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14:57:08 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-egov-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-egov-irc ←
14:57:10 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
14:57:12 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be EGOV
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be EGOV ←
14:57:12 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see T&S_EGOV()11:00AM scheduled to start in 3 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see T&S_EGOV()11:00AM scheduled to start in 3 minutes ←
14:57:13 <trackbot> Meeting: eGovernment Interest Group Teleconference
14:57:13 <trackbot> Date: 03 June 2009
15:01:48 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV()11:00AM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: T&S_EGOV()11:00AM has now started ←
15:01:56 <Zakim> +[CTIC]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[CTIC] ←
15:03:13 <Zakim> + +1.202.731.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.202.731.aaaa ←
15:03:20 <josema> zakim, [CTIC] is josema
José Alonso: zakim, [CTIC] is josema ←
15:03:21 <Zakim> +josema; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +josema; got it ←
15:03:49 <Zakim> - +1.202.731.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: - +1.202.731.aaaa ←
15:04:11 <Zakim> + +1.202.731.aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.202.731.aabb ←
15:06:50 <Zakim> + +0203334aacc
Zakim IRC Bot: + +0203334aacc ←
15:07:11 <josema> zakim, aabbis kevin
José Alonso: zakim, aabbis kevin ←
15:07:11 <Zakim> I don't understand 'aabbis kevin', josema
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'aabbis kevin', josema ←
15:07:15 <josema> zakim, aabb is kevin
José Alonso: zakim, aabb is kevin ←
15:07:15 <Zakim> +kevin; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +kevin; got it ←
15:07:22 <josema> zakim, aacc is john
José Alonso: zakim, aacc is john ←
15:07:22 <Zakim> +john; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +john; got it ←
15:07:26 <josema> zakim, who's here?
José Alonso: zakim, who's here? ←
15:07:26 <Zakim> On the phone I see josema, kevin, john
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see josema, kevin, john ←
15:07:27 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, josema, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, josema, trackbot ←
15:13:19 <josema> scribe: joseam
Scribe problem: the name 'joseam' does not match any of the 56 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Adam Harvey Aldo Gangemi Anne Washington Ari Schwartz Bede McCall Brand Niemann Christine Connors Christopher Testa Dalila Chiadmi Daniel Bennett Dave McAllister David Osimo Faisal Monai George Thomas Hugh Barnes Ilker Karakas Jacob Mumm Jeremiah Albrant Joe Carmel John Sheridan John Wonderlich Jonathan Gray José Alonso Juan Rodríguez Rodríguez Katie Haritos-Shea Ken Fischer Kendall Clark Kevin Novak Laila Benhlima Lanfranco Marasso Luigi Selmi Malcolm Crompton Maria Fernandez Ruiz Miguel Amutio Mohamed ZERGAOUI Oscar Azanon Esteire Owen Ambur Pasquale Popolizio Pietro Russo Rachel Flagg Richard Murphy Rinke Hoekstra Roberto Castaldo Robin Berjon Rowan Smith Sharron Rush Suzanne Acar Tanya Gupta Tim McMahon Tom van Engers Trond Undheim Vagner Diniz Vassilios Peristeras Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
(No events recorded for 5 minutes)
(Scribe set to Unknown joseam)
15:13:23 <josema> scribe: josema
(Scribe set to José Alonso)
15:13:28 <josema> chair: kevin, john
15:16:19 <john> lol!
John Sheridan: lol! ←
15:18:09 <josema> topic: "opengov dinner"
15:18:55 <josema> kevin: chat with other government stakeholders on how things are evolving (Adobe, CDT, Sunlight...)
Kevin Novak: I had a chat with other government stakeholders on how things are evolving (Adobe, CDT, Sunlight...) ←
15:19:21 <josema> s/chat/I had a chat
15:20:09 <josema> ...talk on opendata, discussions on business perspective
...talk on opendata, discussions on business perspective ←
15:20:43 <josema> ...on what's the long term impact for industry
...on what's the long term impact for industry ←
15:21:35 <josema> ...again on the "how" to move from the generic ideas to the practical stuff
...again on the "how" to move from the generic ideas to the practical stuff ←
15:22:33 <josema> ...reinforces the points we made on the paper, people read it, found it useful
...reinforces the points we made on the paper, people read it, found it useful ←
15:23:11 <josema> john: very interesting stuff, how to move from strategy to implemented systems
John Sheridan: very interesting stuff, how to move from strategy to implemented systems ←
15:24:47 <josema> kevin: also discussion about the dialogue, some points Beth made on the blog post recently
Kevin Novak: also discussion about the dialogue, some points Beth made on the blog post recently ←
15:24:49 <josema> [http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Wrap-Up-of-the-Open-Government-Brainstorming-Transparency/]
[http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Wrap-Up-of-the-Open-Government-Brainstorming-Transparency/] ←
15:27:14 <josema> john: one of things one need to do is to engineer processes in the system and get that kind of cultural change
John Sheridan: one of things one need to do is to engineer processes in the system and get that kind of cultural change ←
15:27:24 <josema> ...and that's hard to do, means cultural change
...and that's hard to do, means cultural change ←
15:27:34 <josema> kevin: agree
Kevin Novak: agree ←
15:28:00 <josema> ...creating this line of business is hard
...creating this lines of business is hard ←
15:28:07 <josema> s/line/lines
15:28:25 <josema> ...sometimes people and power located at different agencies
...sometimes people and power located at different agencies ←
15:30:04 <josema> john: one of the things that interesting me about transparency is how to connect it to public policy outcomes
John Sheridan: one of the things that interesting me about transparency is how to connect it to public policy outcomes ←
15:30:14 <josema> ...e.g. better spending of public money
...e.g. better spending of public money ←
15:30:32 <josema> ...one way of achieving transparency is to put up data on the Web
...one way of achieving transparency is to put up data on the Web ←
15:30:43 <josema> ...but then it's the question "so what?"
...but then it's the question "so what?" ←
15:30:52 <josema> ...what's the next part of journey looks like?
...what's the next part of journey looks like? ←
15:31:02 <josema> ...and that's hard
...and that's hard ←
15:31:33 <josema> rrsagent, draf minutes
rrsagent, draf minutes ←
15:31:33 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'draf minutes', josema. Try /msg RRSAgent help
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I'm logging. I don't understand 'draf minutes', josema. Try /msg RRSAgent help ←
15:31:38 <josema> rrsagent, draft minutes
rrsagent, draft minutes ←
15:31:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-egov-minutes.html josema
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-egov-minutes.html josema ←
15:32:28 <josema> topic: open data
15:32:45 <josema> ...what datasets? what for? what's the expected final result?
...what datasets? what for? what's the expected final result? ←
15:32:56 <josema> kevin: great point
Kevin Novak: great point ←
15:33:13 <josema> ...challenge is that some people in charge are technologists
...challenge is that some people in charge are technologists ←
15:33:27 <josema> ...difficult form them to understand government business
...difficult form them to understand government business ←
15:33:32 <josema> john: agree
John Sheridan: agree ←
15:33:52 <josema> ...coming from tech perspective myself
...coming from tech perspective myself ←
15:34:02 <josema> ...have seen people does not care
...have seen people does not care ←
15:34:07 <josema> ...there are bigger challenges
...there are bigger challenges ←
15:34:30 <josema> kevin: right, e.g. cloud computing, well, a buzzword
Kevin Novak: right, e.g. cloud computing, well, a buzzword ←
15:34:36 <josema> ...but what's in it for gov?
...but what's in it for gov? ←
15:34:42 <josema> ...would like to hear more of that
...would like to hear more of that ←
15:35:06 <josema> john: someone could say it reduces total cost of ownership and a number of other things
John Sheridan: someone could say it reduces total cost of ownership and a number of other things ←
15:35:24 <josema> ...in terms of OGD reason is because improves some public policy outcomes
...in terms of OGD reason is because improves some public policy outcomes ←
15:35:33 <josema> ...totally different type of thinking
...totally different type of thinking ←
15:35:39 <josema> ...not about lowering costs
...not about lowering costs ←
15:37:22 <josema> john: we tried to highlight some of this in the Note
John Sheridan: we tried to highlight some of this in the Note ←
15:37:54 <josema> kevin: I'm glad we did not go very technical there
Kevin Novak: I'm glad we did not go very technical there ←
15:38:08 <josema> topic: re-chartering
15:38:34 <josema> kevin: working on a draft charter based on previous discussion with Comm and you
Kevin Novak: working on a draft charter based on previous discussion with Comm and you ←
15:39:05 <josema> ...need to state goals clearly, e.g. need funding
...need to state goals clearly, e.g. need funding ←
15:39:45 <john> its ok for me
John Sheridan: its ok for me ←
15:39:58 <Zakim> -josema
Zakim IRC Bot: -josema ←
15:40:01 <john> had trouble earlier in the call
John Sheridan: had trouble earlier in the call ←
15:40:26 <Zakim> +josema
Zakim IRC Bot: +josema ←
15:41:57 <josema> ...we might need something about protoyping
...we might need something about protoyping ←
15:42:23 <josema> ...jose and I discussed a bit about this, and thought of 3 stages
...jose and I discussed a bit about this, and thought of 3 stages ←
15:42:37 <josema> ...no money: some smaller thing
...no money: some smaller thing ←
15:42:42 <josema> ...money: a bigger one
...money: a bigger one ←
15:42:52 <josema> john: right, need a consistent plan
John Sheridan: right, we need a consistent plan ←
15:43:00 <josema> s/need/we need
15:46:05 <josema> [kevin, tim likely to meet next week]
[kevin, tim likely to meet next week] ←
15:48:08 <josema> [some discussion on whether we should have 3 TFs: OGD, Interop, Web Design + Development]
[some discussion on whether we should have 3 TFs: OGD, Interop, Web Design + Development] ←
15:48:25 <josema> john: I like OGD and WDD, a bit worried about interop
John Sheridan: I like OGD and WDD, a bit worried about interop ←
15:48:52 <josema> ...interop is easy to say, difficult to define, *big* issue
...interop is easy to say, difficult to define, *big* issue ←
15:49:01 <josema> ...lots of stuff in there
...lots of stuff in there ←
15:51:42 <josema> josema: interop from different POVs
José Alonso: interop from different POVs ←
15:52:00 <josema> ...talked in the past much about front-end, big issue on its own
...talked in the past much about front-end, big issue on its own ←
15:52:09 <josema> ...back-end *huge*
...back-end *huge* ←
15:52:35 <josema> kevin: we could focus on the things they have to deliver
Kevin Novak: we could focus on the things they have to deliver ←
15:52:44 <josema> ...e.g. the data.gov kind of thing
...e.g. the data.gov kind of thing ←
15:53:44 <josema> john: I mostly care about OGD, as you know
John Sheridan: I mostly care about OGD, as you know ←
15:53:51 <josema> jose: me mostly
José Alonso: me mostly ←
15:54:07 <josema> ...let's try a different approach, what would be the deliverables?
...let's try a different approach, what would be the deliverables? ←
15:54:10 <john> for me, ogd design patterns - likewise, why not web design patterns?
John Sheridan: for me, ogd design patterns - likewise, why not web design patterns? ←
15:54:25 <josema> I very much like that!
I very much like that! ←
15:55:18 <josema> kevin: not big deliverable, small docs, maybe kind of EricP W3C Tech Survey thing
Kevin Novak: not big deliverable, small docs, maybe kind of EricP W3C Tech Survey thing ←
15:57:46 <josema> [maybe better two than three]
[maybe better two than three] ←
15:58:42 <john> yes
John Sheridan: yes ←
15:58:59 <josema> finally got it! :)
finally got it! :) ←
15:59:18 <josema> [we could split interop into two, some of it goes to TF1, some to TF3, then no TF2]
[we could split interop into two, some of it goes to TF1, some to TF3, then no TF2] ←
16:02:48 <josema> [kevin to draft charter with two TFs in mind]
[kevin to draft charter with two TFs in mind] ←
16:04:56 <josema> [ADJOURNED]
[ADJOURNED] ←
16:05:24 <Zakim> -josema
Zakim IRC Bot: -josema ←
16:05:25 <Zakim> -kevin
Zakim IRC Bot: -kevin ←
16:05:28 <Zakim> -john
Zakim IRC Bot: -john ←
16:05:30 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV()11:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: T&S_EGOV()11:00AM has ended ←
16:05:34 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.202.731.aaaa, josema, +1.202.731.aabb, +0203334aacc, kevin, john
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were +1.202.731.aaaa, josema, +1.202.731.aabb, +0203334aacc, kevin, john ←
16:05:36 <josema> zakim, list attendees
zakim, list attendees ←
16:05:36 <Zakim> sorry, josema, I don't know what conference this is
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, josema, I don't know what conference this is ←
16:05:46 <josema> rrsagent, draft minutes
rrsagent, draft minutes ←
16:05:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-egov-minutes.html josema
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-egov-minutes.html josema ←
16:35:36 <josema> rrsagent, bye
(No events recorded for 29 minutes)
rrsagent, bye ←
16:35:37 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see no action items ←
Formatted by CommonScribe