Chatlog 2012-08-06

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13:56:04 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference
13:56:04 <trackbot> Date: 06 August 2012
13:58:30 <ahaller2> apologies, will only be able to join via irc, no reliable internet connection nor telephone (holiday)
14:06:30 <AndyS> Scribenick: AndyS
14:06:42 <AndyS> scribe: Andy Seaborne
14:06:51 <AndyS> Topic: admin
14:07:21 <AndyS> Arnaud: mins from July 9 and July 23
14:07:32 <AndyS> ...    http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/meeting/2012-07-09
14:07:35 <mhausenblas> +1
14:07:39 <SteveS> +1
14:07:40 <krp> +1
14:07:41 <AndyS> ...    http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/meeting/2012-07-23
14:08:01 <AndyS> RESOLVED: Accept the minutes of July 9th
14:08:08 <Zakim> -??P30
14:08:11 <mhausenblas> +1 for 23 July
14:08:37 <Kalpa> I think it was about participants list for July 23rd
14:08:44 <Kalpa> I think it is solved now
14:08:46 <Kalpa> +1
14:08:55 <SteveS> +1
14:08:56 <AndyS> RESOLVED: Accept the minutes of July 23rd
14:08:57 <krp> +1
14:09:07 <ArthurK> ArthurK has joined #ldp
14:09:17 <AndyS> Topic: Action item review
14:09:48 <Zakim> + +1.512.651.aahh
14:10:03 <AndyS> Arnaud: pending ACTION-7
14:10:36 <AndyS> ... anyone can use the tracker - wiki style - any WG member(+team)
14:10:39 <ArthurK> Zakim +1.512.651.aahh is me
14:10:59 <AndyS> CLOSE Action-7
14:10:59 <trackbot> ACTION-7 Add a use case for authentication.authorization to the use case wiki page closed
14:11:08 <sandro> action-7?
14:11:09 <trackbot> ACTION-7 -- Erik Wilde to add a use case for authentication.authorization to the use case wiki page -- due 2012-07-30 -- CLOSED
14:11:09 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/7
14:11:40 <AndyS> ... (and UC edited just before meeting)
14:12:59 <mhausenblas> q+ to ask about the purpose of the exercise 
14:13:35 <AndyS> ... and open action items   action-4, action-5, action-6
14:13:36 <Reza> Identity, authorization, etc. may be fairly large in scope, is this scope we want to try to tackle or is it just a question of determining pointers to other standards, etc. for these features?  I know other standardization efforts have passed on these.
14:13:46 <Arnaud> q?
14:13:46 <mhausenblas> q?
14:13:54 <AndyS> Regrets: Henry
14:13:58 <mhausenblas> ack me
14:13:58 <Zakim> mhausenblas, you wanted to ask about the purpose of the exercise
14:14:20 <Reza> +1 to mhausenblas
14:14:41 <AndyS> mhausenblas: authentication and authorization is not in the charter 
14:14:48 <Zakim> +??P34
14:14:50 <Zakim> +??P2
14:14:56 <ericP> Zakim, ??P34 is me
14:14:56 <Zakim> +ericP; got it
14:14:57 <antonis> ??P34 is me
14:14:59 <dret> q+
14:15:02 <AndyS> Arnaud: there is an item for a group note or requirements of such
14:15:08 <antonis> zakim, ??p2 is me
14:15:08 <Zakim> +antonis; got it
14:15:37 <MacTed> Zakim, who's noisy?
14:15:48 <Zakim> MacTed, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: antonis (4%), Arnaud (10%), ericP (54%)
14:15:54 <krp> are we talking about having something akin to an IETF "Security Considerations" section in the spec?
14:15:56 <AndyS> (hard to hear Arnaud)
14:16:27 <antonis> sorry - still new to this.. and cant seem to hear anything
14:16:52 <krp> while out of scope for the group, it does seem having consideration of security is essential. i.e. there needs to be a viable solution to this
14:16:56 <AndyS> EriK: main point is that we think about integrating with existing technologies hence not about inventing, but "working with"
14:16:58 <Reza> q+
14:17:10 <AndyS> ... together with patterns and requirements
14:17:37 <AndyS> ... starting point and recommendations for implementers/deployers.
14:18:17 <AndyS> mhausenblas: agree - typically IEFT "security considerations"
14:18:51 <AndyS> erik: see if we can go as far as stating a good way to link to specific frameworks.
14:18:53 <Arnaud> q?
14:18:58 <dret> q-
14:19:04 <AndyS> ack dret
14:19:18 <AndyS> ack Reza
14:19:36 <AndyS> Reza: what has been decided?
14:20:47 <AndyS> arnaud: we had people present existing technologies e.g. SPARQL Graph Store protocol.
14:20:55 <Zakim> +??P33
14:21:00 <AndyS> Reza: consensus so far?
14:21:10 <AndyS> arnaud: not yet - info gathering
14:21:13 <Reza> -q
14:21:20 <svillata> Zakim, ??P33 is me
14:21:21 <Zakim> +svillata; got it
14:21:26 <Reza> +q
14:22:36 <AndyS> Reza: prov-wg breaks up std into modules -- architecture decoupling : Data model query model, primer, (other)  Was a good way to proceed.
14:23:03 <AndyS> .. can take technologies to see how they fit that structure.
14:23:07 <AndyS> ... can take technologies to see how they fit that structure.
14:23:23 <AndyS> arnaud: so far, we have no single way to proceed
14:23:42 <AndyS> (back to ACTION-7)
14:24:00 <AndyS> erik: you were asking about identification in UC
14:24:29 <AndyS> ... I didn't have a complicated idea underlying this other than global identification needs.
14:24:46 <AndyS> ... user name or handle
14:25:04 <AndyS> (open actions)
14:25:14 <AndyS> Topic: open actions
14:25:30 <AndyS> action-4, action-5, action-6
14:26:01 <Arnaud> ok
14:26:25 <AndyS> arnaud: Henry not here today
14:27:58 <Zakim> -antonis
14:28:40 <AndyS> ... SDshare ...  mhausenblas ... could you review for us?
14:29:06 <AndyS>  mhausenblas: sure ... maybe two weeks time.
14:29:09 <Zakim> +??P2
14:29:37 <antonis> zakim, ??P2 is me
14:29:37 <Zakim> +antonis; got it
14:29:55 <ahaller2_> ahaller2_ has joined #ldp
14:29:59 <mhausenblas> Action-6?
14:29:59 <trackbot> ACTION-6 -- Steve Speicher to review SDshare -- due 2012-08-21 -- OPEN
14:29:59 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/6
14:30:14 <sandro> action-6?
14:30:14 <trackbot> ACTION-6 -- Michael Hausenblas to review SDshare -- due 2012-08-21 -- OPEN
14:30:14 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/6
14:30:33 <AndyS>  mhausenblas takes over action-6
14:30:50 <AndyS> Topic: next meeting
14:31:11 <AndyS> arnaud: next meeting in two weeks; 20 August
14:31:19 <AndyS> Topic: Face-to-face
14:31:33 <AndyS> November 1 and 2 at TPAC.
14:31:52 <AndyS> RDF-WG is Mon,Tue
14:32:19 <AndyS> ... we do not have an planned co-ordination meetings yet.
14:32:48 <AndyS> ... Oracle has offered a US location in NYC.
14:33:27 <AndyS> ... fun with timezones
14:33:59 <SteveS> at Lyon
14:34:21 <Ashok_Malhotra> I will be in Lyon
14:34:26 <AndyS> arnaud: please respond to email to confirm/not-confirm attendance
14:34:33 <sandro> I'll be at in Lyon
14:34:45 <svillata> I'll be in Lyon
14:34:49 <ArthurK> I will be in Lyon
14:34:53 <ericP> Lyon -- 80%
14:34:55 <AndyS> sandro: wiki for meeting - all details inc attendance, agenda etc etc
14:35:08 <antonis> 90% for me to be in Lyon
14:35:13 <ahaller2_> at Lyon
14:36:16 <AndyS> Reza: unclear how many would attend in NYC.  Any?
14:36:27 <Ashok_Malhotra> Reza, I have to be in Lyon for other reasons
14:36:47 <Zakim> -??P4
14:36:51 <Zakim> -??P6
14:36:58 <ericP> Reza, how do you feel about showing up at 5am EST?
14:36:59 <AndyS> ACTION: Arnaud: set up wiki page for the F2F meeting
14:36:59 <trackbot> Created ACTION-8 - Set up wiki page for the F2F meeting [on Arnaud Le Hors - due 2012-08-13].
14:37:01 <Reza> Doesn't seem like anyone else needs to be in NYC, but in case there is, I can provide meeting place, etc.
14:37:14 <AndyS> Topic: UC+R
14:37:40 <AndyS> wiki page -- http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Use_Cases_And_Requirements
14:37:47 <AndyS> ... any WG member can add material
14:37:52 <AndyS> ... main focus for now
14:37:58 <AndyS> ... need to ensure coverage
14:38:43 <AndyS> ... there are different styles and levels of specificity
14:38:46 <SteveS> SteveS has joined #ldp
14:38:54 <SteveS> SteveS has joined #ldp
14:38:57 <Reza> @ericP - 5 AM is too early, but Ashok will rep Oracle in Lyon so I probably just won't attend.
14:39:17 <Reza> @ericP [meaning if there are no other people in NYC]
14:39:30 <AndyS> ... erik and arnaud would like to make consistent ... see agenda
14:39:47 <Arnaud> q?
14:39:54 <Reza> -q
14:41:07 <AndyS> erik: we looked at wiki page ... mixed - app driven - functional issues, not specific apps
14:41:12 <stevebattle> q+
14:41:31 <AndyS> ... try to put into a single framework to assess
14:42:05 <mhausenblas> q+ to suggest to follow roughly http://www.w3.org/TR/rdb2rdf-ucr/
14:42:29 <AndyS> ... Erik liked "media fragments"
14:42:55 <mhausenblas> http://www.w3.org/TR/media-frags-reqs/#use-cases
14:42:55 <krp> http://www.w3.org/TR/media-frags-reqs/#use-cases
14:42:59 <dret> http://www.w3.org/TR/media-frags-reqs/#use-cases
14:43:07 <Reza> We should be careful about not overlapping with other existing (and not-dead) standards: e.g. "Maintaining Social Contact Information" has at least some overlap with FOAF
14:43:08 <AndyS> ... section 4
14:43:34 <AndyS> q+ to ask about an editor
14:44:28 <AndyS> Erik:  functional - scenarios using functional aspects.
14:44:38 <AndyS> ... how do we get from there from here?
14:44:49 <mhausenblas> q?
14:44:53 <mhausenblas> ack stevebattle 
14:45:01 <mhausenblas> q?
14:45:46 <AndyS> stevebattle: UC here are end-to-end stories .. e.g. data catalogues   Separate scenarios from the goals  ... relabelling needed
14:45:47 <mhausenblas> ack me
14:45:47 <Zakim> mhausenblas, you wanted to suggest to follow roughly http://www.w3.org/TR/rdb2rdf-ucr/
14:45:49 <stevebattle> q-
14:45:49 <AndyS> ack stevebattle
14:46:46 <AndyS>  mhausenblas: I was there - was great but costly to produce  RDB2RDF was lightly weight and learnt from the process in media fragments
14:47:10 <mhausenblas> q?
14:47:36 <AndyS> ... structure is UC with key feature sections 
14:47:39 <AndyS> ack andys
14:47:39 <Zakim> AndyS, you wanted to ask about an editor
14:47:56 <AndyS> AndyS: Editor needed (sometime)?
14:48:22 <AndyS> arnaud: ericp suggested self-identification by wiki input
14:48:46 <AndyS> ... volunteers for UC+R doc ... two editors to share the load
14:49:12 <stevebattle> q+
# added afterwards:
14:50:00 <Arnaud> stevebattle would be happy to be editor for UC+R doc
#
14:50:08 <AndyS> ack stevebattle
14:50:09 <SteveS> q+
14:50:49 <AndyS>  mhausenblas: could help with secondary editor role 
14:50:49 <stevebattle> :)
14:50:56 <mhausenblas> q?
14:50:56 <SteveS> q-
14:51:05 <AndyS> steveS: could help with secondary editor role 
14:51:06 <krp> I can put some time in to help some word wrangling in September, but not really before then (and hope to add a use case real soon now)
14:52:20 <Reza> +q
14:52:31 <AndyS> arnaud: Reze's point was overlap with existing work.
14:53:45 <AndyS> ack Reza
14:55:13 <AndyS> Reza: not too high level in the UC ... vague ... add solution specification (and note non-LD solutions? and partial overlaps).  
14:55:26 <AndyS> arnaud: charter scope is useful here.
# added afterwards:
14:50:00 <Arnaud> UC+R doc editors are: Steve Battle, Steve Speicher, Michael Hausenblas, Kevin Page
#
14:55:47 <AndyS> topic: public comments
14:56:13 <AndyS> arnaud: Leigh aware we are listening.
14:56:30 <AndyS> ... more generally, we need to capture comments as issues in the tracker.
14:56:53 <AndyS> ... Martynas comments, pre-WG, a bit more unclear process-wise.
14:57:23 <AndyS> ... how do we handle public comments - what's good practice here?
14:57:25 <Reza> At least in Prov, public comments are gathered after first call.
14:58:35 <Reza> I think having public comments coming in during the development of spec is not productive to focus and delivery.  I think it has to be done after some formalization, etc. of calls... 
14:58:38 <sandro> +1 andy: at this point, we should be trying to engage the commenters -- it's not formal at this point
14:58:45 <AndyS> arnaud: at the moment, anyone can join discussion
14:59:37 <AndyS> ... we have the submission as starting point
15:00:03 <AndyS> SteveS: as editor, I can engage in discussion and cc WG.
15:00:52 <Arnaud> q?
15:00:55 <Zakim> - +1.512.651.aahh
15:00:59 <Reza> -q
15:01:03 <dret> thanks, arnaud!
15:01:09 <AndyS> ADJOURNED
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