16:03:35 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
16:03:35 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-irc
16:03:37 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
16:03:37 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #html-a11y
16:03:39 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 2119
16:03:39 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)10:00AM scheduled to start 63 minutes ago
16:03:40 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
16:03:41 <trackbot> Date: 17 January 2013
16:03:54 <janina> zakim, who's here?
16:03:54 <Zakim> WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)10:00AM has not yet started, janina
16:03:55 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, lwatson, JF, chaals, davidb, IanPouncey, Stevef, MichaelC, janina, hober, trackbot
16:04:24 <janina> zakim, this will be WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)
16:04:24 <Zakim> ok, janina, I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)10:00AM already started
16:04:55 <janina> zakim, who's on the phone?
16:04:56 <Zakim> On the phone I see [IPcaller], John_Foliot, ??P36, [Apple], [IPcaller.a]
16:04:59 <Stevef> agenda+ Identify Scribe <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
16:05:01 <Stevef> agenda+ Longdesc Extension Update <http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-proposals/raw-file/b63325998cc1/longdesc1/longdesc.html>http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-proposals/raw-file/b63325998cc1/longdesc1/longdesc.html
16:05:03 <Stevef> agenda+ Status of "alt" text in HTML (specification and usage in the document)
16:05:04 <hober> Zakim, Apple is me
16:05:04 <Zakim> +hober; got it
16:05:04 <Stevef> agenda+ Subteam Reports: Bug Triage; AAPI Mapping;
16:05:06 <Stevef> agenda+ Other Business
16:05:08 <Stevef> agenda+ Actions Review <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
16:05:09 <Stevef> agenda+ Identify Scribe for the next TF teleconference <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
16:05:23 <lwatson> zakim, [ipcaller] is lwatson
16:05:23 <Zakim> +lwatson; got it
16:05:47 <Zakim> +??P33
16:06:07 <chaals> regrets: chaals
16:06:08 <Stevef> chaals:np
16:06:16 <janina> zakim, zakim, ??P36 is Janina_Sajka
16:06:16 <Zakim> I don't understand 'zakim, ??P36 is Janina_Sajka', janina
16:06:21 <MichaelC> zakim, IPcaller is Steve_Faulkner
16:06:21 <Zakim> sorry, MichaelC, I do not recognize a party named 'IPcaller'
16:06:28 <janina> zakim, ??P36 is Janina_Sajka
16:06:28 <Zakim> +Janina_Sajka; got it
16:06:33 <MichaelC> zakim, IPcaller.a is Steve_Faulkner
16:06:33 <Zakim> +Steve_Faulkner; got it
16:07:07 <janina> zakim, who's on the phone?
16:07:07 <Zakim> On the phone I see lwatson, John_Foliot, Janina_Sajka, hober, Steve_Faulkner, Michael_Cooper
16:07:34 <janina> zakim, take up item 1
16:07:34 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Identify Scribe <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List" taken up [from Stevef]
16:08:13 <MichaelC> scribe: lwatson
16:08:24 <Stevef> zakim, take up item 2
16:08:24 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Longdesc Extension Update <http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-proposals/raw-file/b63325998cc1/longdesc1/longdesc.html>http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-proposals/raw-file/b63325998cc1
16:08:28 <Zakim> ... /longdesc1/longdesc.html" taken up [from Stevef]
16:08:46 <paulc> paulc has joined #html-a11y
16:08:54 <paulc> zakim, what is the code?
16:08:54 <Zakim> the conference code is 2119 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), paulc
16:09:12 <Stevef> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Jan/0096.html
16:09:21 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
16:09:30 <lwatson> JS: Did you update the summary Steve?
16:09:31 <paulc> zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc
16:09:31 <Zakim> +paulc; got it
16:09:50 <lwatson> SF: I just responded to two points with James.
16:10:21 <lwatson> JS: The original point James made was that we hadn't correctly positioned his objection in the summary.
16:11:42 <lwatson> JS: We should at least correctly reflect people's positions. We could ask him to rewrite that part?
16:13:15 <lwatson> SF: I'll update it and ask James to look at it.
16:14:23 <Stevef> zakim, next item
16:14:23 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Identify Scribe <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List" taken up [from Stevef]
16:14:24 <lwatson> zakim, next item
16:14:26 <Zakim> agendum 1 was just opened, lwatson
16:14:33 <lwatson> zakim, close item 1
16:14:33 <Zakim> agendum 1, Identify Scribe <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List, closed
16:14:36 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:14:36 <Zakim> 3. Status of "alt" text in HTML (specification and usage in the document) [from Stevef]
16:14:49 <lwatson> zakim, take up item 3
16:14:49 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Status of "alt" text in HTML (specification and usage in the document)" taken up [from Stevef]
16:15:16 <lwatson> JS: This is waiting on me.
16:16:18 <paulc> Can we have the bug numbers?
16:16:18 <lwatson> SF: Not directly related, but there are some alt text issues related to HTML5 that I filed some bugs against.
16:17:30 <lwatson> SF: They were discussed and addressed quickly and positively, which is a good sign we can get things done.
16:17:50 <lwatson> PC: What are the bug numbers? Are there more coming?
16:18:36 <lwatson> SF: The bugs were closed and the updated text went into 5.1. My email after that suggested the same changes should be made to the 5.0 CR.
16:18:47 <lwatson> rrsagent, make minutes
16:18:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-minutes.html lwatson
16:18:55 <Stevef> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2012Dec/0090.html
16:19:55 <richardschwerdtfeger> richardschwerdtfeger has joined #html-a11y
16:20:02 <lwatson> PC: Do these bugs cover all the problems previously identified?
16:20:58 <lwatson> SF: This is an sample of relatively minor things that need to be changed.
16:21:15 <lwatson> PC: I understand.
16:23:15 <lwatson> PC: Bug 12726 has a tracker, and it's held up in the works. The WG has been asked to hold off discussing it. We need to know what the status of the remaining tracker issues is.
16:24:11 <lwatson> JS: With Plan 2014 we agreed to take up the conflict between WCAG and section 4.8 with the editors to see what could be resolved. Sorry, I've been unable to move that forward.
16:24:26 <Stevef> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-admin/2013Jan/0002.html
16:24:58 <lwatson> rrsagent, make minutes
16:24:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-minutes.html lwatson
16:26:00 <lwatson> PC: I thought the result would be that bugs would be filed and resolved through this discussion with the editors. Hence me asking where are the bugs.
16:26:19 <lwatson> PC: I'm not wild about the editors making changes to either 5.0 or 5.1 without a papertrail of bugs.
16:27:04 <lwatson> PC: Steve, your email is why I put it on hold with the WG.
16:27:08 <lwatson> SF: Thank you.
16:28:42 <lwatson> JS: We don't want W3C specifications to be rubbing against each other.
16:29:39 <lwatson> PC: Another reason it would be good to do this via bugs... If we make changes via bugs, Ian tracks those, so it may be more likely the same changes will be applied to the WHATWG spec.
16:29:44 <lwatson> zakim, next item
16:29:44 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Subteam Reports: Bug Triage; AAPI Mapping;" taken up [from Stevef]
16:29:45 <Stevef> zakim, next item
16:29:47 <Zakim> agendum 4 was just opened, Stevef
16:30:02 <JF> scribe: JF
16:30:16 <JF> Bug triage reports: Leonie
16:30:40 <JF> LW: making good progress and have cleared all that have been marked closed and/or won't fix
16:30:54 <JF> there remain 3 that may require some more TF input
16:31:15 <lwatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13541
16:31:20 <JF> the balance of open issues have been assigned to specific people, and now this is becoming something of a project managament issue
16:31:34 <JF> JS: shall we look at those 3
16:31:58 <JF> SF: reviewing the 1st bug
16:32:10 <JF> Accessibility and SVG
16:32:38 <JF> JS: Rich has been active in deploying ARIA in SVG - wonder if there is anything they might have to contribute
16:32:42 <lwatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13657
16:32:55 <JF> SF: Suggest we ask Rick to review
16:33:05 <JF> MC: will assign to Rich
16:33:36 <JF> s/Rick/Rich/
16:34:04 <JF> LW: believe this was filed by Cyns
16:34:23 <JF> MC: Ted (on this call) was the person to initially reject this bug
16:34:55 <JF> SF: Not clear why this is an a11y issue - seems to be something of a more general issue
16:35:06 <JF> possibly affects more than just PWD
16:36:05 <JF> Hober: Agree that it doesn't seem to be an a11y issue, is more about the design of input range
16:36:23 <JF> assumption that any kind of range input is more coarse than a direct input of a value
16:36:45 <JF> is that correct? value judgement - the platform also provides for a finer input control
16:37:08 <JF> SF: suggest removing a11yTF keyword
16:37:44 <JF> Hober: likely worth revisiting n the larger WG, but not really an a11y issue
16:38:12 <lwatson> 13639 (CSS bug?):
16:38:21 <JF> JS: we should email person (Cyns) that this should likely be brought to the the larger WG, but that a11yTF keyword being removed
16:38:28 <MichaelC> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13639
16:38:29 <JF> LW: will notify Cyns
16:38:29 <lwatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13639
16:40:11 <JF> MC: it is true that this should actually be taken up with the CSS-WG, but we want to ensure that this is not lost - perhaps we need to hand this to the PF
16:40:33 <JF> we can perhaps close this and re-open at PF
16:40:51 <JF> SF: if this has no direct impact on the HTML spec, perhaps we should do that
16:41:08 <JF> +Q
16:42:28 <JF> JS: not happy that we just drop this, but perhaps PF should talk directly to the CSS-WG
16:42:44 <MichaelC> -> http://www.w3.org/TR/2011/WD-html5-20110525/common-microsyntaxes.html#colors HTML says ¨CSS2 System Colors are not recognised¨
16:42:57 <MichaelC> -> http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-color/#css2-system CSS 3 says system colors are deprecated
16:44:04 <lwatson> JF: Perhaps this is an issue PF could discuss with CSS at the F2F later in the year?
16:44:46 <lwatson> MC: My recollection is that the colours were deprecated to be replaced by something better, excpet the "something better" never happened.
16:45:19 <JF> ?me Leonie, are you taking back scribe duties?
16:45:33 <JF> s/	?me Leonie, are you taking back scribe duties? /
16:46:00 <JF> scribe: lwatson
16:46:33 <lwatson> MC: HTML is choosing to honour the deprecated status, but doesn't have to, but it's difficult to know where the responsibility sits.
16:47:20 <lwatson> JS: Ted, you're on CSS, any ideas?
16:47:36 <lwatson> TOC: Contact CSS and describe your concerns.
16:47:47 <lwatson> MC: We did that a while back.
16:49:29 <lwatson> MC: We'll triage the bug as reopened, and reassign it to someone.
16:50:19 <lwatson> JS: I can work with Michael on this, let's put Michael as placeholder assignee.
16:50:38 <paulc> I need to leave a little early today to get ready for the HTML WG Weekly teleconference.
16:50:47 <paulc> Anything else on the agenda for me?
16:50:55 <paulc> ok
16:51:03 <Zakim> -[Microsoft]
16:52:03 <lwatson> LW: We really need the sub teams to process the outstanding bugs.
16:52:07 <lwatson> rrsagent, make minutes
16:52:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-minutes.html lwatson
16:52:50 <lwatson> zakim, next item
16:52:50 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, lwatson
16:52:57 <Stevef> zakim, next item
16:52:57 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, Stevef
16:53:08 <MichaelC> q?
16:53:10 <MichaelC> ack j
16:53:19 <lwatson> zakim, next item
16:53:19 <Zakim> agendum 5. "Other Business" taken up [from Stevef]
16:53:19 <Stevef> zakim, next item
16:53:20 <Zakim> agendum 5 was just opened, Stevef
16:54:01 <lwatson> SF: The main element has been added to 5.1 core.
16:54:33 <lwatson> SF: It's another sign of the good working relationship we have with the editors.
16:55:51 <lwatson> rrsagent, make minutes
16:55:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-minutes.html lwatson
16:56:23 <Stevef> zakim, next item
16:56:23 <Zakim> agendum 6. "Actions Review <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open" taken up [from Stevef]
16:56:26 <lwatson> zakim, next item
16:56:26 <Zakim> agendum 6 was just opened, lwatson
16:56:36 <lwatson> zakim, close item 6
16:56:36 <Zakim> agendum 6, Actions Review <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open, closed
16:56:38 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
16:56:38 <Zakim> 7. Identify Scribe for the next TF teleconference <http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List>http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
16:56:38 <Zakim> ... [from Stevef]
16:58:22 <laura_> laura_ has joined #html-a11y
16:58:23 <lwatson> SF: Everyone, pplease review that email.
16:58:44 <lwatson> rrsagent, make minutes
16:58:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-minutes.html lwatson
16:58:58 <Zakim> -Steve_Faulkner
16:59:01 <Zakim> -John_Foliot
16:59:01 <Zakim> -hober
16:59:02 <Zakim> -lwatson
16:59:04 <Zakim> -Janina_Sajka
16:59:09 <Zakim> -Michael_Cooper
16:59:11 <Zakim> WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)10:00AM has ended
16:59:11 <Zakim> Attendees were John_Foliot, hober, lwatson, Michael_Cooper, Janina_Sajka, Steve_Faulkner, paulc
16:59:29 <MichaelC> rrsagent, make minutes
16:59:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/01/17-html-a11y-minutes.html MichaelC
17:03:06 <lwatson> zakim, please part
17:03:06 <Zakim> Zakim has left #html-a11y
17:03:11 <lwatson> rrsagent, please part
17:03:11 <RRSAgent> I see no action items