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XHTML2 WG Weekly Teleconference

Minutes of 26 March 2008

Agenda
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Mar/0056.html
Seen
Gregory Rosmaita, Mark Birbeck, Roland Merrick, Shane McCarron, Steven Pemberton, Tina Holmboe, Toshihiko Yamakami
Regrets
Tina Holmboe, Toshihiko Yamakami
Chair
Roland Merrick
Scribe
Gregory Rosmaita
IRC Log
Original
Resolutions
  1. CSS NS must at least point out that there is change in CSS link
  2. CURIEs issues closed - will move forward to LC link
Topics
13:41:51 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-irc

13:42:32 <rmerric> topic http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Mar/0056.html

Roland Merrick: topic http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Mar/0056.html

13:42:46 <rmerric> rmerric has changed the topic to: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Mar/0056.html

Roland Merrick: rmerric has changed the topic to: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Mar/0056.html

13:43:12 <Roland> Zakim, this will be XHTML2

Roland Merrick: Zakim, this will be XHTML2

13:43:12 <Zakim> ok, Roland, I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM already started

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Roland, I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM already started

13:43:31 <Roland> Zakim, list

Roland Merrick: Zakim, list

13:43:31 <Zakim> I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM, Team_W3M()8:00AM, WAI_ERTWG()9:30AM active

Zakim IRC Bot: I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM, Team_W3M()8:00AM, WAI_ERTWG()9:30AM active

13:43:33 <Zakim> also scheduled at this time is I18N_TS()9:00AM

Zakim IRC Bot: also scheduled at this time is I18N_TS()9:00AM

13:44:46 <Roland> Zakim, who is here

Roland Merrick: Zakim, who is here

13:44:46 <Zakim> Roland, you need to end that query with '?'

Zakim IRC Bot: Roland, you need to end that query with '?'

13:44:56 <Roland> Zakim, who is here?

Roland Merrick: Zakim, who is here?

13:44:56 <Zakim> On the phone I see +0138687aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see +0138687aaaa

13:44:57 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Lachy, ShaneM_, krijn

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Lachy, ShaneM_, krijn

13:45:12 <Roland> Zakim, aaaa is Roland

Roland Merrick: Zakim, aaaa is Roland

13:45:12 <Zakim> +Roland; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +Roland; got it

13:45:25 <Roland> Zakim, who is here?

Roland Merrick: Zakim, who is here?

13:45:25 <Zakim> On the phone I see Roland

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Roland

13:45:26 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Lachy, krijn

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Lachy, krijn

13:46:09 <ShaneM> note that I will be a few minutes late - child conflict this AM

Shane McCarron: note that I will be a few minutes late - child conflict this AM

13:47:01 <Steven> zakim, who is here?

Steven Pemberton: zakim, who is here?

13:47:01 <Zakim> On the phone I see Roland

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Roland

13:47:02 <Zakim> On IRC I see Steven, markbirbeck, ShaneM, RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Lachy, krijn

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Steven, markbirbeck, ShaneM, RRSAgent, Zakim, Roland, oedipus, Lachy, krijn

13:47:15 <Steven> zakim, dial steven-617

Steven Pemberton: zakim, dial steven-617

13:47:15 <Zakim> ok, Steven; the call is being made

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Steven; the call is being made

13:47:15 <Roland> Meeting: XHTML2 WG Weekly Teleconference
13:47:16 <Zakim> +Steven

Zakim IRC Bot: +Steven

13:47:24 <Roland> Chair: Roland
13:47:42 <Roland> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Mar/0056.html
13:47:50 <Steven> Regrets: Tina, Yam
13:48:58 <markbirbeck> zakim, code?

Mark Birbeck: zakim, code?

13:48:58 <Zakim> the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck

13:49:15 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmaita

Zakim IRC Bot: +Gregory_Rosmaita

13:49:28 <Zakim> + +0208761aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: + +0208761aabb

13:49:34 <markbirbeck> zakim i am aabb

Mark Birbeck: zakim i am aabb

13:49:42 <markbirbeck> zakim, i am aabb

Mark Birbeck: zakim, i am aabb

13:49:42 <Zakim> +markbirbeck; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markbirbeck; got it

13:51:10 <Steven> -> http://www.w3.org/2008/03/19-xhtml-minutes Previous

Steven Pemberton: -> http://www.w3.org/2008/03/19-xhtml-minutes Previous

13:53:25 <oedipus> regrets+ Alessio

Gregory Rosmaita: regrets+ Alessio

13:56:51 <oedipus> scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita

(Scribe set to Gregory Rosmaita)

13:56:59 <oedipus> scribeNick: oedipus
13:57:14 <oedipus> TOPIC: CSS Namespace

1. CSS Namespace

13:57:42 <oedipus> SP: we asked for 3 things: drop it or deprecate it or point it out in the spec that this is a change in CSS and this is how you avoid problems;

Steven Pemberton: we asked for 3 things: drop it or deprecate it or point it out in the spec that this is a change in CSS and this is how you avoid problems;

13:58:11 <oedipus> SP: said will ignore comments -- replied to that: asked if refusing to merely pointing out in spec ok

Steven Pemberton: said will ignore comments -- replied to that: asked if refusing to merely pointing out in spec ok

13:58:29 <oedipus> SP: accept disapproval or get an answer, but if no, have to document before CR

Steven Pemberton: accept disapproval or get an answer, but if no, have to document before CR

13:59:09 <oedipus> SP: this has a 1 week heartbeat, so if they accept to point out in spc, we are ok; need to deciide what to do if don't accept any part of our comments?

Steven Pemberton: this has a 1 week heartbeat, so if they accept to point out in spc, we are ok; need to deciide what to do if don't accept any part of our comments?

13:59:22 <oedipus> SP: object or accept the fact they rejected our comments/suggestion

Steven Pemberton: object or accept the fact they rejected our comments/suggestion

13:59:53 <oedipus> SP: don't think much to ask to ask them at the minimum to point out that this is a change in CSS; if don't should say not sufficient, as it is a change in CSS

Steven Pemberton: don't think much to ask to ask them at the minimum to point out that this is a change in CSS; if don't should say not sufficient, as it is a change in CSS

13:59:59 <oedipus> RM: inclined to agree

Roland Merrick: inclined to agree

14:00:32 <oedipus> SP: not much to ask -- don't have to change implementations -- is WG ok with us saying that the least we want them to do is point it out in spec?

Steven Pemberton: not much to ask -- don't have to change implementations -- is WG ok with us saying that the least we want them to do is point it out in spec?

14:01:04 <oedipus> RESOLVED: CSS NS must at least point out that there is change in CSS

RESOLVED: CSS NS must at least point out that there is change in CSS

14:01:15 <oedipus> TOPIC: XHTML M12n

2. XHTML M12n

14:01:51 <oedipus> SP: waiting on Shane to make a new iteration of draft; he's done that, so i'm emailing steve bratt and going throough points and pointing to new spec and asking if ok with transition

Steven Pemberton: waiting on Shane to make a new iteration of draft; he's done that, so i'm emailing steve bratt and going throough points and pointing to new spec and asking if ok with transition

14:01:57 <oedipus> RM: just going through process

Roland Merrick: just going through process

14:02:15 <oedipus> ACTION: StevenP - point SteveB to new wording in M12n

ACTION: StevenP - point SteveB to new wording in M12n

14:02:34 <oedipus> SP: "would you have a look at the new/latest version of the report"

Steven Pemberton: "would you have a look at the new/latest version of the report"

14:02:46 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2008/xhtml-basic-11-implementation.html

Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2008/xhtml-basic-11-implementation.html

14:03:12 <oedipus> SP: at bottom, there is a pointer to Yam's response and test report

Steven Pemberton: at bottom, there is a pointer to Yam's response and test report

14:03:46 <oedipus> [please stand by -- we are temporarily experiencing technical difficulties]

[please stand by -- we are temporarily experiencing technical difficulties]

14:04:05 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2008/a-w3c-inputmode-test-report071130.pdf

Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2008/a-w3c-inputmode-test-report071130.pdf

14:04:19 <oedipus> SP: need to correct test report with above URI

Steven Pemberton: need to correct test report with above URI

14:05:03 <oedipus> SP: [fixed implementation report - can now get PDF report from draft]

Steven Pemberton: [fixed implementation report - can now get PDF report from draft]

14:05:11 <oedipus> MB: input mode?

Mark Birbeck: input mode?

14:06:09 <oedipus> SP: since rest has been implemented, only new item is input mode -- we had exchange with Steve Bratt to see if ok to have single implementation because is optional feature, and he said that was ok; have to organize another transition call with SteveB

Steven Pemberton: since rest has been implemented, only new item is input mode -- we had exchange with Steve Bratt to see if ok to have single implementation because is optional feature, and he said that was ok; have to organize another transition call with SteveB

14:06:23 <oedipus> RM: see if he's happy then schedule LC

Roland Merrick: see if he's happy then schedule LC

14:06:33 <oedipus> SP: will take us to CR

Steven Pemberton: will take us to CR

14:06:53 <oedipus> ACTION SP: ensure SteveB ok with single implementation and get transition in progress

ACTION SP: ensure SteveB ok with single implementation and get transition in progress

14:07:15 <oedipus> TOPIC: Mime Type

3. Mime Type

14:08:24 <oedipus> SP: Karl seems to think anything not absolutely valid and without application/xml mime-type is NOT xhtml -- that's only a single person's opinion

Steven Pemberton: Karl seems to think anything not absolutely valid and without application/xml mime-type is NOT xhtml -- that's only a single person's opinion

14:08:34 <oedipus> SP: DanC agrees with us but doesn't see the problem

Steven Pemberton: DanC agrees with us but doesn't see the problem

14:08:59 <oedipus> SP: will discuss at this week's HTC call -- request discussion now or simply move ahead

Steven Pemberton: will discuss at this week's HTC call -- request discussion now or simply move ahead

14:09:39 <oedipus> RM: prepare materials to be published as part of the mime-types first draft; explain what we have done, what has changed, and what is purpose, can then bring up at HTC

Roland Merrick: prepare materials to be published as part of the mime-types first draft; explain what we have done, what has changed, and what is purpose, can then bring up at HTC

14:10:05 <oedipus> SP: like fact that there are a lot of major web sites delivering xhtml as text/html -- proves can be done and that it works without doing any harm

Steven Pemberton: like fact that there are a lot of major web sites delivering xhtml as text/html -- proves can be done and that it works without doing any harm

14:10:57 <oedipus> RM: seen doctype "HTML Core" but use closing slashes -- real mixture both ways

Roland Merrick: seen doctype "HTML Core" but use closing slashes -- real mixture both ways

14:11:09 <oedipus> SP: drop line to webmaster to change doctype

Steven Pemberton: drop line to webmaster to change doctype

14:11:34 <oedipus> GJR: FYI: the "official" format of Open Accessibility (http://a11y.org) specs is XHTML 1.0 Strict

Gregory Rosmaita: FYI: the "official" format of Open Accessibility (http://a11y.org) specs is XHTML 1.0 Strict

14:11:44 <oedipus> SP: Shane preparing new draft to take to HTC

Steven Pemberton: Shane preparing new draft to take to HTC

14:11:56 <oedipus> RM: don't foresee any problem -- already allowed

Roland Merrick: don't foresee any problem -- already allowed

14:12:12 <oedipus> TOPIC: CURIE Transition

4. CURIE Transition

14:12:31 <oedipus> RM: everything ready to go, but we don't have shane on call -- suggestions as to topics while we wait

Roland Merrick: everything ready to go, but we don't have shane on call -- suggestions as to topics while we wait

14:12:48 <oedipus> SP: could briefly talk about TAG's opinion about mime-type when using RDFa

Steven Pemberton: could briefly talk about TAG's opinion about mime-type when using RDFa

14:12:51 <oedipus> RM: pointer?

Roland Merrick: pointer?

14:13:24 <oedipus> SP: comes under RDFa syntax; have action to let TAG know we disagree -- was drafting reply and realized we hadn't spoken with RDFa group, so i raised it at last week's meeting

Steven Pemberton: comes under RDFa syntax; have action to let TAG know we disagree -- was drafting reply and realized we hadn't spoken with RDFa group, so i raised it at last week's meeting

14:13:32 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/2008/03/20-rdfa-minutes.html

Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/2008/03/20-rdfa-minutes.html

14:13:43 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/2008/03/20-rdfa-minutes.html#item02

Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/2008/03/20-rdfa-minutes.html#item02

14:13:52 <oedipus> SP: self-describing web (item 2)

Steven Pemberton: self-describing web (item 2)

14:14:49 <oedipus> SP: BenA (chair of Task Force) asked if TAG wrong; Ralph abstained no one else agreeed; RDFa group almost unanimously agree with us that media type doesn't need to be updated to use RDFa data in HTML

Steven Pemberton: BenA (chair of Task Force) asked if TAG wrong; Ralph abstained no one else agreeed; RDFa group almost unanimously agree with us that media type doesn't need to be updated to use RDFa data in HTML

14:14:54 <oedipus> RM: namespace?

Roland Merrick: namespace?

14:15:11 <Zakim> +McCarron

Zakim IRC Bot: +McCarron

14:15:23 <oedipus> SP: don't understand TAG point at all or what is foundation of belief -- hard to argue against updating media type

Steven Pemberton: don't understand TAG point at all or what is foundation of belief -- hard to argue against updating media type

14:16:04 <oedipus> MB: TAG logic is that somebody should not be held accountable for statements made unless accountability indicator

Mark Birbeck: TAG logic is that somebody should not be held accountable for statements made unless accountability indicator

14:16:19 <oedipus> SM: proposed wording towards end of last call

Shane McCarron: proposed wording towards end of last call

14:16:38 <oedipus> SP: norm walsh proposed wording or you (ShaneM) proposed wording

Steven Pemberton: norm walsh proposed wording or you (ShaneM) proposed wording

14:17:06 <oedipus> MB: NormW raised issues, ShaneM replied, and everything was ok -- Norm's was most vocal objection, and we have cleared it

Mark Birbeck: NormW raised issues, ShaneM replied, and everything was ok -- Norm's was most vocal objection, and we have cleared it

14:17:10 <oedipus> SP: pointer?

Steven Pemberton: pointer?

14:17:33 <oedipus> SM: has an issue number in tracker (not at PC)

Shane McCarron: has an issue number in tracker (not at PC)

14:18:11 <oedipus> SM: suggested wording something like "conforming parsers MUST extract triples if present; authors who want to use triples should use proper methods" or words to that effect

Shane McCarron: suggested wording something like "conforming parsers MUST extract triples if present; authors who want to use triples should use proper methods" or words to that effect

14:18:21 <oedipus> RM: where can we find the exchange

Roland Merrick: where can we find the exchange

14:18:29 <oedipus> SM: in the RDFa task force log somewhere

Shane McCarron: in the RDFa task force log somewhere

14:18:40 <oedipus> SP: NormW's emails all about missing @profile in test case

Steven Pemberton: NormW's emails all about missing @profile in test case

14:19:03 <oedipus> SM: origin of issue; DanC asked why test cases didn't all have @profile and then others asked why isn't that required

Shane McCarron: origin of issue; DanC asked why test cases didn't all have @profile and then others asked why isn't that required

14:19:32 <oedipus> SP: quotes from NormW -- (pointer?)

Steven Pemberton: quotes from NormW -- (pointer?)

14:19:59 <oedipus> SM: interesting that NW thinks we are changing the meaning of HTML; so does TBL -- don't think we have done that at all

Shane McCarron: interesting that NW thinks we are changing the meaning of HTML; so does TBL -- don't think we have done that at all

14:20:02 <oedipus> SP: me neither

Steven Pemberton: me neither

14:20:05 <oedipus> GJR: nor me

Gregory Rosmaita: nor me

14:20:12 <oedipus> SP: next steps?

Steven Pemberton: next steps?

14:21:22 <oedipus> SP: if this is all result of a LC comment which has been disposed and the commentor has stated publically can live with WG's response, can we move forward -- TAG document only a WD, so can wait until before LC to comment upon that

Steven Pemberton: if this is all result of a LC comment which has been disposed and the commentor has stated publically can live with WG's response, can we move forward -- TAG document only a WD, so can wait until before LC to comment upon that

14:21:34 <oedipus> SP: new doctype

Steven Pemberton: new doctype

14:21:48 <oedipus> SM: not new media type, but new  doctype

Shane McCarron: not new media type, but new doctype

14:21:55 <oedipus> RM: but have introduced new doctype for this

Roland Merrick: but have introduced new doctype for this

14:22:33 <oedipus> SP: want one to be able to ID documents that have RDFa in it; then TBL says doctypes are obsolete and advises us to remove DTD...

Steven Pemberton: want one to be able to ID documents that have RDFa in it; then TBL says doctypes are obsolete and advises us to remove DTD...

14:22:57 <oedipus> SP: but, having said that, have "version" attribute in XHTML -- is an announcement mechanism, so should point that out to TAG

Steven Pemberton: but, having said that, have "version" attribute in XHTML -- is an announcement mechanism, so should point that out to TAG

14:23:23 <oedipus> SP: have we finalized format of "version" attribute -- struck me that one possible format is identify used in DOCTYPE --

Steven Pemberton: have we finalized format of "version" attribute -- struck me that one possible format is identify used in DOCTYPE --

14:23:29 <oedipus> SM: exactly what is in there now

Shane McCarron: exactly what is in there now

14:23:40 <oedipus> SM: inconsistent with XHTML 1.0 and 1.1 and Basic

Shane McCarron: inconsistent with XHTML 1.0 and 1.1 and Basic

14:23:56 <oedipus> SM: use longer formal public identifier

Shane McCarron: use longer formal public identifier

14:24:03 <oedipus> SM: never investigated this

Shane McCarron: never investigated this

14:24:56 <oedipus> SP: issues about doctype -- doctype causes current browsers use DTD to switch to standards mode; nowadays have to do that to be in standards mode

Steven Pemberton: issues about doctype -- doctype causes current browsers use DTD to switch to standards mode; nowadays have to do that to be in standards mode

14:25:13 <Zakim> -McCarron

Zakim IRC Bot: -McCarron

14:25:23 <oedipus> SP: second if want character entities, HAVE to use doctypes -- if can't solve those issues, doctypes going to be around for a long time to come

Steven Pemberton: second if want character entities, HAVE to use doctypes -- if can't solve those issues, doctypes going to be around for a long time to come

14:25:36 <Zakim> + +1.763.767.aacc

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.763.767.aacc

14:25:38 <oedipus> RM: that's exactly what problem is

Roland Merrick: that's exactly what problem is

14:25:42 <ShaneM> zakim, aacc is ShaneM

Shane McCarron: zakim, aacc is ShaneM

14:25:42 <Zakim> +ShaneM; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +ShaneM; got it

14:26:02 <oedipus> SP: TBL recently started talking down doctypes and i'm not sure why or why he cares

Steven Pemberton: TBL recently started talking down doctypes and i'm not sure why or why he cares

14:26:22 <oedipus> RM: not playing down doctypes per se, but stating no need for doctype

Roland Merrick: not playing down doctypes per se, but stating no need for doctype

14:26:27 <oedipus> SP: shouldn't be a "must"

Steven Pemberton: shouldn't be a "must"

14:26:38 <oedipus> RM: just said "remove doctypes" from our specs, not the world

Roland Merrick: just said "remove doctypes" from our specs, not the world

14:26:45 <oedipus> SM: i thought he said remove DTD

Shane McCarron: i thought he said remove DTD

14:26:49 <oedipus> RM: what's the diff?

Roland Merrick: what's the diff?

14:26:58 <oedipus> SM: DTD schema declaration

Shane McCarron: DTD schema declaration

14:27:24 <oedipus> RM: remove doctype requirement, not forcing loading of DTD -- if want to validate, need to keep doctype

Roland Merrick: remove doctype requirement, not forcing loading of DTD -- if want to validate, need to keep doctype

14:28:03 <oedipus> SM: reads from TBL -- besides, don't have "must" but "should"

Shane McCarron: reads from TBL -- besides, don't have "must" but "should"

14:28:16 <oedipus> RM: what ascpect of that do you disagree with -- insist on DTDs forever?

Roland Merrick: what ascpect of that do you disagree with -- insist on DTDs forever?

14:28:39 <oedipus> SM: M12n 1.1 has to have a DTD -- no other implementation technique; second need DTD to validate

Shane McCarron: M12n 1.1 has to have a DTD -- no other implementation technique; second need DTD to validate

14:28:43 <oedipus> SP: doesn't hurt anyone

Steven Pemberton: doesn't hurt anyone

14:29:15 <oedipus> SM: if want XHTML+RDFa to work in current browsers have to have announcement mechanism browsers understand, and that is doctype

Shane McCarron: if want XHTML+RDFa to work in current browsers have to have announcement mechanism browsers understand, and that is doctype

14:29:42 <oedipus> RM: Shane saying we do need announcement mechanism

Roland Merrick: Shane saying we do need announcement mechanism

14:29:53 <oedipus> SM: for it to work in existing browsers

Shane McCarron: for it to work in existing browsers

14:29:59 <oedipus> RM: how does that make a difference?

Roland Merrick: how does that make a difference?

14:30:15 <oedipus> SP: doctype declaration mark is what browsers use to switch into standards mode

Steven Pemberton: doctype declaration mark is what browsers use to switch into standards mode

14:30:40 <oedipus> SM: want XHTML document to render properly

Shane McCarron: want XHTML document to render properly

14:30:56 <oedipus> RM: standards mode about processing, not about processing xhtml

Roland Merrick: standards mode about processing, not about processing xhtml

14:31:19 <oedipus> SM: consistent rendering comes from standards mode

Shane McCarron: consistent rendering comes from standards mode

14:31:34 <oedipus> RM: what has to do with RDFa?

Roland Merrick: what has to do with RDFa?

14:31:53 <oedipus> SM: nothing -- require for consistency amongst the family -- has nothing to do with RDFa, but XHTML

Shane McCarron: nothing -- require for consistency amongst the family -- has nothing to do with RDFa, but XHTML

14:31:59 <oedipus> RM: don't require in RDFa

Roland Merrick: don't require in RDFa

14:32:11 <oedipus> SM: wg told me to make it a "should" a few months ago

Shane McCarron: wg told me to make it a "should" a few months ago

14:32:29 <oedipus> RM: trying to understand what you think we need and why TBL doesn't understand what we need

Roland Merrick: trying to understand what you think we need and why TBL doesn't understand what we need

14:33:34 <oedipus> SP: TBL wants markup that states "this document has RDFa in it" -- DTD not wanted because "old fashioned" -- our response is DTD not required, but is quite useful (for validation, for example) -- does no harm can leave out or include -- also method currently used as marker to declare RDFa

Steven Pemberton: TBL wants markup that states "this document has RDFa in it" -- DTD not wanted because "old fashioned" -- our response is DTD not required, but is quite useful (for validation, for example) -- does no harm can leave out or include -- also method currently used as marker to declare RDFa

14:33:49 <oedipus> SP: if took away would have to invent another markup

Steven Pemberton: if took away would have to invent another markup

14:33:58 <oedipus> SM: have "version" atttribute for that

Shane McCarron: have "version" atttribute for that

14:35:30 <oedipus> SM: all that aside, issue of XHTML family docs and behavior when delivered as text/html -- another thread; note suggests that way to ensure document works consistently is to use DTD, follow appendix c (moving to doctype portion), -- if do that, should behave properly and render properly across UAs

Shane McCarron: all that aside, issue of XHTML family docs and behavior when delivered as text/html -- another thread; note suggests that way to ensure document works consistently is to use DTD, follow appendix c (moving to doctype portion), -- if do that, should behave properly and render properly across UAs

14:35:59 <oedipus> SP: do we need to do anything with TAG right now -- this discussion has gone over to RDFa task force, and turned up there as LC comments; should leave issue there to be dealt with

Steven Pemberton: do we need to do anything with TAG right now -- this discussion has gone over to RDFa task force, and turned up there as LC comments; should leave issue there to be dealt with

14:36:21 <oedipus> RM: agree

Roland Merrick: agree

14:36:46 <oedipus> scribe's note: SP's Action Item on RDFa comments disposed (being done by others)

scribe's note: SP's Action Item on RDFa comments disposed (being done by others)

14:37:00 <oedipus> TOPIC: CURIEs

5. CURIEs

14:37:19 <oedipus> SM: sent status - i think is ready to go, markB had a few comments

Shane McCarron: sent status - i think is ready to go, markB had a few comments

14:37:30 <oedipus> RM: ready to go to LC -- just needs transition request

Roland Merrick: ready to go to LC -- just needs transition request

14:37:38 <oedipus> SP: sent transition request last week --

Steven Pemberton: sent transition request last week --

14:37:49 <oedipus> SM: update working draft today

Shane McCarron: update working draft today

14:37:57 <oedipus> SP: who will send message?

Steven Pemberton: who will send message?

14:38:19 <oedipus> ACTION Steven: send message about CURIEs transition

ACTION Steven: send message about CURIEs transition

14:38:26 <ShaneM> FYI - RDFa version attribute declaration is <!ENTITY % XHTML.version  "XHTML+RDFa 1.0" >

Shane McCarron: FYI - RDFa version attribute declaration is <!ENTITY % XHTML.version "XHTML+RDFa 1.0" >

14:38:31 <oedipus> RM: Role Module status?

Roland Merrick: Role Module status?

14:38:37 <oedipus> RM: can we take to LC today?

Roland Merrick: can we take to LC today?

14:38:58 <oedipus> SM: as far as i'm concerned ready to go last week -- question remaining relates to CURIEs

Shane McCarron: as far as i'm concerned ready to go last week -- question remaining relates to CURIEs

14:39:45 <oedipus> MB: discussions offlist about way CURIEs and Role interact -- my issue is don't think should insist that values that are non-prefixed are invalid; should let those who import role into host language should be allowed to do so

Mark Birbeck: discussions offlist about way CURIEs and Role interact -- my issue is don't think should insist that values that are non-prefixed are invalid; should let those who import role into host language should be allowed to do so

14:40:08 <oedipus> MB: 2 choices -- let docs go through or try and resolve on list so doesn't haunt us during LC

Mark Birbeck: 2 choices -- let docs go through or try and resolve on list so doesn't haunt us during LC

14:40:27 <oedipus> MB: as far as timing, LC comments can be incorporated easily, so shouldn't hold up progress of document

Mark Birbeck: as far as timing, LC comments can be incorporated easily, so shouldn't hold up progress of document

14:40:40 <oedipus> SP: idea of LC is that WG has dealt with all issues in its ken

Steven Pemberton: idea of LC is that WG has dealt with all issues in its ken

14:40:46 <oedipus> SP: prefer to discuss on list

Steven Pemberton: prefer to discuss on list

14:40:57 <oedipus> RM: values of role attribute fixed?

Roland Merrick: values of role attribute fixed?

14:41:51 <oedipus> SM: concerns about CURIE draft or how Role uses it?

Shane McCarron: concerns about CURIE draft or how Role uses it?

14:42:09 <oedipus> MB: minor change needs to be made to Role to use CURIEs

Mark Birbeck: minor change needs to be made to Role to use CURIEs

14:42:14 <oedipus> SM: thought resolved

Shane McCarron: thought resolved

14:42:26 <oedipus> RM: thought problem only with Role -- other problems?

Roland Merrick: thought problem only with Role -- other problems?

14:42:36 <ShaneM> http://htmlwg.mn.aptest.com/htmlwg/curie is the live editors draft

Shane McCarron: http://htmlwg.mn.aptest.com/htmlwg/curie is the live editors draft

14:42:47 <oedipus> MB: i need to re-check, but need to allow un-prefixed values in CURIE spec

Mark Birbeck: i need to re-check, but need to allow un-prefixed values in CURIE spec

14:42:50 <oedipus> SM: we do that

Shane McCarron: we do that

14:42:59 <ShaneM> curie       :=   [ [ prefix ] ':' ] reference

Shane McCarron: curie := [ [ prefix ] ':' ] reference

14:43:27 <oedipus> MB: thought that had changed -- if i review after meeting with SM, can move forward on CURIEs and will raise Role issue on list as requested

Mark Birbeck: thought that had changed -- if i review after meeting with SM, can move forward on CURIEs and will raise Role issue on list as requested

14:43:56 <oedipus> RM: close CURIE today -- go to LC or not; role will take as long as takes to obtain agreement

Roland Merrick: close CURIE today -- go to LC or not; role will take as long as takes to obtain agreement

14:44:24 <oedipus> RESOLVED: CURIEs issues closed - will move forward to LC

RESOLVED: CURIEs issues closed - will move forward to LC

14:44:50 <oedipus> ACTION MarkB: once CURIE draft pushed, post to public-xhtml2 list on Role issues

ACTION MarkB: once CURIE draft pushed, post to public-xhtml2 list on related Role issues

14:45:20 <oedipus> MB: if WG happy with shane and me making changes will do; if not will raise 2 issues on list

Mark Birbeck: if WG happy with shane and me making changes will do; if not will raise 2 issues on list

14:45:43 <oedipus> s/on Role issues/on related Role issues
14:46:01 <oedipus> RM: hope to get Role resolved next week

Roland Merrick: hope to get Role resolved next week

14:46:20 <Zakim> -ShaneM

Zakim IRC Bot: -ShaneM

14:46:26 <Zakim> -Steven

Zakim IRC Bot: -Steven

14:46:27 <oedipus> RM: reconvene this time (or later, depending upon where you are) next week

Roland Merrick: reconvene this time (or later, depending upon where you are) next week

14:46:27 <Zakim> -Roland

Zakim IRC Bot: -Roland

14:46:27 <Zakim> -markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: -markbirbeck

14:46:35 <oedipus> rrsagent, draft minutes

rrsagent, draft minutes

14:46:35 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus

14:46:42 <Zakim> -Gregory_Rosmaita

Zakim IRC Bot: -Gregory_Rosmaita

14:46:43 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended

14:46:44 <Zakim> Attendees were +0138687aaaa, Roland, Steven, Gregory_Rosmaita, +0208761aabb, markbirbeck, McCarron, +1.763.767.aacc, ShaneM

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were +0138687aaaa, Roland, Steven, Gregory_Rosmaita, +0208761aabb, markbirbeck, McCarron, +1.763.767.aacc, ShaneM

14:46:58 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes

Steven Pemberton: rrsagent, make minutes

14:46:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-minutes.html Steven

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-minutes.html Steven

14:47:18 <Steven> rrsagent, make log public

Steven Pemberton: rrsagent, make log public

14:47:25 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes

Steven Pemberton: rrsagent, make minutes

14:47:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-minutes.html Steven

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/26-xhtml-minutes.html Steven



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