McCarron: foo:bar implies a namespace

15:10:34 <oedipus> MB: does imply that alogrithm foo:bar becoming foo_bar is wrong; in DOM2 becomes just bar

Mark Birbeck: does imply that alogrithm foo:bar becoming foo_bar is wrong; in DOM2 becomes just bar

15:10:54 <oedipus> MB: initEvent method receives bar; if eventsNS receive bar plus the foo

Mark Birbeck: initEvent method receives bar; if eventsNS receive bar plus the foo

15:11:30 <oedipus> MB: note needs to state: be careful, if use DOM2 foo will be ignorned and foo:bar and foo_bar will map to same event

Mark Birbeck: note needs to state: be careful, if use DOM2 foo will be ignorned and foo:bar and foo_bar will map to same event

15:12:06 <oedipus> SM: approach might work, but could also say - if ontop of DOM2, should treat foo:bar and bar identically

Shane McCarron: approach might work, but could also say - if ontop of DOM2, should treat foo:bar and bar identically

15:12:22 <oedipus> MB: 2 methods: one with namespace property and one without

Mark Birbeck: 2 methods: one with namespace property and one without

15:12:33 <oedipus> SM: latest editor's draft?

Shane McCarron: latest editor's draft?

15:13:39 <oedipus> SM: define spec on our side that allows our constituents to write applications; no idea what underlying implementation is

Shane McCarron: define spec on our side that allows our constituents to write applications; no idea what underlying implementation is

15:13:48 <oedipus> RM: DOMHasFeature will tell you that

Roland Merrick: DOMHasFeature will tell you that

15:14:03 <oedipus> SM: XML Events 2 not scripting, but declarative through use of handlers

Shane McCarron: XML Events 2 not scripting, but declarative through use of handlers

15:14:25 <oedipus> SM: can't serve diff documents depending upon underlying document type -- at least, i wouldn't want to

Shane McCarron: can't serve diff documents depending upon underlying document type -- at least, i wouldn't want to

15:15:07 <oedipus> MB: what is use of qnames -- in local files, defining my events, don't need qnames; become useful when people write specs xf:done

Mark Birbeck: what is use of qnames -- in local files, defining my events, don't need qnames; become useful when people write specs xf:done

15:15:18 <oedipus> SM: good point;

Shane McCarron: good point;

15:15:34 <oedipus> MB: author has control of document

Mark Birbeck: author has control of document

15:15:39 <oedipus> SM: sometimes

Shane McCarron: sometimes

15:15:55 <oedipus> MB: use qualified names with multiple markup

Mark Birbeck: use qualified names with multiple markup

15:16:10 <oedipus> SM: if constituency is basic author, not going to use qnames for own events

Shane McCarron: if constituency is basic author, not going to use qnames for own events

15:16:21 <oedipus> RM: this is language-designer concern only?

Roland Merrick: this is language-designer concern only?

15:16:39 <oedipus> SM: do we want to tell users "don't use qnames for your own defined events"

Shane McCarron: do we want to tell users "don't use qnames for your own defined events"

15:16:58 <oedipus> SM: "If you use qualified names, in some implementations, they may collide"

Shane McCarron: "If you use qualified names, in some implementations, they may collide"

15:17:40 <oedipus> MB: not convinced there is a perfect solution to this; what is it that DOM3 event designers seeing when took this approach; AJAX library fires event when initialized and make dojo:done - can i register that?

Mark Birbeck: not convinced there is a perfect solution to this; what is it that DOM3 event designers seeing when took this approach; AJAX library fires event when initialized and make dojo:done - can i register that?

15:17:56 <oedipus> MB: perhaps dojo:done should be different that yahoo:done

Mark Birbeck: perhaps dojo:done should be different that yahoo:done

15:18:08 <oedipus> RM: how do we move forward? next steps?

Roland Merrick: how do we move forward? next steps?

15:18:38 <oedipus> MB: need to ascertain from DOM what were thinking - can attach event with one technique and can fire event with another

Mark Birbeck: need to ascertain from DOM what were thinking - can attach event with one technique and can fire event with another

15:18:46 <oedipus> MB: what is effect we are attempting to achieve

Mark Birbeck: what is effect we are attempting to achieve

15:19:06 <oedipus> MB: at script level could register event using AddEventListenerNS

Mark Birbeck: at script level could register event using AddEventListenerNS

15:19:59 <oedipus> MB: also generic AddEventListener - if author writes DOM2 code to register event, another author may write a DOM3 firing of event using different methods; may be why said xyz_bar same as foo:bar

Mark Birbeck: also generic AddEventListener - if author writes DOM2 code to register event, another author may write a DOM3 firing of event using different methods; may be why said xyz_bar same as foo:bar

15:20:19 <oedipus> MB: doesn't bring us any closer to next step, though...

Mark Birbeck: doesn't bring us any closer to next step, though...

15:20:52 <oedipus> RM: perhaps have to step back and ask question: "Do we think we should accomodate DOM2 events or move forward and use DOM3 events"

Roland Merrick: perhaps have to step back and ask question: "Do we think we should accomodate DOM2 events or move forward and use DOM3 events"

15:21:00 <oedipus> RM: should we tie ourselves to DOM3?

Roland Merrick: should we tie ourselves to DOM3?

15:21:40 <oedipus> MB: i would no, interim step here -- XForms uses DOM2 events, ended up with if and for which migrated to XML Events

Mark Birbeck: i would no, interim step here -- XForms uses DOM2 events, ended up with if and for which migrated to XML Events

15:22:36 <oedipus> MB: reason for qnames addition, was to support future when DOM3 finalized; follow evolution of DOM2 events into DOM3 -- if can't figure out solution, should leave out qnames for now -- would not want to be tied to DOM3 Events because may not be done for 4 years

Mark Birbeck: reason for qnames addition, was to support future when DOM3 finalized; follow evolution of DOM2 events into DOM3 -- if can't figure out solution, should leave out qnames for now -- would not want to be tied to DOM3 Events because may not be done for 4 years

15:22:50 <oedipus> RM: other thoughts?

Roland Merrick: other thoughts?

15:23:26 <oedipus> SM: can go back to DOM2 Events; could potentially provide guidance - intent to support qnames via DOM3 Events in future, and devs might want to keep that in mind

Shane McCarron: can go back to DOM2 Events; could potentially provide guidance - intent to support qnames via DOM3 Events in future, and devs might want to keep that in mind

15:23:45 <oedipus> SM: unfortunate Steven not here; would like to hear his input before make decision

Shane McCarron: unfortunate Steven not here; would like to hear his input before make decision

15:23:53 <alessio> true

Alessio Cartocci: true

15:24:05 <oedipus> RM: thinking about the issues won't harm us, only benefit us

Roland Merrick: thinking about the issues won't harm us, only benefit us

15:24:48 <oedipus> RM: soften question about DOM3 - should support DOM3, but requiring DOM3 different; capable of supporting DOM3 in compatability mode from earlier versions

Roland Merrick: soften question about DOM3 - should support DOM3, but requiring DOM3 different; capable of supporting DOM3 in compatability mode from earlier versions

15:25:09 <oedipus> RM: add new features from capability point of view; can support some DOM3 features when deployed

Roland Merrick: add new features from capability point of view; can support some DOM3 features when deployed

15:25:27 <oedipus> SM: like that story-line -- trying to get XML Events 2 deployed now

Shane McCarron: like that story-line -- trying to get XML Events 2 deployed now

15:26:15 <oedipus> RM: entire WG should take time to review this -- anyone want to write up proposal and send to mailing list to capture the position we reached today, then revisit at call in 2 week's time

Roland Merrick: entire WG should take time to review this -- anyone want to write up proposal and send to mailing list to capture the position we reached today, then revisit at call in 2 week's time

15:26:24 <oedipus> [complete silence]

[complete silence]

15:26:36 <oedipus> RM: anyone want to try and summarize where we just go to?

Roland Merrick: anyone want to try and summarize where we just go to?

15:26:42 <oedipus> SM: can do in an email

Shane McCarron: can do in an email

15:26:45 <oedipus> RM: thanks, shane

Roland Merrick: thanks, shane

15:26:59 <oedipus> TOPIC: Upcoming Calls

4. Upcoming Calls

15:27:10 <oedipus> RM: next week is thanksgiving - will there be enough attendees?

Roland Merrick: next week is thanksgiving - will there be enough attendees?

15:27:13 <oedipus> SM: available

Shane McCarron: available

15:27:17 <oedipus> TH: available

Tina Holmboe: available

15:27:19 <oedipus> AC: no

Alessio Cartocci: yes

15:27:21 <oedipus> MB: no

Mark Birbeck: no

15:27:23 <oedipus> GJR: yes

Gregory Rosmaita: yes

15:27:33 <oedipus> s/AC: no/AC: yes
15:27:37 <alessio> :)

Alessio Cartocci: :)

15:27:38 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

15:27:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

15:28:05 <oedipus> RM: i will - SP has actions to clear before he takes off in december - will ask him to clear as much as can before december

Roland Merrick: i will - SP has actions to clear before he takes off in december - will ask him to clear as much as can before december

15:28:33 <oedipus> RM: leave decision on DOM2 and DOM3 to meeting 2 weeks from today - Mark will you be here?

Roland Merrick: leave decision on DOM2 and DOM3 to meeting 2 weeks from today - Mark will you be here?

15:28:42 <oedipus> MB: no, unavailable

Mark Birbeck: no, unavailable

15:28:56 <ShaneM> ACTION: Shane to write a quick summary of the position w.r.t. DOM2 vs. DOM3 in XML Events 2

ACTION: Shane to write a quick summary of the position w.r.t. DOM2 vs. DOM3 in XML Events 2

15:28:56 <trackbot> Created ACTION-33 - Write a quick summary of the position w.r.t. DOM2 vs. DOM3 in XML Events 2 [on Shane McCarron - due 2008-11-26].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-33 - Write a quick summary of the position w.r.t. DOM2 vs. DOM3 in XML Events 2 [on Shane McCarron - due 2008-11-26].

15:29:01 <oedipus> RM: can you make sure you get your views and opinions onto emailing list so can make decision

Roland Merrick: can you make sure you get your views and opinions onto emailing list so can make decision

15:29:03 <oedipus> MB: yes

Mark Birbeck: yes

15:29:21 <oedipus> TOPIC: Roadmap for XHTML2

5. Roadmap for XHTML2

15:29:37 <oedipus> RM: gregory been pushing; believe agreed should get new draft out; what were we waiting for

Roland Merrick: gregory been pushing; believe agreed should get new draft out; what were we waiting for

15:29:42 <oedipus> SM: editing cycles

Shane McCarron: editing cycles

15:29:55 <oedipus> RM: like to get to LC by end of first quarter of next year?

Roland Merrick: like to get to LC by end of first quarter of next year?

15:30:07 <oedipus> SM: a year ago was next public draft would be LC --

Shane McCarron: a year ago was next public draft would be LC --

15:30:26 <oedipus> RM: think at june f2f decided to publish public draft

Roland Merrick: think at june f2f decided to publish public draft

15:30:31 <oedipus> SM: need to get to it

Shane McCarron: need to get to it

15:30:54 <oedipus> RM: when can we get a draft out?  by moritorium - next month

Roland Merrick: when can we get a draft out? by moritorium - next month

15:30:58 <oedipus> SM: moritorium?

Shane McCarron: moritorium?

15:31:07 <oedipus> RM: normally one during holiday period

Roland Merrick: normally one during holiday period

15:31:18 <oedipus> RM: can we get another draft by 2 weeks

Roland Merrick: can we get another draft by 2 weeks

15:31:45 <oedipus> SM: everything else done, so have more time to work on XHTML2 and XML Events

Shane McCarron: everything else done, so have more time to work on XHTML2 and XML Events

15:32:12 <oedipus> RM: will try and draft a roadmap for XHTML2 that we can then discuss as to its reasonableness at next week's call

Roland Merrick: will try and draft a roadmap for XHTML2 that we can then discuss as to its reasonableness at next week's call

15:32:39 <oedipus> ACTION: Roland - draft roadmap for XHTML2 to discuss reasonableness at next call

ACTION: Roland - draft roadmap for XHTML2 to discuss reasonableness at next call

15:32:39 <trackbot> Created ACTION-34 - - draft roadmap for XHTML2 to discuss reasonableness at next call [on Roland Merrick - due 2008-11-26].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-34 - - draft roadmap for XHTML2 to discuss reasonableness at next call [on Roland Merrick - due 2008-11-26].

15:33:16 <oedipus> TOPIC: ????

XHTML Mime

15:33:27 <oedipus> SM: addressed all of opera's issues; ready to go

Shane McCarron: addressed all of opera's issues; ready to go

15:34:05 <oedipus> s/TOPIC: ????/XHTML Mime
15:34:22 <oedipus> SM: have a free weekend, so expect to get work done

Shane McCarron: have a free weekend, so expect to get work done

15:34:30 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

15:34:30 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

15:34:41 <oedipus> TOPIC: Lingering Items

6. Lingering Items

15:35:06 <oedipus> RM: PERs for 1.1 (dependent upon having new note on mime); continue with modularization

Roland Merrick: PERs for 1.1 (dependent upon having new note on mime); continue with modularization

15:35:39 <oedipus> SM: all done -- PERs ready - just need date; depends on whether can get CR stuff in and if can do anything when steven gone for a month

Shane McCarron: all done -- PERs ready - just need date; depends on whether can get CR stuff in and if can do anything when steven gone for a month

15:35:50 <oedipus> RM: i will discuss PERs with steven

Roland Merrick: i will discuss PERs with steven

15:36:15 <oedipus> SM: happy to have meeting with RM and SP to come up with work plan for December

Shane McCarron: happy to have meeting with RM and SP to come up with work plan for December

15:36:25 <oedipus> TOPIC: Action Item Review

7. Action Item Review

15:36:37 <oedipus> SM: action 4 - replying to forms content on access module

Shane McCarron: ACTION-4 - replying to forms content on access module

15:36:41 <ShaneM> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/4

Shane McCarron: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/tracker/actions/4

15:37:10 <oedipus> SM: replied formally to TAG on 18 October 2008; not acknowledged; think can close with a "no response"

Shane McCarron: replied formally to TAG on 18 October 2008; not acknowledged; think can close with a "no response"

15:37:43 <oedipus> RM: MarkB, could you bring this up in XForms call?

Roland Merrick: MarkB, could you bring this up in XForms call?

15:38:55 <oedipus> ACTION: Mark - ask XForms about Access Module concerns

ACTION: Mark - ask XForms about Access Module concerns

15:38:55 <trackbot> Created ACTION-35 - - ask XForms about Access Module concerns [on Mark Birbeck - due 2008-11-26].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-35 - - ask XForms about Access Module concerns [on Mark Birbeck - due 2008-11-26].

15:39:43 <ShaneM> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2008Oct/0011.html

Shane McCarron: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2008Oct/0011.html

15:39:46 <oedipus> SM: may not have been responded because didn't submit LC to right list - sent to www-html not to our either of public lists

Shane McCarron: may not have been responded because didn't submit LC to right list - sent to www-html not to our either of public lists

15:40:00 <oedipus> SM: Mark, please ask them to look at the post referenced above

Shane McCarron: Mark, please ask them to look at the post referenced above

15:40:14 <oedipus> SM: with respect to action 4 will put in link to related email, but think should close

Shane McCarron: with respect to ACTION-4 will put in link to related email, but think should close

15:40:25 <oedipus> RM: agree - action was to reply

Roland Merrick: agree - action was to reply

15:41:13 <oedipus> TH: issue on roadmap - 4 different types of list comment

Tina Holmboe: issue on roadmap - 4 different types of list comment

15:41:18 <oedipus> RM: can we clear in 5 minutes

Roland Merrick: can we clear in 5 minutes

15:41:53 <oedipus> TH: initial reaction is to suggest that we say "thank you for your opinion, but we don't agree with you" don't think should go from specific set of elements to generic set of elements

Tina Holmboe: initial reaction is to suggest that we say "thank you for your opinion, but we don't agree with you" don't think should go from specific set of elements to generic set of elements

15:42:10 <oedipus> RM: last week we said we had 4; feeling was 3 is good, but is NL necessary

Roland Merrick: last week we said we had 4; feeling was 3 is good, but is NL necessary

15:42:14 <oedipus> TH: need more, not less

Tina Holmboe: need more, not less

15:42:31 <oedipus> TH: NL is a generic list of links with specific semantics which UL doesn't have

Tina Holmboe: NL is a generic list of links with specific semantics which UL doesn't have

15:42:58 <oedipus> RM: could use any of other 3 list types with role="navigation"

Roland Merrick: could use any of other 3 list types with role="navigation"

15:43:38 <oedipus> SM: NL implies certain behavior and certain semantics about content; NL implies orderedness that UL does not, and OL is inappropriate construct for navigation

Shane McCarron: NL implies certain behavior and certain semantics about content; NL implies orderedness that UL does not, and OL is inappropriate construct for navigation

15:43:45 <oedipus> GJR: plus 1 on keeping NL

Gregory Rosmaita: plus 1 on keeping NL

15:44:03 <_alessio> +1 too

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown _alessio: +1 too

15:44:24 <oedipus> MB: don't like NL -- my problem is why stop at NL, why not video list -- ability to turn anything into hyperlink in XHTML2 hard to figure out the semantics;

Mark Birbeck: don't like NL -- my problem is why stop at NL, why not video list -- ability to turn anything into hyperlink in XHTML2 hard to figure out the semantics;

15:44:41 <oedipus> MB: understand why added NL, but think that role made superfluous

Mark Birbeck: understand why added NL, but think that role made superfluous

15:45:13 <oedipus> TH: semantics, traditionally, has been placed in element type name; UL, OL, DL, and generic list with role="navigation"

Tina Holmboe: semantics, traditionally, has been placed in element type name; UL, OL, DL, and generic list with role="navigation"

15:45:19 <oedipus> MB: what is generic list?

Mark Birbeck: what is generic list?

15:45:25 <oedipus> SM: not thinking of adding generic list

Shane McCarron: not thinking of adding generic list

15:45:46 <oedipus> MB: either use semantics to clarify lists (people tend to use @class to do that)

Mark Birbeck: either use semantics to clarify lists (people tend to use @class to do that)

15:45:50 <Roland_> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/html5/#the-nav-element

Roland Merrick: http://www.w3.org/html/wg/html5/#the-nav-element

15:46:06 <oedipus> RM: HTML5 dealt with this with nav element

Roland Merrick: HTML5 dealt with this with nav element

15:46:42 <oedipus> TH: like to see "inline list", but need to look at our philosophy; strictly speaking could end up with 1 element and 3 attributes; big step away from precedent

Tina Holmboe: like to see "inline list", but need to look at our philosophy; strictly speaking could end up with 1 element and 3 attributes; big step away from precedent

15:47:49 <oedipus> MB: guiding prinicple of XHTML2 is "less is more" -- do talk about not having just DIVs and SPANs, but ensuring hooks in language so that people can add own semantics - that's what @role introduced;

Mark Birbeck: guiding prinicple of XHTML2 is "less is more" -- do talk about not having just DIVs and SPANs, but ensuring hooks in language so that people can add own semantics - that's what @role introduced;

15:48:09 <oedipus> TH: can extend as needed in XHTML M12n framework - extend XHTML via namespaces

Tina Holmboe: can extend as needed in XHTML M12n framework - extend XHTML via namespaces

15:48:19 <_alessio> I'm not against nl but I see some warnings for nested lists

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown _alessio: I'm not against nl but I see some warnings for nested lists

15:48:44 <oedipus> MB: you are saying that preferred extension method should be elements; have to write special module for extension

Mark Birbeck: you are saying that preferred extension method should be elements; have to write special module for extension

15:48:56 <_alessio> for example what about an unordered list with his role="navigation" inside an nl?

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown _alessio: for example what about an unordered list with his role="navigation" inside an nl?

15:49:13 <oedipus> MB: other method is use attributes and allow identifier in there - with role and RDFa used RDF identifiers or URIs to merge with semantic web

Mark Birbeck: other method is use attributes and allow identifier in there - with role and RDFa used RDF identifiers or URIs to merge with semantic web

15:49:23 <oedipus> q+

q+

15:49:55 <oedipus> GJR: there are XML derived modules for shipping addresses and such

Gregory Rosmaita: there are XML derived modules for shipping addresses and such

15:51:38 <ShaneM> sorry - I have to run

Shane McCarron: sorry - I have to run

15:51:44 <Zakim> -ShaneM

Zakim IRC Bot: -ShaneM

15:51:50 <oedipus> RM: need to examine HTML5 additions

Roland Merrick: need to examine HTML5 additions

15:51:58 <_alessio> agree

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown _alessio: agree

15:52:57 <markbirbeck> bye...have to go to XForms call

Mark Birbeck: bye...have to go to XForms call

15:53:02 <Zakim> -markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: -markbirbeck

15:53:09 <oedipus> RM: good to document philosophy behind XHTML2

Roland Merrick: good to document philosophy behind XHTML2

15:53:17 <oedipus> GJR: good place to start is verbiage in spec

Gregory Rosmaita: good place to start is with the extant Introduction (http:\

15:53:28 <oedipus> TH: can't avoid what authors doing

Tina Holmboe: can't avoid what authors doing

15:53:33 <oedipus> RM: need to develop policy

Roland Merrick: need to develop policy

15:54:13 <oedipus> RM: should spend time thinking about a policy to apply would be useful

Roland Merrick: should spend time thinking about a policy to apply would be useful

15:54:36 <oedipus> RM: prefer do on overall approach on how we deal with issues instead of one-off solutions and ad hoc solutions

Roland Merrick: prefer do on overall approach on how we deal with issues instead of one-off solutions and ad hoc solutions

15:54:41 <Zakim> -Roland

Zakim IRC Bot: -Roland

15:54:43 <Zakim> -Alessio

Zakim IRC Bot: -Alessio

15:54:47 <Zakim> -Gregory_Rosmaita

Zakim IRC Bot: -Gregory_Rosmaita

15:54:49 <Zakim> -Tina

Zakim IRC Bot: -Tina

15:54:49 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended

15:54:50 <Zakim> Attendees were Roland, +04670855aaaa, Tina, Gregory_Rosmaita, ShaneM, Alessio, markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were Roland, +04670855aaaa, Tina, Gregory_Rosmaita, ShaneM, Alessio, markbirbeck

15:55:14 <_alessio> bye! :)

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Scribe problem: the name '_alessio' does not match any of the 22 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown _alessio: bye! :)

15:55:24 <oedipus> zakim, please part

zakim, please part

15:55:35 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

15:55:35 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

15:57:40 <oedipus> present- +04670855aaaa

present- +04670855aaaa

15:57:45 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

15:57:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

16:00:49 <oedipus> s/good place to start is verbiage in spec/good place to start is with the extant Introduction (http:\/\/www.w3.org\/MarkUp\/2007\/ED-xhtml2-20071024\/introduction.html#s_intro_whatisxhtml2)
16:00:53 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

16:00:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

16:01:23 <oedipus> s/RS: regrets from/RM: regrets from
16:01:24 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

16:01:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

16:01:51 <oedipus> s/good place to start is verbiage in spec/good place to start is with the extant Introduction
16:01:54 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes

rrsagent, make minutes

16:01:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

16:02:34 <Tina> oedipus: might be one too many /s in that URI

Gregory Rosmaita: might be one too many /s in that URI [ Scribe Assist by Tina Holmboe ]

16:03:00 <oedipus> tina: yeah, it didn't work, so i just left it at "Introduction" <grin>

Tina Holmboe: yeah, it didn't work, so i just left it at "Introduction" <grin>

16:03:10 <Tina> oedipus: mm.

Gregory Rosmaita: mm. [ Scribe Assist by Tina Holmboe ]

16:03:29 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-xhtml2-20071024/introduction.html#s_intro_whatisxhtml2">

http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-xhtml2-20071024/introduction.html#s_intro_whatisxhtml2">

16:04:25 <oedipus> tina: the bullet-pointed Design Aims (1.1.1.) is what i quote to people when they ask why XHTML2

Tina Holmboe: the bullet-pointed Design Aims (1.1.1.) is what i quote to people when they ask why XHTML2

16:04:52 <Tina> oedipus: its certainly an interesting list.

Gregory Rosmaita: its certainly an interesting list. [ Scribe Assist by Tina Holmboe ]

16:05:27 <oedipus> tina: it is why DAISY wants to use XHTML2 as the basis for the new digital talking book spec

Tina Holmboe: it is why DAISY wants to use XHTML2 as the basis for the new digital talking book spec

16:06:12 <oedipus> i've been asked to collaborate on the ZedNext project, as it is code-named, and DAISY's chief technical officer is keen to join the WG

i've been asked to collaborate on the ZedNext project, as it is code-named, and DAISY's chief technical officer is keen to join the WG

16:06:16 <Tina> oedipus: I found that an interesting project; thank you for mentioning it.

Gregory Rosmaita: I found that an interesting project; thank you for mentioning it. [ Scribe Assist by Tina Holmboe ]

16:06:45 <oedipus> tina: that's what the web/'net's about - sharing what one finds

Tina Holmboe: that's what the web/'net's about - sharing what one finds

16:07:01 <oedipus> rrsagent, please part

rrsagent, please part

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> I see 6 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-actions.rdf :

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see 6 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-actions.rdf :

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Steven - request CR Transition for Role Module [1]

ACTION: Steven - request CR Transition for Role Module [1]

16:07:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T14-50-23

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T14-50-23

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Steven - request CR transition for Access Module [2]

ACTION: Steven - request CR transition for Access Module [2]

16:07:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T14-50-39

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T14-50-39

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to update XML Events 2 draft so it has a diff mark to previous public working draft AND to the previous recommendation [3]

ACTION: Shane to update XML Events 2 draft so it has a diff mark to previous public working draft AND to the previous recommendation [3]

16:07:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T14-53-06

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T14-53-06

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to write a quick summary of the position w.r.t. DOM2 vs. DOM3 in XML Events 2 [4]

ACTION: Shane to write a quick summary of the position w.r.t. DOM2 vs. DOM3 in XML Events 2 [4]

16:07:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T15-28-56

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T15-28-56

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Roland - draft roadmap for XHTML2 to discuss reasonableness at next call [5]

ACTION: Roland - draft roadmap for XHTML2 to discuss reasonableness at next call [5]

16:07:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T15-32-39

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T15-32-39

16:07:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Mark - ask XForms about Access Module concerns [6]

ACTION: Mark - ask XForms about Access Module concerns [6]

16:07:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T15-38-55

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/11/19-xhtml-irc#T15-38-55

16:07:18 <Tina> oedipus: Mm.

Gregory Rosmaita: Mm. [ Scribe Assist by Tina Holmboe ]



Formatted by CommonScribe