IRC log of prov on 2013-02-28
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 15:53:04 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #prov
- 15:53:04 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/02/28-prov-irc
- 15:53:06 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs world
- 15:53:06 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #prov
- 15:53:08 [trackbot]
- Zakim, this will be PROV
- 15:53:08 [Zakim]
- ok, trackbot; I see SW_(PROV)11:00AM scheduled to start in 7 minutes
- 15:53:09 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Provenance Working Group Teleconference
- 15:53:09 [trackbot]
- Date: 28 February 2013
- 15:53:16 [pgroth]
- Zakim, this will be PROV
- 15:53:16 [Zakim]
- ok, pgroth; I see SW_(PROV)11:00AM scheduled to start in 7 minutes
- 15:53:28 [pgroth]
- Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2013.02.28
- 15:53:39 [pgroth]
- Chair: Paul Groth
- 15:53:46 [pgroth]
- Scribe: Curt Tilmes
- 15:53:52 [pgroth]
- rrsagent, make logs public
- 15:54:21 [pgroth]
- Regrets: Luc Moreau, Stephan Zednik
- 15:55:14 [ctrim]
- ctrim has joined #PROV
- 15:56:10 [Paolo]
- Paolo has joined #prov
- 15:57:08 [Curt]
- Curt has joined #prov
- 15:57:14 [Zakim]
- SW_(PROV)11:00AM has now started
- 15:57:22 [Zakim]
- +[IPcaller]
- 15:57:29 [smiles]
- smiles has joined #prov
- 15:57:32 [GK]
- GK has joined #prov
- 15:57:33 [pgroth]
- Zakim, [IPcaller] is me
- 15:57:33 [Zakim]
- +pgroth; got it
- 15:57:35 [Zakim]
- +Curt_Tilmes
- 15:57:51 [Zakim]
- + +1.661.382.aaaa
- 15:58:02 [Zakim]
- +??P28
- 15:58:04 [ctrim]
- ctrim: Zakim, aaaa is me
- 15:58:11 [ctrim]
- Zakim, aaaa is me
- 15:58:11 [Zakim]
- +ctrim; got it
- 15:58:12 [smiles]
- zakim, ??P28 is me
- 15:58:13 [Zakim]
- +smiles; got it
- 15:58:31 [Zakim]
- +??P30
- 15:58:47 [GK]
- zakim, ??p30 is me
- 15:58:48 [Zakim]
- +GK; got it
- 15:59:45 [stain]
- stain has changed the topic to: Provenance WG - http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/ - http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2013.02.28
- 16:00:00 [stain]
- (love it when zakim just gives up before asking for the code..)
- 16:00:11 [Zakim]
- +[IPcaller]
- 16:00:22 [stain]
- Zakim, [IPcaller] is me
- 16:00:22 [Zakim]
- +stain; got it
- 16:00:51 [hook]
- hook has joined #prov
- 16:01:12 [Zakim]
- +OpenLink_Software
- 16:01:30 [Zakim]
- + +1.818.731.aabb
- 16:01:53 [Zakim]
- +[IPcaller]
- 16:02:02 [Zakim]
- +[IPcaller.a]
- 16:02:05 [Chrsistine]
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- 16:02:21 [pgroth]
- Topic: Admin
- 16:02:32 [pgroth]
- http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2013-02-21
- 16:02:41 [Curt]
- scribe: Curt
- 16:02:50 [pgroth]
- Minutes of Feb 21, 2013
- 16:02:51 [dgarijo]
- dgarijo has joined #prov
- 16:02:54 [smiles]
- +1
- 16:02:55 [Curt]
- +1
- 16:03:01 [stain]
- 0 (not there)
- 16:03:08 [hook]
- +1
- 16:03:12 [dgarijo]
- +1
- 16:03:18 [satya]
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- 16:03:32 [GK]
- +1
- 16:03:35 [jcheney]
- jcheney has joined #prov
- 16:03:47 [Dong]
- Dong has joined #prov
- 16:03:53 [Zakim]
- +??P13
- 16:03:54 [Zakim]
- +Satya_Sahoo
- 16:03:56 [pgroth]
- accept: Minutes of Feb 21, 2013 telcon
- 16:04:00 [dgarijo]
- Zakim, ??P13 is me
- 16:04:01 [Zakim]
- +dgarijo; got it
- 16:04:03 [Zakim]
- -Satya_Sahoo
- 16:04:07 [Zakim]
- + +44.131.467.aacc
- 16:04:13 [jcheney]
- zakim, aacc is me
- 16:04:13 [Zakim]
- +jcheney; got it
- 16:04:34 [Zakim]
- +Satya_Sahoo
- 16:04:41 [pgroth]
- Topic: PR update
- 16:04:42 [Curt]
- pgroth: scribes, need them
- 16:05:06 [Curt]
- pgroth: director's call for PR coming up
- 16:05:13 [Curt]
- pgroth: next friday
- 16:05:20 [SamCoppens]
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- 16:05:23 [Curt]
- pgroth: everything should be staged by then
- 16:05:58 [pgroth]
- prov:hasProvenance
- 16:05:59 [Curt]
- pgroth: need to update link headers to lowercase for link relations
- 16:06:03 [pgroth]
- prov:has_provenance
- 16:06:24 [ivan]
- zakim, dial ivan-voip
- 16:06:24 [Zakim]
- ok, ivan; the call is being made
- 16:06:25 [Zakim]
- +Ivan
- 16:06:33 [khalidBelhajjame]
- khalidBelhajjame has joined #prov
- 16:06:47 [Zakim]
- +TomDN
- 16:06:53 [Zakim]
- +Luc
- 16:06:59 [pgroth]
- topic: wasQuotedFrom
- 16:07:05 [SamCoppens]
- zakim, TomDN is me
- 16:07:05 [pgroth]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-prov-wg/2013Feb/0289.html
- 16:07:05 [Zakim]
- +SamCoppens; got it
- 16:07:14 [Zakim]
- +[IPcaller.aa]
- 16:07:17 [SamCoppens]
- zakim, mute me
- 16:07:17 [Zakim]
- SamCoppens should now be muted
- 16:07:45 [Curt]
- pgroth: reviewer issue with primer description of wasQuotedFrom, proposed response circulated
- 16:08:26 [Curt]
- smiles: changed example to be very clear about the quote relationship
- 16:08:39 [Curt]
- pgroth: any objections to that response?
- 16:08:41 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:08:52 [smiles]
- OK, thanks, will do
- 16:09:03 [Curt]
- pgroth: smiles should send the response
- 16:09:10 [pgroth]
- Topic: Notes
- 16:09:35 [pgroth]
- http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/PublicationRequestMarch12
- 16:09:53 [Curt]
- pgroth: All notes should be ready for synchronized release on March 12
- 16:10:03 [SamCoppens]
- zakim, TomDN is with me
- 16:10:03 [Zakim]
- +TomDN; got it
- 16:10:27 [Curt]
- pgroth: need to be sent by March 5 to be ready to publish on March 12
- 16:10:35 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:10:38 [TomDN]
- TomDN has joined #prov
- 16:10:51 [TomDN]
- Zakim, TomDN is with SamCoppens
- 16:10:51 [Zakim]
- TomDN was already listed in SamCoppens, TomDN
- 16:11:11 [pgroth]
- sub-topic: prov-dc
- 16:11:43 [Curt]
- dgarijo: some small issues will be addressed today or tomorrow
- 16:11:48 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:12:05 [pgroth]
- PROPOSED: to publish prov-dc as a WD Note.
- 16:12:12 [ivan]
- +1
- 16:12:13 [dgarijo]
- +1
- 16:12:13 [smiles]
- +1
- 16:12:15 [stain]
- +1
- 16:12:15 [SamCoppens]
- +1
- 16:12:20 [Dong]
- +1
- 16:12:21 [Curt]
- +1
- 16:12:23 [TomDN]
- +1
- 16:12:24 [hook]
- +1
- 16:12:26 [dgarijo]
- +q
- 16:12:27 [satya]
- +1
- 16:12:28 [jcheney]
- +1
- 16:12:39 [GK]
- (abstain - not reviewed)
- 16:12:59 [Curt]
- dgarijo: Kai engaged DC people to solicit feedback after release
- 16:13:05 [pgroth]
- accepted: to publish prov-dc as a WD Note.
- 16:13:06 [GK]
- Is this being released as NOTEW or WD?
- 16:13:21 [GK]
- Ah, thanks. Then +1
- 16:13:24 [Curt]
- pgroth: will be a working draft, not yet a released note
- 16:13:58 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:14:00 [Curt]
- pgroth: We will refer the WD to the DC community for their review and for them to recommend as part of DC recommendations
- 16:14:01 [pgroth]
- ack dgarijo
- 16:14:07 [dgarijo]
- Also, we have to explore the relation between dct:provenance and prov:has_provenance
- 16:14:13 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:14:20 [pgroth]
- sub-topic: prov-sem
- 16:14:36 [TomDN]
- @Graham: everything is WD-NOTE except PROV-DM, -Constraints, -N and -O I think
- 16:15:16 [Curt]
- jcheney: current version has clearly marked places for more work, released monday, some reviews in, waiting for Paolo
- 16:15:41 [Curt]
- jcheney: general consensus to release WD, some questions remain to resolve
- 16:15:41 [satya]
- @James, Paolo also sent comments on Feb 27
- 16:15:58 [GK]
- @Tom thanks (proposal was originally just NOTE)
- 16:16:09 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:16:15 [Paolo]
- I can send them again
- 16:16:26 [pgroth]
- proposed: to publish prov-sem as a first public working draft
- 16:16:33 [smiles]
- +1
- 16:16:34 [satya]
- +1
- 16:16:37 [dgarijo]
- +1
- 16:16:39 [Curt]
- +1
- 16:16:39 [hook]
- +1
- 16:16:39 [khalidBelhajjame]
- +1 (University of Manchester)
- 16:16:41 [TomDN]
- +1
- 16:16:41 [pgroth]
- +1
- 16:16:41 [GK]
- @Tom, or so I thought p- I read "WG Note" ;)
- 16:16:47 [GK]
- +1
- 16:16:52 [Dong]
- +1
- 16:17:07 [ivan]
- +1
- 16:17:09 [stain]
- +1
- 16:17:14 [TallTed]
- +1
- 16:17:19 [Paolo]
- +1
- 16:17:23 [SamCoppens]
- +1
- 16:17:40 [pgroth]
- accepted: to publish prov-sem as a first public working draft
- 16:17:41 [jcheney]
- @Paolo: I found it, no need to resend.
- 16:17:50 [jcheney]
- thx
- 16:17:56 [pgroth]
- sub-topic: prov-xml
- 16:18:32 [GK]
- Curt: believes most comments have been addresses
- 16:18:40 [hook]
- q+
- 16:18:51 [pgroth]
- ack hook
- 16:19:06 [GK]
- … Question about whether qnames have to be qualified … in examples?
- 16:19:17 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:19:33 [Curt]
- q+
- 16:19:43 [pgroth]
- ack curt
- 16:20:13 [stain]
- <:fred> is not a valid qname, but <fred> is
- 16:20:24 [stain]
- s/is/has/g
- 16:20:49 [Curt]
- q+
- 16:20:54 [pgroth]
- ack Curt
- 16:21:56 [GK]
- I note that http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-xml-names/#Conformance defines a notion of namespace-well-formed separately from XML well-formed
- 16:21:58 [Curt]
- It would be fine to go either way, it is a minor issue
- 16:22:37 [Curt]
- pgroth: have tim and stain reviewed yet?
- 16:23:02 [GK]
- "Namespace constraint: Prefix Declared
- 16:23:02 [GK]
- The namespace prefix, unless it is xml or xmlns, MUST have been declared in a namespace declaration attribute in either the start-tag of the element where the prefix is used or in an ancestor element (i.e., an element in whose http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-xml/#dt-content the prefixed markup occurs)."
- 16:23:02 [Curt]
- stain: I have not yet done so, but I don't think there are major problems
- 16:23:12 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:23:24 [Curt]
- pgroth: Other issues with PROV-XML?
- 16:23:41 [pgroth]
- PROPOSED: to publish prov-xml as a working draft note
- 16:23:48 [TomDN]
- +1
- 16:23:49 [SamCoppens]
- +1
- 16:23:50 [stain]
- +1
- 16:23:50 [Curt]
- +1
- 16:23:52 [ivan]
- +1
- 16:23:55 [GK]
- +1
- 16:23:56 [jcheney]
- +1
- 16:23:56 [satya]
- +1
- 16:23:56 [Dong]
- +1
- 16:23:58 [dgarijo]
- +1
- 16:24:04 [stain]
- which thread describes this qname issue btw..?
- 16:24:35 [hook]
- +1
- 16:24:40 [smiles]
- +0 (not reviewed)
- 16:24:43 [pgroth]
- accepted: to publish prov-xml as a working draft note
- 16:24:43 [khalidBelhajjame]
- +1
- 16:24:52 [stain]
- ah, but that would just be the empty namespace if there is none defined. That's a valid qname, but probably does not make much sense in PROV-DM land.
- 16:25:11 [Curt]
- @stain subject "Re: review of prov-xml"
- 16:25:23 [pgroth]
- hard to hear you
- 16:25:32 [stain]
- it's xmlns=""
- 16:25:41 [TomDN]
- we get about 2 words per sentence
- 16:25:49 [stain]
- it breaks out as if there's auto-mute
- 16:27:02 [Curt]
- GK: PROV-AQ has mostly editorial work, 2 major issues: service description, a property relating to the service document
- 16:27:24 [Curt]
- GK: a change to the ping back specification, discussed, changes being documented in the WD
- 16:27:50 [Curt]
- GK: ping back is really another discovery mechanism for provenance
- 16:28:14 [Curt]
- GK: change target uri to entity uri, changing back to target uri, fundamentally editorial, but pervasive
- 16:29:47 [Curt]
- pgroth: We have already voted to release PROV-AQ as a working draft, but there was an objection by stain, but that has now been addressed
- 16:30:10 [Curt]
- pgroth: By Monday, people who did review it, take a final look for blockers to releasing as a WD
- 16:30:29 [Curt]
- pgroth: If there are no objections, will release as a WD
- 16:30:58 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:31:00 [GK]
- BTW, I've one more thing to do: update the revision log (copied from mercurial log) - but that shouldn't affect reviews
- 16:31:12 [stain]
- what does "by Monday" mean in clock sense?
- 16:31:12 [pgroth]
- proposed: release prov-aq as a working draft if there are no objections by Monday March 4, 2013
- 16:31:49 [Curt]
- GK: does that mean we can release Tuesday?
- 16:32:01 [Curt]
- pgroth: Yes, we will need to stage by Tuesday
- 16:32:39 [stain]
- so we've got over the weekend to re-review PAQ, and then the week after it goes out with the rest ?
- 16:33:05 [Curt]
- GK: I'm busy on that day, can Paul stage?
- 16:33:09 [Curt]
- pgroth: yes, I will stage
- 16:33:26 [stain]
- mm.. so it's a +1 / -1 kind of review
- 16:33:49 [stain]
- fine by me
- 16:33:53 [Curt]
- pgroth: We need to know about blockers/major objections by Monday to get it staged and out
- 16:33:59 [GK]
- @stian thanks
- 16:34:02 [pgroth]
- proposed: release prov-aq as a working draft if there are no objections by Monday March 4, 2013
- 16:34:10 [smiles]
- +1
- 16:34:10 [khalidBelhajjame]
- +1
- 16:34:11 [GK]
- +1
- 16:34:12 [satya]
- +1
- 16:34:13 [ivan]
- +1
- 16:34:14 [dgarijo]
- +1
- 16:34:14 [Curt]
- +1
- 16:34:15 [TomDN]
- +1
- 16:34:16 [Paolo]
- +1
- 16:34:17 [SamCoppens]
- +1
- 16:34:19 [Dong]
- +1
- 16:34:19 [stain]
- +1 (except for the awkward date format! :) )
- 16:34:19 [jcheney]
- +1
- 16:34:50 [hook]
- +1
- 16:35:05 [Curt]
- pgroth: GK - can you send out an email with the URL to review?
- 16:35:06 [Curt]
- GK: yes
- 16:35:07 [stain]
- [ relevant XKCD: http://xkcd.com/1179/ ]
- 16:35:19 [pgroth]
- accepted: release prov-aq as a working draft if there are no objections by Monday March 4, 2013
- 16:35:43 [pgroth]
- sub-topic: other notes
- 16:36:18 [Curt]
- pgroth: need final updates on other notes (primer, overview, links) to point to the right versions of everything
- 16:36:19 [Zakim]
- -ctrim
- 16:36:27 [pgroth]
- Proposed: to publish prov-primer, prov-overview, prov- links as working drafts
- 16:36:34 [TomDN]
- +1
- 16:36:35 [Curt]
- +1
- 16:36:36 [stain]
- +1
- 16:36:37 [smiles]
- +1
- 16:36:37 [dgarijo]
- +1
- 16:36:38 [ivan]
- +1
- 16:36:39 [jcheney]
- +1
- 16:36:39 [satya]
- +1
- 16:36:39 [SamCoppens]
- +1
- 16:36:46 [khalidBelhajjame]
- +1
- 16:36:56 [GK]
- +1
- 16:37:04 [Paolo]
- +1
- 16:37:11 [pgroth]
- accepted: to publish prov-primer, prov-overview, prov- links as working drafts
- 16:37:30 [dgarijo]
- yes
- 16:38:01 [Curt]
- pgroth: staging XML?
- 16:38:03 [smiles]
- yes
- 16:38:11 [Curt]
- Curt: will make sure it gets staged
- 16:38:24 [Curt]
- jcheney: will stage PROV-SEM
- 16:38:30 [ivan]
- q+
- 16:38:31 [Curt]
- jcheney: will discuss process with Luc
- 16:38:36 [smiles]
- Is it a particular time on Tuesday?
- 16:38:44 [pgroth]
- ack ivan
- 16:38:49 [TomDN]
- fyi: we will resolve PROV-Dictionary validation issues on Monday
- 16:38:54 [pgroth]
- i can't hear you
- 16:39:24 [Curt]
- ivan: the web links for document provenance (?)
- 16:39:34 [ivan]
- zakim, unmute
- 16:39:34 [Zakim]
- I don't understand 'unmute', ivan
- 16:39:45 [pgroth]
- zakim, who's noisy?
- 16:39:56 [Zakim]
- pgroth, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: pgroth (38%), Ivan (65%)
- 16:40:26 [Curt]
- pgroth: If you want to include the provenance for your document, tell Ivan where to point the links
- 16:40:28 [ivan]
- you guys should give me all the links to the provenance directory before tuesday
- 16:40:35 [ivan]
- exactly
- 16:40:35 [ivan]
- thanks
- 16:40:44 [pgroth]
- q?
- 16:41:02 [Zakim]
- -[IPcaller.a]
- 16:41:04 [dgarijo]
- bbye
- 16:41:04 [khalidBelhajjame]
- bye
- 16:41:07 [Zakim]
- -Satya_Sahoo
- 16:41:08 [GK]
- Bye
- 16:41:08 [Dong]
- thanks, bye
- 16:41:09 [Zakim]
- -[IPcaller.aa]
- 16:41:09 [Zakim]
- -jcheney
- 16:41:11 [Zakim]
- -Ivan
- 16:41:12 [stain]
- bye
- 16:41:12 [Zakim]
- -pgroth
- 16:41:14 [Zakim]
- -dgarijo
- 16:41:14 [Zakim]
- -SamCoppens
- 16:41:16 [Zakim]
- -Luc
- 16:41:18 [Zakim]
- - +1.818.731.aabb
- 16:41:20 [pgroth]
- rrsagent, set log public
- 16:41:21 [Zakim]
- -stain
- 16:41:22 [Zakim]
- -TallTed
- 16:41:24 [pgroth]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 16:41:24 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/02/28-prov-minutes.html pgroth
- 16:41:27 [Zakim]
- -Curt_Tilmes
- 16:41:29 [pgroth]
- trackbot, end telcon
- 16:41:29 [trackbot]
- Zakim, list attendees
- 16:41:29 [Zakim]
- As of this point the attendees have been pgroth, Curt_Tilmes, +1.661.382.aaaa, ctrim, smiles, GK, stain, TallTed, +1.818.731.aabb, [IPcaller], Satya_Sahoo, dgarijo,
- 16:41:32 [Zakim]
- ... +44.131.467.aacc, jcheney, Ivan, Luc, SamCoppens, TomDN
- 16:41:37 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, please draft minutes
- 16:41:37 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/02/28-prov-minutes.html trackbot
- 16:41:38 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, bye
- 16:41:38 [RRSAgent]
- I see no action items