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13:59:26 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/04/04-gld-irc
13:59:32 <PhilA> zakim, this is gld
13:59:33 <Zakim> ok, PhilA; that matches T&S_GLDWG()10:00AM
13:59:37 <olyerickson> olyerickson has joined #gld
13:59:48 <PhilA> zakim, code?
13:59:48 <Zakim> the conference code is 45394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), PhilA
14:00:10 <HadleyBeeman> cheers, philA
14:00:14 <HadleyBeeman> Sorry to be missing you, olyerickson
14:00:24 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:00:28 <PhilA> zakim, ipcaller is me
14:00:28 <Zakim> +PhilA; got it
14:00:31 <olyerickson> sorry to, but need to provide moral support ;)
14:00:40 <olyerickson> olyerickson has left #gld
14:00:51 <DaveReynolds> DaveReynolds has joined #gld
14:01:39 <Zakim> +Sandro
14:01:47 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
14:02:02 <TallTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
14:02:02 <Zakim> +TallTed; got it
14:02:05 <TallTed> Zakim, mute me
14:02:05 <Zakim> TallTed should now be muted
14:02:22 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:02:22 <TallTed> TallTed has changed the topic to: Gov't Linked Data WG -- http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/ -- http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20130404
14:03:18 <sandro> Zakim, who is on the phone?
14:03:18 <Zakim> On the phone I see HadleyBeeman, PhilA, Sandro, TallTed (muted), DaveReynolds
14:04:21 <sandro> scribe: sandro
14:04:31 <sandro> RRSAgent, pointer?
14:04:31 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2013/04/04-gld-irc#T14-04-31
14:05:00 <sandro> trackbot, start meeting
14:05:02 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
14:05:04 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be GLD
14:05:04 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see T&S_GLDWG()10:00AM already started
14:05:05 <trackbot> Meeting: Government Linked Data Working Group Teleconference
14:05:05 <trackbot> Date: 04 April 2013
14:05:42 <MakxDekkers> MakxDekkers has joined #gld
14:05:52 <james> james has joined #gld
14:05:58 <HadleyBeeman> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/meeting/2013-03-28
14:06:00 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:06:29 <sandro> proposed: accept http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/meeting/2013-03-28 as minutes of last week
14:06:35 <PhilA> +1
14:06:39 <DaveReynolds> +1
14:06:43 <james> +1
14:06:44 <sandro> +1
14:06:49 <MakxDekkers> +1
14:06:52 <sandro> resolved: accept http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/meeting/2013-03-28 as minutes of last week
14:07:21 <TallTed> HadleyBeeman's connection is dicey, yes
14:07:40 <sandro> topic: adms
14:07:58 <sandro> phil: Trying to upload it to hg as we speak.   come back to me in 5 mins?
14:08:20 <sandro> topic: Incoming comments on LC documents
14:08:23 <MakxDekkers> have problems connecting voice, local problem it seems, will keep trying
14:08:37 <HadleyBeeman> Comments mailing list: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-gld-comments/
14:08:43 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: we've been trying to generate interest and get review comments.    not sure it's sufficient yet.
14:08:56 <sandro> .. looking mostly at March and April
14:09:10 <sandro> .. we have some on PROV and ORG, resolved
14:09:20 <sandro> .. cube and dcat are a concern
14:09:22 <MakxDekkers> have asked members of DCAT application profile group in Europe to send comments
14:09:25 <sandro> .. anything at all on cube?
14:09:44 <sandro> DaveReynolds: There was one comment, editorial, which I responded to.
14:10:01 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: We're supposed to close LC next week
14:10:31 <MakxDekkers> https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/asset/dcat_application_profile/description
14:11:27 <Zakim> +MakxDekkers
14:11:29 <sandro> sandro: Can we at least get the statistics people who were in the group, Dan Gilman, and the Australian person & get them to review it.
14:12:32 <sandro> sandro: we want evidence of wide public review
14:12:53 <sandro> DaveReynolds: Yeah, they've been around for several years, so not a lot of comments right now.
14:13:39 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: any proxy for comments?
14:14:05 <sandro> sandro: evidence of use, and the fact that we did announce it to these lists, .... that's something.
14:14:47 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: So maybe the discussion has already happened
14:15:11 <sandro> sandro: It's still be good to get a few more emails from people saying they've looked at it, and at least "seems okay to me"
14:15:33 <MakxDekkers> I will again send a message to the DCAT-AP working group list (over 40 people discussiong using DCAT)
14:15:35 <MariosMeimaris> MariosMeimaris has joined #gld
14:15:49 <sandro> DaveReynolds: Okay, sounds like I should ping the statistics list and Dan
14:16:06 <sandro> thanks, MakxDekkers
14:16:37 <DaveReynolds> action: DaveReynolds contact Dan Gilman and PublishingStatistics list to encourage LC responses on Data Cube
14:16:37 <trackbot> Error finding 'DaveReynolds'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/users>.
14:16:59 <sandro> sandro: I suggest provocative deadline-oriented emails.   One More Week!
14:17:24 <sandro> action: dave  contact Dan Gilman and PublishingStatistics list to encourage LC responses on Data Cube
14:17:24 <trackbot> Created ACTION-107 -  contact Dan Gilman and PublishingStatistics list to encourage LC responses on Data Cube [on Dave Reynolds - due 2013-04-11].
14:17:29 <DaveReynolds> We have had quite a lot of comments on DCAT over last few days
14:18:03 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:18:09 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Everyone else, PLEASE try to find other people who might care and could review these documents
14:18:12 <MariosMeimaris> zakim, IPcaller is me
14:18:12 <Zakim> +MariosMeimaris; got it
14:18:27 <PhilA> topic: ADMS
14:18:29 <PhilA> http://philarcher.org/adms/
14:18:29 <sandro> topic: ADMS
14:18:52 <sandro> PhilA: Forgive me to the non w3.org address for now; I'll put it in mercurial when I can
14:19:21 <sandro> .. I hope I've simplified ADMS quite significantly, applying what I've seen in discussions about org and dcat
14:19:29 <sandro> .. I've removed RADION references
14:19:40 <sandro> .. look at diagram.
14:20:00 <sandro> .. 6. The ADMS Domain Model
14:20:20 <sandro> PhilA: Was using rdfs:label, .... not we're using dcterms: title
14:20:34 <sandro> .. now using skos:altLabel
14:20:46 <sandro> .. accessURL, landingPage, etc.
14:20:58 <sandro> .. where there's something in dcat, ADMS now just uses it.
14:21:35 <sandro> .. was originally XML or RDF, still true, but we're ignoring XML for this now.   So diagram can be simpler/clearer.
14:21:46 <sandro> .. I suggest this goes through as a WG NOTE.
14:22:09 <sandro> .. extensive use, but all for one application (EC's own platform)
14:22:20 <sandro> q+
14:22:38 <sandro> .. some ADMS-only terms, they are in ADMS namespace.    Almost everything is in DC or DCAT.
14:23:02 <sandro> sandro: Have your changes been reflected in the implementation?
14:23:09 <DaveReynolds> q+
14:23:20 <sandro> PhilA: MakxDekkers and I are working with the relevant people, so this should be easy enough.
14:23:39 <sandro> .. This will be the first time ADMS has occured in TR space
14:23:47 <sandro> sandro: You don't expect pushback over these changes?
14:24:19 <sandro> MakxDekkers: The tools maintaining ADMS, with OpenRefine, ... No, I don't expect a lot of pushback.   We should share this ASAP.
14:24:37 <PhilA> ack sandro
14:24:38 <sandro> .. with the right explanations, I *expect* people will like the alignment with DCAT.
14:24:55 <sandro> sandro: So is the plan to get that buyin before or after NOTE?
14:25:19 <sandro> PhilA: We should have feedback before we meet next week, so yes, buying first.
14:25:19 <PhilA> ack DaveReynolds
14:25:46 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Okay with voting at F2F?
14:26:19 <sandro> PhilA: If there's space on the agenda at the F2F, let's do it then, yes.   We'll have a polycom.
14:27:09 <sandro> sandro: If it's not too much of a hassle, please try to have the major decisions later in the day, for those of us in the western hemisphere.
14:27:26 <sandro> DaveReynolds: For the classes, is there any more you say, eg about SemanticAssets
14:27:47 <sandro> PhilA: I'd like to make them subclasses of the DCAT classes, but MakxDekkers is telling me why that might not work.
14:27:58 <sandro> PhilA: I think of this as a profile of dcat
14:29:20 <sandro> MakxDekkers: I haven't thought about whether it's a dcat profile.   I see that DCAT was a perspective of a catalog, it describes a virtual file store, where files are distributions, where some share charactrtistics, making a dataset.  Instead ADMS focusses on the assets, like the datasets, that can exist WITHOUT a catalog, and without the files.
14:29:48 <sandro> .. So ADMS handles assets that are not necessarily in a catalog, and do not necessarily have distributions associated with them
14:30:01 <sandro> .. and that doesn't seem to align with dcat
14:30:20 <HadleyBeeman> scribe: hadleybeeman
14:30:49 <HadleyBeeman> phila:  I did try… we're not 100% sure where to go.  Def of DCAT dataset is so broad, it's almost the same as RDF resource.
14:31:46 <HadleyBeeman> phila:  You may have a semantic asset that exists conceptually, but doesn't have a downloadable form.  Example:  future deliverables from a working group's charter.
14:32:23 <HadleyBeeman> DaveReynolds:  Not sure I agree. Notion of a dataset as an abstract thing seems reasonable.  If ADMS asset isn't a subset of DCAT dataset, then you have a problem.
14:33:06 <HadleyBeeman> DaveReynolds:  The notion of a repository vs the notion of a catalogue may be sufficiently distinct to not be able to relate those two.  But I see DCAT as being pretty generic.
14:33:13 <MakxDekkers> q+
14:33:29 <sandro> (back)
14:33:36 <sandro> scribe: sandro
14:33:37 <HadleyBeeman> PhilA:  I would find it easier to make assertions directily about DCAT;  I didn't because i didn't want to not take on board what MaksDekkers was saying
14:34:11 <sandro> phil: I think it would be simpler for us as a group if we could say ADMS was a profile of DCAT.      If we can do that.....
14:34:17 <PhilA> ack MakxDekkers
14:35:26 <sandro> MakxDekkers: I find those arguments quite compelling.    If we see adms:asset as a subclass ...     my objjections were maybe on the theoretical side.    I prefer asset as subclass of dataset, with the understanding that dcat dataset is fairly broad -- so it doesn't have to be part of a catalog, and have distributions.
14:35:30 <DaveReynolds> q+
14:36:09 <sandro> sandro: Maybe MakxDekkers should check the dcat spec to see whether it allows this reading?
14:36:17 <PhilA> definition of dcat:Dataset "This class represents the actual dataset as published by the dataset publisher. In cases where a distinction between the actual dataset and its entry in the catalog is necessary (because metadata such as modification date and maintainer might differ), the catalog record class can be used for the latter."
14:36:18 <sandro> MakxDekkers: It wasn't clear, when I read it.
14:36:34 <sandro> MakxDekkers: ... so in that case it can be a subclass
14:36:35 <sandro> q?
14:36:46 <DaveReynolds> ack me
14:36:47 <PhilA> ack DaveReynolds
14:37:39 <sandro> DaveReynolds: Can you put this on the list as a question for the dcat editors/users -- making clear that a dcat: dataset can exist without a catalog ?    And if so, then we can take ADMS this way.   And if so, can we update the documentation?
14:38:11 <sandro> sandro: comments list or WG list?      WG list is probably easier.
14:38:21 <bhyland> bhyland has joined #gld
14:38:37 <sandro> DaveReynolds: If we end up wanting to change it, we should track that as a last call comment.
14:38:51 <sandro> PhilA: Sounds good.
14:39:42 <sandro> action: Makx to raise on the mailing list the question of whether dcat:Dataset can exist without a catalog (and thus adms:Asset can be a subclass of it), and how to clarify this in the text
14:39:42 <trackbot> Created ACTION-108 - Raise on the mailing list the question of whether dcat:Dataset can exist without a catalog (and thus adms:Asset can be a subclass of it), and how to clarify this in the text [on Makx Dekkers - due 2013-04-11].
14:40:04 <sandro> PhilA: While we haven't talked about ADMS a lot, the work of the group has overall helped ADMS, I think,
14:40:32 <sandro> sandro: Do we have WG reviewers assigned for ADMS?
14:41:06 <sandro> PhilA: I'd hope Richard and/or Fadi could do it, maybe James?
14:41:28 <sandro> action: james to review ADMS
14:41:28 <trackbot> Created ACTION-109 - Review ADMS [on James McKinney - due 2013-04-11].
14:42:01 <sandro> topic: status of WG NOTEs ?
14:42:13 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: But Fadi and Benedikt are not on the call
14:42:47 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Looks like things are roughly on track
14:43:00 <sandro> subtopic: regorg
14:43:01 <HadleyBeeman> RegORG timetable: http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/wiki/REGORG_Timetable
14:43:24 <sandro> PhilA: No comments yet.  But I'll check in on Chris Taggert and see if he'll update OpenCorporates
14:43:44 <sandro> .. then we can republish it as a NOTE, with some credibility
14:43:57 <sandro> .. with it being used by the biggest db of corps
14:44:15 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Do you want to identify reviewers now or wait?
14:44:42 <DaveReynolds> My previous review comments should be traceable from the email list
14:44:43 <sandro> PhilA: I think DaveReynolds has reviewed it.    It had the FPWD review, and it hasn't changed since then.
14:45:02 <sandro> PhilA: Unless some problem shows up, it should be simple enough.
14:45:27 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Perfect.
14:45:54 <sandro> topic: Action Review
14:46:59 <sandro> issue-14?
14:46:59 <trackbot> ISSUE-14 -- add dcat:permanentIdentifier property -- open
14:46:59 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/14
14:47:12 <sandro> DaveReynolds: This we decided to postpone
14:47:27 <sandro> issue-32?
14:47:27 <trackbot> ISSUE-32 -- Relationship to ISO19156 - Observations & Measurements? -- open
14:47:27 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/32
14:47:44 <sandro> DaveReynolds: That's going to be handled in the Cube UCR
14:47:51 <sandro> issue-41?
14:47:51 <trackbot> ISSUE-41 -- use of skos:altLabel or dcterms:alternative -- open
14:47:51 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/41
14:48:01 <sandro> PhilA: I don't actually have a problem with this.
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14:48:28 <sandro> PhilA: I'm happy for that to be closed, and turned into an action.
14:48:33 <danbri> danbri has joined #gld
14:48:49 <sandro> sandro: and issue-32 could also be turned into an action
14:49:18 <sandro> DaveReynolds: it might already be one.
14:49:30 <PhilA> action: PhilA to amend RegOrg to use skaos altLabel cf. dcterms alternative
14:49:30 <trackbot> Created ACTION-110 - Amend RegOrg to use skaos altLabel cf. dcterms alternative [on Phil Archer - due 2013-04-11].
14:49:35 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Okay, I'll ping Fadi on closing 14.
14:49:40 <PhilA> close issue-41
14:49:40 <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-41 use of skos:altLabel or dcterms:alternative.
14:50:12 <HadleyBeeman> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/raised
14:50:55 <sandro> DaveReynolds: I'm updating tracker for issue-32 to have it be closed
14:51:10 <sandro> subtopic: raised issues
14:51:13 <Zakim> -MakxDekkers
14:51:24 <sandro> issue-6?
14:51:24 <trackbot> ISSUE-6 -- How should publishers figure out good URIs for properties with non-literal ranges? -- raised
14:51:24 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/6
14:51:39 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: We'll wait for Bernadette
14:51:50 <sandro> lots of PEOPLE issues....
14:52:00 <sandro> PhilA: Those can all be closed.  I'll do that.
14:52:05 <sandro> issue-47?
14:52:05 <trackbot> ISSUE-47 -- RegOrg should be defined as an Org profile -- raised
14:52:05 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/47
14:52:28 <sandro> PhilA: Yes, I'm planning to do this.
14:52:30 <Zakim> +MakxDekkers
14:52:51 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: You've been talking about this for a while, and everyone seems supportive
14:53:27 <sandro> action: Phil to define RegOrg as a profile of org (and mark ISSUE-47 as closed)
14:53:27 <trackbot> Created ACTION-111 - Define RegOrg as a profile of org (and mark ISSUE-47 as closed) [on Phil Archer - due 2013-04-11].
14:53:41 <sandro> issue-54
14:53:41 <trackbot> ISSUE-54 -- Relationship of DCAT and VoID -- raised
14:53:41 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/track/issues/54
14:54:05 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: I don't recall any discussion of this recently
14:54:11 <sandro> (no one else does either)
14:54:41 <sandro> topic: dir.w3.org
14:54:49 <sandro> sandro: I saw the email; I haven't tried it yet
14:55:07 <sandro> DaveReynolds: I thought there was a slight error in the vocab usage, which I think they're fixing
14:55:14 <sandro> .. so maybe good to hold off
14:55:42 <sandro> topic: F2F
14:55:53 <sandro> phil: W3C is taking care of tea and coffee and the polycom
14:57:26 <sandro> sandro: I think I can attend most of it remotely.
14:57:37 <Zakim> -MakxDekkers
14:57:40 <sandro> HadleyBeeman: Great.   See / talk to you all next week in Dublin!
14:57:41 <Zakim> -james
14:57:42 <DaveReynolds> bye
14:57:42 <Zakim> -PhilA
14:57:42 <Zakim> -HadleyBeeman
14:57:43 <sandro> ADJOURN
14:57:43 <Zakim> -TallTed
14:57:47 <MariosMeimaris> bye
14:57:50 <Zakim> -Sandro
14:57:51 <Zakim> -DaveReynolds
14:57:51 <Zakim> -MariosMeimaris
14:57:51 <Zakim> T&S_GLDWG()10:00AM has ended
14:57:51 <Zakim> Attendees were HadleyBeeman, PhilA, Sandro, TallTed, DaveReynolds, james, MakxDekkers, MariosMeimaris
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14:58:10 <HadleyBeeman> Thank you, Sandro, for scribing :)
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