15:02:35 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dap
15:02:35 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-irc
15:02:35 <Zakim> +Dsr
15:02:37 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
15:02:39 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be DAP
15:02:39 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see UW_DAP()10:00AM already started
15:02:40 <trackbot> Meeting: Device APIs Working Group Teleconference
15:02:40 <trackbot> Date: 01 February 2012
15:02:48 <Zakim> +??P5
15:02:54 <darobin> Zakim, ??P5 is me
15:02:54 <Zakim> +darobin; got it
15:03:00 <dsr> Present + dsr
15:03:09 <dsr> Present+ dsr
15:03:11 <AnssiK> Present+ Anssi_Kostiainen
15:03:39 <spoussa> Present+ Sakari_Poussa
15:03:49 <Claes> Claes has joined #dap
15:03:50 <darobin> Chair: Robin
15:03:54 <darobin> Regrets: Frederick
15:04:08 <darobin> Zakim, aaaa is spoussa 
15:04:08 <Zakim> +spoussa; got it
15:04:21 <fjh> Present+ Frederick_Hirsch
15:05:33 <Zakim> + +46.1.08.01.aabb
15:05:45 <darobin> Zakim, aabb is Claes 
15:05:45 <Zakim> +Claes; got it
15:06:17 <darobin> ScribeNick: darobin 
15:06:26 <darobin> Topic: Welcome, agenda review, scribe selection, announcements
15:06:41 <Josh_Soref> Scribe: Josh_Soref 
15:06:44 <Josh_Soref> ScribeNick: Josh_Soref 
15:07:07 <Josh_Soref> RRSAgent, draft minutes
15:07:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-minutes.html Josh_Soref
15:07:25 <Josh_Soref> Topic: Minutes Approval
15:07:31 <darobin> proposed RESOLUTION: Minutes from 18 January 2012 are approved.
15:07:37 <Josh_Soref> RESOLUTION: Minutes from 18 January 2012 are approved.
15:07:45 <Josh_Soref> Topic: March F2F Meeting
15:07:48 <Josh_Soref> darobin: questions?
15:07:53 <Josh_Soref> ... please make sure you've registered yourself
15:08:11 <fjh> Note that going back and forth to hong kong is not recommended
15:08:36 <Josh_Soref> darobin: I don't think we have a WBS for the actual meeting
15:08:40 <Josh_Soref> ... we should probably set one up
15:08:46 <Clarke> Clarke has joined #dap
15:08:53 <Josh_Soref> darobin: dsr, is that something you could take care of?
15:08:56 <fjh> At this point the meeting dates are fixed
15:08:58 <Josh_Soref> dsr: yes, I can set that up
15:09:04 <Josh_Soref> ... i should also ask the hosts for their list
15:09:09 <darobin> ACTION: dsr to set up registration WBS for March f2f
15:09:09 <trackbot> Created ACTION-500 - Set up registration WBS for March f2f [on Dave Raggett - due 2012-02-08].
15:09:10 <Josh_Soref> ... i'll take an action item
15:09:21 <fjh> might want to ask who plans to dial in voice and/or video
15:09:37 <Zakim> +??P18
15:09:46 <fjh> announce WBS to task forces as well...
15:09:50 <Clarke> ??P18 is me
15:09:59 <Clarke> zakim, ??P18 is me
15:09:59 <Zakim> +Clarke; got it
15:10:07 <Josh_Soref> [ fjh 's note is to dsr for the WBS ]
15:10:39 <Josh_Soref> darobin: as fjh notes, we also need to send it to the Intents TF people
15:10:42 <Josh_Soref> ... so they can register
15:10:54 <Josh_Soref> Topic: Vibration
15:10:56 <darobin> proposed RESOLUTION: Move Vibration to LC
15:10:59 <AnssiK> q+
15:11:04 <darobin> ack AnssiK 
15:11:14 <Josh_Soref> AnssiK: we had one comment
15:11:21 <AnssiK> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Feb/0001.html
15:11:22 <Josh_Soref> ... i'm not sure if it was before/after the CfC
15:11:35 <Josh_Soref> ... I replied to jlebar
15:11:43 <Josh_Soref> ... he had suggested dropping `optional`
15:11:52 <Josh_Soref> ... and removing the obsolete mozilla related items
15:12:02 <Zakim> -darobin
15:12:09 <Josh_Soref> i/proposed/darobin: We had a few comments, but I don't think they invalidated the CfC/
15:12:23 <Josh_Soref> RRSAgent, draft minutes
15:12:23 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-minutes.html Josh_Soref
15:12:33 <Zakim> +??P0
15:12:43 <darobin> Zakim, ?P0 is me
15:12:43 <Zakim> sorry, darobin, I do not recognize a party named '?P0'
15:12:47 <darobin> Zakim, ??P0 is me
15:12:47 <Zakim> +darobin; got it
15:12:48 <glenn> glenn has joined #dap
15:13:07 <Josh_Soref> darobin: Any objections to moving Vibration to LC?
15:13:16 <Josh_Soref> [ None ]
15:13:24 <darobin> ACTION: Robin to publish Vibration LC
15:13:24 <trackbot> Created ACTION-501 - Publish Vibration LC [on Robin Berjon - due 2012-02-08].
15:13:25 <Josh_Soref> RESOLUTION: Move Vibration to LC
15:13:51 <Josh_Soref> darobin: Anything else on Vibration?
15:13:53 <Josh_Soref> [ None ]
15:13:55 <Josh_Soref> Topic: Closing the Device Status TF
15:14:01 <Josh_Soref> darobin: as you know, Mozilla has joined the Group
15:14:04 <Josh_Soref> ... welcome Mozilla
15:14:10 <Josh_Soref> ... since they were the reason we had a TF
15:14:18 <Josh_Soref> ... there doesn't seem to be a reason to retain the TF
15:14:20 <fjh> welcome to Mozilla, +1 to closing the Device Status TF
15:14:23 <darobin> proposed RESOLUTION: Merge TF back into group
15:14:28 <Josh_Soref> Zakim, who is making noise?
15:14:29 <AnssiK> +1
15:14:38 <Josh_Soref> ... it seems like a good idea to fold it back into the group
15:14:42 <Zakim> Josh_Soref, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds
15:14:53 <Josh_Soref> darobin: I don't know how the actual process of closing the TF is
15:14:55 <Josh_Soref> ... dsr ?
15:15:03 <Josh_Soref> darobin: maybe we just let it die and figure it out later?
15:15:16 <darobin> ACTION: Robin to figure out if anything is needed to close the DSTF; announce to the TF itself
15:15:16 <trackbot> Created ACTION-502 - Figure out if anything is needed to close the DSTF; announce to the TF itself [on Robin Berjon - due 2012-02-08].
15:15:23 <AnssiK> perhaps send a tombstone message to the TF ML to make sure people looking at the archives understand what happened?
15:15:40 <Josh_Soref> i/actual/darobin: the group + tf lists aren't high traffic, so there's no big need to keep them distinct/
15:15:49 <Josh_Soref> darobin: Anything else on the TF?
15:15:50 <Zakim> -darobin
15:15:51 <fjh> +1, announce work is now being done in main WG on public mailing list of DAP WG
15:16:05 <Josh_Soref> Josh_Soref: welcome Mozilla to WG :)
15:16:09 <Zakim> +GlennAdams
15:16:18 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:16:32 <Josh_Soref> Zakim, [IPcaller] is darobin 
15:16:32 <Zakim> +darobin; got it
15:16:47 <Josh_Soref> Topic: Network Information API
15:17:04 <Josh_Soref> darobin: this Agenda item was initially empty
15:17:11 <Josh_Soref> ... but mounir submitted a draft yesterday evening
15:17:14 <darobin> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/dap/raw-file/84a2fb7b753b/network-api/index.html
15:17:21 <darobin> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/dap/raw-file/tip/network-api/index.html
15:17:45 <Josh_Soref> darobin: I sent feedback
15:17:53 <Josh_Soref> ... i encourage everyone else who is interested to send feedback
15:18:00 <Josh_Soref> Josh_Soref: I need to read it and send feedback
15:18:07 <Josh_Soref> darobin: I'd like to publish a heartbeat
15:18:11 <Josh_Soref> ... perhaps next week
15:18:20 <AnssiK> +1 on publishing a heartbeat
15:18:22 <Josh_Soref> ... since mounir isn't on the call, i'll prod him to see what he thinks
15:18:33 <Josh_Soref> ... if you have any feedback, it'd be good to provide it sooner rather than later
15:18:42 <AnssiK> are we able to add a disclaimer to the netinfo on /TR that it's being obsoleted?
15:18:46 <Josh_Soref> darobin: Anything else?
15:19:11 <Josh_Soref> darobin: we probably don't need to as this one will replace this one
15:19:32 <Josh_Soref> ... as this one should have the same short name
15:19:43 <Josh_Soref> ... the previous one was in CVS, the new one is in Hg
15:19:47 <Josh_Soref> ... I think we're pretty safe
15:19:50 <fjh> +1 on publishing heartbeat, with clear sotd section about change
15:19:50 <AnssiK> that'd be great, I thing we should re-ignite the discussion on shelving docs
15:19:55 <Josh_Soref> Topic: Testing
15:20:07 <Josh_Soref> darobin: I started pushing tests for Vibration
15:20:13 <Josh_Soref> ... not necessarily very good
15:20:17 <Josh_Soref> ... and certainly not complete
15:20:24 <Josh_Soref> ... but the idea was to work on the template
15:20:33 <darobin> http://w3c-test.org/framework/docs/maintainer/
15:20:34 <Josh_Soref> ... i wanted to draw your attn to the way in which they're organized
15:20:41 <darobin> http://w3c-test.org/framework/
15:20:50 <Josh_Soref> W3C is working on a framework
15:20:59 <Josh_Soref> s/W3C/darobin: W3C/
15:21:07 <Josh_Soref> darobin: people can easily see the results of the tests
15:21:14 <Josh_Soref> ... and people can enter data directly
15:21:20 <Josh_Soref> RRSAgent, draft minutes
15:21:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-minutes.html Josh_Soref
15:21:41 <Josh_Soref> ... right now we don't have a way to manage submissions
15:21:52 <Josh_Soref> ... we have approved/, submissions/ the same way that webapps does
15:22:03 <Josh_Soref> ... there's a tool being developed to organize (manage) the process
15:22:12 <Josh_Soref> ... if you're interested in the testing side, i recommend you look at this
15:22:15 <Josh_Soref> ... feedback welcome
15:22:20 <darobin> public-test-infra <public-test-infra@w3.org>
15:22:24 <Josh_Soref> ... there's a thread on the testing infra list
15:22:27 <darobin> http://www.w3.org/mid/CAA2gsfoAmYWLC60p7DOyo1D-NB0SUQLcjpxff-7K1zK4eHXe7Q@mail.gmail.com
15:22:39 <Josh_Soref> ... essentially it documents the practices of developing tests
15:22:43 <Josh_Soref> ... in a common manner
15:22:49 <Josh_Soref> ... so all groups do things the same way
15:22:57 <bryan> q+
15:23:01 <Josh_Soref> ... and so that tests integrate with the tooling
15:23:08 <Josh_Soref> ... i encourage everyone to pay attn to this
15:23:09 <darobin> ack bryan 
15:23:13 <Josh_Soref> ... bryan is working on it
15:23:18 <Josh_Soref> bryan: the email I sent
15:23:35 <Josh_Soref> ... I agreed to bring together documentation practices
15:23:54 <Josh_Soref> ... marcos had done this thing of integrating test assertions into spec markup
15:23:56 <mounir> Josh_Soref: i'm on IRC, fwiw
15:24:04 <mounir> I can join the call if needed
15:24:07 <Josh_Soref> ... looking back at what the QA WG did
15:24:31 <Josh_Soref> ... i'm trying to look back
15:24:37 <Josh_Soref> bryan: for the DAP specs
15:24:51 <Josh_Soref> ... we want to look and see what works for people
15:24:53 <Josh_Soref> ... etc.
15:25:04 <Josh_Soref> darobin: for DAP specs, we haven't marked up testable asserts/etc
15:25:08 <Josh_Soref> ... as you document these things
15:25:21 <Josh_Soref> ... it'd probably be helpful if you suggested the approach that makes the most sense
15:25:27 <Josh_Soref> ... the most frequently used/...
15:26:28 <Josh_Soref> Topic: AoB
15:26:32 <Josh_Soref> s/AoB/AOB/
15:26:56 <Josh_Soref> s/Josh_Soref: i'm on IRC, fwiw/
15:27:06 <Josh_Soref> s/I can join the call if needed/
15:27:11 <AnssiK> q+ to ask about shelving docs
15:27:17 <darobin> ack AnssiK 
15:27:17 <Zakim> AnssiK, you wanted to ask about shelving docs
15:27:17 <Josh_Soref> darobin: I'll talk to mounir on irc afterwards
15:27:36 <Josh_Soref> AnssiK: a couple of months ago we almost reached a consensus about shelving
15:27:41 <Josh_Soref> ... last i checked they didn't have a disclaimer
15:27:45 <Josh_Soref> ... did this get stuck?
15:27:51 <Josh_Soref> darobin: you're probably right
15:28:04 <Josh_Soref> ... the problem with it is that instead of doing my action items
15:28:09 <Josh_Soref> ... i've been doing yours (vibration)
15:28:14 <Josh_Soref> AnssiK: is it ok if i do the shelving?
15:28:17 <Josh_Soref> darobin: that'd be wonderful
15:28:37 <Josh_Soref> Josh_Soref: i was probably supposed to give suggestions on the template text
15:28:53 <Josh_Soref> bryan: look at the webapps-WebSQL
15:29:02 <Josh_Soref> darobin: don't steal it completely
15:29:09 <Josh_Soref> ... we wanted to flag documents as
15:29:20 <Josh_Soref> ... things that when we do them would probably have a different design
15:29:31 <Josh_Soref> ... it isn't that we're giving up on the area, just the design
15:29:48 <Josh_Soref> ... just do something
15:29:57 <Josh_Soref> ... people can give comments after you do it
15:30:16 <Josh_Soref> AnssiK: it's good to clear up things under w3.org to indicate they aren't "official do this"
15:30:25 <Josh_Soref> darobin: AO[O]B?
15:30:32 <Josh_Soref> [ None ]
15:30:36 <Josh_Soref> [ Adjourn ]
15:30:41 <Zakim> -AnssiK
15:30:42 <Zakim> -Clarke
15:30:42 <Zakim> -bryan
15:30:44 <Zakim> -darobin
15:30:46 <Josh_Soref> trackbot, end meeting
15:30:46 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
15:30:46 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Josh_Soref, +1.503.333.aaaa, bryan, AnssiK, Dsr, darobin, spoussa, +46.1.08.01.aabb, Claes, Clarke, GlennAdams
15:30:49 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:30:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-minutes.html trackbot
15:30:49 <Zakim> -Claes
15:30:50 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
15:30:50 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-actions.rdf :
15:30:50 <RRSAgent> ACTION: dsr to set up registration WBS for March f2f [1]
15:30:50 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-irc#T15-09-09
15:30:50 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Robin to publish Vibration LC [2]
15:30:50 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-irc#T15-13-24
15:30:50 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Robin to figure out if anything is needed to close the DSTF; announce to the TF itself [3]
15:30:50 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/01-dap-irc#T15-15-16
15:30:50 <Zakim> -spoussa
15:30:52 <fjh> fjh has left #dap
15:30:53 <Zakim> -GlennAdams
15:31:02 <Zakim> -Josh_Soref
15:31:04 <Zakim> -Dsr
15:31:05 <Zakim> UW_DAP()10:00AM has ended
15:31:06 <Zakim> Attendees were Josh_Soref, +1.503.333.aaaa, bryan, AnssiK, Dsr, darobin, spoussa, +46.1.08.01.aabb, Claes, Clarke, GlennAdams
15:31:08 <bryan> bryan has left #dap