14:59:49 RRSAgent has joined #sparql 14:59:49 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/12/11-sparql-irc 14:59:51 RRSAgent, make logs world 14:59:51 Zakim has joined #sparql 14:59:53 Zakim, this will be 77277 14:59:53 ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute 14:59:54 Meeting: SPARQL Working Group Teleconference 14:59:54 Date: 11 December 2012 15:00:08 agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2012-12-11 15:00:15 AxelPolleres has changed the topic to: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2012-12-11 15:00:33 SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started 15:00:39 +??P5 15:00:41 +??P3 15:00:44 zakim, ??P5 is me 15:00:44 +cbuilara; got it 15:00:45 +kasei 15:00:46 zakim, mute me 15:00:46 cbuilara should now be muted 15:00:58 Zakim, ??P3 is me 15:00:58 +bglimm; got it 15:01:03 MattPerry has joined #sparql 15:01:06 + +43.12.aaaa 15:01:21 Zakim, aaaa is me 15:01:22 +AxelPolleres; got it 15:01:38 Zakim, sho is on the phone? 15:01:38 I don't understand your question, AxelPolleres. 15:01:44 Zakim, who is on the phone? 15:01:44 On the phone I see bglimm, cbuilara (muted), kasei, AxelPolleres 15:01:56 +pgearon 15:02:00 chimezie_ has joined #sparql 15:02:34 +chimezie_ 15:02:35 Zakim, who is on the phone? 15:02:35 On the phone I see bglimm, cbuilara (muted), kasei, AxelPolleres, pgearon, chimezie_ 15:02:45 + +1.603.897.aabb 15:02:49 regrets: AndyS, Sandro 15:02:55 Zakim, mute me 15:02:55 chimezie_ should now be muted 15:02:56 Zakim, who is on the phone? 15:02:57 On the phone I see bglimm, cbuilara (muted), kasei, AxelPolleres, pgearon, chimezie_ (muted), +1.603.897.aabb 15:02:58 zakim, aabb is me 15:02:59 +MattPerry; got it 15:03:17 +LeeF 15:03:44 topic: admin 15:04:03 Zakim, pick a victim? 15:04:03 I don't understand your question, AxelPolleres. 15:04:04 +Sandro 15:04:07 Zakim, pick a victim 15:04:07 Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose pgearon 15:04:36 I can do it 15:04:43 scribe: carlos 15:04:54 PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-12-04 15:05:04 AxelPolleres: approve minutes, objections? 15:05:15 RESOLVED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-12-04 15:05:38 AxelPolleres: any regrets for next week? 15:05:44 regrets from me for next week 15:05:49 AxelPolleres: me 15:05:55 AxelPolleres: Sandro 15:06:11 Sandro: regrets for me too 15:06:16 topic: approval of test cases 15:06:29 AxelPolleres: enatilment 15:06:30 Entailment (cf. ACTION-729, ACTION-716) 15:06:47 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0199.html 15:07:09 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0200.html 15:07:17 AxelPolleres: doesn't include RIF tests 15:07:31 s/AxelPolleres/bglimm 15:07:44 199 is non rif, 200 is rif 15:08:07 AxelPolleres: all test cases discussed are passed by 2 implementations? 15:08:09 PROPOSED: approve test cases as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0199.html 15:08:09 bglimm: yes 15:08:16 +1 15:08:18 +1 15:08:18 +1 15:08:20 +1 15:08:22 +1 15:08:23 +1 15:08:27 +1 15:08:28 +1 15:08:29 +1 15:08:39 RESOLVED: approve test cases as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0199.html 15:09:04 ACTION: birte to approve test cases as per resolution in this telco 15:09:04 Created ACTION-730 - Approve test cases as per resolution in this telco [on Birte Glimm - due 2012-12-18]. 15:09:18 AxelPolleres: RIF test cases 15:09:21 Zakim, unmute me 15:09:21 chimezie_ should no longer be muted 15:09:37 AxelPolleres: 4 test cases that now pass 15:09:49 AxelPolleres: the non pass test cases are RIF02 and =5 15:09:58 s/=5/05 15:10:15 AxelPolleres, rif02 depends on rif-in-rdf which is not rec track, so we can't have it be normative. (ER does not require it) 15:10:45 RESOLVED: approve test cases as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0200.html 15:10:46 AxelPolleres: suggest to approve test cases in the RIF email 15:10:57 PROPOSED: approve test cases as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0200.html 15:10:59 AxelPolleres: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0200.html 15:11:00 +1 15:11:06 +1 15:11:06 +1 15:11:07 +1 15:11:10 +1 15:11:14 +1 15:11:20 +1 15:11:26 RESOLVED: approve test cases as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012OctDec/0200.html 15:11:43 (earlier resolved was a bit ahead of itself :-) 15:12:07 chimezie_: no hope for another implementation passing the tests 15:12:54 http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/IRI_from_RDF_Literal 15:13:02 AxelPolleres: is any of the other test cases testing RIF building 15:13:29 chimezie_: the import RDF from RIF and building 15:13:42 AxelPolleres: no hope that we can go forward with these tests 15:14:04 AxelPolleres: go ahead with only those tests that we approved now to PR 15:14:30 I think it's a probably unreasonably high bar that SPARQL-RIF conformance is dependent on full RIF Core conformance -- I think it's helpful to keep those two things loosely coupled 15:14:41 +1 15:14:45 chimezie_: none of these missing tests have to do with the specification 15:14:49 I agree with Chimezie 15:14:56 yes 15:15:09 it seems reasonable to me to be able to say "I implement RIF-in-SPARQL conformantly; it supports most of RIF except for X and Y" 15:15:37 AxelPolleres: all approved test cases are passed by two implementation so we can proceed 15:15:40 AxelPolleres: So it sounds like we've passed the exit criteria for the RIF Core part of ER 15:16:19 pgearon: two more test cases need to be approved for Update to go for PR 15:17:00 Zakim, mute me 15:17:00 chimezie_ should now be muted 15:17:11 http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/implementations/#sparql11-update 15:18:40 AxelPolleres: are these tests passed by 2 implementations? 15:19:42 basic-update/manifest#insert-05 15:19:42 basic-update/manifest#insert-data-same-bnode 15:19:43 basic-update/manifest#insert-data-same-bnode, basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode, basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode2, syntax-update-1/manifest#test_54 15:19:44 basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode 15:19:44 basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode2 15:19:45 syntax-update-1/manifest#test_54 15:20:31 AxelPolleres: in the implementation report these seem to be passed by more than 2 implementations 15:20:46 AxelPolleres: are these ready for approval or not? 15:20:54 pgearon: personally I do not know 15:21:25 kasei: all 4 that are listed in the implementation report are ready to approve, those that do not pass are already covered 15:21:34 insert05 was replaced by insert05a 15:22:21 ACTION: greg to comment out insert05 in manifest 15:22:21 Created ACTION-731 - Comment out insert05 in manifest [on Gregory Williams - due 2012-12-18]. 15:22:37 PROPOSED: approve test cases basic-update/manifest#insert-data-same-bnode, basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode, basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode2, syntax-update-1/manifest#test_54 15:22:52 +1 15:23:03 +1 15:23:06 +1 15:23:06 +1 15:23:07 +1 15:23:07 +1 15:23:10 +1 15:23:11 +1 15:23:25 RESOLVED: approve test cases basic-update/manifest#insert-data-same-bnode, basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode, basic-update/manifest#insert-where-same-bnode2, syntax-update-1/manifest#test_54 15:23:57 AxelPolleres: Kasei to mark for approval those test cases 15:24:00 ACTION: greg mark update testcases approved in this telco in the manifest 15:24:00 Created ACTION-732 - Mark update testcases approved in this telco in the manifest [on Gregory Williams - due 2012-12-18]. 15:24:41 kasei: missing tests for approval 15:25:06 #get_of_put__empty_graph, #post__empty_graph_to_existing_graph, #put__empty_graph show up as unclassified in the impl. report 15:25:36 Zakim, unmute me 15:25:36 chimezie_ should no longer be muted 15:25:46 http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-12-04#GSP 15:25:51 http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-11-27#resolution_3 15:25:57 AxelPolleres: we have approved test cases here 15:26:23 AxelPolleres: which ones would be left? 15:26:56 AxelPolleres: can we approve them? 15:27:10 AxelPolleres: no second implementation available 15:27:30 kasei: can we removed these unapproved tests from the manifest? 15:27:52 AxelPolleres: we can comment them out 15:28:06 ACTION: chime to comment/rmeove unapproved GSP test cases in themanifest 15:28:06 Created ACTION-733 - Comment/rmeove unapproved GSP test cases in themanifest [on Chimezie Ogbuji - due 2012-12-18]. 15:28:13 Zakim, mute me 15:28:13 chimezie_ should now be muted 15:28:20 AxelPolleres: anything more on test cases? 15:28:33 q? 15:28:46 pgearon: test 54 passes on Fuseki 15:29:06 pgearon: syntax test 54 15:30:09 pgearon: that test is supposed to fail 15:30:23 pgearon: it won't pass 15:30:54 www.w3.org/2009/sparql/implementations/ 15:30:55 Seems ok to me 15:30:56 kasei: we have 4 implementations doing the right thing, 1 that there isn't 15:31:32 syntax-update-1/manifest#test_54 15:31:56 What's the issue here? :) 15:33:02 Zakim, mute me 15:33:02 bglimm should now be muted 15:33:11 topic: publications 15:33:21 Zakim, unmute me 15:33:21 bglimm should no longer be muted 15:33:43 PROPOSED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/http-rdf-update/ (SPARQL1.1 Graph Store HTTP Protocol) as PR 15:33:46 Zakim, unmute me 15:33:46 chimezie_ should no longer be muted 15:33:52 AxelPolleres: vote for Graph Store protocol to go for PR 15:33:53 +1 (W3C) 15:33:53 q? 15:33:54 +q 15:34:09 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2012Dec/0048.html 15:34:27 chimezie_: David Wood email about requirements of LD protocol and GS Protocol 15:35:10 chimezie_: personal email 15:35:44 sandro, do you know anything about this? 15:35:45 ah 15:35:54 AxelPolleres: I do not see the point on dicussing that 15:36:27 Sandro: we talked about that one year ago, there is no harm in proceeding 15:36:34 Let me see if I can reach David W on IRC in the next 5 minutes while we pursue othe rbusiness 15:36:38 +1 in no harm on proceeding with GSP. 15:36:43 +1 (Ulm) 15:36:53 +1 (IE) 15:36:54 AxelPolleres: the proposal stands 15:36:55 +1 (siemens) 15:36:58 +1 15:37:00 +1 (Oracle) 15:37:02 +1 15:37:09 -LeeF 15:37:23 +1 15:37:27 waiting for Lee 15:37:31 +LeeF 15:38:03 holding for Lee to try to reach David Wood 15:38:22 we hold with 8 +1 votes, no objection. 15:38:42 PROPOSED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/protocol-1.1/ (SPARQL1.1 Protocol) as PR modulo completion of ACTION-725 15:38:47 action-725? 15:38:48 ACTION-725 -- Gregory Williams to answer to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2012Nov/0010.html and implement requested editorial fix. -- due 2012-12-11 -- OPEN 15:38:48 http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/track/actions/725 15:39:24 AxelPolleres: comments on protocol we discussed last time, getting reply 15:39:31 reply is here: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2012Dec/0002.html 15:39:52 kasei: that was an editorial comment 15:40:03 AxelPolleres: what about the other comments? 15:40:26 That comment is irrelevant 15:40:28 I did write a response 15:40:36 close ACTION-725 15:40:36 ACTION-725 Answer to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2012Nov/0010.html and implement requested editorial fix. closed 15:40:41 kasei: PH1 is not applicable to this protocol (had to do with WSDL i.e. Portocol 1.0) 15:40:48 PROPOSED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/protocol-1.1/ (SPARQL1.1 Protocol) as PR 15:40:51 +1 15:40:53 s/PH1/TH-1/ 15:40:54 +1 15:40:55 +1 (siemens) 15:40:55 +1 15:40:56 +1 (UUlm) 15:41:00 +1 (Oracle) 15:41:01 +1 (IE) 15:41:19 Zakim, mute me 15:41:19 chimezie_ should now be muted 15:41:29 +1 (revelytix) 15:42:05 RESOLVED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/protocol-1.1/ (SPARQL1.1 Protocol) as PR 15:42:15 no objections, no abstentions 15:42:27 Not yet. 15:42:50 PROPOSED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/ (SPARQL1.1 Entailment Regimes) as PR (removing AT RISK for any entailment regimes where we reach the exist criterion by christmas, and leaving the other AT RISK entailment regimes as "informative") 15:43:13 +q 15:43:27 PROPOSED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/ (SPARQL1.1 Entailment Regimes) as PR (removing AT RISK for any entailment regimes marked in the CR version) 15:43:42 earlier 15:43:49 queue=pgearon 15:43:52 ack chimezie_ 15:43:59 +1 (W3C) 15:44:03 +1 15:44:05 +1 (UUlm) 15:44:07 +1 (revelytix) 15:44:07 +1 15:44:08 +1 (siemens) 15:44:08 +1 (Oracle) 15:44:08 +1 (IE)  15:44:26 +1 15:44:42 RESOLVED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/ (SPARQL1.1 Entailment Regimes) as PR (removing AT RISK for any entailment regimes marked in the CR version) 15:44:53 no objections, no abstentions 15:45:49 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2012Dec/0001.html 15:46:15 pgearon: wondering if we have to response a formal response to comments by D Wood 15:46:18 +1 to greg 15:46:33 s/D Wood/L Dodds/ 15:46:42 s/D Wood/L Doods 15:46:42 greg was about to write a response to get this closed by next week 15:47:14 Nothing new, let's move ahead 15:48:35 AxelPolleres: we are up to date on the comments page 15:48:39 comments page looks up-to-date to me. 15:48:47 Nothing from David, so let's move ahead 15:48:59 ROPOSED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/http-rdf-update/ (SPARQL1.1 Graph Store HTTP Protocol) as PR 15:49:00 AxelPolleres: back to earlier proposal of GSP to P>R 15:49:09 s/P>R/PR/ 15:49:13 +1 (UUlm) 15:49:16 +1 (IE) 15:49:21 +1 (W3C) 15:49:21 +1 15:49:26 +1 (Oracle) 15:49:28 we had 8 +1 already before, if I counted correctly 15:49:28 +1 (revelytix) 15:49:35 +1 (Siemens) 15:49:37 s/personal email/WG email 15:49:41 +1 15:49:51 +1 (RPI) 15:50:05 RESOLVED: Publish http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/http-rdf-update/ (SPARQL1.1 Graph Store HTTP Protocol) as PR 15:50:15 congratulations all!!!! 15:50:19 yay 15:50:37 way to go, everyone 15:50:41 I muted my loud celebration :) 15:51:43 Zakim, unmute me 15:51:43 chimezie_ was not muted, chimezie_ 15:51:55 bglimm: do we have to do something with the documents? 15:52:00 Sandro: remove at risk 15:52:06 ACTION: birte to take out AT RISK notes from entailment 15:52:06 Created ACTION-734 - Take out AT RISK notes from entailment [on Birte Glimm - due 2012-12-18]. 15:53:05 LeeF: I'm impressed for the people in the group, their quality, strong group of engaging, hard work 15:53:14 +1 so many capable and engaged people making this happen! thanks all! 15:53:25 AxelPolleres: I cannot add much to that, greetings 15:53:46 +1 thanks to Lee and Axel! 15:53:59 AxelPolleres: anything more to do in the process side? 15:54:02 yes, thanks Lee and Axel 15:54:07 +1 thanks Lee and Axel 15:54:29 Sandro: procedurally the group does not have anything to do 15:54:51 -chimezie_ 15:54:51 bye all 15:54:53 -Sandro 15:54:55 bye and merry Christmas! 15:54:56 everybody a big thanks again!!! 15:54:58 -pgearon 15:55:00 bye 15:55:05 -kasei 15:55:05 Take care ppl 15:55:06 -MattPerry 15:55:09 -LeeF 15:55:10 -cbuilara 15:55:21 next week's meeting cancelled. 15:56:37 -AxelPolleres 15:57:13 Zakim, make records public 15:57:13 I don't understand 'make records public', AxelPolleres 15:57:26 rrsagent, make records public 15:59:15 we ended with only 46 open actions :) 16:18:49 that's not too bad 16:18:52 are they all on me? 16:21:55 :-) 16:22:08 Maybe we should have said we can't stop meeting until the action items are done. 16:24:02 trackbot, close all actions 16:24:02 Sorry, LeeF, I don't understand 'trackbot, close all actions'. Please refer to http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help. 16:35:00 disconnecting the lone participant, bglimm, in SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM 16:35:03 SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has ended 16:35:03 Attendees were cbuilara, kasei, bglimm, +43.12.aaaa, AxelPolleres, pgearon, chimezie_, +1.603.897.aabb, MattPerry, LeeF, Sandro 16:48:29 pgearon_ has joined #sparql 16:50:17 was somebody doing minutes for the meeting? 17:11:58 argh. pgearon, you're marking tests as approved without an approvedBy triple! 17:17:02 rrsagent, generate minutes 17:17:02 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/12/11-sparql-minutes.html cbuilara 17:34:34 rrsagent, make log public 17:34:46 rrsagent, generate minutes 17:34:46 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/12/11-sparql-minutes.html cbuilara 17:35:01 kasei: on a call, but sorry. Will fix 17:41:18 pgearon: don't worry about it. I just fixed it now that carlos published the minutes. 17:41:27 thanks 18:11:15 SteveH has joined #sparql 18:26:59 Zakim has left #sparql