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17:54:41 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/01/23-owl-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/01/23-owl-irc ←
17:55:08 <sandro> scribenick: DougL
(Scribe set to Doug Lenat)
17:58:07 <Zakim> +??P12
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P12 ←
17:58:33 <Zakim> +??P13
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P13 ←
17:58:44 <Zakim> + +1.312.052.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.312.052.aaaa ←
17:58:53 <Rinke> Zakim, aaaa is me
Rinke Hoekstra: Zakim, aaaa is me ←
17:58:53 <Zakim> +Rinke; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Rinke; got it ←
17:59:14 <Zakim> +Alan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Alan ←
17:59:27 <Ratnesh> ??P12, is me
Ratnesh Sahay: ??P12, is me ←
17:59:30 <Zakim> +msmith
Zakim IRC Bot: +msmith ←
17:59:35 <alanr_> rrsagent, make log public
Alan Ruttenberg: rrsagent, make log public ←
17:59:41 <alanr_> rrsagent, bookmark
Alan Ruttenberg: rrsagent, bookmark ←
17:59:41 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2008/01/23-owl-irc#T17-59-41
RRSAgent IRC Bot: See http://www.w3.org/2008/01/23-owl-irc#T17-59-41 ←
17:59:50 <jjc> Zakim, mute me
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: Zakim, mute me ←
17:59:50 <Zakim> jjc should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc should now be muted ←
18:00:09 <Rinke> Zakim, ??P12 is Ratnesh
Rinke Hoekstra: Zakim, ??P12 is Ratnesh ←
18:00:11 <Zakim> +Ratnesh; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ratnesh; got it ←
18:00:22 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
18:00:25 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
18:00:27 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
18:00:33 <Zakim> +??P2
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P2 ←
18:00:49 <alanr_> bernardo, can you scribe
Alan Ruttenberg: bernardo, can you scribe ←
18:00:51 <Zakim> +??P6
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P6 ←
18:00:52 <Zakim> +??P17
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P17 ←
18:00:54 <Zakim> +??P18
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P18 ←
18:00:56 <bcuencag> Zakim, ??P2 is me
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: Zakim, ??P2 is me ←
18:00:56 <Zakim> +bcuencag; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bcuencag; got it ←
18:01:02 <ivan> me waves to all around
Ivan Herman: me waves to all around ←
18:01:06 <uli> zakim, ??P2 is me
Uli Sattler: zakim, ??P2 is me ←
18:01:06 <Zakim> I already had ??P2 as bcuencag, uli
Zakim IRC Bot: I already had ??P2 as bcuencag, uli ←
18:01:07 <bmotik> Zakim, ??P6 is me
Boris Motik: Zakim, ??P6 is me ←
18:01:07 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it ←
18:01:09 <IanH> I already asked Doug Lenat to scribe
Ian Horrocks: I already asked Doug Lenat to scribe ←
18:01:13 <bcuencag> Hi Alan, unfortunately I am leaving early with Ian today
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: Hi Alan, unfortunately I am leaving early with Ian today ←
18:01:17 <Zakim> +??P19
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P19 ←
18:01:24 <alanr_> Jonathan Rees is joining us on the same line as me
Alan Ruttenberg: Jonathan Rees is joining us on the same line as me ←
18:01:24 <IanH> And he agreed
Ian Horrocks: And he agreed ←
18:01:28 <bcuencag> I could scribe until then
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: I could scribe until then ←
18:01:31 <bcuencag> or next week
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: or next week ←
18:01:31 <alanr_> zakim, who is here"
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, who is here" ←
18:01:31 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is here"', alanr_
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'who is here"', alanr_ ←
18:01:34 <bmotik> Zakim, ??p18 is bmotik
Boris Motik: Zakim, ??p18 is bmotik ←
18:01:34 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it ←
18:01:35 <alanr_> zakim, who is here?
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, who is here? ←
18:01:35 <Zakim> On the phone I see DougL, Sandro, Ratnesh, jjc (muted), Rinke, Alan, msmith, Ivan, bcuencag, bmotik, ??P17, bmotik.a, ??P19
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see DougL, Sandro, Ratnesh, jjc (muted), Rinke, Alan, msmith, Ivan, bcuencag, bmotik, ??P17, bmotik.a, ??P19 ←
18:01:39 <Zakim> On IRC I see Zhe, bmotik, ivan, IanH, uli, jjc, alanr_, MarkusK, msmith, Ratnesh, RRSAgent, Zakim, bcuencag, DougL, Rinke, sandro, pfps, trackbot-ng
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Zhe, bmotik, ivan, IanH, uli, jjc, alanr_, MarkusK, msmith, Ratnesh, RRSAgent, Zakim, bcuencag, DougL, Rinke, sandro, pfps, trackbot-ng ←
18:01:50 <bcuencag> zakim, mute me
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: zakim, mute me ←
18:01:51 <Zakim> bcuencag should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencag should now be muted ←
18:01:55 <Zakim> +Zhe
Zakim IRC Bot: +Zhe ←
18:01:57 <Zakim> -bmotik.a
Scribe problem: the name 'bmotik.a' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Zakim IRC Bot: -bmotik.a ←
18:02:02 <IanH> zakim, ??P17 is me
Ian Horrocks: zakim, ??P17 is me ←
18:02:02 <uli> Boris, P2 is me, not you
Uli Sattler: Boris, P2 is me, not you ←
18:02:03 <Zakim> +IanH; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +IanH; got it ←
18:02:13 <DougL> First-time scriber, so feel free to type in your comment-summary if I garble it or fail to scribe it.
First-time scriber, so feel free to type in your comment-summary if I garble it or fail to scribe it. ←
18:02:17 <uli> zakim, ??P2 is me
Uli Sattler: zakim, ??P2 is me ←
18:02:17 <Zakim> I already had ??P2 as bcuencag, uli
Zakim IRC Bot: I already had ??P2 as bcuencag, uli ←
18:02:26 <Zakim> +??P18
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P18 ←
18:02:40 <bmotik> Zakim, ??p18 is me
Boris Motik: Zakim, ??p18 is me ←
18:02:40 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it ←
18:02:57 <Zakim> +Evan_Wallace
Zakim IRC Bot: +Evan_Wallace ←
18:03:07 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:03:07 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:03:51 <bmotik> Zakim, bmotik.a is me
Boris Motik: Zakim, bmotik.a is me ←
18:03:51 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it ←
18:03:58 <uli> zakim, ??P2 is me
Uli Sattler: zakim, ??P2 is me ←
18:03:58 <Zakim> I already had ??P2 as bcuencag, uli
Zakim IRC Bot: I already had ??P2 as bcuencag, uli ←
18:04:02 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:04:02 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:04:03 <alanr_> zakim, who is here?
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, who is here? ←
18:04:04 <Zakim> On the phone I see DougL, Sandro, Ratnesh, jjc (muted), Rinke, Alan, msmith, Ivan, bcuencag (muted), bmotik (muted), IanH (muted), MarkusK (muted), Zhe, bmotik.aa, Evan_Wallace
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see DougL, Sandro, Ratnesh, jjc (muted), Rinke, Alan, msmith, Ivan, bcuencag (muted), bmotik (muted), IanH (muted), MarkusK (muted), Zhe, bmotik.aa, Evan_Wallace ←
18:04:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see ewallace, Zhe, bmotik, ivan, IanH, uli, jjc, alanr_, MarkusK, msmith, Ratnesh, RRSAgent, Zakim, bcuencag, DougL, Rinke, sandro, pfps, trackbot-ng
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see ewallace, Zhe, bmotik, ivan, IanH, uli, jjc, alanr_, MarkusK, msmith, Ratnesh, RRSAgent, Zakim, bcuencag, DougL, Rinke, sandro, pfps, trackbot-ng ←
18:04:18 <Zakim> +??P21
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P21 ←
18:04:25 <pfps> zakim, ??p21 is me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, ??p21 is me ←
18:04:25 <Zakim> +pfps; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +pfps; got it ←
18:04:29 <pfps> zakim, mute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:04:29 <Zakim> pfps should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should now be muted ←
18:04:29 <sandro> Zakim, alanr_ has JonathanRees
Sandro Hawke: Zakim, alanr_ has JonathanRees ←
18:04:30 <Zakim> sorry, sandro, I do not recognize a party named 'alanr_'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, sandro, I do not recognize a party named 'alanr_' ←
18:04:48 <sandro> zakim, bmotik is Unknown1
Sandro Hawke: zakim, bmotik is Unknown1 ←
18:04:48 <Zakim> +Unknown1; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Unknown1; got it ←
18:04:55 <Zakim> + +1.518.276.aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.518.276.aabb ←
18:05:05 <jjc> Zakim, who's speaking?
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: Zakim, who's speaking? ←
18:05:17 <Zakim> jjc, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: Sandro (30%), Ratnesh (8%), bmotik.aa (9%)
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: Sandro (30%), Ratnesh (8%), bmotik.aa (9%) ←
18:05:47 <bcuencag> alan, who is scribing?
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: alan, who is scribing? ←
18:05:47 <Zakim> +JeffP
Zakim IRC Bot: +JeffP ←
18:05:47 <uli> ...the system still thinks that Bernardo is me...but this is wrong!
Uli Sattler: ...the system still thinks that Bernardo is me...but this is wrong! ←
18:05:50 <DougL> Alan: accept minutes from Jan 9
Alan Ruttenberg: accept minutes from Jan 9 ←
18:05:55 <sandro> PROPOSED: accept minutes of Jan 9
PROPOSED: accept minutes of Jan 9 ←
18:05:55 <ivan> 0
Ivan Herman: 0 ←
18:06:11 <pfps> +1 and a BIG thanks to Ian for fixing the minutes!
Peter Patel-Schneider: +1 and a BIG thanks to Ian for fixing the minutes! ←
18:06:12 <uli> ok
Uli Sattler: ok ←
18:06:19 <Zakim> -Unknown1
Scribe problem: the name 'Unknown1' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Zakim IRC Bot: -Unknown1 ←
18:06:23 <DougL> +1
+1 ←
18:06:25 <Rinke> +1 to accept
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 to accept ←
18:06:37 <IanH> +1
Ian Horrocks: +1 ←
18:06:41 <alanr_> +1
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 ←
18:06:43 <JeffP> +1
18:06:45 <Zakim> +??P0
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P0 ←
18:06:45 <bcuencag> +1
18:06:47 <dlm> 0 - abstain - missed meeting
Deborah McGuinness: 0 - abstain - missed meeting ←
18:06:56 <uli> zakim, ??P0 is me
Uli Sattler: zakim, ??P0 is me ←
18:06:56 <Zakim> +uli; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +uli; got it ←
18:06:59 <alanr_> zakim, ??P0 is Uli
Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, ??P0 is Uli ←
18:06:59 <uli> +1
Uli Sattler: +1 ←
18:07:00 <Zakim> I already had ??P0 as uli, alanr_
Zakim IRC Bot: I already had ??P0 as uli, alanr_ ←
18:07:04 <msmith> +0, noting the minutes still contain queue management and zakim clutter
Michael Smith: +0, noting the minutes still contain queue management and zakim clutter ←
18:07:04 <Ratnesh> +1
Ratnesh Sahay: +1 ←
18:07:22 <sandro> RESOLVED: accept minutes of Jan 9
RESOLVED: accept minutes of Jan 9 ←
18:07:31 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
18:07:32 <IanH> +1
Ian Horrocks: +1 ←
18:07:34 <alanr_> +1
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 ←
18:07:34 <DougL> +1
+1 ←
18:07:36 <pfps> +1, they are acceptable
Peter Patel-Schneider: +1, they are acceptable ←
18:07:36 <jjc> +1
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: +1 ←
18:07:38 <bcuencag> +1
18:07:38 <MarkusK> +1
Markus Krötzsch: +1 ←
18:07:39 <sandro> PROPOSED: accept minutes of last week
PROPOSED: accept minutes of last week ←
18:07:40 <Rinke> +1
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 ←
18:07:42 <msmith> +1
Michael Smith: +1 ←
18:07:46 <sandro> RESOLVED: accept minutes of last week
RESOLVED: accept minutes of last week ←
18:07:47 <Zhe> +1
18:07:50 <JeffP> +1
18:08:24 <DougL> Discussion (quick) of pending issues
Discussion (quick) of pending issues ←
18:08:49 <jjc> Zakim, unmute me
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: Zakim, unmute me ←
18:08:49 <Zakim> jjc should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc should no longer be muted ←
18:09:06 <DougL> Jeremy: action 63 has been closed, he believes
Jeremy Carroll: ACTION-63 has been closed, he believes ←
18:09:57 <DougL> Alan: action 52: added test guidelines: link added with draft instructions. respond to this please
Alan Ruttenberg: ACTION-52: added test guidelines: link added with draft instructions. respond to this please ←
18:10:18 <uli> action 61 is also done, I thin
Uli Sattler: ACTION-61 is also done, I think ←
18:10:24 <uli> s/thin/think
18:11:08 <IanH> I also believe that 61 is done
Ian Horrocks: I also believe that 61 is done ←
18:11:48 <dlm> you said there is the option to document?
Deborah McGuinness: you said there is the option to document? ←
18:11:51 <DougL> Issue 8: as proposed (not clear how to do this, hence postpone)
ISSUE-8: as proposed (not clear how to do this, hence postpone) ←
18:11:54 <dlm> are we not definitely documenting?
Deborah McGuinness: are we not definitely documenting? ←
18:12:23 <DougL> As per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0122.html
As per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0122.html ←
18:12:31 <sandro> PROPOSED: close (as POSTPONED) Issue 8 (dataproperty chains) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0122.html
PROPOSED: close (as POSTPONED) ISSUE-8 (dataproperty chains) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0122.html ←
18:12:32 <dlm> +q
Deborah McGuinness: +q ←
18:12:44 <ivan> ack dlm
Ivan Herman: ack dlm ←
18:13:42 <sandro> RESOLVED: close (as POSTPONED) Issue 8 (dataproperty chains) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0122.html
RESOLVED: close (as POSTPONED) ISSUE-8 (dataproperty chains) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0122.html ←
18:13:46 <pfps> +1
18:13:53 <sandro> PROPOSED: close (as RESOLVED) Issue 15 (Ontologies should not be required to include a URI) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0019.html
PROPOSED: close (as RESOLVED) ISSUE-15 (Ontologies should not be required to include a URI) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0019.html ←
18:13:56 <DougL> Turning to Issue 15 (Ontologies should not be required to include a URI) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0019.html
Turning to ISSUE-15 (Ontologies should not be required to include a URI) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0019.html ←
18:13:59 <pfps> +1
18:14:43 <dlm> are we doing anything to encourage naming ontologies?
Deborah McGuinness: are we doing anything to encourage naming ontologies? ←
18:15:03 <dlm> +q
Deborah McGuinness: +q ←
18:15:10 <ivan> ack dlm
Ivan Herman: ack dlm ←
18:15:23 <jjc> q+ to ask about divergence ...
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to ask about divergence ... ←
18:15:30 <DougL> DeborahM: We'd be better off with named ontologies, and should indicate it's a "best practice".
Deborah McGuinness: We'd be better off with named ontologies, and should indicate it's a "best practice". ←
18:15:32 <pfps> q+
18:15:38 <DougL> ...easier to track where they came from.
...easier to track where they came from. ←
18:15:40 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
18:15:40 <Zakim> jjc, you wanted to ask about divergence ...
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc, you wanted to ask about divergence ... ←
18:15:49 <pfps> zakim, unmute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
18:15:49 <Zakim> pfps should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should no longer be muted ←
18:16:48 <DougL> Jeremy: concern about further diversion from owl full and its family members.
Jeremy Carroll: concern about further diversion from owl full and its family members. ←
18:16:55 <ivan> ack pfps
Ivan Herman: ack pfps ←
18:17:12 <alanr_> q+
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ ←
18:17:16 <DougL> Peter: don't have to right now, allow unnamed ones, so what the hell?
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: don't have to right now, allow unnamed ones, so what the hell? ←
18:17:21 <pfps> zakim, mute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:17:21 <Zakim> pfps should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should now be muted ←
18:17:32 <alanr_> ack
Alan Ruttenberg: ack ←
18:17:32 <ivan> ack alanr_
Ivan Herman: ack alanr_ ←
18:18:02 <DougL> Alan: we want imports, want synergies, so why not encourage it?
Alan Ruttenberg: we want imports, want synergies, so why not encourage it? ←
18:18:19 <jjc> Alan: if the imports task force shows unexepctred divergence then we would have new information to revisit this issue
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Alan Ruttenberg: if the imports task force shows unexepctred divergence then we would have new information to revisit this issue [ Scribe Assist by Unknown jjc ] ←
18:18:21 <IanH> unmute me
Ian Horrocks: unmute me ←
18:18:25 <sandro> RESOLVED: close (as RESOLVED) Issue 15 (Ontologies should not be required to include a URI) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0019.html
RESOLVED: close (as RESOLVED) ISSUE-15 (Ontologies should not be required to include a URI) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0019.html ←
18:18:34 <sandro> PROPOSED: close (as RESOLVED) Issue 29 (ser-defined Datatypes: owl:DataRange vs rdfs:Datatype) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0017.html (see also http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0147.html and thread)
PROPOSED: close (as RESOLVED) ISSUE-29 (ser-defined Datatypes: owl:DataRange vs rdfs:Datatype) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0017.html (see also http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0147.html and thread) ←
18:18:44 <pfps> zakim, unmute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
18:18:44 <Zakim> pfps should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should no longer be muted ←
18:19:02 <jjc> +1
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: +1 ←
18:19:17 <DougL> Peter: summarizing the issue: proposal to make owl datarange unnec. wrt backwards compatibility
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: summarizing the issue: proposal to make owl datarange unnec. wrt backwards compatibility ←
18:19:33 <pfps> zakim, mute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:19:33 <Zakim> pfps should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should now be muted ←
18:19:34 <DougL> peter, you should type in your summary of that if you want to here.
peter, you should type in your summary of that if you want to here. ←
18:19:37 <pfps> +1
18:19:42 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
18:19:43 <alanr_> +1
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 ←
18:19:43 <DougL> +1
+1 ←
18:19:44 <MarkusK> +1
Markus Krötzsch: +1 ←
18:19:47 <uli> +1
Uli Sattler: +1 ←
18:19:47 <Rinke> +1
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 ←
18:19:48 <msmith> +1
Michael Smith: +1 ←
18:19:48 <IanH> +1
Ian Horrocks: +1 ←
18:19:49 <Zhe> +1
18:19:49 <JeffP> +1
18:19:51 <bcuencag> +1
18:19:54 <dlm> +1
Deborah McGuinness: +1 ←
18:19:55 <bmotik> +1
Boris Motik: +1 ←
18:20:01 <Ratnesh> +1
Ratnesh Sahay: +1 ←
18:20:18 <sandro> RESOLVED: close (as RESOLVED) Issue 29 (ser-defined Datatypes: owl:DataRange vs rdfs:Datatype) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0017.html (see also http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0147.html and thread)
RESOLVED: close (as RESOLVED) ISSUE-29 (ser-defined Datatypes: owl:DataRange vs rdfs:Datatype) as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0017.html (see also http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0147.html and thread) ←
18:20:31 <pfps> zakim, mute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, mute me ←
18:20:32 <Zakim> pfps was already muted, pfps
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps was already muted, pfps ←
18:20:44 <DougL> Punning discussion beginning now. Not a resolution, a discussion.
Punning discussion beginning now. Not a resolution, a discussion. ←
18:20:47 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
Ivan Herman: zakim, who is here? ←
18:20:51 <Zakim> On the phone I see DougL, Sandro, Ratnesh, jjc, Rinke, Alan, msmith, Ivan, bcuencag (muted), IanH (muted), MarkusK (muted), Zhe, bmotik.aa (muted), Evan_Wallace, pfps (muted),
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see DougL, Sandro, Ratnesh, jjc, Rinke, Alan, msmith, Ivan, bcuencag (muted), IanH (muted), MarkusK (muted), Zhe, bmotik.aa (muted), Evan_Wallace, pfps (muted), ←
18:20:56 <Zakim> ... +1.518.276.aabb, JeffP, uli (muted)
Zakim IRC Bot: ... +1.518.276.aabb, JeffP, uli (muted) ←
18:21:00 <Zakim> On IRC I see dlm, JeffP, ewallace, Zhe, bmotik, ivan, IanH, uli, jjc, alanr_, MarkusK, msmith, Ratnesh, RRSAgent, Zakim, bcuencag, DougL, Rinke, sandro, pfps, trackbot-ng
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see dlm, JeffP, ewallace, Zhe, bmotik, ivan, IanH, uli, jjc, alanr_, MarkusK, msmith, Ratnesh, RRSAgent, Zakim, bcuencag, DougL, Rinke, sandro, pfps, trackbot-ng ←
18:21:27 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
18:21:34 <DougL> See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html
See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html ←
18:21:46 <DougL> for a list of the questions
for a list of the questions ←
18:22:17 <dlm> \me dlm is 518 276 aabb
Deborah McGuinness: \me dlm is 518 276 aabb ←
18:22:39 <pfps> owl 1.1 allows at least six-way punning
Peter Patel-Schneider: owl 1.1 allows at least six-way punning ←
18:23:48 <ivan> 0 :-)
Ivan Herman: 0 :-) ←
18:23:50 <jjc> 0 for splitting
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: 0 for splitting ←
18:23:51 <bmotik> -0
Boris Motik: -0 ←
18:23:54 <sandro> +0 don't know enough about how the discussion will go, to have an opinion
Sandro Hawke: +0 don't know enough about how the discussion will go, to have an opinion ←
18:23:57 <MarkusK> +0
Markus Krötzsch: +0 ←
18:24:01 <Rinke> 0
Rinke Hoekstra: 0 ←
18:24:04 <dlm> 0
18:24:05 <DougL> No clear opinions on whether to distinguish those 2 kinds of punning.
No clear opinions on whether to distinguish those 2 kinds of punning. ←
18:24:08 <Zhe> 0
18:24:21 <DougL> Turning to question 2.
Turning to question 2. ←
18:24:44 <JeffP> where to find these questions?
Jeff Pan: where to find these questions? ←
18:24:56 <DougL> See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html
See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html ←
18:24:56 <uli> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html
Uli Sattler: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html ←
18:25:24 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:25:29 <ivan> ack bmotik
Ivan Herman: ack bmotik ←
18:25:32 <alanr_> ack boris
Alan Ruttenberg: ack boris ←
18:25:39 <JeffP> DougL, thanks!
18:25:48 <JeffP> Uli, too. :-)
18:26:31 <DougL> Boris: "services" are instances, take instances of people,... the value of the property is not a particular person but the class Person.
Boris Motik: "services" are instances, take instances of people,... the value of the property is not a particular person but the class Person. ←
18:27:06 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
18:27:07 <alanr_> is there an expectations that monkey species statements flow to monkeys?
Alan Ruttenberg: is there an expectations that monkey species statements flow to monkeys? ←
18:27:10 <ivan> ack uli
Ivan Herman: ack uli ←
18:27:14 <DougL> ...Monkeys eat bananas meaning that EACH instance does this, and Monkeys is itself an instance of Species(Type)
...Monkeys eat bananas meaning that EACH instance does this, and Monkeys is itself an instance of Species(Type) ←
18:27:16 <bmotik> Zakim, bmotik.aa is bmotik
Boris Motik: Zakim, bmotik.aa is bmotik ←
18:27:16 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it ←
18:27:21 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:27:21 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:27:42 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:27:42 <MarkusK> q+
Markus Krötzsch: q+ ←
18:27:47 <alanr_> q+ to mention property/instance punning
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ to mention property/instance punning ←
18:27:49 <bmotik> Zakim unmute me
Boris Motik: Zakim unmute me ←
18:27:51 <ivan> ack bmotik
Ivan Herman: ack bmotik ←
18:27:58 <uli> zakim, mute me
Uli Sattler: zakim, mute me ←
18:27:58 <Zakim> uli should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: uli should now be muted ←
18:28:08 <alanr_> q- alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: q- alanr ←
18:28:10 <DougL> ...case for treating classes as instances and properties as instances
...case for treating classes as instances and properties as instances ←
18:28:32 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
18:28:50 <alanr_> q: what about using annotations?
Scribe problem: the name 'q' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown q: what about using annotations? [ Scribe Assist by Alan Ruttenberg ] ←
18:28:57 <uli> ...but this will be taken care of with annotation spaces/other extended annotation mechanisms
Uli Sattler: ...but this will be taken care of with annotation spaces/other extended annotation mechanisms ←
18:29:02 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
18:29:09 <ivan> ack MarkusK
Ivan Herman: ack MarkusK ←
18:29:13 <jjc> q+ to ask for clarification of boris's annotation use case
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to ask for clarification of boris's annotation use case ←
18:29:15 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:29:15 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:29:30 <DougL> Markus: theuse case Boris mentioned is similar to my experience.
Markus Krötzsch: theuse case Boris mentioned is similar to my experience. ←
18:29:32 <msmith> q+ on punning between data & object
Michael Smith: q+ on punning between data & object ←
18:29:47 <DougL> ...City instances have the property population, e.g.
...City instances have the property population, e.g. ←
18:29:54 <uli> ...but this is "class as individual" punning
Uli Sattler: ...but this is "class as individual" punning ←
18:29:56 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:30:15 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
18:30:15 <Zakim> jjc, you wanted to ask for clarification of boris's annotation use case
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc, you wanted to ask for clarification of boris's annotation use case ←
18:30:19 <DougL> ...don't know types of things you have in advance always.
...don't know types of things you have in advance always. ←
18:30:23 <msmith> I reinforce the container use case for data/object
Michael Smith: I reinforce the container use case for data/object ←
18:30:33 <alanr_> q+ to ask about annotation properties versus data/object punning
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ to ask about annotation properties versus data/object punning ←
18:30:44 <alanr_> ack ivan
Alan Ruttenberg: ack ivan ←
18:30:49 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
18:30:52 <bmotik> Zakim, unmute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, unmute me ←
18:30:52 <Zakim> bmotik should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should no longer be muted ←
18:30:53 <ivan> ack bmotik
Ivan Herman: ack bmotik ←
18:30:55 <DougL> Ivan: Dublin Core had to worry about this with e.g. different ways to identify a person
Ivan Herman: Dublin Core had to worry about this with e.g. different ways to identify a person ←
18:31:17 <alanr_> q+ to mention logical consequences
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ to mention logical consequences ←
18:31:25 <MarkusK> +1 to Boris: punnig "metamodelling" does not require complex logical consequences
Markus Krötzsch: +1 to Boris: punnig "metamodelling" does not require complex logical consequences ←
18:31:34 <DougL> Boris: in these examples, people are just stating things, and using idiosyncratic code to reason with those assertions.
Boris Motik: in these examples, people are just stating things, and using idiosyncratic code to reason with those assertions. ←
18:31:35 <alanr_> ack alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr ←
18:31:35 <Zakim> alanr_, you wanted to ask about annotation properties versus data/object punning and to mention logical consequences
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr_, you wanted to ask about annotation properties versus data/object punning and to mention logical consequences ←
18:31:37 <ivan> ack alanr_
Ivan Herman: ack alanr_ ←
18:32:08 <DougL> Alan: people want to restrict domains and ranges on class properties
Alan Ruttenberg: people want to restrict domains and ranges on class properties ←
18:32:33 <DougL> ...punning lets us use real properties and subproperties this way.
...punning lets us use real properties and subproperties this way. ←
18:33:00 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:33:05 <bmotik> Zakim, unmute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, unmute me ←
18:33:05 <Zakim> bmotik was not muted, bmotik
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik was not muted, bmotik ←
18:33:05 <DougL> ...Can someone compare data and object property punning to the use of annotation properties (pro or con)?
...Can someone compare data and object property punning to the use of annotation properties (pro or con)? ←
18:33:07 <alanr_> ack bmotik
Alan Ruttenberg: ack bmotik ←
18:33:25 <DougL> Boris: when it comes to annotation-spaces, they require this type of punning.
Boris Motik: when it comes to annotation-spaces, they require this type of punning. ←
18:34:09 <DougL> ...given an annotation in the original ontology, you need punning because in the new ontology it might be one of two or more types.
...given an annotation in the original ontology, you need punning because in the new ontology it might be one of two or more types. ←
18:34:48 <uli> I still don't understand Alan's question...
Uli Sattler: I still don't understand Alan's question... ←
18:34:51 <DougL> Alan: what about the annotation properties in Owl 1.0 -- still okay? still there?
Alan Ruttenberg: what about the annotation properties in Owl 1.0 -- still okay? still there? ←
18:35:19 <jjc> q+ to ask about recording use cases
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to ask about recording use cases ←
18:35:32 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:35:34 <uli> not really, because in OWL1.0 we cannot pose any restrictions on this!
Uli Sattler: not really, because in OWL1.0 we cannot pose any restrictions on this! ←
18:35:38 <DougL> ...in what sense is that not enough, why do we need to use punning for that now, suddenly?
...in what sense is that not enough, why do we need to use punning for that now, suddenly? ←
18:35:46 <ewallace> q+
Evan Wallace: q+ ←
18:36:09 <MarkusK> +1 to uli: annotation properties cannot be used with enough OWL features
Markus Krötzsch: +1 to uli: annotation properties cannot be used with enough OWL features ←
18:36:23 <DougL> Jeremy: let's record these various use cases (DougL: on the wiki, not having the scribe record them all in real time!)
Jeremy Carroll: let's record these various use cases (DougL: on the wiki, not having the scribe record them all in real time!) ←
18:36:32 <DougL> exactly.
exactly. ←
18:36:55 <ewallace> +1
Evan Wallace: +1 ←
18:36:56 <bmotik> +1
Boris Motik: +1 ←
18:36:58 <DougL> +1
+1 ←
18:36:58 <MarkusK> +1
Markus Krötzsch: +1 ←
18:36:59 <Rinke> +!1
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 ←
18:37:16 <Rinke> s/+!1/+1
18:37:31 <DougL> See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html
See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html ←
18:37:34 <ivan> we already have http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/PropertyPunning
Ivan Herman: we already have http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/PropertyPunning ←
18:37:44 <DougL> Ivan's page is a good one.
Ivan's page is a good one. ←
18:38:17 <sandro> ACTION: MarkusK to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page
ACTION: MarkusK to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page ←
18:38:17 <trackbot-ng> Sorry, couldn't find user - MarkusK
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - MarkusK ←
18:38:21 <sandro> ACTION: Markus to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page
ACTION: Markus to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page ←
18:38:22 <trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-70 - Put his use case for punning onto a wiki page [on Markus Krötzsch - due 2008-01-30].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-70 - Put his use case for punning onto a wiki page [on Markus Krötzsch - due 2008-01-30]. ←
18:38:24 <DougL> We will modify that -- the ones who gave use cases -- Boris, Markus etc.
We will modify that -- the ones who gave use cases -- Boris, Markus etc. ←
18:38:26 <sandro> ACTION: Boris to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page
ACTION: Boris to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page ←
18:38:26 <trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-71 - Put his use case for punning onto a wiki page [on Boris Motik - due 2008-01-30].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-71 - Put his use case for punning onto a wiki page [on Boris Motik - due 2008-01-30]. ←
18:38:59 <sandro> ACTION: Alan to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page (for reasoning associated with punned properties, and the question about object data property punning vs annotation properties)
ACTION: Alan to put his use case for punning onto a wiki page (for reasoning associated with punned properties, and the question about object data property punning vs annotation properties) ←
18:38:59 <trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-72 - Put his use case for punning onto a wiki page (for reasoning associated with punned properties, and the question about object data property punning vs annotation properties) [on Alan Ruttenberg - due 2008-01-30].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-72 - Put his use case for punning onto a wiki page (for reasoning associated with punned properties, and the question about object data property punning vs annotation properties) [on Alan Ruttenberg - due 2008-01-30]. ←
18:39:04 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
18:39:08 <jjc> q-
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q- ←
18:39:09 <sandro> ack jjc
Sandro Hawke: ack jjc ←
18:39:16 <sandro> ack bmotik
Sandro Hawke: ack bmotik ←
18:39:40 <DougL> Boris: annotation properties (in OWL DL) not real properties
Boris Motik: annotation properties (in OWL DL) not real properties ←
18:39:43 <Rinke> very late +1 on uli's earlier remark on annotation properties and restrictions
Rinke Hoekstra: very late +1 on uli's earlier remark on annotation properties and restrictions ←
18:39:54 <DougL> ...they can have both indiv and data values
...they can have both indiv and data values ←
18:40:08 <ivan> ack ewallace
Ivan Herman: ack ewallace ←
18:40:10 <jjc> q+ on annotations in OWL 1.1
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ on annotations in OWL 1.1 ←
18:40:20 <jjc> q+ to comment on annotations in OWL 1.1
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to comment on annotations in OWL 1.1 ←
18:40:23 <alanr_> q+ alanr to ask for use cases for restrictions on punned object/data properties
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ alanr to ask for use cases for restrictions on punned object/data properties ←
18:40:34 <DougL> Evan: UML has association class, a natural way to talk about properties of relations.
Evan Wallace: UML has association class, a natural way to talk about properties of relations. ←
18:40:58 <DougL> ...not its defintion, properties of the relation. Commonly used in UML.
...not its defintion, properties of the relation. Commonly used in UML. ←
18:41:08 <jjc> q-
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q- ←
18:41:16 <alanr_> ack alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr ←
18:41:16 <Zakim> alanr, you wanted to ask for use cases for restrictions on punned object/data properties
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr, you wanted to ask for use cases for restrictions on punned object/data properties ←
18:41:34 <sandro> ACTION: Evan action to describe UML association class on the wiki, w.r.t. punning discussions
ACTION: Evan action to describe UML association class on the wiki, w.r.t. punning discussions ←
18:41:35 <trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-73 - Action to describe UML association class on the wiki, w.r.t. punning discussions [on Evan Wallace - due 2008-01-30].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-73 - Action to describe UML association class on the wiki, w.r.t. punning discussions [on Evan Wallace - due 2008-01-30]. ←
18:41:37 <msmith> q+ to comment on restrictions
Michael Smith: q+ to comment on restrictions ←
18:41:54 <DougL> Alan: use cases where people want to do logical inference not just recording the assertions, please.
Alan Ruttenberg: use cases where people want to do logical inference not just recording the assertions, please. ←
18:42:14 <ivan> ack msmith
Ivan Herman: ack msmith ←
18:42:14 <Zakim> msmith, you wanted to comment on restrictions
Zakim IRC Bot: msmith, you wanted to comment on restrictions ←
18:42:23 <MarkusK> yes, I think
Markus Krötzsch: yes, I think ←
18:42:39 <DougL> Mike: describing another case, may be the same as Markus' essentially.
Michael Smith: describing another case, may be the same as Markus' essentially. ←
18:43:22 <DougL> Next question: would dropping some/all punning help? impact on owl-full, on number of new vocab terms used,... etc.
Next question: would dropping some/all punning help? impact on owl-full, on number of new vocab terms used,... etc. ←
18:43:36 <pfps> zakim, unmute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
18:43:36 <Zakim> pfps should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should no longer be muted ←
18:43:39 <jjc> a moment ...
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: a moment ... ←
18:43:55 <DougL> Peter: no
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: no ←
18:44:04 <jjc> ok
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: ok ←
18:44:14 <DougL> Peter: period.
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: period. ←
18:45:34 <DougL> Jeremy: issue 65, 69, and 68 are relevant: for each issue, the intro. of punning introduces new difficulties.
Jeremy Carroll: ISSUE-65, 69, and 68 are relevant: for each issue, the intro. of punning introduces new difficulties. ←
18:46:00 <DougL> ...so now we have to come up with three fixes for these three new problems.
...so now we have to come up with three fixes for these three new problems. ←
18:46:07 <DougL> ...in order to allow punning.
...in order to allow punning. ←
18:46:18 <pfps> q+
18:46:19 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:47:04 <DougL> ...the owl DL and owl FULL gap is widened more than it would otherwise be, by allowing punning.
...the owl DL and owl FULL gap is widened more than it would otherwise be, by allowing punning. ←
18:47:30 <DougL> (Jeremy, send me an elaboration of this point and I will insert it into the minutes)
(Jeremy, send me an elaboration of this point and I will insert it into the minutes) ←
18:47:59 <alanr_> q+ to try to separate increase in vocabulary motivations in to the two parts
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ to try to separate increase in vocabulary motivations in to the two parts ←
18:49:14 <DougL> Peter: disagree: if you're not limiting yourself to OWL DL, why should you care?
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: disagree: if you're not limiting yourself to OWL DL, why should you care? ←
18:49:42 <bmotik> Zakim, unmute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, unmute me ←
18:49:42 <Zakim> bmotik should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should no longer be muted ←
18:50:18 <DougL> ... Complicated mapping rules are worth it, if it makes the conversion of triples into ontology easier.
... Complicated mapping rules are worth it, if it makes the conversion of triples into ontology easier. ←
18:50:46 <DougL> Boris: why not allow a few more properties here and there, what is bad about that?
Boris Motik: why not allow a few more properties here and there, what is bad about that? ←
18:50:47 <pfps> the mapping rules have been changed to make OWL DL parsing much easier, at a small expense - the driving factor is thus not punning, but parsing (as has been said before)
Peter Patel-Schneider: the mapping rules have been changed to make OWL DL parsing much easier, at a small expense - the driving factor is thus not punning, but parsing (as has been said before) ←
18:50:52 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:50:52 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:50:53 <jjc> q+ to reply to boris on quantity
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to reply to boris on quantity ←
18:50:56 <alanr_> ack alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr ←
18:50:56 <Zakim> alanr_, you wanted to try to separate increase in vocabulary motivations in to the two parts
Zakim IRC Bot: alanr_, you wanted to try to separate increase in vocabulary motivations in to the two parts ←
18:51:02 <pfps> q-
18:51:07 <bmotik> q-
Boris Motik: q- ←
18:51:07 <ivan> ack bmotik
Ivan Herman: ack bmotik ←
18:51:40 <DougL> Alan: tried to separate 2 issues. Incr. vocab makes the parsing of triples easier and deterministic.
Alan Ruttenberg: tried to separate 2 issues. Incr. vocab makes the parsing of triples easier and deterministic. ←
18:51:54 <DougL> ...the addl vocab removes ambiguities and localizes information.
...the addl vocab removes ambiguities and localizes information. ←
18:52:03 <bmotik> q+
Boris Motik: q+ ←
18:52:13 <DougL> ...This is a nice-to-have but not a need-to-have feature.
...This is a nice-to-have but not a need-to-have feature. ←
18:52:52 <DougL> ...allowing obj/data polymorphism makes it more of a requirement than an option.
...allowing obj/data polymorphism makes it more of a requirement than an option. ←
18:53:08 <pfps> zakim, unmute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
18:53:08 <Zakim> pfps should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps should no longer be muted ←
18:53:42 <DougL> Peter: you may need some fancy footwork, to avoid ambiguity...
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: you may need some fancy footwork, to avoid ambiguity... ←
18:54:31 <uli> ...desirable or understandable?
Uli Sattler: ...desirable or understandable? ←
18:55:01 <bmotik> +1 to continue
Boris Motik: +1 to continue ←
18:55:29 <ivan> q?
Ivan Herman: q? ←
18:55:37 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
18:55:37 <Zakim> jjc, you wanted to reply to boris on quantity
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc, you wanted to reply to boris on quantity ←
18:56:08 <pfps> q+
18:56:26 <ivan> ack bmotik
Ivan Herman: ack bmotik ←
18:56:30 <DougL> Jeremy: to answer Boris: larger vocabularies means more work and may actually drive off other potential OWL users.
Jeremy Carroll: to answer Boris: larger vocabularies means more work and may actually drive off other potential OWL users. ←
18:57:05 <uli> Jeremy, but these users will use tools to write ontologies, so perhaps they won't need to bother
Uli Sattler: Jeremy, but these users will use tools to write ontologies, so perhaps they won't need to bother ←
18:57:26 <jar> +1
Jonathan Rees: +1 ←
18:57:30 <DougL> Boris: punning doesn't necessitate more vocab actually.
Boris Motik: punning doesn't necessitate more vocab actually. ←
18:57:47 <bcuencag> Regrets, I need to leave early today, bye
Bernardo Cuenca Grau: Regrets, I need to leave early today, bye ←
18:57:48 <DougL> ...using typing to specify the type of partic properties.
...using typing to specify the type of partic properties. ←
18:58:11 <alanr_> +1
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 ←
18:58:12 <DougL> ...if there is no obj/data punning.
...if there is no obj/data punning. ←
18:58:14 <Zakim> -bcuencag
Zakim IRC Bot: -bcuencag ←
18:58:17 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
18:58:19 <jar> here's what i heard (of course i'm a newcomer) that I liked: Why not allow punning between class/property/individual, but not between dataproperty/objectproperty ?
Jonathan Rees: here's what i heard (of course i'm a newcomer) that I liked: Why not allow punning between class/property/individual, but not between dataproperty/objectproperty ? ←
18:58:23 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me ←
18:58:23 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted ←
18:58:25 <ivan> ack pfps
Ivan Herman: ack pfps ←
18:59:01 <DougL> Peter: using rdf + a litle bit of owl means what, exactly? you're probably not in owl-dl any longer.
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: using rdf + a litle bit of owl means what, exactly? you're probably not in owl-dl any longer. ←
18:59:03 <Rinke> just a thought, but if this dl-specific vocab is confusing to rdf/full users, couldn't we introduce a different namespace for dl vocab? ... ah, but that introduces yet other syntactic bloat
Rinke Hoekstra: just a thought, but if this dl-specific vocab is confusing to rdf/full users, couldn't we introduce a different namespace for dl vocab? ... ah, but that introduces yet other syntactic bloat ←
18:59:29 <IanH> Suggestion: document describing OWL for RDFers
Scribe problem: the name 'Suggestion' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Suggestion: document describing OWL for RDFers [ Scribe Assist by Ian Horrocks ] ←
18:59:33 <DougL> Moving on to question 4 of http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html
Moving on to question 4 of http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Jan/0231.html ←
18:59:34 <ivan> and what about a fragment like dlp?
Ivan Herman: and what about a fragment like dlp? ←
18:59:53 <pfps> a user of RDFS++ should have a document written for them (but maybe not by the WG)
Peter Patel-Schneider: a user of RDFS++ should have a document written for them (but maybe not by the WG) ←
18:59:58 <uli> I repeat my guess that these users will use tools to write ontologies, so perhaps they won't need to bother
Uli Sattler: I repeat my guess that these users will use tools to write ontologies, so perhaps they won't need to bother ←
19:00:03 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:01:15 <uli> q+
Uli Sattler: q+ ←
19:01:27 <pfps> q+
19:01:27 <DougL> Ivan: agree with Jeremy; I'm afraid of bloating the number of things a user needs to learn.
Ivan Herman: agree with Jeremy; I'm afraid of bloating the number of things a user needs to learn. ←
19:01:58 <DougL> ...most users use some editing tool; for them, learning more is a major issue.
...most users use some editing tool; for them, learning more is a major issue. ←
19:01:58 <pfps> q+ say that OWL DL already needed to know, and OWL Full users don't
Peter Patel-Schneider: q+ say that OWL DL already needed to know, and OWL Full users don't ←
19:01:59 <alanr_> ack uli
Alan Ruttenberg: ack uli ←
19:02:22 <DougL> Uli: looking to the future, fewer and fewer people will be using standard editors to
Uli Sattler: looking to the future, fewer and fewer people will be using standard editors to ←
19:02:25 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
19:02:30 <DougL> ..manually write OWL ontologies.
..manually write OWL ontologies. ←
19:02:43 <DougL> ...future tools will take care of more the bookkeeping details.
...future tools will take care of more the bookkeeping details. ←
19:02:49 <DougL> Peter: agree.
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: agree. ←
19:03:00 <uli> ...or have seen?
Uli Sattler: ...or have seen? ←
19:03:01 <IanH> +1
Ian Horrocks: +1 ←
19:03:18 <dlm> +q
Deborah McGuinness: +q ←
19:03:19 <IanH> Me too
Ian Horrocks: Me too ←
19:03:23 <pfps> q-
19:03:43 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:04:04 <DougL> Ivan: there will be users who create complex ontologies and will need future sophis. tools.
Ivan Herman: there will be users who create complex ontologies and will need future sophis. tools. ←
19:04:08 <alanr_> We are at time. Deb is last to speak on the issue
Alan Ruttenberg: We are at time. Deb is last to speak on the issue ←
19:04:10 <pfps> only people who need to know are those writing OWL DL in RDF/XML
Peter Patel-Schneider: only people who need to know are those writing OWL DL in RDF/XML ←
19:04:27 <DougL> ...but folksonomies staying at the DLP level is another more common situation.
...but folksonomies staying at the DLP level is another more common situation. ←
19:04:32 <pfps> ... directly in RDF/XML
Peter Patel-Schneider: ... directly in RDF/XML ←
19:04:44 <DougL> ...and those users will be around for many years, using EMACS eg and that's it.
...and those users will be around for many years, using EMACS eg and that's it. ←
19:04:49 <alanr_> emacs (emotes love)
Alan Ruttenberg: emacs (emotes love) ←
19:05:03 <jjc> q+ to talk about (x)html editing
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to talk about (x)html editing ←
19:05:04 <bmotik> If they can learn to use vi, they can use the distinction between object and data properties :-)
Boris Motik: If they can learn to use vi, they can use the distinction between object and data properties :-) ←
19:05:07 <DougL> ,,,they won't be using Protege and similar tools that go way behond what they need.
,,,they won't be using Protege and similar tools that go way behond what they need. ←
19:05:09 <jjc> q-
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q- ←
19:05:11 <ivan> ack ivan
Ivan Herman: ack ivan ←
19:05:38 <DougL> Deborah: stepping back a bit, to the general issue of adding more and more new constructs...
Deborah McGuinness: stepping back a bit, to the general issue of adding more and more new constructs... ←
19:05:52 <DougL> ...maybe there is such a thing as too many.
...maybe there is such a thing as too many. ←
19:06:07 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:06:14 <alanr_> ack dlm
Alan Ruttenberg: ack dlm ←
19:06:16 <msmith> To the final question, it is necessarily the case that additional features complicate user documentation. Certainly this is the case with OWA and lack of UNA. Like those cases, the complication is a trade-off between documentation complexity and meeting use cases
Michael Smith: To the final question, it is necessarily the case that additional features complicate user documentation. Certainly this is the case with OWA and lack of UNA. Like those cases, the complication is a trade-off between documentation complexity and meeting use cases ←
19:06:17 <Rinke> Note that we are again talking about vocab... but this is a different issue than punning itself?
Rinke Hoekstra: Note that we are again talking about vocab... but this is a different issue than punning itself? ←
19:06:18 <DougL> ...TO handle that, maybe select fragments ahead of time to help them focus on a useful subset or two.
...TO handle that, maybe select fragments ahead of time to help them focus on a useful subset or two. ←
19:06:24 <IanH> Look at SQL -- who knows all of the language, but many users seem to manage.
Ian Horrocks: Look at SQL -- who knows all of the language, but many users seem to manage. ←
19:06:53 <DougL> good point, ian.
good point, ian. ←
19:07:07 <uli> And even for documentation, you could hide/fold in some of these, I guess.
Uli Sattler: And even for documentation, you could hide/fold in some of these, I guess. ←
19:07:18 <DougL> Decide whether to discuss these next N issues, or skip them.
Decide whether to discuss these next N issues, or skip them. ←
19:07:47 <DougL> See Raised Issues in http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Teleconference.2008.01.23/Agenda
See Raised Issues in http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Teleconference.2008.01.23/Agenda ←
19:07:47 <jjc> +1 to accept
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: +1 to accept ←
19:07:57 <bmotik> +1 to accept
Boris Motik: +1 to accept ←
19:07:58 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
19:07:59 <msmith> +1 to accept ISSUE-95
Michael Smith: +1 to accept ISSUE-95 ←
19:07:59 <pfps> +1 to accept, and resolve quickly- its easy
Peter Patel-Schneider: +1 to accept, and resolve quickly- its easy ←
19:07:59 <jjc> (good catch)
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: (good catch) ←
19:08:04 <DougL> no one minds discussing issue 95.
no one minds discussing ISSUE-95. ←
19:08:04 <Rinke> +1 to accept
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 to accept ←
19:08:05 <alanr_> +1
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 ←
19:08:06 <ewallace> +1
Evan Wallace: +1 ←
19:08:07 <uli> +1
Uli Sattler: +1 ←
19:08:32 <DougL> Issue 94 Problem with roundtripping when going from functional-style syntax into RDF and back
ISSUE-94 Problem with roundtripping when going from functional-style syntax into RDF and back ←
19:08:47 <jjc> q+
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ ←
19:08:47 <bmotik> +1 to accept
Boris Motik: +1 to accept ←
19:08:48 <alanr_> +1
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 ←
19:08:49 <MarkusK> +1
Markus Krötzsch: +1 ←
19:08:49 <pfps> -1
19:08:50 <ewallace> +1
Evan Wallace: +1 ←
19:08:51 <Rinke> +1
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 ←
19:08:51 <DougL> -1
-1 ←
19:08:54 <IanH> +1
Ian Horrocks: +1 ←
19:08:57 <jjc> 0
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: 0 ←
19:08:59 <dlm> +1
Deborah McGuinness: +1 ←
19:09:00 <uli> +1
Uli Sattler: +1 ←
19:09:38 <jjc> q+
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ ←
19:09:48 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
19:09:59 <IanH> q+
Ian Horrocks: q+ ←
19:10:08 <alanr_> q+ alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ alanr ←
19:10:27 <Rinke> this is a replacement of ISSUE-2, as far as I understood the minutes of last week
Rinke Hoekstra: this is a replacement of ISSUE-2, as far as I understood the minutes of last week ←
19:10:29 <alanr_> ack ian
Alan Ruttenberg: ack ian ←
19:10:30 <ivan> ack IanH
Ivan Herman: ack IanH ←
19:10:35 <pfps> given the number of +1, it seems that we need to accept the issue
Peter Patel-Schneider: given the number of +1, it seems that we need to accept the issue ←
19:10:38 <DougL> If enough people want to discuss it, then tautologically it is WORTH discussing.
If enough people want to discuss it, then tautologically it is WORTH discussing. ←
19:10:49 <alanr_> ack alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr ←
19:11:29 <ivan> +1 to alanr
Ivan Herman: +1 to alanr ←
19:11:30 <pfps> could we get the issue fixed up? or at least a def of OWL/RDF
Peter Patel-Schneider: could we get the issue fixed up? or at least a def of OWL/RDF ←
19:11:31 <DougL> Alan: think also about whether and to what extent round-tripping is a requirement.
Alan Ruttenberg: think also about whether and to what extent round-tripping is a requirement. ←
19:11:42 <msmith> ISSUE-2 is CLOSED already
Michael Smith: ISSUE-2 is CLOSED already ←
19:12:01 <alanr_> +1 to ian
Alan Ruttenberg: +1 to ian ←
19:12:03 <jjc> ok
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: ok ←
19:12:06 <bmotik> AlLDisjointClasses
Boris Motik: AlLDisjointClasses ←
19:12:21 <jjc> thank you
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: thank you ←
19:12:39 <alanr_> Note that it was resolved for reasons other than roundtripping - n^2 -> n size for encoding
Alan Ruttenberg: Note that it was resolved for reasons other than roundtripping - n^2 -> n size for encoding ←
19:12:49 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:13:05 <bmotik> Zakim, unmute me
Boris Motik: Zakim, unmute me ←
19:13:05 <Zakim> bmotik should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should no longer be muted ←
19:13:54 <DougL> Issue 93 RFC 3066 - Tags for the Identification of Languages
ISSUE-93 RFC 3066 - Tags for the Identification of Languages ←
19:14:19 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:14:20 <IanH> I'm afraid that I need to leave early this week, so TTFN.
Ian Horrocks: I'm afraid that I need to leave early this week, so TTFN. ←
19:14:21 <pfps> there is the concern of duplicate "resolution" notes
Peter Patel-Schneider: there is the concern of duplicate "resolution" notes ←
19:14:22 <ewallace> +1
Evan Wallace: +1 ←
19:14:25 <DougL> +1
+1 ←
19:14:25 <Rinke> +1
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 ←
19:14:26 <jjc> q+
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ ←
19:14:26 <ivan> +1
Ivan Herman: +1 ←
19:14:31 <Zakim> -IanH
Zakim IRC Bot: -IanH ←
19:14:32 <Zhe> +1
19:14:33 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
19:14:35 <alanr_> ack jjc
Alan Ruttenberg: ack jjc ←
19:15:22 <DougL> Backward compatibility nits: see Issue 90, Issue 91 and Issue 92
Backward compatibility nits: see ISSUE-90, ISSUE-91 and ISSUE-92 ←
19:16:08 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:16:35 <DougL> Rinke: (please summarize what you are talking about, I am not following you.)
Rinke Hoekstra: (please summarize what you are talking about, I am not following you.) ←
19:17:09 <alanr_> q?
Alan Ruttenberg: q? ←
19:17:15 <pfps> the issue is built-in annotation properties (and related stuff) like deprecation
Peter Patel-Schneider: the issue is built-in annotation properties (and related stuff) like deprecation ←
19:17:32 <DougL> Options related to deprecating classes, properties and datatypes
Options related to deprecating classes, properties and datatypes ←
19:17:37 <alanr_> q+ alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ alanr ←
19:17:51 <alanr_> ack alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr ←
19:17:57 <DougL> Peter: let's not preserve deprecation, though versioning is still required.
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: let's not preserve deprecation, though versioning is still required. ←
19:18:19 <uli> ...where do I find the semantics of deprecated classes?
Uli Sattler: ...where do I find the semantics of deprecated classes? ←
19:18:39 <DougL> Alan: should we ignore them, treat them as annotations,...?
Alan Ruttenberg: should we ignore them, treat them as annotations,...? ←
19:18:41 <pfps> as for everything else, OWL S&AS
Peter Patel-Schneider: as for everything else, OWL S&AS ←
19:19:02 <bmotik> Even in OWL 1.0 deprecation was ignored, so we can ignore it in OWL 1.1 as well.
Boris Motik: Even in OWL 1.0 deprecation was ignored, so we can ignore it in OWL 1.1 as well. ←
19:19:15 <pfps> q+
19:19:18 <pfps> zakim, unmute me
Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, unmute me ←
19:19:18 <Zakim> pfps was not muted, pfps
Zakim IRC Bot: pfps was not muted, pfps ←
19:19:29 <ivan> ack pfps
Ivan Herman: ack pfps ←
19:20:01 <DougL> Peter: depr. is special, wierd,... just ignore it and see if something bad happens.
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: depr. is special, wierd,... just ignore it and see if something bad happens. ←
19:20:39 <uli> ...do we read this "who's screaming" with least or greatest fixpoint semantics?
Uli Sattler: ...do we read this "who's screaming" with least or greatest fixpoint semantics? ←
19:20:49 <bmotik> Just ignore them.
Boris Motik: Just ignore them. ←
19:20:57 <jjc> q+
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ ←
19:21:03 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
19:21:41 <DougL> Jeremy: if we do deprecate deprecation, then we better ask other groups whether there is some unintended bad synergy with what they are doing.
Jeremy Carroll: if we do deprecate deprecation, then we better ask other groups whether there is some unintended bad synergy with what they are doing. ←
19:21:56 <pfps> I can put together a proposal
Peter Patel-Schneider: I can put together a proposal ←
19:22:00 <jjc> q+ to go back to issue 93 (briefly)
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: q+ to go back to ISSUE-93 (briefly) ←
19:22:32 <pfps> no problem
Peter Patel-Schneider: no problem ←
19:22:47 <alanr_> Action: Peter to write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes
ACTION: Peter to write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes ←
19:22:47 <trackbot-ng> Sorry, amibiguous username (more than one match) - Peter
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, amibiguous username (more than one match) - Peter ←
19:22:47 <trackbot-ng> Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. ppatelsc, phaase)
Trackbot IRC Bot: Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. ppatelsc, phaase) ←
19:22:57 <jjc> action: jeremy to edit references in syntax to address addison's bcp47 comment
ACTION: jeremy to edit references in syntax to address addison's bcp47 comment ←
19:22:57 <trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-74 - Edit references in syntax to address addison's bcp47 comment [on Jeremy Carroll - due 2008-01-30].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-74 - Edit references in syntax to address addison's bcp47 comment [on Jeremy Carroll - due 2008-01-30]. ←
19:23:20 <pfps> Action: pfps to write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes
ACTION: pfps to write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes ←
19:23:20 <trackbot-ng> Sorry, couldn't find user - pfps
Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - pfps ←
19:23:34 <DougL> Turning to http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/tracker/issues/91
Turning to http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/tracker/issues/91 ←
19:23:43 <pfps> Action: Patel-Schneider to write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes
ACTION: Patel-Schneider to write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes ←
19:23:43 <trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-75 - Write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes [on Peter Patel-Schneider - due 2008-01-30].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-75 - Write proposal to resolve 90 to drop deprecation and document in changes [on Peter Patel-Schneider - due 2008-01-30]. ←
19:23:49 <DougL> Rinke: summarizing what it says on that link.
Rinke Hoekstra: summarizing what it says on that link. ←
19:23:54 <alanr_> I think we should keep ontology properties
Alan Ruttenberg: I think we should keep ontology properties ←
19:24:37 <alanr_> q+ alanr
Alan Ruttenberg: q+ alanr ←
19:24:38 <DougL> Ontology properties are: owl:imports, owl:priorVersion, owl:backwardCompatibleWith, and owl:incompatibleWith.
Ontology properties are: owl:imports, owl:priorVersion, owl:backwardCompatibleWith, and owl:incompatibleWith. ←
19:24:43 <ivan> ack jjc
Ivan Herman: ack jjc ←
19:24:43 <Zakim> jjc, you wanted to go back to issue 93 (briefly)
Zakim IRC Bot: jjc, you wanted to go back to ISSUE-93 (briefly) ←
19:24:45 <alanr_> ack jjc
Alan Ruttenberg: ack jjc ←
19:24:47 <ivan> ack alanr_
Ivan Herman: ack alanr_ ←
19:25:33 <pfps> directive
Peter Patel-Schneider: directive ←
19:25:44 <DougL> Peter: the state of owl:imports is: directive
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Patel-Schneider Peter Haase . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: the state of owl:imports is: directive ←
19:25:52 <pfps> i.e., something different than an annotation
Peter Patel-Schneider: i.e., something different than an annotation ←
19:26:10 <DougL> Alan: leave it as it is, not an ontol. property; make it subservient to versioning.
Alan Ruttenberg: leave it as it is, not an ontol. property; make it subservient to versioning. ←
19:26:24 <uli> sounds like a good idea to me
Uli Sattler: sounds like a good idea to me ←
19:26:24 <Rinke> +1
Rinke Hoekstra: +1 ←
19:26:27 <DougL> +1
+1 ←
19:26:28 <ewallace> +1
Evan Wallace: +1 ←
19:26:39 <DougL> Turning to The RDF to FS mapping does not provide a mapping for the owl:Ontology element to the Functional Style syntax
Turning to The RDF to FS mapping does not provide a mapping for the owl:Ontology element to the Functional Style syntax ←
19:26:45 <DougL> (issue 92)
19:27:09 <pfps> just a bug
Peter Patel-Schneider: just a bug ←
19:27:16 <Rinke> bug
Rinke Hoekstra: bug ←
19:27:16 <DougL> Proposal: just fix it.
PROPOSED: just fix it. ←
19:27:26 <bmotik> It is the inverse mapping; the mapping to RDF exists.
Boris Motik: It is the inverse mapping; the mapping to RDF exists. ←
19:27:30 <bmotik> I can fix that.
Boris Motik: I can fix that. ←
19:27:32 <pfps> I thought I did at some point, but I can produce a proposal
Peter Patel-Schneider: I thought I did at some point, but I can produce a proposal ←
19:27:44 <bmotik> I'd consider this just editorial..
Boris Motik: I'd consider this just editorial.. ←
19:27:57 <DougL> Treat it as an editorial issue (not something to discuss)
Treat it as an editorial issue (not something to discuss) ←
19:28:31 <jjc> regrets for next week
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown jjc: regrets for next week ←
19:28:32 <JeffP> bye
19:28:33 <Rinke> bye
Rinke Hoekstra: bye ←
19:28:34 <alanr_> adjourned
Alan Ruttenberg: adjourned ←
19:28:35 <MarkusK> bye
Markus Krötzsch: bye ←
19:28:35 <bmotik> bye
Boris Motik: bye ←
19:28:36 <Zakim> -Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan ←
19:28:37 <Zakim> -msmith
Zakim IRC Bot: -msmith ←
19:28:38 <Zhe> bye
19:28:39 <Zakim> -Evan_Wallace
Zakim IRC Bot: -Evan_Wallace ←
19:28:40 <Zakim> -JeffP
Zakim IRC Bot: -JeffP ←
19:28:41 <Ratnesh> bye
Ratnesh Sahay: bye ←
19:28:42 <Zakim> -MarkusK
Zakim IRC Bot: -MarkusK ←
19:28:43 <Zakim> -jjc
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 48 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Zakim IRC Bot: -jjc ←
19:28:43 <DougL> meeting ends.
meeting ends. ←
19:28:44 <Zakim> -Rinke
Zakim IRC Bot: -Rinke ←
19:28:45 <Zakim> -bmotik
Zakim IRC Bot: -bmotik ←
19:28:46 <Zakim> -Zhe
Zakim IRC Bot: -Zhe ←
19:28:47 <Zakim> -Alan
Zakim IRC Bot: -Alan ←
19:28:48 <Zakim> -pfps
Zakim IRC Bot: -pfps ←
19:28:50 <Zakim> -Ratnesh
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ratnesh ←
19:28:52 <Zakim> -uli
Zakim IRC Bot: -uli ←
19:30:52 <Zakim> -Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro ←
19:30:54 <Zakim> -DougL
Zakim IRC Bot: -DougL ←
19:31:08 <sandro> RRSAgent, list attendees
Sandro Hawke: RRSAgent, list attendees ←
19:31:08 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'list attendees', sandro. Try /msg RRSAgent help
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I'm logging. I don't understand 'list attendees', sandro. Try /msg RRSAgent help ←
19:31:12 <Zakim> -dlm
Zakim IRC Bot: -dlm ←
19:31:13 <Zakim> SW_OWL()12:00PM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_OWL()12:00PM has ended ←
19:31:14 <sandro> zakim, list attendees
Sandro Hawke: zakim, list attendees ←
19:31:15 <Zakim> Attendees were DougL, Sandro, +1.312.052.aaaa, Rinke, Alan, jjc, msmith, Ratnesh, Ivan, bcuencag, MarkusK, Zhe, IanH, Evan_Wallace, pfps, Unknown1, JeffP, uli, dlm, bmotik
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were DougL, Sandro, +1.312.052.aaaa, Rinke, Alan, jjc, msmith, Ratnesh, Ivan, bcuencag, MarkusK, Zhe, IanH, Evan_Wallace, pfps, Unknown1, JeffP, uli, dlm, bmotik ←
19:31:17 <Zakim> sorry, sandro, I don't know what conference this is
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, sandro, I don't know what conference this is ←
19:32:01 <sandro> Present: DougL, Sandro, Rinke, Alan, jjc, msmith, Ratnesh, Ivan, bcuencag, MarkusK, Zhe, IanH, Evan_Wallace, pfps, JeffP, uli, dlm, bmotik
Scribe problem: the name 'jjc' does not match any of the 45 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Achille Fokoue Alan Ruttenberg Anne Cregan Bernardo Cuenca Grau Bijan Parsia Boris Motik Conrad Bock Deborah McGuinness Doug Lenat Elisa Kendall Enrico Franconi Evan Wallace Evren Sirin Fabian Neuhaus Fabien Gandon Giorgos Stamou Giorgos Stoilos Ian Horrocks Ivan Herman James Hendler Jeff Pan Jeremy Carroll Joanne Luciano Jonathan Rees Markus Krötzsch Martin Dzbor Michael Sintek Michael Smith Michael Schneider Olivier Corby Pascal Hitzler Peter Haase Peter Patel-Schneider Ratnesh Sahay Rinke Hoekstra Sandro Hawke Steve Battle Suzette Stoutenburg Tommie Meyer Uli Sattler Vassilis Tzouvaras Vipul Kashyap Vit Novacek Vojtech Svatek Zhe Wu
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