18:00:41 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #audio
18:00:41 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/04/16-audio-irc
18:00:46 <olivier> trackbot, start meeting
18:00:48 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
18:00:50 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 28346
18:00:50 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see RWC_Audio()2:00PM scheduled to start now
18:00:51 <trackbot> Meeting: Audio Working Group Teleconference
18:00:51 <trackbot> Date: 16 April 2012
18:00:54 <olivier> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-audio/2012AprJun/0026.html
18:01:09 <olivier> Agenda+ Decide on the time/day for our teleconferences through Autumn 2012
18:01:28 <olivier> Agenda+ Decide on whether we will meet at TPAC and/or for another f2f
18:01:39 <olivier> Agenda+ Quick review of issues "Pending Review"
18:02:17 <jussi> jussi has joined #audio
18:02:45 <olivier> zakim, who is here?
18:02:45 <Zakim> RWC_Audio()2:00PM has not yet started, olivier
18:02:46 <Zakim> On IRC I see jussi, RRSAgent, Zakim, olivier, jernoble, FILT3R, automata, colinbdclark, MMTLukas, kinetik, foolip, kennyluck, F1LT3R, shepazu, paul___irish, trackbot
18:03:02 <olivier> zakim, this is audio
18:03:02 <Zakim> ok, olivier; that matches RWC_Audio()2:00PM
18:05:10 <chris> chris has joined #audio
18:05:22 <olivier> Present: Al, Doug, Olivier, Jer, Jussi 
18:05:44 <olivier> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:05:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/04/16-audio-minutes.html olivier
18:06:01 <olivier> rrsagent, make logs public
18:06:02 <olivier> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:06:02 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/04/16-audio-minutes.html olivier
18:06:33 <Zakim> + +1.650.253.aaaa
18:06:45 <olivier> zakim, aaaa is CRogers
18:06:45 <Zakim> +CRogers; got it
18:07:25 <olivier> Chair: Al
18:07:30 <olivier> Scribe: Olivier
18:07:46 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 1
18:07:46 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Decide on the time/day for our teleconferences through Autumn 2012" taken up [from olivier]
18:07:55 <olivier> http://www.doodle.com/ayb6qkrwc94scru7
18:09:25 <Alistair> Olivier: We has switch time, which means Aukland has switched to winter time. The time is 6am in NZ, being quite inconvenient. The best time seems to be 3-4pm Boston time, which is one hour later than now. Based on that I started the poll to see which day would be best for that time. So far the best choice would be Wed. Could people fill this in quickly now so we can work out a date.
18:11:00 <jussi> Zakim, what's the agenda?
18:11:00 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda:
18:11:02 <Zakim> 1. Decide on the time/day for our teleconferences through Autumn 2012 [from olivier]
18:11:02 <Zakim> 2. Decide on whether we will meet at TPAC and/or for another f2f [from olivier]
18:11:02 <Zakim> 3. Quick review of issues "Pending Review" [from olivier]
18:11:39 <olivier> Olivier: based on the poll, 3pm Wednesdays (Boston) is a clear winner
18:12:19 <olivier> ACTION: Olivier to change teleconference time (wed 3pm Boston), announce to the group
18:12:19 <trackbot> Created ACTION-44 - Change teleconference time (wed 3pm Boston), announce to the group [on Olivier Thereaux - due 2012-04-23].
18:12:24 <olivier> Zakim, next
18:12:24 <Zakim> I don't understand 'next', olivier
18:12:44 <olivier> valid from next week
18:12:48 <olivier> Zakim, next agendum
18:12:48 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Decide on whether we will meet at TPAC and/or for another f2f" taken up [from olivier]
18:13:18 <olivier> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/46884/f2f2012/results
18:13:25 <olivier> (Results of poll on TPAC)
18:14:50 <Alistair> Olivier: We need to decide quickly on this. We had a reasonable number of answers on the poll above. A few people said they may not be able to make it, but people seem to agree the telecon should go ahead with meeting at TPAC. We also have the option of canceling and having another F3F elsewhere, but we should book this anyway.
18:15:11 <olivier> Olivier: I'll reply on behalf of the group
18:16:23 <olivier> Resolution: we will say yes to meeting at TPAC, assess later whether we need/want to hold another f2f, possibly in East Coast USA
18:16:27 <olivier> Zakim, next agendum
18:16:27 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Quick review of issues "Pending Review"" taken up [from olivier]
18:16:44 <Alistair> http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/issues/3
18:16:57 <olivier> Al: Destroying audio context
18:18:45 <olivier> Olivier: this does not seem to be controversial. Ordinary garbage collection rules seemed to be sufficient. Assuming we could close, and let people reopen if need be?
18:18:56 <olivier> Chris: agreed, I think this is not going to be a problem
18:19:15 <olivier> Al: is this per tab?
18:19:26 <olivier> Chris: implementation specific, but I suppose it could be per domain
18:20:08 <olivier> Doug: it seems that developers don't like undocumented differences between implementations
18:20:16 <olivier> … and don't like not knowing what they can do
18:20:17 <olivier> q+
18:20:39 <olivier> Doug: could we specify a number?
18:21:00 <olivier> Chris: we could write that the audiocontext can be managed, and that the usual garbage collection holds
18:21:12 <olivier> Doug: we could document outside of the spec
18:21:29 <olivier> … document what the limit is
18:21:56 <jernoble> q+
18:22:24 <olivier> Chris: it's something that is likely to be increased, but it's similar to webGL, an implementation will start complaining if you create too many
18:22:38 <olivier> … the limit at the moment in webkit is low
18:23:18 <olivier> … hope that people will use the web audio API in such a way that they won't use too many… there are ways to use it by having one context per page
18:23:24 <olivier> Doug: mashup scenario
18:23:52 <Alistair> ack olivier
18:23:53 <olivier> … we want to set some developer expectation
18:24:47 <Zakim> -??P2
18:24:56 <olivier> Olivier: we want to avoid documenting limits in the spec
18:25:02 <olivier> Doug: even hard lower limits
18:25:04 <Alistair> ack jernoble
18:25:06 <olivier> Olivier: doesn't hurt
18:25:25 <olivier> Al: support Chris' view on this
18:25:35 <Zakim> +??P2
18:25:41 <jernoble> Zakim, ++P2 is me
18:25:41 <Zakim> sorry, jernoble, I do not recognize a party named '++P2'
18:25:48 <jernoble> Zakim, ??P2 is me
18:25:48 <Zakim> +jernoble; got it
18:25:53 <olivier> … if you do a mashup, making things work together would be really difficult unless you share a context anyway
18:26:18 <olivier> Jer: wanted to make a clarification - iOS doesn't have this yet, but when it does it will be based on the same webkit source
18:26:28 <olivier> … hence with the same limits
18:27:00 <olivier> Jussi: satisfied with the solution
18:27:38 <olivier> RESOLUTION: close ISSUE-3 as satisfying as is, make sure we document limits in the number of contexts - not necessarily in the spec but in some developer doc
18:27:50 <Alistair> http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/issues/5
18:28:06 <olivier> Al: we already have a resolution for this
18:28:17 <olivier> … I will take care of closing it
18:28:27 <Alistair> http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/issues/7
18:29:12 <olivier> Olivier: just checking if there was progress on ACTION-42 and ACTION-41
18:29:22 <olivier> Jussi: am having second thoughts about FFTNode
18:29:35 <olivier> … need more discussion, want to work on a use case for it
18:30:12 <olivier> Al: Jussi, is there anything specific that had you reconsider?
18:30:23 <olivier> Jussi: too many edge cases in the use case
18:30:30 <olivier> … not sure it's a good idea any more
18:31:06 <Alistair> http://www.w3.org/2011/audio/track/issues/raised
18:31:30 <olivier> Topic: review open issues
18:31:48 <chris> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/
18:31:53 <olivier> CRogers: some of these will be covered by recent changes to the spec
18:32:03 <olivier> Agenda+ review of recent editor's draft changes
18:32:07 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 4
18:32:07 <Zakim> agendum 4. "review of recent editor's draft changes" taken up [from olivier]
18:32:16 <olivier> CRogers: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/
18:32:53 <olivier> last 3 changesets: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/rev/7011f54ec0db https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/rev/38fc7dcef032 and https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/rev/908b6b7b8702
18:33:24 <olivier> CRogers: start with https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/rev/908b6b7b8702 - https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/raw-rev/908b6b7b8702
18:33:43 <olivier> … a lot of this is updating the spec with things we talked about but wasn't in the spec yet
18:34:04 <olivier> … such as the JavaScriptAudioNode
18:34:08 <olivier> … it's quite a lot of changes
18:34:53 <olivier> Olivier: we've been struggling with handling of number of channels in the JavaScriptAudioNode
18:35:09 <olivier> CRogers: yes, the spec wasn't clear and there was a bug in the WebKit implementation too
18:36:06 <olivier> CRogers: I could post to the list with links
18:36:46 <olivier> Olivier: agree, maybe highlight things that you weren't sure about, and then send mail to the list with details
18:39:20 <olivier> CRogers: the gain was always nominal like this in the implementation, but the spec was saying it could not be negative
18:41:35 <olivier> CRogers: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/rev/38fc7dcef032
18:41:46 <olivier> … addition of Oscillator and WaveTable nodes
18:41:52 <olivier> … made it into a formal source node
18:42:01 <olivier> … might be easiest to check in the current ED
18:42:07 <olivier> … easier to read than the diff
18:42:27 <chris> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/raw-file/tip/webaudio/specification.html#Oscillator
18:42:30 <olivier> Al: these changes are not live in /TR
18:42:41 <olivier> CRogers: only in ED for now, we haven't republished
18:43:18 <olivier> … implementation-wise, should be in safary and chrome nightlies, except for noteon and noteoff calls
18:43:49 <olivier> Al: developers I talked to recently were very excited with idea of oscillator nodes
18:43:59 <olivier> CRogers: yes, and it's reasonably high quality
18:44:03 <olivier> q+
18:44:28 <olivier> CRogers: there is also a SetWaveTable method
18:44:36 <olivier> s/Set/set/
18:45:22 <olivier> Al: question about aliasing
18:45:42 <olivier> CRogers: not sure we want to add anti-aliasing to the spec
18:45:44 <olivier> q-
18:46:26 <olivier> q?
18:47:31 <olivier> CRogers: added commonly used typical wave forms 
18:47:39 <Alistair> Chris: I see why alias/anti-alias option on oscillators could be very useful. I think would could add this as a tru or false value.
18:47:46 <olivier> … the one thing that may be missing is pulse-width modulation
18:47:59 <olivier> Al: that could be really useful
18:48:37 <olivier> CRogers: most recent changeset: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/rev/7011f54ec0db
18:48:50 <olivier> …added a way to connect an audionode to an audioparam
18:48:55 <olivier> … something we'd talked about on the list
18:49:03 <olivier> … especially interesting for FM synthesis
18:49:37 <olivier> s/an audioparam/the audioparam of another node/
18:49:45 <olivier> Jussi: cool
18:50:00 <olivier> CRogers: you can use it for amplitude modulation
18:50:16 <olivier> … can create quite a few different FM architectures out of this
18:50:34 <olivier> CRogers: also a lot of cleanup
18:50:39 <olivier> … will send details to the list
18:50:59 <olivier> … will also go back to the list over the past few months, see if there is any issue
18:51:07 <olivier> … hope to be able to publish a 3rd WD soon
18:57:43 <chris> Xylophone demo: 
18:57:44 <chris> http://www.soundstep.com/blog/2012/03/22/javascript-motion-detection/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=javascript-motion-detection
18:58:32 <olivier> [discussion about future publications, integration with WebRTC, etc]
19:09:15 <olivier> ADJOURNED
19:09:19 <jernoble> bye all!
19:09:22 <Zakim> -??P0
19:09:23 <Zakim> -??P3
19:09:23 <Zakim> -Doug_Schepers
19:09:24 <Zakim> -CRogers
19:09:24 <Zakim> -jernoble
19:09:30 <Zakim> -??P4
19:09:30 <olivier> rrsagent, make minutes
19:09:30 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/04/16-audio-minutes.html olivier
19:09:31 <Zakim> RWC_Audio()2:00PM has ended
19:09:31 <Zakim> Attendees were Doug_Schepers, +1.650.253.aaaa, CRogers, jernoble
19:15:26 <olivier> zakim, bye
19:15:26 <Zakim> Zakim has left #audio
19:15:30 <olivier> rrsagent, bye
19:15:30 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/04/16-audio-actions.rdf :
19:15:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Olivier to change teleconference time (wed 3pm Boston), announce to the group [1]
19:15:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/04/16-audio-irc#T18-12-19