13:56:47 RRSAgent has joined #xproc 13:56:47 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/04/12-xproc-irc 13:56:51 Zakim has joined #xproc 13:56:56 zakim, this will be xproc 13:56:56 ok, Norm; I see XML_PMWG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 4 minutes 13:57:03 rrsagent, set logs world-visible 13:57:03 Meeting: XML Processing Model WG 13:57:03 Date: 12 April 2012 13:57:03 Agenda: http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/04/12-agenda 13:57:03 Meeting: 212 13:57:05 Chair: Norm 13:57:06 Scribe: Norm 13:57:08 ScribeNick: Norm 13:58:18 zakim, passcode? 13:58:18 the conference code is 97762 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Norm 13:58:42 XML_PMWG()10:00AM has now started 13:58:49 +Norm 13:59:49 +??P12 13:59:59 zakim, ??P12 is jfuller 13:59:59 +jfuller; got it 14:00:25 Vojtech has joined #xproc 14:01:51 alexmilowski has joined #xproc 14:02:07 +Alex_Milows 14:02:45 +Murray 14:03:22 +Jeroen 14:03:27 zakim, jeroen is me 14:03:27 +Vojtech; got it 14:03:35 Present: Norm, Jim, Alex, Murray, Vojtech 14:03:50 ht has joined #xproc 14:04:15 zakim, alexmilowski has Veronika 14:04:15 sorry, Norm, I do not recognize a party named 'alexmilowski' 14:04:23 zakim, alex_milowski has Veronika 14:04:23 sorry, Norm, I do not recognize a party named 'alex_milowski' 14:04:28 zakim, alex_milows has Veronika 14:04:29 +Veronika; got it 14:05:45 +??P22 14:06:11 Present: Norm, Jim, Alex, Murray, Vojtech, Henry 14:06:28 Topic: Accept this agenda? 14:06:28 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/04/12-agenda 14:06:33 Accepted. 14:06:41 Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting? 14:06:41 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/04/05-minutes 14:07:13 Accepted. 14:07:18 Topic: Next meeting: telcon, 19 April 2012 14:07:29 No regrets heard 14:07:38 Topic: Review of open actions 14:07:57 http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/docs/xproc-zip_unzip.html 14:08:04 Jim, I've done some work on zip/unzip but it's still ongoing. 14:08:27 Norm: Thanks, Jim. Send a pointer when it's ready for review. 14:08:49 Norm reports that Liam has sent the charter to W3C management. 14:09:09 Norm: Remaining actions are continued. 14:09:22 Topic: Review of the draft requirements document 14:10:34 Murray: I've been working on it. The draft is at the point now where what we need most is to determine if it's going in the right direction. 14:10:58 ...The document as it stands now, the introduction is quite minimal. 14:11:22 ...I've left sections 2-5 pretty much intact. I've added comments wrt the standard names for component inventory. 14:11:33 ...I've drawn a list of all the specs from XProc 1.0 and dropped them into this document. 14:11:47 ...Verified that all the items in 4.5 were covered at least to some extent. 14:11:58 ...Then went on to list a bunch of specs that weren't in the requirements list but have been satisified. 14:12:14 ...And then for the rest of the sections, there's very little commentary beyond a few editorial notes. 14:12:42 ...In Appendix A, I've added references to all the specs that I think might be relevant. 14:13:22 ...The collective input that I got out of the wiki and the mailing list and all the other sources, I've been trying to collate. 14:13:36 ...Appendixes D through F reflect those changes. 14:13:44 ...I added the list of categorized steps that Alex published a while ago. 14:14:05 ...Hopefully it's becoming complete and useful on it's own. 14:14:31 Alex: Going through section 5, there are a number of use cases which I would say we're able to satisfy if we stretch the definition of "satisfy" 14:14:43 ...I can write a pipeline that satisfies the use case with some fabricated extension step. 14:15:09 ...5.10 for example, could be satisified if we had a digital signature step. 14:15:24 ...A bunch of them are like that, they require steps that we don't have in our vocabulary. 14:16:04 Alex: In other words, some we can write out and some require steps that we don't have. And some require interpretation of the use case. 14:17:12 Norm: I think if we can satisfy a use case with a new step, we should collect up those steps. 14:17:29 Jim: So you're looking for a definition of "satisfaction". 14:17:49 ...For example, 5.9, run a custom program. We have an optional p:exec step, does that satisfy it? I think it does. 14:18:29 Alex: I think of grouping these things into three categories: we can write a pipeline that satisfies the spirit of the use case, we could if we had a new atomic step, and we can't without making language changes. 14:19:32 ...So 5.10, it's not clear how signing fits in, but 5.12, just requires any of a number of "store" steps. 14:20:01 Norm: I think starting with a three-bucket cut makes a lot of sense. 14:20:20 Jim: Would that be full, partial, and not? 14:20:25 Alex: I don't think it's partial. 14:21:47 Norm: I think we can say "use cases we can satisfy now, use cases we could satisfy with a new atomic step, and use cases we're not sure about." 14:22:05 Alex: We've given users the ability to define their own steps, so we might, but don't have to, write it for them. 14:22:27 Murray: So if we find a case like that, we add a new step to Appendix E and that informs our process. 14:22:39 ...From my point of view, the use cases and requirements is fodder for the back section and we get there later. 14:22:54 Alex: I like the idea of grouping things into three categories and we can finesse the middle category name. 14:23:50 ...Maybe we can just give them labels without worrying about the subtlety of the descriptions. 14:24:14 Jim: I'm happy to review them as well. 14:24:32 Alex: I personally would like to see us write the simple pipeline that demonstrates the solution for categories 1 and 2 at least. 14:24:59 Norm: I think that's consistent with what we said last week. 14:25:12 Alex: That will also help us decide if it's easy or not. 14:25:56 Norm: I think sending the solutions to the list is a good idea. 14:26:58 Norm: Murray, can you checkin what you've got done by next Tuesday so everyone has a couple of days to review it before the next meeting. 14:27:16 Murray: Certainly. 14:27:38 Alex: And I'll try to get it checked in. 14:28:16 Norm: I think the document is going in a good direction. Murray, are there any other questions you'd like answered before you continue? 14:28:20 Murray: Not that I can think of. 14:28:33 ...Feedback on the use cases would be really great. 14:30:18 Norm: Any further comments? 14:30:26 Topic: Any other business? 14:30:31 None heard. 14:30:47 Adjourned. 14:30:51 rrsagent, draft minues 14:30:51 I'm logging. I don't understand 'draft minues', Norm. Try /msg RRSAgent help 14:30:52 -Alex_Milows 14:30:53 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:30:53 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/04/12-xproc-minutes.html Norm 14:30:54 -Murray 14:30:56 -Vojtech 14:30:57 -jfuller 14:30:57 -Norm 14:30:59 -ht 14:30:59 XML_PMWG()10:00AM has ended 14:30:59 Attendees were Norm, jfuller, Murray, Vojtech, Veronika, ht 15:55:08 Norm has joined #xproc 16:28:30 Zakim has left #xproc 16:36:15 norm, ping? 16:36:30 RRSAgent, bye 16:36:30 I see no action items 16:36:31 scribing for xslt, right now, but ok