The group agreed to co-locate the fourth face to face meeting with ISWC'12, in Boston. F2F4 will take place on November 9-10, MIT CS department, details to follow.
Since the last teleconference, the editors of the prov-constraints document have addressed the remaining technical issues. The group voted for the release of prov-constraints as a last call working draft. The end of the review period is set to October 10, 2012. Paolo will initiate the drafting of a blog. Congratulations to the group for releasing LCWDs for all the deliverables on recommendation track.
Implementing constraints with SW technologies
There was a discussion on how much time should be spent on designing/discussing the implementation of prov-constraints using Semantic Web technologies such as OWL. It was agreed (see resolution) that the actual implementation is not to be carried out by the Working Group, but by its participants. Of course, we welcome interoperable implementations of constraints, and several individuals have indicated their intent to work on this. The PROV-WG will focus on defining what it means to be an inter-operable implementation of constraints, and will consider defining test suites.
We are still hoping for further feedback on the specifications recently released. The release of prov-constraints as LCWD presents us with a good opportunity to send kind reminders to our various contacts. Editors have now to tackle public comments and initiate discussions by email.
Implementation Report Skeleton
Stephan updated us on the form to be completed by implementers. The group is invited to send comments on the mailing list. Paul, Stephan, and Dong are going to produce a first version of the implementation report skeleton by the next teleconference.
The prov-xml subgroup has been writing examples according to the draft schema and has been raising issues on the tracker. The issues are mostly about aligning the prov-xml schema with the latest prov-dm. In line with the resolution on constraints, implementation of constraints for prov-xml is left to individual members. Version 1 of the XML schema is planned to be released by the next teleconference. The issue of prov:type (ISSUE-493) was briefly mentioned at the end of the call. More email discussion is required.
14:43:03 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/09/06-prov-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/09/06-prov-irc ←
14:43:05 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world ←
14:43:07 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be ←
14:43:07 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot ←
14:43:08 <trackbot> Meeting: Provenance Working Group Teleconference
14:43:08 <trackbot> Date: 06 September 2012
14:43:10 <Luc> Zakim, this will be PROV
Luc Moreau: Zakim, this will be PROV ←
14:43:11 <Zakim> ok, Luc; I see SW_(PROV)11:00AM scheduled to start in 17 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Luc; I see SW_(PROV)11:00AM scheduled to start in 17 minutes ←
14:43:22 <Luc> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2012.09.06
14:44:01 <Luc> rrsagent, make logs public
Luc Moreau: rrsagent, make logs public ←
14:44:06 <Luc> chair: Luc Moreau
14:44:14 <Luc> Regrets: James Cheney, Timothy Lebo
14:55:14 <Zakim> SW_(PROV)11:00AM has now started
(No events recorded for 11 minutes)
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(PROV)11:00AM has now started ←
14:55:20 <Zakim> +??P11
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P11 ←
14:55:51 <smiles> zakim, ??P11 is me
Simon Miles: zakim, ??P11 is me ←
14:55:53 <Zakim> +smiles; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +smiles; got it ←
14:57:11 <Luc> scribe: simon miles
(Scribe set to Simon Miles)
14:58:12 <Zakim> + +44.238.059.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.238.059.aaaa ←
14:58:26 <Luc> zakim, +44.238.059.aaaa is me
Luc Moreau: zakim, +44.238.059.aaaa is me ←
14:58:28 <Zakim> +Luc; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Luc; got it ←
14:58:42 <Zakim> +??P4
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P4 ←
14:58:47 <Zakim> +Curt_Tilmes
Zakim IRC Bot: +Curt_Tilmes ←
14:58:49 <pgroth> Zakim, ??P4 is me
Paul Groth: Zakim, ??P4 is me ←
14:58:49 <Zakim> +pgroth; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +pgroth; got it ←
14:59:23 <Zakim> +Luc.a
Zakim IRC Bot: +Luc.a ←
14:59:33 <Luc> zakim, who is on the call?
Luc Moreau: zakim, who is on the call? ←
14:59:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see smiles, Luc, pgroth, Curt_Tilmes, Luc.a
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see smiles, Luc, pgroth, Curt_Tilmes, Luc.a ←
15:00:48 <Zakim> + +329331aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +329331aabb ←
15:00:53 <Luc> topic: admin
15:00:59 <TomDN> zakim, +329 is me
Tom De Nies: zakim, +329 is me ←
15:00:59 <Zakim> +TomDN; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +TomDN; got it ←
15:01:10 <TomDN> zakim, mute me
Tom De Nies: zakim, mute me ←
15:01:10 <Zakim> TomDN should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: TomDN should now be muted ←
15:01:19 <Zakim> +??P7
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P7 ←
15:01:39 <Zakim> +??P16
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P16 ←
15:01:45 <smiles> Luc: outlines agenda
Luc Moreau: outlines agenda ←
15:01:50 <khalidBelhajjame> zakim, ??P16 is me
Khalid Belhajjame: zakim, ??P16 is me ←
15:01:50 <Zakim> +khalidBelhajjame; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +khalidBelhajjame; got it ←
15:02:01 <pgroth> Zakim, who is loud?
Paul Groth: Zakim, who is loud? ←
15:02:01 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, pgroth.
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand your question, pgroth. ←
15:02:04 <TomDN> zakim, who is noisy?
Tom De Nies: zakim, who is noisy? ←
15:02:04 <Luc> proposed: to approve Minutes of the Aug 9, 2012 Telecon
PROPOSED: to approve Minutes of the Aug 9, 2012 Telecon ←
15:02:12 <Zakim> +Satya_Sahoo
Zakim IRC Bot: +Satya_Sahoo ←
15:02:15 <Zakim> TomDN, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (28%), khalidBelhajjame (19%)
Zakim IRC Bot: TomDN, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (28%), khalidBelhajjame (19%) ←
15:02:19 <Zakim> + +1.818.731.aacc
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.818.731.aacc ←
15:02:20 <Luc> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-08-09
Luc Moreau: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-08-09 ←
15:02:24 <TomDN> +1
Tom De Nies: +1 ←
15:02:24 <Curt> +1
Curt Tilmes: +1 ←
15:02:32 <SamCoppens> +1
Sam Coppens: +1 ←
15:02:35 <satya> +1
Satya Sahoo: +1 ←
15:02:36 <khalidBelhajjame> +1
Khalid Belhajjame: +1 ←
15:02:41 <TomDN> zakim, samcoppens is with tomdn
Tom De Nies: zakim, samcoppens is with tomdn ←
15:02:41 <Zakim> +samcoppens; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +samcoppens; got it ←
15:02:44 <hook> +1
15:02:45 <smiles> +1
+1 ←
15:02:47 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
15:02:47 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
15:02:48 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
15:02:49 <Paolo> 0 (not attended)
Paolo Missier: 0 (not attended) ←
15:03:00 <Luc> accepted: Minutes of the Aug 9, 2012 Telecon
RESOLVED: Minutes of the Aug 9, 2012 Telecon ←
15:03:07 <stainPhone> 0
15:03:10 <Zakim> +??P13
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P13 ←
15:03:27 <smiles> Luc: open actions for Paulo and Paul
Luc Moreau: open actions for Paulo and Paul ←
15:03:48 <Zakim> +??P3
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P3 ←
15:03:51 <GK> zakim, ??p13 is me
Graham Klyne: zakim, ??p13 is me ←
15:03:51 <Zakim> +GK; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +GK; got it ←
15:03:51 <smiles> Paul: Not yet done overview slide for Wiki
Paul Groth: Not yet done overview slide for Wiki ←
15:03:57 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: +OpenLink_Software ←
15:04:02 <Luc> Topic: F2F4
Summary: The group agreed to co-locate the fourth face to face meeting with ISWC'12, in Boston. F2F4 will take place on November 9-10, MIT CS department, details to follow.
<Luc>Summary: The group agreed to co-locate the fourth face to face meeting with ISWC'12, in Boston. F2F4 will take place on November 9-10, MIT CS department, details to follow.
15:04:02 <MacTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
15:04:02 <Zakim> +MacTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +MacTed; got it ←
15:04:04 <MacTed> Zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me ←
15:04:04 <Zakim> MacTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should now be muted ←
15:04:32 <smiles> Luc: Idea to co-locate F2F4 with ISWC
Luc Moreau: Idea to co-locate F2F4 with ISWC ←
15:04:38 <Luc> November 9 - 10, 2012
Luc Moreau: November 9 - 10, 2012 ←
15:04:44 <Zakim> + +44.789.470.aadd
Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.789.470.aadd ←
15:05:04 <smiles> ... available before ISWC workshops/tutorials, 9-10
... available before ISWC workshops/tutorials, 9-10 ←
15:05:17 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:05:20 <smiles> ... any blocking reasons against?
... any blocking reasons against? ←
15:05:26 <stainPhone> Zakim, +44.789.470.aadd is me
Stian Soiland-Reyes: Zakim, +44.789.470.aadd is me ←
15:05:26 <Zakim> +stainPhone; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +stainPhone; got it ←
15:05:47 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
15:05:50 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:05:53 <Luc> ack pg
Luc Moreau: ack pg ←
15:05:53 <smiles> Luc: Vote or just accept those dates?
Luc Moreau: Vote or just accept those dates? ←
15:06:06 <Zakim> -TomDN
Zakim IRC Bot: -TomDN ←
15:06:09 <smiles> Paul: Don't think we need a vote, but need sign-up page
Paul Groth: Don't think we need a vote, but need sign-up page ←
15:06:16 <pgroth> yes
Paul Groth: yes ←
15:06:43 <Luc> ACCEPTED: F2F4 will take place in Boston, on November 9 - 10, 2012
RESOLVED: F2F4 will take place in Boston, on November 9 - 10, 2012 ←
15:06:55 <Zakim> -??P7
Zakim IRC Bot: -??P7 ←
15:06:56 <Zakim> +TomDN
Zakim IRC Bot: +TomDN ←
15:07:00 <smiles> Luc: details available later, but hosted at MIT
Luc Moreau: details available later, but hosted at MIT ←
15:07:04 <TomDN> Zakim, mute me
Tom De Nies: Zakim, mute me ←
15:07:04 <Zakim> TomDN should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: TomDN should now be muted ←
15:07:07 <Zakim> +??P25
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P25 ←
15:07:11 <smiles> Ivan: at Computer Science
Ivan Herman: at Computer Science ←
15:07:14 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:07:15 <TomDN> Zakim, samcoppens is with tomdn
Tom De Nies: Zakim, samcoppens is with tomdn ←
15:07:15 <Zakim> +samcoppens; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +samcoppens; got it ←
15:07:17 <Paolo> zakim, ??P25 is me
Paolo Missier: zakim, ??P25 is me ←
15:07:17 <Zakim> +Paolo; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Paolo; got it ←
15:07:24 <smiles> Luc: questions about F2F4?
Luc Moreau: questions about F2F4? ←
15:07:27 <pgroth> action: paul to set-up web page f2f4
ACTION: paul to set-up web page f2f4 ←
15:07:27 <trackbot> Created ACTION-104 - Set-up web page f2f4 [on Paul Groth - due 2012-09-13].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-104 - Set-up web page f2f4 [on Paul Groth - due 2012-09-13]. ←
15:07:33 <Luc> topic: prov-constraints
Summary: Since the last teleconference, the editors of the prov-constraints document have addressed the remaining technical issues. The group voted for the release of prov-constraints as a last call working draft. The end of the review period is set to October 10, 2012. Paolo will initiate the drafting of a blog. Congratulations to the group for releasing LCWDs for all the deliverables on recommendation track.
<Luc> Summary: Since the last teleconference, the editors of the prov-constraints document have addressed the remaining technical issues. The group voted for the release of prov-constraints as a last call working draft. The end of the review period is set to October 10, 2012. Paolo will initiate the drafting of a blog. Congratulations to the group for releasing LCWDs for all the deliverables on recommendation track.
15:07:40 <pgroth> Zakim, who is noisy?
Paul Groth: Zakim, who is noisy? ←
15:07:47 <Zakim> +??P7
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P7 ←
15:07:50 <Zakim> pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (54%)
Zakim IRC Bot: pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (54%) ←
15:07:57 <dgarijo> Zakim, ??P7 is me
Daniel Garijo: Zakim, ??P7 is me ←
15:07:57 <Zakim> +dgarijo; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +dgarijo; got it ←
15:07:58 <smiles> Luc: At last telecon, we looked at remaining technical issues on the document
Luc Moreau: At last telecon, we looked at remaining technical issues on the document ←
15:08:00 <GK> (I assume MIT is easily accessible from the ISWC and/or downtown location?)
Graham Klyne: (I assume MIT is easily accessible from the ISWC and/or downtown location?) ←
15:08:02 <Zakim> +??P27
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P27 ←
15:08:09 <jun> zakim, ??p27 is me
Jun Zhao: zakim, ??p27 is me ←
15:08:09 <Zakim> +jun; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +jun; got it ←
15:08:23 <Luc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-prov-wg/2012Aug/0228.html
Luc Moreau: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-prov-wg/2012Aug/0228.html ←
15:08:24 <stainPhone> @gk yes, metro from downtown
Stian Soiland-Reyes: @gk yes, metro from downtown ←
15:08:25 <smiles> ... work was done over August
... work was done over August ←
15:08:44 <Luc> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/default/model/releases/WD-prov-constraints-20120911/Overview.html
Luc Moreau: http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/default/model/releases/WD-prov-constraints-20120911/Overview.html ←
15:08:46 <smiles> ... distributed link above for feedback (seems good so far)
... distributed link above for feedback (seems good so far) ←
15:08:53 <pgroth> Zakim, who is noisy?
Paul Groth: Zakim, who is noisy? ←
15:09:05 <Zakim> pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (73%), Paolo (89%)
Zakim IRC Bot: pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (73%), Paolo (89%) ←
15:09:12 <MacTed> Zakim, mute Paolo
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute Paolo ←
15:09:12 <Zakim> Paolo should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Paolo should now be muted ←
15:09:28 <Paolo> sorry -- new VOIP client
Paolo Missier: sorry -- new VOIP client ←
15:09:37 <smiles> ... before formal vote, is there any comment on the document?
... before formal vote, is there any comment on the document? ←
15:09:38 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:09:47 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:09:52 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:10:18 <smiles> Ivan: one thread of discussion on terminology alignment of "top-level bundles". What is current status?
Ivan Herman: one thread of discussion on terminology alignment of "top-level bundles". What is current status? ←
15:10:53 <smiles> Luc: Top-level bundle introduced in PROV-N, not part of PROV-DM
Luc Moreau: Top-level bundle introduced in PROV-N, not part of PROV-DM ←
15:11:02 <stainPhone> q+
Stian Soiland-Reyes: q+ ←
15:11:09 <smiles> ... it is the structure of the complete document you would write in PROV-N
... it is the structure of the complete document you would write in PROV-N ←
15:11:09 <ivan> ack ivan
Ivan Herman: ack ivan ←
15:11:27 <smiles> ... "top-level bundle" was not adequate term, because it is not a bundle
... "top-level bundle" was not adequate term, because it is not a bundle ←
15:11:50 <smiles> ... James suggested talking about a "PROV document" instead, and this is adopted in PROV Constraints
... James suggested talking about a "PROV document" instead, and this is adopted in PROV Constraints ←
15:12:10 <smiles> ... PROV documents can contain PROV statements or bundles
... PROV documents can contain PROV statements or bundles ←
15:12:30 <smiles> ... In context of PROV-N, will propose that will align terminology to also use PROV document
... In context of PROV-N, will propose that will align terminology to also use PROV document ←
15:12:30 <Luc> ack ivan
Luc Moreau: ack ivan ←
15:12:55 <smiles> stian: Thank you to the editor for addressing the issues I raised
Stian Soiland-Reyes: Thank you to the editor for addressing the issues I raised ←
15:13:10 <smiles> Luc: Also thank you and other reviewers for quality of reviews
Luc Moreau: Also thank you and other reviewers for quality of reviews ←
15:13:12 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:13:14 <Luc> ack st
Luc Moreau: ack st ←
15:13:30 <Luc> PROPOSED: publish PROV-Constraints as Last Call Working Draft
PROPOSED: publish PROV-Constraints as Last Call Working Draft ←
15:13:41 <smiles> +1
+1 ←
15:13:42 <MacTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
15:13:44 <stainPhone> +1
Stian Soiland-Reyes: +1 ←
15:13:46 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
15:13:49 <khalidBelhajjame> +1 (University of Manchester)
Khalid Belhajjame: +1 (University of Manchester) ←
15:13:51 <TomDN> +1 (IBBT)
Tom De Nies: +1 (IBBT) ←
15:13:53 <Curt> +1 (NASA)
Curt Tilmes: +1 (NASA) ←
15:13:55 <Paolo> +1 Newcastle University
Paolo Missier: +1 Newcastle University ←
15:13:57 <zednik> +1 (RPI)
Stephan Zednik: +1 (RPI) ←
15:13:57 <pgroth> +1 (VU University Amsterdam)
Paul Groth: +1 (VU University Amsterdam) ←
15:13:57 <SamCoppens> +1 (IBBT)
Sam Coppens: +1 (IBBT) ←
15:13:58 <satya> +1, Invited expert (CWRU)
Satya Sahoo: +1, Invited expert (CWRU) ←
15:13:58 <smiles> (invited expert, King's College London)
(invited expert, King's College London) ←
15:13:59 <GK> +1 Oxford U
Graham Klyne: +1 Oxford U ←
15:14:03 <hook> +1 (IE)
15:14:07 <MacTed> (OpenLink Software)
Ted Thibodeau: (OpenLink Software) ←
15:14:08 <dgarijo> +1 (UPM)
Daniel Garijo: +1 (UPM) ←
15:14:12 <Luc> +1 (University of Southampton)
Luc Moreau: +1 (University of Southampton) ←
15:14:25 <stainPhone> (univ of Manchester as well)
Stian Soiland-Reyes: (univ of Manchester as well) ←
15:14:33 <jun> +1
15:14:41 <Luc> Accepted: to publish PROV-Constraints as Last Call Working Draft
RESOLVED: to publish PROV-Constraints as Last Call Working Draft ←
15:14:51 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
15:15:24 <smiles> Luc: When are we going to release the document? And what is the review period?
Luc Moreau: When are we going to release the document? And what is the review period? ←
15:15:27 <pgroth> q-
Paul Groth: q- ←
15:15:46 <pgroth> q+
Paul Groth: q+ ←
15:15:57 <smiles> ... Editors do not intend to make any changes, can prepare for release next Tuesday pending webmaster approval
... Editors do not intend to make any changes, can prepare for release next Tuesday pending webmaster approval ←
15:16:05 <smiles> ... Release date 11 September
... Release date 11 September ←
15:16:27 <smiles> ... Propose review period closes 10 October
... Propose review period closes 10 October ←
15:17:05 <ivan> +10000 to Paul
Ivan Herman: +10000 to Paul ←
15:17:09 <smiles> Paul: Have to also consider some blog post to go with document, it is heavy duty and needs context to interpret
Paul Groth: Have to also consider some blog post to go with document, it is heavy duty and needs context to interpret ←
15:17:22 <smiles> ... Who will write the post?
... Who will write the post? ←
15:17:59 <smiles> Luc: Paolo, would you have bandwidth to draft blog entry?
Luc Moreau: Paolo, would you have bandwidth to draft blog entry? ←
15:18:00 <Paolo> zakim, unmute me
Paolo Missier: zakim, unmute me ←
15:18:00 <Zakim> Paolo should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Paolo should no longer be muted ←
15:18:02 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:18:10 <pgroth> q+
Paul Groth: q+ ←
15:18:39 <pgroth> i can then polish
Paul Groth: i can then polish ←
15:18:46 <smiles> Paolo: Can try to first draft something tomorrow
Paolo Missier: Can try to first draft something tomorrow ←
15:18:53 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:18:53 <smiles> Luc: I could then work on it on Monday
Luc Moreau: I could then work on it on Monday ←
15:19:06 <smiles> Paul: That's fine and can also run by me
Paul Groth: That's fine and can also run by me ←
15:19:08 <Luc> ack pgro
Luc Moreau: ack pgro ←
15:19:09 <ivan> q-
Ivan Herman: q- ←
15:19:54 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:19:56 <pgroth> nice one everyone
Paul Groth: nice one everyone ←
15:20:00 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:20:02 <smiles> Luc: Any other comments on constraints?
Luc Moreau: Any other comments on constraints? ←
15:20:30 <smiles> Ivan: Reminder that we should finalise the timetable tomorrow
Ivan Herman: Reminder that we should finalise the timetable tomorrow ←
15:20:51 <Luc> ack iv
Luc Moreau: ack iv ←
15:21:17 <smiles> Ivan: should become synchronised with other documents
Ivan Herman: should become synchronised with other documents ←
15:21:21 <Luc> topic: Implementing constraints with SW technologies
Summary: There was a discussion on how much time should be spent on designing/discussing the implementation of prov-constraints using Semantic Web technologies such as OWL. It was agreed (see resolution) that the actual implementation is not to be carried out by the Working Group, but by its participants. Of course, we welcome interoperable implementations of constraints, and several individuals have indicated their intent to work on this. The PROV-WG will focus on defining what it means to be an inter-operable implementation of constraints, and will consider defining test suites.
<Luc> Summary: There was a discussion on how much time should be spent on designing/discussing the implementation of prov-constraints using Semantic Web technologies such as OWL. It was agreed (see resolution) that the actual implementation is not to be carried out by the Working Group, but by its participants. Of course, we welcome interoperable implementations of constraints, and several individuals have indicated their intent to work on this. The PROV-WG will focus on defining what it means to be an inter-operable implementation of constraints, and will consider defining test suites.
15:21:58 <smiles> Paul: We have noticed that there is discussion around implementing constraints using SW tech
Paul Groth: We have noticed that there is discussion around implementing constraints using SW tech ←
15:22:08 <smiles> ... great, but not part of the WG's responsibility
... great, but not part of the WG's responsibility ←
15:22:50 <smiles> ... should be done by individuals if interested, but implementation should not be done in WG time, cannot respond to all questions
... should be done by individuals if interested, but implementation should not be done in WG time, cannot respond to all questions ←
15:22:56 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:23:00 <smiles> ... encouraged but outside WG
... encouraged but outside WG ←
15:23:37 <zednik> q+
Stephan Zednik: q+ ←
15:23:45 <ivan> ack ivan
Ivan Herman: ack ivan ←
15:23:46 <GK> I agree with Paul here, but I also note that we'll need interoperable implementations for REC track progress?
Graham Klyne: I agree with Paul here, but I also note that we'll need interoperable implementations for REC track progress? ←
15:23:58 <smiles> Ivan: Agreed that deliverables need to be delivered, but if work is done WG might decide to publish in W3C Notes and could be valuable
Ivan Herman: Agreed that deliverables need to be delivered, but if work is done WG might decide to publish in W3C Notes and could be valuable ←
15:24:15 <khalidBelhajjame> @Paul, agreed. With Jun and Stian, we decided to specify the constraints (that are speciable within OWL), outside the context of the working group
Khalid Belhajjame: @Paul, agreed. With Jun and Stian, we decided to specify the constraints (that are speciable within OWL), outside the context of the working group ←
15:24:35 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:24:39 <smiles> Luc: Yes, are very keen for implementation of constraints using SW tech, but concerned about using WG bandwidth and mission creep
Luc Moreau: Yes, are very keen for implementation of constraints using SW tech, but concerned about using WG bandwidth and mission creep ←
15:24:49 <zednik> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/viewform?formkey=dGM4cXZYMk0xaFBDT2VyRV92YkY5WkE6MQ
Stephan Zednik: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/viewform?formkey=dGM4cXZYMk0xaFBDT2VyRV92YkY5WkE6MQ ←
15:24:59 <Paolo> q+
Paolo Missier: q+ ←
15:25:01 <smiles> zednik: Added constraints implementation section to implementation questionanire
Stephan Zednik: Added constraints implementation section to implementation questionanire ←
15:25:07 <ivan> ack zednik
Ivan Herman: ack zednik ←
15:25:27 <smiles> .. not intended to be saying we will be creating these implementation, but part of implementation report
.. not intended to be saying we will be creating these implementation, but part of implementation report ←
15:26:33 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
15:26:33 <smiles> Paolo: Agree not done on WG time, but cannot claim have reference implementation without compliance validator
Paolo Missier: Agree not done on WG time, but cannot claim have reference implementation without compliance validator ←
15:26:39 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:26:42 <satya> q+
Satya Sahoo: q+ ←
15:26:42 <Luc> ack pao
Luc Moreau: ack pao ←
15:26:56 <Luc> ack pg
Luc Moreau: ack pg ←
15:27:13 <pgroth> mute paolo
Paul Groth: mute paolo ←
15:27:18 <MacTed> Zakim, mute pa
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute pa ←
15:27:18 <Zakim> Paolo should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Paolo should now be muted ←
15:27:51 <smiles> Paul: Implement both specs, and if don't have implementations then spec can't be approved as recommendation
Paul Groth: Implement both specs, and if don't have implementations then spec can't be approved as recommendation ←
15:27:51 <stainPhone> @paolo, yes, our (khalid/jun) intent is to do what can practically be done in owl
Stian Soiland-Reyes: @paolo, yes, our (khalid/jun) intent is to do what can practically be done in owl ←
15:27:55 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:27:57 <Paolo> agree -- and that's why Khalid's qualification worried me
Paolo Missier: agree -- and that's why Khalid's qualification worried me ←
15:28:28 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:28:33 <stainPhone> As owl is not a constraint language
Stian Soiland-Reyes: As owl is not a constraint language ←
15:28:34 <ivan> ack satya
Ivan Herman: ack satya ←
15:28:37 <smiles> satya: When talking about implementations/validators, are we talking about conforming to PROV-O or to constraints?
Satya Sahoo: When talking about implementations/validators, are we talking about conforming to PROV-O or to constraints? ←
15:28:39 <GK> Hmmm... I thought we needed (interoperable) implementations of each feature rather than a "reference implementation"
Graham Klyne: Hmmm... I thought we needed (interoperable) implementations of each feature rather than a "reference implementation" ←
15:28:41 <khalidBelhajjame> Just to clarify, within OWL, we will not aim to implement all constraints but only the one that are easy to express within OWL
Khalid Belhajjame: Just to clarify, within OWL, we will not aim to implement all constraints but only the one that are easy to express within OWL ←
15:28:56 <stainPhone> @gk +1
Stian Soiland-Reyes: @gk +1 ←
15:29:00 <smiles> Luc: We are talking about conforming to constraints, validity is not in scope of WG
Luc Moreau: We are talking about conforming to constraints, validity is not in scope of WG ←
15:29:04 <jun> @paolo, my understanding that exploring OWL for the implementation is our first step, to see what can be implemented in OWL and what can't
Jun Zhao: @paolo, my understanding that exploring OWL for the implementation is our first step, to see what can be implemented in OWL and what can't ←
15:29:16 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:29:33 <Luc> ack ivan
Luc Moreau: ack ivan ←
15:29:50 <smiles> Ivan: What we in general need is not a reference implementation of everything, but interoperable implementation for each feature
Ivan Herman: What we in general need is not a reference implementation of everything, but interoperable implementation for each feature ←
15:30:22 <Paolo> @ khalidBelhajjame, jun I am doing the same in the deductive programming space, but there are unknown -- hence the difficulty to committing to a deliverable
Paolo Missier: @ khalidBelhajjame, jun I am doing the same in the deductive programming space, but there are unknown -- hence the difficulty to committing to a deliverable ←
15:30:27 <smiles> ... but more general point, what do we really mean by the implementation of the particular document or the whole PROV enivronment?
... but more general point, what do we really mean by the implementation of the particular document or the whole PROV enivronment? ←
15:30:46 <smiles> ... no fixed rules, but need to show world this is not just a paper exercise and can be put into practice
... no fixed rules, but need to show world this is not just a paper exercise and can be put into practice ←
15:31:05 <smiles> ... not clear what this means for constraints document in relation to other documents
... not clear what this means for constraints document in relation to other documents ←
15:31:13 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:31:16 <Luc> q+
Luc Moreau: q+ ←
15:31:25 <smiles> ... will need to be clear when we present to the management
... will need to be clear when we present to the management ←
15:31:57 <smiles> Luc: Not discussed yet, and may be an item of discussion of implementation report skeleton
Luc Moreau: Not discussed yet, and may be an item of discussion of implementation report skeleton ←
15:32:15 <smiles> ... WG will have to identify features to implement in constraints document (e.g. type checking)
... WG will have to identify features to implement in constraints document (e.g. type checking) ←
15:32:35 <smiles> ... Question is then how we demonstrate whether this is implemented properly
... Question is then how we demonstrate whether this is implemented properly ←
15:32:45 <smiles> ... In my own implementation, am using test cases
... In my own implementation, am using test cases ←
15:32:53 <Luc> q-
Luc Moreau: q- ←
15:33:07 <smiles> Ivan: For me, test cases is very much what I would like to see
Ivan Herman: For me, test cases is very much what I would like to see ←
15:33:15 <smiles> Luc: Discussion of test cases are in scope of WG
Luc Moreau: Discussion of test cases are in scope of WG ←
15:33:16 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:33:58 <smiles> Luc: We want to come up with an agreement that we will not spend WG time defining constraints in SW technologies
Luc Moreau: We want to come up with an agreement that we will not spend WG time defining constraints in SW technologies ←
15:34:00 <pgroth> @stefan can I get edit access to the implementation questionnaire?
Paul Groth: @stefan can I get edit access to the implementation questionnaire? ←
15:34:00 <Luc> PROPOSED: The Working Group will not formalize constraints with Semantic Web technologies, but implementations of constraints by group members are welcomed
PROPOSED: The Working Group will not formalize constraints with Semantic Web technologies, but implementations of constraints by group members are welcomed ←
15:34:03 <GK> (Test cases are a good way to illustrate the consequences of specified features.)
Graham Klyne: (Test cases are a good way to illustrate the consequences of specified features.) ←
15:34:30 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:34:38 <GK> +1
Graham Klyne: +1 ←
15:34:39 <Zakim> -stainPhone
Zakim IRC Bot: -stainPhone ←
15:34:46 <jun> +1
15:34:49 <satya> seems reasonable
Satya Sahoo: seems reasonable ←
15:34:49 <dgarijo> +1
Daniel Garijo: +1 ←
15:34:52 <smiles> +1
+1 ←
15:34:52 <satya> +1
Satya Sahoo: +1 ←
15:34:52 <TomDN> +1
Tom De Nies: +1 ←
15:34:55 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
15:34:58 <SamCoppens> +1
Sam Coppens: +1 ←
15:34:58 <khalidBelhajjame> +1
Khalid Belhajjame: +1 ←
15:34:59 <hook> +1
15:34:59 <Curt> +1
Curt Tilmes: +1 ←
15:34:59 <MacTed> +1
Ted Thibodeau: +1 ←
15:35:13 <Paolo> +1
Paolo Missier: +1 ←
15:35:22 <Luc> ACCEPTED: The Working Group will not formalize constraints with Semantic Web technologies, but implementations of constraints by group members are welcomed
RESOLVED: The Working Group will not formalize constraints with Semantic Web technologies, but implementations of constraints by group members are welcomed ←
15:35:49 <Luc> topic: Public Comments
Summary: We are still hoping for further feedback on the specifications recently released. The release of prov-constraints as LCWD presents us with a good opportunity to send kind reminders to our various contacts. Editors have now to tackle public comments and initiate discussions by email.
<Luc>Summary: We are still hoping for further feedback on the specifications recently released. The release of prov-constraints as LCWD presents us with a good opportunity to send kind reminders to our various contacts. Editors have now to tackle public comments and initiate discussions by email.
15:36:09 <Luc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-prov-comments/
Luc Moreau: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-prov-comments/ ←
15:36:49 <smiles> Paul: We had a number of public comments, one needs cutting up, some we've started discussing
Paul Groth: We had a number of public comments, one needs cutting up, some we've started discussing ←
15:37:19 <smiles> ... All can be handled, but maybe we should readvertise to get more comments
... All can be handled, but maybe we should readvertise to get more comments ←
15:37:30 <Luc> should we take the opportunity to ask for feedback as we release prov-constraints?
Luc Moreau: should we take the opportunity to ask for feedback as we release prov-constraints? ←
15:37:51 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:38:01 <smiles> Luc: comments?
Luc Moreau: comments? ←
15:38:04 <pgroth> in particular on advertising?
Paul Groth: in particular on advertising? ←
15:38:34 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
15:38:36 <smiles> Luc: Now we've released constraints document, we can take the opportunity to go back to groups and individuals to get feedback on that
Luc Moreau: Now we've released constraints document, we can take the opportunity to go back to groups and individuals to get feedback on that ←
15:38:52 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:38:59 <smiles> ... then editors need to go through comments one by one and address
... then editors need to go through comments one by one and address ←
15:39:00 <pgroth> ack pgroth
Paul Groth: ack pgroth ←
15:39:16 <smiles> ... Ivan, you said RDF group would give us feedback but not received yet
... Ivan, you said RDF group would give us feedback but not received yet ←
15:39:41 <smiles> Ivan: Will prompt again, have discussion paper but not yet dealt with
Ivan Herman: Will prompt again, have discussion paper but not yet dealt with ←
15:39:51 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:39:51 <pgroth> talking to guus is difficult
Paul Groth: talking to guus is difficult ←
15:40:18 <smiles> Luc: Once constraints document out, easy to get back to them
Luc Moreau: Once constraints document out, easy to get back to them ←
15:40:27 <pgroth> sure
Paul Groth: sure ←
15:40:29 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:40:37 <pgroth> zakim, who is noisy?
Paul Groth: zakim, who is noisy? ←
15:40:40 <Luc> topic: Implementation Report Skeleton
Summary: Stephan updated us on the form to be completed by implementers. The group is invited to send comments on the mailing list. Paul, Stephan, and Dong are going to produce a first version of the implementation report skeleton by the next teleconference.
<Luc>Summary: Stephan updated us on the form to be completed by implementers. The group is invited to send comments on the mailing list. Paul, Stephan, and Dong are going to produce a first version of the implementation report skeleton by the next teleconference.
15:40:48 <Zakim> pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (30%)
Zakim IRC Bot: pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Luc (30%) ←
15:40:57 <smiles> Luc: Now time to think about structure of this report
Luc Moreau: Now time to think about structure of this report ←
15:41:15 <smiles> ... identifying kinds of feedback expected from implementors
... identifying kinds of feedback expected from implementors ←
15:41:56 <smiles> zednik: Have gone through and updated skeleton, Paolo will update actual questionairres
Stephan Zednik: Have gone through and updated skeleton, Paul will update actual questionairres ←
15:42:11 <smiles> s/Paolo/Paul
15:42:11 <Luc> s/Paolo/Paul
15:42:47 <smiles> Paul: Currently based on SKOS, If we decide we need to test cases that might change this
Paul Groth: Currently based on SKOS, If we decide we need to test cases that might change this ←
15:42:51 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:43:21 <smiles> Luc: Have you received feedback on questionnaire?
Luc Moreau: Have you received feedback on questionnaire? ←
15:43:31 <smiles> zednik: Not yet, but good opportunity to now re-ask
Stephan Zednik: Not yet, but good opportunity to now re-ask ←
15:43:51 <Dong> @Paul: I can help with the implementation report as well
Trung Huynh: @Paul: I can help with the implementation report as well ←
15:43:57 <smiles> Luc: Will make clear in minutes summary, please send an email again with link to questionnaire
Luc Moreau: Will make clear in minutes summary, please send an email again with link to questionnaire ←
15:44:09 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:44:44 <Luc> action on Paul to draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires
Luc Moreau: action on Paul to draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires ←
15:44:44 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - on
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - on ←
15:44:49 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
15:44:55 <Luc> action on pgroth to draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires
Luc Moreau: action on pgroth to draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires ←
15:44:55 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - on
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - on ←
15:45:08 <pgroth> action: pgroth draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires
ACTION: pgroth draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires ←
15:45:08 <trackbot> Created ACTION-105 - Draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires [on Paul Groth - due 2012-09-13].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-105 - Draft implementation report skeleton based on Stephan's questionnaires [on Paul Groth - due 2012-09-13]. ←
15:45:28 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:45:40 <smiles> Paul: Ivan, have Google questionnaire, does it need to be a W3C poll?
Paul Groth: Ivan, have Google questionnaire, does it need to be a W3C poll? ←
15:45:40 <Luc> ack pgr
Luc Moreau: ack pgr ←
15:46:01 <smiles> Ivan: Questionnaire is just for activity of group, not deliverable?
Ivan Herman: Questionnaire is just for activity of group, not deliverable? ←
15:46:28 <smiles> Paul: Yes. Easy to collect by web poll
Paul Groth: Yes. Easy to collect by web poll ←
15:46:49 <pgroth> ok
Paul Groth: ok ←
15:46:51 <smiles> ... Will copy part of result of poll into implementation report
... Will copy part of result of poll into implementation report ←
15:46:55 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:47:03 <smiles> Ivan: Yes, that's OK. How you collected data is your business
Ivan Herman: Yes, that's OK. How you collected data is your business ←
15:47:13 <pgroth> ok
Paul Groth: ok ←
15:47:58 <smiles> Ivan: RDFa had many tests, running on site outside of W3C, but results collected into static page on W3C as implementation report
Ivan Herman: RDFa had many tests, running on site outside of W3C, but results collected into static page on W3C as implementation report ←
15:48:06 <pgroth> yes
Paul Groth: yes ←
15:48:13 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:48:26 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:48:40 <Luc> Topic:PROV-XML
Summary: The prov-xml subgroup has been writing examples according to the draft schema and has been raising issues on the tracker. The issues are mostly about aligning the prov-xml schema with the latest prov-dm. In line with the resolution on constraints, implementation of constraints for prov-xml is left to individual members. Version 1 of the XML schema is planned to be released by the next teleconference. The issue of prov:type (ISSUE-493) was briefly mentioned at the end of the call. More email discussion is required.
<Luc>Summary: The prov-xml subgroup has been writing examples according to the draft schema and has been raising issues on the tracker. The issues are mostly about aligning the prov-xml schema with the latest prov-dm. In line with the resolution on constraints, implementation of constraints for prov-xml is left to individual members. Version 1 of the XML schema is planned to be released by the next teleconference. The issue of prov:type (ISSUE-493) was briefly mentioned at the end of the call. More email discussion is required.
15:49:03 <smiles> Luc: Some emails sent, issues raised, what is the progess?
Luc Moreau: Some emails sent, issues raised, what is the progess? ←
15:49:30 <smiles> zednik: Split up DM terms and encoded in XML schema, published and raised issues
Stephan Zednik: Split up DM terms and encoded in XML schema, published and raised issues ←
15:49:42 <smiles> ... Reza has been working on implementation at Oracle
... Reza has been working on implementation at Oracle ←
15:50:38 <smiles> ... also interested in constraints, and had a side discussion on this, decided not to pursue as part of WG but instead side-activity at Oracle or NASA for implementation report
... also interested in constraints, and had a side discussion on this, decided not to pursue as part of WG but instead side-activity at Oracle or NASA for implementation report ←
15:51:00 <smiles> ... looked into Schematron and XSD inadequate for expressing constraints
... looked into Schematron and XSD inadequate for expressing constraints ←
15:51:16 <hook> Schematrons have been used by ISO working groups for constraints checks
Hook Hua: Schematrons have been used by ISO working groups for constraints checks ←
15:51:23 <smiles> ... For schema, implemented almost all terms and should not be too many issues raised
... For schema, implemented almost all terms and should not be too many issues raised ←
15:51:27 <Curt> q+
Curt Tilmes: q+ ←
15:51:28 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:51:53 <Luc> ack cur
Luc Moreau: ack cur ←
15:52:06 <Luc> @curt +1
Luc Moreau: @curt +1 ←
15:52:09 <smiles> Curt: Most of the issues are minor inconsistencies, and inclined to take from DM and make XML match, even copying non-normative language
Curt Tilmes: Most of the issues are minor inconsistencies, and inclined to take from DM and make XML match, even copying non-normative language ←
15:52:40 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:52:42 <hook> We also tried to sync the XML examples with the PROV-DM examples.
Hook Hua: We also tried to sync the XML examples with the PROV-DM examples. ←
15:52:45 <smiles> Luc: Schema was still a bit behind DM, and issues raised are good
Luc Moreau: Schema was still a bit behind DM, and issues raised are good ←
15:53:14 <smiles> hook: We also tried to make XML examples match one-to-one those in DM document
Hook Hua: We also tried to make XML examples match one-to-one those in DM document ←
15:53:31 <pgroth> +q to ask about prove xml html
Paul Groth: +q to ask about prove xml html ←
15:53:33 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:53:39 <smiles> ... this forces us to make sure DM is in sync with XSD (and PROV-O)
... this forces us to make sure DM is in sync with XSD (and PROV-O) ←
15:54:03 <smiles> Paul: Is editors draft of document on XML up to date, can be looked at? Or just XSD?
Paul Groth: Is editors draft of document on XML up to date, can be looked at? Or just XSD? ←
15:54:09 <pgroth> ok
Paul Groth: ok ←
15:54:13 <Curt> agreed -- not ready
Curt Tilmes: agreed -- not ready ←
15:54:15 <smiles> zednik: XSD up to date, not the document
Stephan Zednik: XSD up to date, not the document ←
15:54:15 <Luc> ack pg
Luc Moreau: ack pg ←
15:54:16 <Zakim> pgroth, you wanted to ask about prove xml html
Zakim IRC Bot: pgroth, you wanted to ask about prove xml html ←
15:54:48 <smiles> Luc: When can say have version 1 of XML schema?
Luc Moreau: When can say have version 1 of XML schema? ←
15:54:57 <Curt> I'll address the issues I've raised by this weekend
Curt Tilmes: I'll address the issues I've raised by this weekend ←
15:55:02 <smiles> zednik: Need to ensure no open issues, but pretty close
Stephan Zednik: Need to ensure no open issues, but pretty close ←
15:55:20 <smiles> ... aim for Tuesday/Wednesday next week
... aim for Tuesday/Wednesday next week ←
15:55:25 <Luc> action stephan to produce version 1 of xml schema
Luc Moreau: action stephan to produce version 1 of xml schema ←
15:55:25 <trackbot> Sorry, ambiguous username (more than one match) - stephan
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, ambiguous username (more than one match) - stephan ←
15:55:25 <trackbot> Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. estephan, szednik)
Trackbot IRC Bot: Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. estephan, szednik) ←
15:55:36 <Luc> action zednik to produce version 1 of xml schema
Luc Moreau: action zednik to produce version 1 of xml schema ←
15:55:36 <trackbot> Created ACTION-106 - Produce version 1 of xml schema [on Stephan Zednik - due 2012-09-13].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-106 - Produce version 1 of xml schema [on Stephan Zednik - due 2012-09-13]. ←
15:56:10 <smiles> Luc: Can come back to at next week's telecon
Luc Moreau: Can come back to at next week's telecon ←
15:56:51 <smiles> ... PROV-O spent long time looking at tools to convert their schema into HTML document
... PROV-O spent long time looking at tools to convert their schema into HTML document ←
15:57:19 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
15:58:01 <smiles> Paul: On the editors draft, there is an XSD/HTML document, who created?
Paul Groth: On the editors draft, there is an XSD/HTML document, who created? ←
15:58:12 <smiles> Luc: I created
Luc Moreau: I created ←
15:58:18 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
15:58:57 <Curt> q+
Curt Tilmes: q+ ←
15:58:57 <pgroth> ack pgroth
Paul Groth: ack pgroth ←
15:59:01 <smiles> Paul: We said that for the XML, we wouldnt worry about the verbiage around the schema, right? Just need schema
Paul Groth: We said that for the XML, we wouldnt worry about the verbiage around the schema, right? Just need schema ←
15:59:25 <smiles> Luc: Want to minimise work, but need something readable. Can extract lots of text from DM document
Luc Moreau: Want to minimise work, but need something readable. Can extract lots of text from DM document ←
15:59:53 <pgroth> sure
Paul Groth: sure ←
16:00:00 <smiles> Luc: Paul and I will identify editor(s) for this document
Luc Moreau: Paul and I will identify editor(s) for this document ←
16:00:00 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
16:00:23 <Zakim> -Satya_Sahoo
Zakim IRC Bot: -Satya_Sahoo ←
16:00:27 <Luc> ack cur
Luc Moreau: ack cur ←
16:00:40 <smiles> Curt: Considered adding links to anchors in XSD HTML document to link to DM, rather than copy
Curt Tilmes: Considered adding links to anchors in XSD HTML document to link to DM, rather than copy ←
16:00:54 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
16:01:28 <smiles> Luc: XML schema editors, are there specific issues you want to discuss?
Luc Moreau: XML schema editors, are there specific issues you want to discuss? ←
16:01:32 <Zakim> -??P3
Zakim IRC Bot: -??P3 ←
16:01:37 <zednik_> sorry, disconnected
Stephan Zednik: sorry, disconnected ←
16:01:59 <Zakim> +??P6
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P6 ←
16:02:00 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
16:02:41 <smiles> zednik: Issue on representing prov:type
Stephan Zednik: Issue on representing prov:type ←
16:03:16 <smiles> ... Type of prov:type is defined as a value (effectively a literal)
... Type of prov:type is defined as a value (effectively a literal) ←
16:03:26 <smiles> ... Consequence is that 42 is a prov:type, etc.
... Consequence is that 42 is a prov:type, etc. ←
16:03:33 <smiles> ... Is that what we want?
... Is that what we want? ←
16:03:58 <Luc> q?
Luc Moreau: q? ←
16:04:06 <Curt> zednik: could discuss prov:Agent vs. prov:Person too? (or is that resolved?)
Stephan Zednik: could discuss prov:Agent vs. prov:Person too? (or is that resolved?) [ Scribe Assist by Curt Tilmes ] ←
16:04:11 <smiles> ... In XSD would be xsd:anySimpleType, not constraints
... In XSD would be xsd:anySimpleType, not constraints ←
16:04:22 <pgroth> +q
Paul Groth: +q ←
16:04:24 <zednik_> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/493
Stephan Zednik: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/493 ←
16:05:17 <smiles> Paul: QName would improve interop, but are there examples where you don't want than (Java package names?)
Paul Groth: QName would improve interop, but are there examples where you don't want than (Java package names?) ←
16:05:41 <smiles> Luc: DM contains examples of types that are just strings
Luc Moreau: DM contains examples of types that are just strings ←
16:06:07 <zednik_> @curt raise as an issue
Stephan Zednik: @curt raise as an issue ←
16:06:28 <smiles> Luc: Will not resolve issue now, but is important as has potential impact on DM, so suggest continue over email and will revisit
Luc Moreau: Will not resolve issue now, but is important as has potential impact on DM, so suggest continue over email and will revisit ←
16:06:37 <TomDN> bye
Tom De Nies: bye ←
16:06:39 <ivan> bye everyone
Ivan Herman: bye everyone ←
16:06:39 <jun> bye
16:06:40 <Dong> Thanks, bye
Trung Huynh: Thanks, bye ←
16:06:41 <Zakim> -Paolo
Zakim IRC Bot: -Paolo ←
16:06:42 <SamCoppens> bye
Sam Coppens: bye ←
16:06:42 <Zakim> -TomDN
Zakim IRC Bot: -TomDN ←
16:06:42 <pgroth> congrats - another last call
Paul Groth: congrats - another last call ←
16:06:43 <Zakim> -dgarijo
Zakim IRC Bot: -dgarijo ←
16:06:43 <Zakim> -jun
Zakim IRC Bot: -jun ←
16:06:44 <pgroth> bye
Paul Groth: bye ←
16:06:45 <Zakim> -Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan ←
16:06:46 <Zakim> -Curt_Tilmes
Zakim IRC Bot: -Curt_Tilmes ←
16:06:46 <zednik_> bye
Stephan Zednik: bye ←
16:06:46 <khalidBelhajjame> bye
Khalid Belhajjame: bye ←
16:06:48 <Zakim> -smiles
Zakim IRC Bot: -smiles ←
16:06:49 <Zakim> -pgroth
Zakim IRC Bot: -pgroth ←
16:06:49 <Zakim> -Luc
Zakim IRC Bot: -Luc ←
16:06:51 <Zakim> -khalidBelhajjame
Zakim IRC Bot: -khalidBelhajjame ←
16:06:51 <Zakim> -MacTed
Zakim IRC Bot: -MacTed ←
16:06:53 <Zakim> -??P6
Zakim IRC Bot: -??P6 ←
16:06:56 <Luc> rrsagent, set log public
Luc Moreau: rrsagent, set log public ←
16:06:59 <Zakim> - +1.818.731.aacc
Zakim IRC Bot: - +1.818.731.aacc ←
16:07:02 <Luc> rrsagent, draft minutes
Luc Moreau: rrsagent, draft minutes ←
16:07:02 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/09/06-prov-minutes.html Luc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/09/06-prov-minutes.html Luc ←
16:07:06 <Luc> trackbot, end telcon
Luc Moreau: trackbot, end telcon ←
16:07:06 <trackbot> Sorry, Luc, I don't understand 'trackbot, end telcon '. Please refer to http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, Luc, I don't understand 'trackbot, end telcon '. Please refer to http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help ←
Formatted by CommonScribe