21:03:23 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wai-wcag
21:03:23 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/11/17-wai-wcag-irc
21:03:25 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
21:03:25 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #wai-wcag
21:03:27 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAI_WCAG
21:03:27 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see WAI_WCAG()4:00PM already started
21:03:28 <trackbot> Meeting: Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
21:03:28 <trackbot> Date: 17 November 2011
21:03:35 <Zakim> +Michael_Cooper
21:03:47 <shadi> zakim, aaaa is Detlev
21:03:47 <Zakim> +Detlev; got it
21:03:56 <shadi> zakim, ipcaller is Kerstin
21:03:56 <Zakim> +Kerstin; got it
21:04:02 <shadi> zakim, mute me
21:04:02 <Zakim> Shadi should now be muted
21:04:14 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
21:04:14 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
21:04:17 <MichaelC> zakim, Ipcaller is Kerstin_Probiesch
21:04:17 <Zakim> sorry, MichaelC, I do not recognize a party named 'Ipcaller'
21:04:43 <David> Scribe: David
21:04:51 <MichaelC> MichaelC has joined #wai-wcag
21:05:13 <marcjohlic> marcjohlic has joined #wai-wcag
21:05:19 <Zakim> +Marc_Johlic
21:05:49 <MichaelC> scribe: David
21:06:14 <shadi> ack me
21:06:21 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/conformance/ED-methodology-20111115.html
21:06:33 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
21:06:33 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
21:07:12 <MichaelC> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2011OctDec/0045.html
21:11:07 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
21:11:23 <adam> this is adam
21:11:40 <MichaelC> zakim, ipcaller is Adam_Solomon
21:11:40 <Zakim> +Adam_Solomon; got it
21:12:16 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/20111117misc/results
21:12:20 <Detlev> yes
21:13:07 <Zakim> +[Oracle]
21:13:37 <MichaelC> zakim, Oracle is James_Nurthen
21:13:37 <Zakim> +James_Nurthen; got it
21:15:13 <David> topic: discussion of the Evaluation Methodology task force preliminary draft... the group felt that it needed more more work before releasing for public comment. 
21:17:20 <MichaelC> q+
21:17:31 <MichaelC> q+ to talk about conformance in a Note-track document
21:17:52 <MichaelC> q+ to talk about difficulty of evaluating success and failures wrt techniques
21:18:10 <MichaelC> ack br
21:18:58 <Detlev> Detlev has joined #wai-wcag
21:19:35 <Detlev> had a computer crash - can you link my line back to Zakim?
21:20:01 <MichaelC> ack me
21:20:01 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to talk about conformance in a Note-track document and to talk about difficulty of evaluating success and failures wrt techniques
21:20:59 <Detlev> zakim, unmute me
21:20:59 <Zakim> Detlev should no longer be muted
21:21:19 <Detlev> still seems to recognise me...
21:21:21 <Detlev> no
21:21:25 <shadi> zakim, mute me
21:21:25 <Zakim> Shadi should now be muted
21:23:02 <David> Topic: The role of failure techniques in the WCAG Techniques document
21:23:31 <Detlev> q+
21:26:31 <Detlev> ack me
21:26:42 <Detlev> q+
21:27:09 <Detlev> zakim, unmute me
21:27:09 <Zakim> Detlev was not muted, Detlev
21:28:19 <MichaelC> q+ to talk about technology-specific faiures
21:28:34 <MichaelC> ack d
21:29:20 <Loretta> q+
21:31:18 <MichaelC> ack me
21:31:18 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to talk about technology-specific faiures
21:31:48 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
21:31:48 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
21:32:46 <Detlev> ok
21:32:53 <Loretta> ack me
21:33:26 <Detlev> q+
21:33:54 <Detlev> ack me
21:34:47 <adam> q+
21:35:04 <kerstin> q+
21:35:08 <Loretta> q+
21:35:30 <MichaelC> q+ to say we documented failures that cause page to fail even when sufficient techniques used; not applying any sufficient technique is also a failure but we don't document that as such
21:35:42 <Loretta> http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/G178
21:36:14 <Loretta> ack adam
21:36:22 <adam> ack me
21:37:07 <kerstin> zakim, unmute me
21:37:07 <Zakim> Kerstin should no longer be muted
21:37:11 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
21:37:11 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
21:37:11 <Loretta> ack ke
21:37:33 <jamesn> jamesn has joined #wai-wcag
21:38:12 <David> q+ to ask doesn't F69 applies to 1.4.8-bullet 5 (shouldn't it be listed as such?) so wouldn't be dropped from our roster
21:39:10 <kerstin> http://www.flickr.com/photos/kprobiesch/6354964973/in/photostream
21:39:30 <kerstin> http://www.flickr.com/photos/kprobiesch/6354964879/in/photostream
21:40:10 <Loretta> ack me
21:40:10 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
21:40:11 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
21:42:03 <Detlev> q+
21:42:18 <MichaelC> ack me
21:42:18 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to say we documented failures that cause page to fail even when sufficient techniques used; not applying any sufficient technique is also a failure but we
21:42:21 <Zakim> ... don't document that as such
21:42:30 <Loretta> ack dav
21:42:30 <Zakim> David, you wanted to ask doesn't F69 applies to 1.4.8-bullet 5 (shouldn't it be listed as such?) so wouldn't be dropped from our roster
21:44:05 <adam> q+
21:44:25 <MichaelC> ack d
21:44:31 <Detlev> ack me
21:47:55 <jamesn> q+ to say that zoom CAN meet 1.4.8 depending on the page itself
21:48:55 <Zakim> -Bruce_Bailey
21:49:03 <kerstin> q+
21:49:32 <Loretta> ack adam
21:49:47 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
21:49:47 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
21:50:18 <Loretta> ack james
21:50:18 <Zakim> jamesn, you wanted to say that zoom CAN meet 1.4.8 depending on the page itself
21:51:13 <Detlev> good point
21:51:15 <kerstin> zakim, unmute me
21:51:15 <Zakim> Kerstin should no longer be muted
21:51:25 <Loretta> ack ke
21:52:34 <shadi> q+
21:52:39 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
21:52:39 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
21:52:42 <shadi> q-
21:52:58 <Detlev> ok
21:53:02 <kerstin> no specific questions
21:55:30 <David> Topic: Issue LC-2513: Conflict between alternative options 1-4 and F69
21:55:31 <Detlev> q+
21:55:39 <Detlev> ack me
21:56:53 <jongund> jongund has joined #wai-wcag
21:58:36 <Detlev> q+
21:59:03 <Zakim> +??P6
21:59:15 <jongund> zakim, ??P6 is jongund
21:59:15 <Zakim> +jongund; got it
21:59:37 <Detlev> ack me
21:59:39 <Loretta> q+
22:00:55 <Detlev> q+
22:01:10 <Loretta> ack me
22:01:13 <jamesn> q+
22:01:26 <Loretta> q+
22:01:35 <Loretta> ack det
22:01:58 <Loretta> ack ja
22:02:22 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
22:02:22 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
22:02:35 <Loretta> ack me
22:02:36 <Detlev> tricky!
22:04:33 <Zakim> +Bruce_Bailey
22:05:22 <kerstin> sorry, problems at skype I just understand every second or third word
22:05:30 <Detlev> q+
22:05:52 <Detlev> ack me
22:05:53 <kerstin> q+
22:06:20 <kerstin> zakim, unmute me
22:06:20 <Zakim> Kerstin should no longer be muted
22:06:52 <jamesn> q+
22:07:08 <jamesn> ack me
22:07:48 <Loretta> ack ke
22:08:01 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
22:08:01 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
22:08:37 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
22:08:37 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
22:09:43 <Zakim> -Adam_Solomon
22:10:52 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
22:10:58 <adam> adam has joined #wai-wcag
22:11:19 <Detlev> q+
22:11:25 <MichaelC> zakim, ipcaller is Adam_Solomon
22:11:25 <Zakim> +Adam_Solomon; got it
22:11:58 <shadi> ack me
22:11:59 <Detlev> ack me
22:13:09 <Loretta> q+
22:13:36 <kerstin> q+
22:14:44 <Loretta> ack me
22:15:15 <Zakim> -Adam_Solomon
22:15:54 <kerstin> zakim, unmute me
22:15:55 <Zakim> Kerstin should no longer be muted
22:16:21 <Loretta> ack ker
22:16:40 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
22:16:40 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
22:17:26 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
22:17:26 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
22:19:01 <Detlev> q+
22:20:11 <Detlev> ack me
22:20:20 <shadi> zakim, mute me
22:20:20 <Zakim> Shadi should now be muted
22:21:00 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
22:21:00 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
22:22:07 <Detlev> q+
22:22:27 <Detlev> ack me
22:25:25 <Detlev> zakim, mute me
22:25:25 <Zakim> Detlev should now be muted
22:25:44 <Zakim> -James_Nurthen
22:25:48 <kerstin> q+
22:25:57 <kerstin> zakim, umute me
22:25:57 <Zakim> I don't understand 'umute me', kerstin
22:26:55 <kerstin> zakim, ack me
22:26:55 <Zakim> unmuting Kerstin
22:26:56 <Zakim> I see no one on the speaker queue
22:27:05 <Loretta> Note: The Working Group has discovered many misunderstandings about how to test this failure. We are planning to review this failure in a future update. Until then, if you test this failure, be sure to test against at least all of the sufficient techniques listed for this success criterion and ensure that hte content fails for all of them.
22:27:22 <Detlev> fine.
22:27:57 <kerstin> q+
22:29:19 <Detlev> q+
22:29:25 <Loretta> ack ker
22:29:46 <Detlev> ack me
22:33:11 <Detlev> q+
22:33:59 <Detlev> ack me
22:34:14 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
22:34:14 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
22:35:23 <kerstin> q+
22:35:34 <kerstin> zakim, unmute me
22:35:34 <Zakim> Kerstin should no longer be muted
22:35:57 <Zakim> -jongund
22:37:14 <Detlev> no worries happy to discuss this
22:37:29 <kerstin> zakim, mute me
22:37:29 <Zakim> Kerstin should now be muted
22:38:02 <Detlev> agree
22:38:54 <Detlev> fine
22:39:10 <Detlev> ack me
22:39:53 <kerstin> don't why I am still on the queue
22:40:01 <shadi> q- k
22:40:17 <Zakim> -David_MacDonald
22:40:18 <Zakim> -Michael_Cooper
22:40:21 <Zakim> -Shadi
22:40:22 <Zakim> -Loretta_Guarino_Reid
22:40:25 <Zakim> -Bruce_Bailey
22:40:26 <Zakim> -Detlev
22:40:26 <Zakim> -Marc_Johlic
22:40:35 <kerstin> -kerstin
22:42:13 <shadi> good night y'all
22:42:18 <Loretta> That's what I get for poiking buttons that I don't unerstand!
22:43:29 <Zakim> -Kerstin
22:43:31 <Zakim> WAI_WCAG()4:00PM has ended
22:43:33 <Zakim> Attendees were +49.403.17.aaaa, David_MacDonald, Shadi, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Bruce_Bailey, Michael_Cooper, Detlev, Kerstin, Marc_Johlic, Adam_Solomon, James_Nurthen, jongund
22:48:15 <MichaelC> chair: Loretta_Guarino_Reid
22:48:22 <MichaelC> trackbot, end meeting
22:48:22 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
22:48:22 <Zakim> sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
22:48:23 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
22:48:23 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/11/17-wai-wcag-minutes.html trackbot
22:48:24 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
22:48:24 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
22:55:19 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wai-wcag
22:55:19 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/11/17-wai-wcag-irc
22:55:23 <MichaelC> rrsagent, make minutes
22:55:23 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/11/17-wai-wcag-minutes.html MichaelC
22:56:04 <MichaelC> rrsagent, bye
22:56:09 <MichaelC> rrsagent, make log world
22:56:11 <MichaelC> rrsagent, bye
22:56:11 <RRSAgent> I see no action items