00:00:00 <scribenick> PRESENT: bmotik, Ivan, IanH, Zhe, Michael Schneider, Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, uli, Alan Ruttenberg, msmith, MarkusK, Joanne, Christine
00:00:00 <scribenick> REGRETS: Elisa Kendall
00:00:00 <scribenick> CHAIR: IanH
17:55:03 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/01/14-owl-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/01/14-owl-irc ←
17:55:28 <IanH> IanH has changed the topic to: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Teleconference.2009.01.14/Agenda
Ian Horrocks: IanH has changed the topic to: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Teleconference.2009.01.14/Agenda ←
17:55:41 <IanH> Zakim, this will be owlwg
Ian Horrocks: Zakim, this will be owlwg ←
17:55:41 <Zakim> ok, IanH; I see SW_OWL()1:00PM scheduled to start in 5 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, IanH; I see SW_OWL()1:00PM scheduled to start in 5 minutes ←
17:56:09 <IanH> ScribeNick: Achille Fokoue
(Scribe set to Achille Fokoue)
17:56:25 <IanH> RRSAgent, make records public
Ian Horrocks: RRSAgent, make records public ←
17:59:04 <Zakim> SW_OWL()1:00PM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_OWL()1:00PM has now started ←
17:59:11 <Zakim> + +0186528aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +0186528aaaa ←
17:59:12 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
17:59:12 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
17:59:13 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
17:59:15 <bmotik> Zakim, this will be OWL
Boris Motik: Zakim, this will be OWL ←
17:59:15 <Zakim> ok, bmotik, I see SW_OWL()1:00PM already started
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, bmotik, I see SW_OWL()1:00PM already started ←
17:59:54 <bmotik> Zakim, aaaa is me
Boris Motik: Zakim, aaaa is me ←
17:59:54 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it ←
18:00:08 <Zakim> +IanH
Zakim IRC Bot: +IanH ←
18:00:09 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:00:09 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:00:28 <IanH> zakim, who is here?
Ian Horrocks: zakim, who is here? ←
18:00:28 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH ←
18:00:35 <Zakim> On IRC I see MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:01:15 <Zakim> + +1.603.897.aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.603.897.aabb ←
18:01:22 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
18:01:32 <Zhe> zakim, +1.603.897.aabb is me
Zhe Wu: zakim, +1.603.897.aabb is me ←
18:01:32 <Zakim> +Zhe; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Zhe; got it ←
18:01:35 <IanH> zakim, who is here?
Ian Horrocks: zakim, who is here? ←
18:01:35 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe, [IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe, [IPcaller] ←
18:01:36 <Zakim> On IRC I see Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:01:37 <Zhe> zakim, mute me
18:01:37 <Zakim> Zhe should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Zhe should now be muted ←
18:01:51 <schneid> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
Michael Schneider: zakim, [IPcaller] is me ←
18:01:51 <Zakim> +schneid; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +schneid; got it ←
18:01:52 <Zakim> +[IBM]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IBM] ←
18:02:05 <schneid> zakim, mute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:02:05 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted ←
18:02:07 <Zakim> + +1.518.276.aacc
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.518.276.aacc ←
18:02:08 <Achille> Zakim, IBM is me
Zakim, IBM is me ←
18:02:08 <Zakim> +Achille; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Achille; got it ←
18:02:14 <schneid> zakim, unmute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
18:02:14 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted ←
18:02:21 <Zakim> +Evan_Wallace
Zakim IRC Bot: +Evan_Wallace ←
18:02:30 <IanH> ScribeNick: Achille
18:02:31 <Achille> ScribeNick: Achille
18:02:44 <Zakim> +??P15
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P15 ←
18:02:50 <Zakim> +??P12
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P12 ←
18:02:54 <Bernardo Cuenca Grau> Zakim, ??P12 is me
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: Zakim, ??P12 is me ←
18:02:54 <Zakim> +Bernardo Cuenca Grau; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Bernardo Cuenca Grau; got it ←
18:03:04 <Bernardo Cuenca Grau> Zakim, mute me
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: Zakim, mute me ←
18:03:04 <Zakim> Bernardo Cuenca Grau should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Bernardo Cuenca Grau should now be muted ←
18:03:11 <Zakim> +??P16
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P16 ←
18:03:19 <uli> zakim, ??P16 is me
Uli Sattler: zakim, ??P16 is me ←
18:03:19 <Zakim> +uli; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +uli; got it ←
18:03:24 <baojie> Zakim, who is on the phone
Jie Bao: Zakim, who is on the phone ←
18:03:24 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is on the phone', baojie
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'who is on the phone', baojie ←
18:03:37 <IanH> zakim, who is here?
Ian Horrocks: zakim, who is here? ←
18:03:37 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid, Achille, +1.518.276.aacc, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid, Achille, +1.518.276.aacc, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli ←
18:03:39 <Zakim> On IRC I see uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:03:42 <uli> zakim, mute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, mute me ←
18:03:42 <Zakim> uli should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should now be muted ←
18:03:45 <schneid> zakim, mute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:03:45 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted ←
18:03:49 <baojie> Zakim, aacc is baojie
Jie Bao: Zakim, aacc is baojie ←
18:03:49 <Zakim> +baojie; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +baojie; got it ←
18:03:51 <ivan> scribenick: Achille
18:03:51 <Zakim> +Jonathan_Rees
Zakim IRC Bot: +Jonathan_Rees ←
18:03:59 <ivan> scribe: Achille
18:04:34 <IanH> zakim, aacc is baojie
Ian Horrocks: zakim, aacc is baojie ←
18:04:34 <Zakim> sorry, IanH, I do not recognize a party named 'aacc'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, IanH, I do not recognize a party named 'aacc' ←
18:04:53 <IanH> zakim, who is here?
Ian Horrocks: zakim, who is here? ←
18:04:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), Jonathan_Rees
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), Jonathan_Rees ←
18:04:56 <Zakim> On IRC I see msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:05:23 <Achille> topic: Admin
18:05:23 <Achille> subtopic: Agenda amendments?
18:05:24 <alanr> zakim, who is here?
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, who is here? ←
18:05:24 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), Jonathan_Rees
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), Jonathan_Rees ←
18:05:27 <Zakim> On IRC I see alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:05:32 <Zakim> +msmith
Zakim IRC Bot: +msmith ←
18:05:36 <Achille> ianh: no agenda amendments
Ian Horrocks: no agenda amendments ←
18:05:41 <alanr> zakim, Jonathan_Rees is alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, Jonathan_Rees is alanr ←
18:05:41 <Zakim> +alanr; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +alanr; got it ←
18:05:49 <Achille> subtopic: Accept Previous Minutes (07 January)
18:05:59 <alanr> zakim, mute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, mute me ←
18:05:59 <Zakim> alanr should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr should now be muted ←
18:06:00 <Achille> ian: ok to me
Ian Horrocks: ok to me ←
18:06:22 <Achille> PROPOSED: Accept Previous Minutes (07 January)
PROPOSED: Accept Previous Minutes (07 January) ←
18:06:38 <Achille> RESOLVED: Accept Previous Minutes (07 January)
RESOLVED: Accept Previous Minutes (07 January) ←
18:06:53 <Achille> subtopic: Pending Review Actions
18:07:08 <Achille> subsubtopic: Action 250: Send mime-type registrations in to IETF when we do last-call publications / Sandro Hawke
18:07:27 <schneid> I remember some mail this week from IETF people?
Michael Schneider: I remember some mail this week from IETF people? ←
18:07:34 <Achille> ian: the applications have been made, and it is ongoing process
Ian Horrocks: the applications have been made, and it is ongoing process ←
18:07:59 <Achille> subsubtopic: Action 261: Implement change to syntax for datetime xml schema coordination / Peter Patel-Schneider
18:08:21 <Achille> ianh: Peter has done his part. We are waiting for xml schema wg response
Ian Horrocks: Peter has done his part. We are waiting for xml schema wg response ←
18:08:44 <Achille> subtopic: Due and overdue Actions
18:08:44 <Achille> subsubtopic: Action 262: Send mail to Cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment / Alan Ruttenberg
18:08:45 <alanr> tyes
Alan Ruttenberg: tyes ←
18:08:46 <alanr> yes
Alan Ruttenberg: yes ←
18:08:52 <alanr> sorry - muted
Alan Ruttenberg: sorry - muted ←
18:09:09 <Achille> ianh: Action 262 done!
Ian Horrocks: ACTION-262 done! ←
18:09:35 <Achille> subtopic: Soliciting reviews of and/or comments on LC documents
18:09:48 <Achille> ianh: we did not receive a lot of comments this should be a cause for concerns at this point
Ian Horrocks: we did not receive a lot of comments this should be a cause for concerns at this point ←
18:10:03 <Zhe> q+
18:10:20 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:10:20 <uli> zakim, mute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, mute me ←
18:10:21 <Zakim> uli was already muted, uli
Zakim IRC Bot: uli was already muted, uli ←
18:10:21 <Zhe> zakim, unmute me
18:10:21 <Zakim> Zhe should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Zhe should no longer be muted ←
18:10:29 <Achille> ivan: i agree with ian concerns
Ivan Herman: i agree with ian concerns ←
18:10:42 <Achille> zhe: Oracle is sending some comments in a few days. It is hard to get further comments given the size of the spec and the background needed to understand it.
Zhe Wu: Oracle is sending some comments in a few days. It is hard to get further comments given the size of the spec and the background needed to understand it. ←
18:11:40 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
18:11:43 <ivan> ack Zhe
Ivan Herman: ack Zhe ←
18:11:49 <Achille> ianh: important to get comments from companies and organizations outside the working group
Ian Horrocks: important to get comments from companies and organizations outside the working group ←
18:11:54 <IanH> ack zhe
Ian Horrocks: ack zhe ←
18:11:57 <IanH> ack ivan
Ian Horrocks: ack ivan ←
18:12:03 <Zhe> zakim, mute me
18:12:03 <Zakim> Zhe should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Zhe should now be muted ←
18:12:22 <alanr> I will do so again on the lists that I sent to.
Alan Ruttenberg: I will do so again on the lists that I sent to. ←
18:12:25 <Achille> ivan: An explicit call for comment from the chair might have some positive effect
Ivan Herman: An explicit call for comment from the chair might have some positive effect ←
18:12:45 <Achille> ianh: yes, we will repeat the call for comment that we did initially
Ian Horrocks: yes, we will repeat the call for comment that we did initially ←
18:12:45 <alanr> will do
Alan Ruttenberg: will do ←
18:12:56 <Achille> ivan: great. The call should be cosign with Alan
Ivan Herman: great. The call should be cosign with Alan ←
18:13:09 <Achille> ianh: personal solicitations are even better
Ian Horrocks: personal solicitations are even better ←
18:13:52 <alanr> zakim, unmute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, unmute me ←
18:13:52 <Zakim> alanr should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr should no longer be muted ←
18:13:55 <Achille> ivan: people with influencial blogs might also help by posting on their blogs
Ivan Herman: people with influencial blogs might also help by posting on their blogs ←
18:14:02 <Achille> ivan: Example: Alan, can you post it on your blog?
Ivan Herman: Example: Alan, can you post it on your blog? ←
18:14:20 <msmith> yes, it does
Michael Smith: yes, it does ←
18:14:23 <Achille> ianh: yes anybody with a blog
Ian Horrocks: yes anybody with a blog ←
18:14:33 <msmith> yes
Michael Smith: yes ←
18:14:34 <Achille> alanr: Example: Clark & Parsia's blog?
Alan Ruttenberg: Example: Clark & Parsia's blog? ←
18:14:36 <msmith> will pas it on
Michael Smith: will pas it on ←
18:14:45 <alanr> zakim, mute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, mute me ←
18:14:45 <Zakim> alanr should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr should now be muted ←
18:15:01 <Achille> ianh: Alan and I will send a final reminder on the various mailing lists
Ian Horrocks: Alan and I will send a final reminder on the various mailing lists ←
18:15:12 <Achille> ianh: people should write to their blogs
Ian Horrocks: people should write to their blogs ←
18:15:23 <Achille> ianh: personal solicitations are also recommended
Ian Horrocks: personal solicitations are also recommended ←
18:15:35 <Achille> ianh: other ideas?
Ian Horrocks: other ideas? ←
18:15:50 <Achille> subtopic: F2F5 (23-24 February, 2009)
18:16:33 <Achille> ianh: only 6 participants confirmed and 4 remote participants confirmed
Ian Horrocks: only 6 participants confirmed and 4 remote participants confirmed ←
18:16:51 <Achille> topic: Last Call Comments
18:17:10 <Achille> ianh: let's discuss Alan Rector's comment
Ian Horrocks: let's discuss Alan Rector's comment ←
18:17:11 <alanr> but this time to the official list
Alan Ruttenberg: but this time to the official list ←
18:17:17 <alanr> zakim, unmute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, unmute me ←
18:17:17 <Zakim> alanr should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr should no longer be muted ←
18:17:21 <Zakim> + +1.781.271.aadd
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.781.271.aadd ←
18:17:24 <uli> i didn't see 2...
Uli Sattler: i didn't see 2... ←
18:17:25 <msmith> I agree, it seemed close to the same
Michael Smith: I agree, it seemed close to the same ←
18:17:30 <Achille> ianh: is the latest version of the comment different from the first one?
Ian Horrocks: is the latest version of the comment different from the first one? ←
18:17:39 <Achille> alanr: No, it is roughly the same. It was just moved to the right page
Alan Ruttenberg: No, it is roughly the same. It was just moved to the right page ←
18:17:40 <Zhe> I just updated the F2f5, I will join.
Zhe Wu: I just updated the F2f5, I will join. ←
18:17:54 <alanr> great, Zhe!
Alan Ruttenberg: great, Zhe! ←
18:18:19 <IanH> zakim, who is here?
Ian Horrocks: zakim, who is here? ←
18:18:19 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), alanr, msmith, +1.781.271.aadd
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), alanr, msmith, +1.781.271.aadd ←
18:18:22 <Zakim> On IRC I see alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:19:14 <IanH> Who called in from USA area code 781?
Ian Horrocks: Who called in from USA area code 781? ←
18:19:24 <Achille> alanr: i have proposed a solution to the issue raised by Alan Rector at http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/LC_Responses/ALR1
Alan Ruttenberg: i have proposed a solution to the issue raised by Alan Rector at http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/LC_Responses/ALR1 ←
18:19:31 <uli> what would the changes be?
Uli Sattler: what would the changes be? ←
18:19:35 <Achille> alanr: The proposed solution will require changes on our side
Alan Ruttenberg: The proposed solution will require changes on our side ←
18:20:11 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
18:20:18 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:21:09 <Achille> ivan: warning for ourselves: a major technical change will require a new Last Call (LC)
Ivan Herman: warning for ourselves: a major technical change will require a new Last Call (LC) ←
18:21:23 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
18:21:31 <IanH> ack ivan
Ian Horrocks: ack ivan ←
18:21:42 <Achille> ianh: The change suggested by Alan will require a new LC
Ian Horrocks: The change suggested by Alan will require a new LC ←
18:21:45 <uli> zakim, unmute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, unmute me ←
18:21:45 <Zakim> uli should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should no longer be muted ←
18:21:45 <Achille> ivan: yes
Ivan Herman: yes ←
18:21:45 <IanH> ack uli
Ian Horrocks: ack uli ←
18:22:03 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:22:12 <Achille> uli: what will be the required change?
Uli Sattler: what will be the required change? ←
18:22:24 <alanr> http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/LC_Responses/ALR1
Alan Ruttenberg: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/LC_Responses/ALR1 ←
18:22:30 <Achille> alanr: the proposed serialization is at http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/LC_Responses/ALR1
Alan Ruttenberg: the proposed serialization is at http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/LC_Responses/ALR1 ←
18:22:35 <Achille> alanr: the RDF mapping will have to change
Alan Ruttenberg: the RDF mapping will have to change ←
18:22:43 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:23:20 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:23:42 <Achille> uli: The parser will need to make sure that the strings are syntactically correct.
Uli Sattler: The parser will need to make sure that the strings are syntactically correct. ←
18:24:03 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:24:13 <Achille> uli: it sounds complicated
Uli Sattler: it sounds complicated ←
18:24:37 <Achille> alanr: the declarations for classes have no semantic impacts
Alan Ruttenberg: the declarations for classes have no semantic impacts ←
18:25:03 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:25:26 <Achille> uli: the parser will have to make sure the class expressions are correct according to the syntax
Uli Sattler: the parser will have to make sure the class expressions are correct according to the syntax ←
18:25:59 <bmotik> Zakim, unmute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, unmute me ←
18:25:59 <Zakim> bmotik should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should no longer be muted ←
18:26:08 <IanH> ack bmotik
Ian Horrocks: ack bmotik ←
18:26:18 <uli> zakim, mute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, mute me ←
18:26:18 <Zakim> uli should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should now be muted ←
18:28:01 <alanr> q+
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ ←
18:28:05 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:28:13 <Achille> bmotik: not a good idea to put all this kind of managarial information in annotation
Boris Motik: not a good idea to put all this kind of managarial information in annotation ←
18:28:47 <IanH> ack alanr
Ian Horrocks: ack alanr ←
18:28:58 <Achille> bmotik: not important from an interoperability perspective
Boris Motik: not important from an interoperability perspective ←
18:28:59 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:29:04 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
18:29:14 <uli> q-
Uli Sattler: q- ←
18:29:28 <IanH> ack bmotik
Ian Horrocks: ack bmotik ←
18:29:30 <Achille> alanr: we cannot say to such a world-class expert in modeling that his view on modeling is wrong
Alan Ruttenberg: we cannot say to such a world-class expert in modeling that his view on modeling is wrong ←
18:29:39 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
Ivan Herman: zakim, who is here? ←
18:29:39 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik, Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), alanr, msmith, +1.781.271.aadd
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik, Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, MarkusK_, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), alanr, msmith, +1.781.271.aadd ←
18:29:42 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
18:29:42 <Zakim> On IRC I see Joanne, alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Joanne, alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, MarkusK_, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:29:45 <uli> q-
Uli Sattler: q- ←
18:29:47 <Achille> bmotik: annotations are not about modeling
Boris Motik: annotations are not about modeling ←
18:29:53 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:30:01 <Achille> bmotik: for modeling purposes, use owl-dl
Boris Motik: for modeling purposes, use owl-dl ←
18:30:21 <Achille> bmotik: the Alan Rector's list of requirements has nothing to do with modeling
Boris Motik: the Alan Rector's list of requirements has nothing to do with modeling ←
18:30:28 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:30:42 <uli> ...but we can say even to world-leading expert that, given that the complications incurred by his workaround and (!) the fact that it will still be a work-around (and not a proper fix), this isn't worth it
Uli Sattler: ...but we can say even to world-leading expert that, given that the complications incurred by his workaround and (!) the fact that it will still be a work-around (and not a proper fix), this isn't worth it ←
18:30:52 <Achille> ianh: should we continue this discussion on email?
Ian Horrocks: should we continue this discussion on email? ←
18:31:19 <alanr> uli: Agree. Need a coherent explanation of what the complications are to support such.
Uli Sattler: Agree. Need a coherent explanation of what the complications are to support such. [ Scribe Assist by Alan Ruttenberg ] ←
18:31:19 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:31:23 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:31:42 <IanH> ack bmotik
Ian Horrocks: ack bmotik ←
18:31:46 <Achille> ianh: people should look at Alan's proposal and we need to clarify the technical issues/difficulties
Ian Horrocks: people should look at Alan's proposal and we need to clarify the technical issues/difficulties ←
18:31:59 <msmith> q+
Michael Smith: q+ ←
18:32:05 <Achille> bmotik: those issues were already discussed at the last F2F
Boris Motik: those issues were already discussed at the last F2F ←
18:32:12 <alanr> q+
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ ←
18:32:19 <msmith> q-
Michael Smith: q- ←
18:32:23 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:32:40 <Achille> ianh: i agree, but could someone send an email about the issues
Ian Horrocks: i agree, but could someone send an email about the issues ←
18:32:48 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:32:51 <IanH> ack alanr
Ian Horrocks: ack alanr ←
18:32:59 <Achille> ianh: for example,a summary of the discussions at the F2F or a pointer to the minutes of the last F2F
Ian Horrocks: for example,a summary of the discussions at the F2F or a pointer to the minutes of the last F2F ←
18:33:15 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:33:44 <Achille> alanr: i would like a discussion about the alternative solutions
Alan Ruttenberg: i would like a discussion about the alternative solutions ←
18:33:55 <alanr> zakim, mute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, mute me ←
18:33:55 <Zakim> alanr should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr should now be muted ←
18:34:19 <Achille> ianh: how do we deal with internal LC comments?
Ian Horrocks: how do we deal with internal LC comments? ←
18:34:42 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
18:34:50 <IanH> ack ivan
Ian Horrocks: ack ivan ←
18:34:51 <Achille> ianh should they be treated the exact same way as external comments?
ianh should they be treated the exact same way as external comments? ←
18:35:42 <Achille> ivan: the wiki page should contain all the comments (internal or external) because it will be used to track the changes to the spec
Ivan Herman: the wiki page should contain all the comments (internal or external) because it will be used to track the changes to the spec ←
18:36:03 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:36:10 <alanr> ok by me
Alan Ruttenberg: ok by me ←
18:36:19 <schneid> +1
Michael Schneider: +1 ←
18:37:06 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:37:30 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:38:26 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:39:00 <Achille> ianh: I will send an email clarifying how to make and deal with WG internal comments on LC documents
Ian Horrocks: I will send an email clarifying how to make and deal with WG internal comments on LC documents ←
18:39:44 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:39:46 <msmith> q+
Michael Smith: q+ ←
18:39:46 <ivan> action to IanH: send a mail to the group clarifying the dealing with WG internal comments on LC documents
Ivan Herman: action to IanH: send a mail to the group clarifying the dealing with WG internal comments on LC documents ←
18:39:46 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - to
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - to ←
18:39:56 <IanH> ack msmith
Ian Horrocks: ack msmith ←
18:39:58 <Achille> action: ianh to send an email to clarify how to make and deal with WG comments on LC documents
ACTION: ianh to send an email to clarify how to make and deal with WG comments on LC documents ←
18:39:58 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - ianh
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - ianh ←
18:40:19 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:40:47 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:41:00 <Achille> subtopic: Comment from Tim Redmond
18:41:02 <alanr> zakim, unmute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, unmute me ←
18:41:02 <Zakim> alanr should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr should no longer be muted ←
18:41:07 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:41:30 <Achille> ianh: we can simply send a note about the discussion we already had on the import issues
Ian Horrocks: we can simply send a note about the discussion we already had on the import issues ←
18:42:10 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:42:16 <Achille> alanr: I will call him to help clarify his understanding
Alan Ruttenberg: I will call him to help clarify his understanding ←
18:42:41 <Achille> ianh: i agree with Alan that he may not have fully understood the spec
Ian Horrocks: i agree with Alan that he may not have fully understood the spec ←
18:42:49 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:42:53 <alanr> we agreed to disagree :)
Alan Ruttenberg: we agreed to disagree :) ←
18:42:53 <ivan> yes
Ivan Herman: yes ←
18:43:49 <alanr> action: alanr to talk to tim redmond about his lc comment
ACTION: alanr to talk to tim redmond about his lc comment ←
18:43:49 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - alanr
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - alanr ←
18:43:59 <Achille> subtopic: Comment from Andy Seaborne
18:44:11 <baojie> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg//2009Jan/0025.html
Jie Bao: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg//2009Jan/0025.html ←
18:44:13 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:44:19 <alanr> action: alanruttenberg to talk to tim redmond about his lc comment
ACTION: alanruttenberg to talk to tim redmond about his lc comment ←
18:44:19 <trackbot> Created ACTION-264 - Talk to tim redmond about his lc comment [on Alan Ruttenberg - due 2009-01-21].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-264 - Talk to tim redmond about his lc comment [on Alan Ruttenberg - due 2009-01-21]. ←
18:44:31 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/mid/b6b357670901140921j4be87090h76df1d20a00878d6@mail.gmail.com Baojie's answer
Ivan Herman: -> http://www.w3.org/mid/b6b357670901140921j4be87090h76df1d20a00878d6@mail.gmail.com Baojie's answer ←
18:45:03 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:45:43 <Achille> baojie: my response is at http://www.w3.org/mid/b6b357670901140921j4be87090h76df1d20a00878d6@mail.gmail.com
Jie Bao: my response is at http://www.w3.org/mid/b6b357670901140921j4be87090h76df1d20a00878d6@mail.gmail.com ←
18:45:46 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:45:51 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
18:46:00 <IanH> ack ivan
Ian Horrocks: ack ivan ←
18:46:48 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:46:57 <Achille> ivan: there is another comment from Andy about RDF wg taking over some datatypes
Ivan Herman: there is another comment from Andy about RDF wg taking over some datatypes ←
18:47:09 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:47:13 <schneid> I agree that only an RDF working group may make such a statement
Michael Schneider: I agree that only an RDF working group may make such a statement ←
18:47:27 <Achille> ivan: i agree with Andy that we should not have such a statement in our spec about RDF working group
Ivan Herman: i agree with Andy that we should not have such a statement in our spec about RDF working group ←
18:47:49 <baojie> http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/InternationalizedStringSpec#Definition_of_the_rdf:text_Datatype
Jie Bao: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/InternationalizedStringSpec#Definition_of_the_rdf:text_Datatype ←
18:47:49 <ivan> The text in the rdf:text says: "In addition to the RIF and OWL specifications, this datatype is expected to supersede RDF's plain literals with language tags"
Ivan Herman: The text in the rdf:text says: "In addition to the RIF and OWL specifications, this datatype is expected to supersede RDF's plain literals with language tags" ←
18:48:15 <Achille> ivan: this should not be part of our document
Ivan Herman: this should not be part of our document ←
18:48:38 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:48:42 <Achille> ianh: should we discuss this issue further?
Ian Horrocks: should we discuss this issue further? ←
18:48:49 <Zakim> -MarkusK_
Zakim IRC Bot: -MarkusK_ ←
18:49:02 <Achille> ivan: baojie, did you also have a discussion with the RIF group?
Ivan Herman: baojie, did you also have a discussion with the RIF group? ←
18:49:07 <baojie> not yet
18:49:20 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:49:33 <Achille> ianh: let's add that to our todo list on the topic of coordination with RIF group
Ian Horrocks: let's add that to our todo list on the topic of coordination with RIF group ←
18:49:46 <Achille> topic: Test Cases
18:49:56 <Achille> ianh: Problems with approved test cases?
Ian Horrocks: Problems with approved test cases? ←
18:49:59 <Achille> ianh: no
Ian Horrocks: no ←
18:50:30 <Achille> ianh: tests are coming in fast. It is not clear how to run the approval process
Ian Horrocks: tests are coming in fast. It is not clear how to run the approval process ←
18:50:34 <alanr> q+
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ ←
18:50:38 <alanr> zakim, unmute me
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, unmute me ←
18:50:38 <Zakim> alanr was not muted, alanr
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr was not muted, alanr ←
18:50:40 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:50:42 <Achille> ianh: have anyone looked at the tests?
Ian Horrocks: have anyone looked at the tests? ←
18:50:43 <IanH> ack alanr
Ian Horrocks: ack alanr ←
18:50:58 <Achille> alanr: we should split the labor to make sure that every test is looked at by at least one person
Alan Ruttenberg: we should split the labor to make sure that every test is looked at by at least one person ←
18:52:39 <msmith> q+
Michael Smith: q+ ←
18:52:41 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:52:46 <Achille> ianh: If all reasoners pass successfully a test, it should not require additional human validation
Ian Horrocks: If all reasoners pass successfully a test, it should not require additional human validation ←
18:52:46 <IanH> ack msmith
Ian Horrocks: ack msmith ←
18:53:20 <Achille> mike: if there is no table entry, it means that the test cannot be tested by a OWL-DL reasoner (OWL Full test)
Michael Smith: if there is no table entry, it means that the test cannot be tested by a OWL-DL reasoner (OWL Full test) ←
18:53:45 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:54:03 <Achille> mike: there are also tests meant to illustrate the differences between DL and Full
Michael Smith: there are also tests meant to illustrate the differences between DL and Full ←
18:54:16 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:54:19 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
18:54:21 <schneid> q+
Michael Schneider: q+ ←
18:54:22 <uli> q-
Uli Sattler: q- ←
18:54:28 <schneid> zakim, unmute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
18:54:28 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted ←
18:54:29 <IanH> ack schneid
Ian Horrocks: ack schneid ←
18:55:03 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:55:39 <msmith> I don't know of tests that touch these cases
Michael Smith: I don't know of tests that touch these cases ←
18:55:40 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
18:55:44 <Achille> schneid: there are some corner cases that will cease to be valid OWL DL
Michael Schneider: there are some corner cases that will cease to be valid OWL DL ←
18:58:36 <schneid> schneid: there might be old test cases about the reserved vocabulary: OWL 2 DL is now more restrictive, cancelling out almost /all/ names from the rdf, rdfs, owl and xsd namespaces, where in OWL 1 many names were actually not disallowed. But these are corner cases.
Michael Schneider: there might be old test cases about the reserved vocabulary: OWL 2 DL is now more restrictive, cancelling out almost /all/ names from the rdf, rdfs, owl and xsd namespaces, where in OWL 1 many names were actually not disallowed. But these are corner cases. [ Scribe Assist by Michael Schneider ] ←
18:55:58 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:56:05 <schneid> zakim, mute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:56:05 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted ←
18:56:11 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:56:11 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:56:12 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:56:28 <alanr> that's one way
Alan Ruttenberg: that's one way ←
18:57:03 <alanr> I'll take 5
Alan Ruttenberg: I'll take 5 ←
18:57:06 <Achille> ianh: how to process tests validation by reasoners?
Ian Horrocks: how to process tests validation by reasoners? ←
18:57:09 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:57:14 <ivan> ok
Ivan Herman: ok ←
18:57:15 <Zhe> I will take 5
18:57:26 <msmith> I've already eye-balled them all, so can do it again, but that won't help.
Michael Smith: I've already eye-balled them all, so can do it again, but that won't help. ←
18:57:45 <Achille> no objection from me
no objection from me ←
18:58:02 <uli> ...why doesn't eye-balling help
Uli Sattler: ...why doesn't eye-balling help ←
18:58:04 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
Ivan Herman: zakim, who is here? ←
18:58:04 <Zakim> On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), alanr, msmith, +1.781.271.aadd, MarkusK_
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bmotik (muted), Ivan, IanH, Zhe (muted), schneid (muted), Achille, baojie, Evan_Wallace, Bernardo Cuenca Grau (muted), uli (muted), alanr, msmith, +1.781.271.aadd, MarkusK_ ←
18:58:05 <uli> ?
Uli Sattler: ? ←
18:58:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see MarkusK_, Joanne, alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see MarkusK_, Joanne, alanr, msmith, uli, baojie, Bernardo Cuenca Grau, Achille, Zhe, bmotik, schneid, ewallace, RRSAgent, Zakim, IanH, ivan, sandro, trackbot ←
18:58:10 <Achille> ianh: does anybody object to receiving 5 testcases to evaluate?
Ian Horrocks: does anybody object to receiving 5 testcases to evaluate? ←
18:58:11 <MarkusK_> I missed the discussion -- I also will check some further tests
Markus Krötzsch: I missed the discussion -- I also will check some further tests ←
18:58:11 <ivan> zakim, aadd is Joanne
Ivan Herman: zakim, aadd is Joanne ←
18:58:11 <Zakim> +Joanne; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Joanne; got it ←
18:58:20 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:58:23 <uli> zakim, unmute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, unmute me ←
18:58:23 <Zakim> uli should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should no longer be muted ←
18:58:23 <Zhe> please let me know which 5 though :)
Zhe Wu: please let me know which 5 though :) ←
18:58:55 <msmith> yes.
Michael Smith: yes. ←
18:59:02 <msmith> you can check my sanity :)
Michael Smith: you can check my sanity :) ←
18:59:17 <Achille> ianh: i am not convince that it will help
Ian Horrocks: i am not convince that it will help ←
18:59:39 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
18:59:43 <msmith> q+
Michael Smith: q+ ←
18:59:56 <Achille> alanr: it will help make sure that they are not OWL DL
Alan Ruttenberg: it will help make sure that they are not OWL DL ←
19:00:07 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:00:16 <IanH> ack msmith
Ian Horrocks: ack msmith ←
19:00:23 <Achille> ianh: if all three reasoners say there are not OWL DL that should be good enough, right?
Ian Horrocks: if all three reasoners say there are not OWL DL that should be good enough, right? ←
19:00:48 <Zakim> +??P24
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P24 ←
19:01:12 <Christine> Zakim, ??P24 is Christine
Christine Golbreich: Zakim, ??P24 is Christine ←
19:01:12 <Zakim> +Christine; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Christine; got it ←
19:01:28 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:01:35 <Achille> mike: the entries in the table are the ones that are now OWL DL.
Michael Smith: the entries in the table are the ones that are now OWL DL. ←
19:02:02 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:02:06 <Achille> mike: the only one handle to the reasoner were the OWL DL examples
Michael Smith: the only one handle to the reasoner were the OWL DL examples ←
19:03:08 <msmith> will do shortly
Michael Smith: will do shortly ←
19:03:52 <uli> http://owl.cs.manchester.ac.uk/converter/
Uli Sattler: http://owl.cs.manchester.ac.uk/converter/ ←
19:03:54 <ivan> i do not have a practice in m'ter syntax, sorry
Ivan Herman: i do not have a practice in m'ter syntax, sorry ←
19:04:16 <msmith> q+
Michael Smith: q+ ←
19:04:22 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:04:27 <IanH> ack msmith
Ian Horrocks: ack msmith ←
19:04:43 <msmith> +5, this would be nice
Michael Smith: +5, this would be nice ←
19:04:58 <msmith> @alan regarding declarations http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Syntax#Entity_Declarations_and_Typing
Michael Smith: @alan regarding declarations http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Syntax#Entity_Declarations_and_Typing ←
19:05:08 <uli> zakim, mute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, mute me ←
19:05:08 <Zakim> uli should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should now be muted ←
19:05:32 <Achille> ianh: we can use the converter as a species checker provided that the repair functionality is disable
Ian Horrocks: we can use the converter as a species checker provided that the repair functionality is disable ←
19:05:51 <Achille> topic: Plans for non-LC documents
19:05:55 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:06:53 <Achille> ianh: last week strawpoll on ManchesterSyntax to become Rec Track was not conclusive
Ian Horrocks: last week strawpoll on ManchesterSyntax to become Rec Track was not conclusive ←
19:07:16 <Achille> ianh: has anyone changed his/her mind since then?
Ian Horrocks: has anyone changed his/her mind since then? ←
19:07:26 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
19:07:30 <Zhe> q+
19:07:55 <Achille> ianh: would anybody raise a formal objection if ManchesterSyntax were to become a Rec Track?
Ian Horrocks: would anybody raise a formal objection if ManchesterSyntax were to become a Rec Track? ←
19:08:09 <Christine> +q
Christine Golbreich: +q ←
19:08:10 <Zhe> zakim, unmute me
19:08:10 <Zakim> Zhe should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: Zhe should no longer be muted ←
19:08:11 <IanH> ack ivan
Ian Horrocks: ack ivan ←
19:08:48 <Achille> ivan: I do not think it is part of our scope
Ivan Herman: I do not think it is part of our scope ←
19:08:52 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:09:05 <Achille> ivan: it was not part of the charter, and we are taking too much here
Ivan Herman: it was not part of the charter, and we are taking too much here ←
19:09:11 <IanH> ack zhe
Ian Horrocks: ack zhe ←
19:09:36 <uli> no, I don't think so
Uli Sattler: no, I don't think so ←
19:09:39 <Achille> Zhe: what are the consequences if it becomes rec track? will vendors be required to support it?
Zhe Wu: what are the consequences if it becomes rec track? will vendors be required to support it? ←
19:10:03 <Achille> ianh: no.
Ian Horrocks: no. ←
19:10:29 <Achille> ianh: it will be optional
Ian Horrocks: it will be optional ←
19:10:52 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
19:10:57 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:11:32 <Achille> ivan: but it will mean that it is a syntax taken seriously by the group
Ivan Herman: but it will mean that it is a syntax taken seriously by the group ←
19:12:15 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:12:19 <IanH> ack christine
Ian Horrocks: ack christine ←
19:13:16 <Achille> christine: it will become first class syntax if it becomes rec track
Christine Golbreich: it will become first class syntax if it becomes rec track ←
19:13:20 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:14:14 <uli> zakim, unmute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, unmute me ←
19:14:14 <Zakim> uli should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should no longer be muted ←
19:14:14 <IanH> ack uli
Ian Horrocks: ack uli ←
19:14:27 <Achille> christine: what are the arguments in favor of it being rec track?
Christine Golbreich: what are the arguments in favor of it being rec track? ←
19:15:08 <Achille> uli: better visibility, interoperability between tools, and shared human readable syntax
Uli Sattler: better visibility, interoperability between tools, and shared human readable syntax ←
19:16:14 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
19:16:29 <ivan> q-
Ivan Herman: q- ←
19:16:46 <uli> zakim, mute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, mute me ←
19:16:46 <Zakim> uli should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should now be muted ←
19:17:07 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:17:08 <Achille> ianh: how about ManchesterSyntax being a Note?
Ian Horrocks: how about ManchesterSyntax being a Note? ←
19:17:55 <Achille> ianh: seems nobody will vote against it
Ian Horrocks: seems nobody will vote against it ←
19:18:09 <uli> not extremely unhappy, but I would think that this was "treating the MS designers no too nicely" (note, I am not one of them)
Uli Sattler: not extremely unhappy, but I would think that this was "treating the MS designers no too nicely" (note, I am not one of them) ←
19:18:11 <Achille> PROPOSED : ManchesterSyntax will be a Note
PROPOSED : ManchesterSyntax will be a Note ←
19:18:26 <schneid> what about the editor?
Michael Schneider: what about the editor? ←
19:18:29 <uli> ...but I will shut up now
Uli Sattler: ...but I will shut up now ←
19:18:50 <schneid> q+
Michael Schneider: q+ ←
19:18:54 <schneid> zakim, unmute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
19:18:54 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted ←
19:18:58 <IanH> ack schneid
Ian Horrocks: ack schneid ←
19:19:28 <Achille> schneid: peter would be in favor of a recommendation
Michael Schneider: peter would be in favor of a recommendation ←
19:19:36 <Christine> +q
Christine Golbreich: +q ←
19:20:00 <schneid> zakim, mute me
Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
19:20:00 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted ←
19:20:33 <Achille> ianh: we can vote now and revisit the vote in light of completely new arguments
Ian Horrocks: we can vote now and revisit the vote in light of completely new arguments ←
19:20:52 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:21:19 <Achille> ivan: my impression was that peter was just lukewarmly in favor of it being Rec track
Ivan Herman: my impression was that peter was just lukewarmly in favor of it being Rec track ←
19:21:47 <Achille> christine: it would not be wlecome to delay the vote again and again. It has been on the Agenda several times before (on TC (2008.12.17), on TC (2009.01.07) and has already been postponed because one (or another) author was not there (indeed, Peter had the opportunity to support MS as a Rec if he wanted so since he was there on the previous TC 2008.12.17 and 2009.01.07, but he did not argue for it, e.g. before the straw-poll; on 2009.01.07 Bijan was not there again but Uli was there as a Manchester representative.
Christine Golbreich: it would not be wlecome to delay the vote again and again. It has been on the Agenda several times before (on TC (2008.12.17), on TC (2009.01.07) and has already been postponed because one (or another) author was not there (indeed, Peter had the opportunity to support MS as a Rec if he wanted so since he was there on the previous TC 2008.12.17 and 2009.01.07, but he did not argue for it, e.g. before the straw-poll; on 2009.01.07 Bijan was not there again but Uli was there as a Manchester representative. ←
19:21:59 <Achille> PROPOSED : ManchesterSyntax will be a Note
PROPOSED : ManchesterSyntax will be a Note ←
19:21:59 <IanH> ROPOSED : ManchesterSyntax will be a Note
Ian Horrocks: ROPOSED : ManchesterSyntax will be a Note ←
19:22:11 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
19:22:12 <ewallace> +1
Evan Wallace: +1 ←
19:22:12 <baojie> +1
19:22:14 <uli> -0
Uli Sattler: -0 ←
19:22:14 <Achille> +0.5
+0.5 ←
19:22:14 <MarkusK_> +0
Markus Krötzsch: +0 ←
19:22:15 <Zhe> +1 (ORACLE)
19:22:16 <msmith> 0
Michael Smith: 0 ←
19:22:16 <Bernardo Cuenca Grau> 0
19:22:18 <schneid> +1
Michael Schneider: +1 ←
19:22:18 <bmotik> -0
Boris Motik: -0 ←
19:22:18 <Christine> +1
Christine Golbreich: +1 ←
19:22:29 <IanH> 0
Ian Horrocks: 0 ←
19:22:50 <Achille> RESOLVED: ManchesterSyntax will be a Note
RESOLVED: ManchesterSyntax will be a Note ←
19:23:13 <Zakim> -uli
Zakim IRC Bot: -uli ←
19:23:21 <Achille> topic: Coordination with RIF
19:23:51 <Achille> ianh: jie agrees to take the job wrt to rdf:text
Ian Horrocks: jie agrees to take the job wrt to rdf:text ←
19:24:03 <Achille> ianh: what do we need for this coordination?
Ian Horrocks: what do we need for this coordination? ←
19:24:12 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:24:28 <IanH> ack christine
Ian Horrocks: ack christine ←
19:24:41 <Achille> baojie: what are the other issues on the list wrt to the coordination?
Jie Bao: what are the other issues on the list wrt to the coordination? ←
19:25:01 <Christine> -q
Christine Golbreich: -q ←
19:25:02 <Achille> ianh: some issues regarding datatypes
Ian Horrocks: some issues regarding datatypes ←
19:25:08 <IanH> q?
Ian Horrocks: q? ←
19:25:52 <Achille> ivan: one of the issues is the difference between how owl and xml schema handle datatype value spaces
Ivan Herman: one of the issues is the difference between how owl and xml schema handle datatype value spaces ←
19:26:04 <baojie> is there a pointer to previous discussions? thanks
Jie Bao: is there a pointer to previous discussions? thanks ←
19:27:03 <Achille> ivan: we do not want different view of datatypes by owl wg and rif wg
Ivan Herman: we do not want different view of datatypes by owl wg and rif wg ←
19:27:14 <Achille> ianh: no need to discuss it in detail now
Ian Horrocks: no need to discuss it in detail now ←
19:29:29 <Achille> topic: Additional other business
19:30:07 <Zakim> -Evan_Wallace
Zakim IRC Bot: -Evan_Wallace ←
19:30:12 <msmith> thanks everyone, bye
Michael Smith: thanks everyone, bye ←
19:30:13 <Zakim> -bmotik
Zakim IRC Bot: -bmotik ←
19:30:15 <Zakim> -msmith
Zakim IRC Bot: -msmith ←
19:30:19 <Zhe> bye
19:30:19 <Zakim> -Achille
Zakim IRC Bot: -Achille ←
19:30:25 <Zakim> -MarkusK_
Zakim IRC Bot: -MarkusK_ ←
19:30:28 <Zakim> -Zhe
Zakim IRC Bot: -Zhe ←
19:30:35 <Zakim> -Christine
Zakim IRC Bot: -Christine ←
19:30:41 <Zakim> -Joanne
Zakim IRC Bot: -Joanne ←
19:30:48 <Zakim> -baojie
Zakim IRC Bot: -baojie ←
19:31:03 <Zakim> -schneid
Zakim IRC Bot: -schneid ←
19:32:01 <Zakim> -Bernardo Cuenca Grau
Zakim IRC Bot: -Bernardo Cuenca Grau ←
19:32:35 <alanr> have to go to another call
Alan Ruttenberg: have to go to another call ←
19:32:44 <Zakim> -alanr
Zakim IRC Bot: -alanr ←
Formatted by CommonScribe