13:00:33 RRSAgent has joined #egov 13:00:33 logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-irc 13:00:43 zakim, this is egov 13:00:43 ok, HadleyBeeman; that matches T&S_EGOV()9:00AM 13:00:51 Morning all :) 13:00:53 trackbot, start telcon 13:00:55 RRSAgent, make logs public 13:00:57 Zakim, this will be EGOV 13:00:57 ok, trackbot, I see T&S_EGOV()9:00AM already started 13:00:58 Meeting: eGovernment Interest Group Teleconference 13:00:58 Date: 18 October 2011 13:01:12 +??P5 13:01:29 -??P0 13:01:50 +??P6 13:02:01 + +1.818.434.aabb 13:02:03 zakim, p6 is me 13:02:03 sorry, kliehm, I do not recognize a party named 'p6' 13:02:19 zakim, ??P6 is me 13:02:19 +kliehm; got it 13:02:20 +??P8 13:02:26 Zakim, ??p8 is olyerickson 13:02:26 +olyerickson; got it 13:02:28 zakim, mute me 13:02:29 kliehm should now be muted 13:02:36 +[IPcaller] 13:02:57 Jeanne has joined #egov 13:03:03 PhilA2 has joined #egov 13:03:17 zakim, who is here? 13:03:17 On the phone I see +1.843.682.aaaa, ??P5, kliehm (muted), +1.818.434.aabb, olyerickson, [IPcaller] 13:03:20 On IRC I see PhilA2, Jeanne, RRSAgent, bhyland, Owen, Zakim, kliehm, HadleyBeeman, somnath, olyerickson, tlr, edsu, trackbot, sandro 13:03:29 zakim, [IPcaller] is me 13:03:29 +PhilA2; got it 13:04:57 + +1.440.389.aacc 13:05:03 zakim, aacc is me 13:05:04 +HadleyBeeman; got it 13:05:41 zakim, aaaa is Owen 13:05:41 +Owen; got it 13:06:06 aabb is me 13:06:06 +[IPcaller] 13:06:10 zakim, aabb is Jeanne 13:06:10 +Jeanne; got it 13:06:16 Zakim, IPcaller is edsu 13:06:16 +edsu; got it 13:06:54 zakim, who is here? 13:06:54 On the phone I see Owen, ??P5, kliehm (muted), Jeanne, olyerickson, PhilA2, HadleyBeeman, edsu 13:06:56 On IRC I see PhilA2, Jeanne, RRSAgent, bhyland, Owen, Zakim, kliehm, HadleyBeeman, somnath, olyerickson, tlr, edsu, trackbot, sandro 13:07:27 zakim, unmute me 13:07:27 kliehm should no longer be muted 13:07:54 Looking forward to seeing lots of you in Warsaw tomorrow 13:07:59 @warsaw travellers: safe travels 13:08:23 +1 to TPAC 13:08:41 nope 13:08:54 chair: Jeanne 13:08:54 okay I see it now (was looking at wrong list) 13:09:08 Topic: TPAC 13:09:36 JH: We're trying to build momentum towards the meeting 13:09:40 W3C TPAC eov proposed agenda: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/F2F4 13:09:54 ... Josema was telling me about the World Bank event 13:10:00 MacTed has joined #egov 13:10:16 ... and now we have the Warsaw meeting 13:10:27 bhyland has joined #egov 13:10:36 ... I've been working on the agenda with Joseam, Jonathan etc 13:10:54 ... some frustration that enthusiasm dies down in between the big events 13:11:03 ... so we want to keep the balls in the air 13:11:12 ... and coordinated 13:11:24 ... so TPAC will build on what we're doing in Warsaw 13:12:16 kliehm: Sounds good 13:12:19 HadleyBeeman: +1 13:12:35 olyerickson: Communicationwill be essential for it to work as Jeanne has described 13:12:44 JH: So we're thinking of the IG being the repository of resources that can be used 13:12:55 ... definitions, agreements, licences etc. 13:13:18 ... W3C is a long term entity, more so than some of our own websites 13:13:21 q+ 13:13:26 Sounds to me like what is needed is a performance plan, with roles assigned to individuals and deadlines for outputs 13:13:52 JH: Communication is tricky. We might see a lot of cross posting on the lists. 13:14:14 ... I've been trying to take more of the conversation to Twitter, but that is challenging in its won way of course 13:14:23 s/won/own/ 13:15:05 +OpenLink_Software 13:15:05 PhilA: Is there not a directory being created by GLD WG? 13:15:08 Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me 13:15:08 +MacTed; got it 13:15:08 Zakim, mute me 13:15:09 MacTed should now be muted 13:15:14 q+ 13:15:16 JH: That's one of the things we're talking about in Warsaw 13:15:21 ack PhilA2 13:15:29 q? 13:15:41 9- 13:15:43 q- 13:16:08 JH: Explains the differences 13:16:13 +1 to deeper understanding of best practices w.r.t. licensing, policies, etc 13:16:27 + +1.413.652.aadd 13:16:42 +1 to Hadley's comments --- GLD is very focused 13:16:43 Need to be able to look at data that is also not 5-star data 13:16:43 HadleyBeeman: I agree with what JH jas said, but add that the GLD WG is focussed on 5 start LD, so there's plenty of scope for sharing info about data that is not 5* 13:16:58 HadleyBeeman: All for not duplicating what GLD is doing but there is more to do 13:17:01 JH: +1 13:17:21 ack me 13:17:23 ... on data.gov we link to sites whatever format it's in 13:17:44 ... what's important is that it's official data 13:18:05 bdhandspicker has joined #egov 13:18:19 ... each catalogue that we see has slightly different criteria we notice 13:18:26 .. the first star is the hardest to get 13:18:38 The most important star is the first star 13:18:53 ... if we can get people to start changing their behaviour by publishing PDF I'm happy 13:19:03 JH: The agenda is still tentative 13:19:26 ... again, f2f agenda is at http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/F2F4 13:19:39 + +1.202.684.aaee 13:20:16 zakim, who's on the phone? 13:20:16 On the phone I see Owen, ??P5, kliehm, Jeanne, olyerickson, PhilA2, HadleyBeeman, edsu, MacTed (muted), +1.413.652.aadd, +1.202.684.aaee 13:20:21 zakim, aaee is Daniel 13:20:21 +Daniel; got it 13:20:48 zakim, mute me 13:20:48 kliehm should now be muted 13:21:00 zakim, who is here? 13:21:00 On the phone I see Owen, ??P5, kliehm (muted), Jeanne, olyerickson, PhilA2, HadleyBeeman, edsu, MacTed (muted), +1.413.652.aadd, Daniel 13:21:02 On IRC I see bdhandspicker, bhyland, MacTed, PhilA2, Jeanne, RRSAgent, Owen, Zakim, kliehm, HadleyBeeman, somnath, olyerickson, tlr, edsu, trackbot, sandro 13:21:27 aadd is bdhandspicker 13:21:32 Zakim, aadd is bdhandspicker 13:21:32 +bdhandspicker; got it 13:21:33 JH: Idea is to do a quick summary of the recent events 13:21:34 :-) 13:21:36 DanielBennett has joined #egov 13:21:45 zakim, aadd is bdhandspicker 13:21:45 sorry, bdhandspicker, I do not recognize a party named 'aadd' 13:21:56 JH: HadleyBeeman has offered to chair the next session :-) 13:22:41 NOTE: If you're participating at TPAC, please add your name: http://www.w3.org/egov/wiki/F2F4 13:23:13 JH: Any ideas for other speakers/organisations? 13:23:21 Any suggestions for speakers or activities to be at the TPAC? 13:23:30 q+ 13:24:06 HadleyBeeman: Going back to our last conversation... it might be useful to create a wiki space for materials that we might find useful in our own work 13:24:19 JH: Sandro started a wiki and we can build off that page 13:24:53 JH: Idea is that anyone can post 13:25:06 Not sure what area of the Wiki we';re talking about... 13:25:26 action: PhilA2 to make sure he know how to grant write access to the wiki before TPAC 13:25:26 Sorry, couldn't find user - PhilA2 13:25:35 olyerickson: I was deliberately vague… But I think we need some way to take home stories from each other, evidence or tools for our own work. 13:25:35 action: Phil Archer to make sure he know how to grant write access to the wiki before TPAC 13:25:36 Created ACTION-120 - Archer to make sure he know how to grant write access to the wiki before TPAC [on Phil Archer - due 2011-10-25]. 13:26:08 JH: Needs to be a permanent place 13:26:14 ack edsu 13:26:18 Where is this "on-going permanent place?" 13:26:29 edsu: Do you see the issues around Cloud Computing fitting in here? 13:27:13 edsu: We're increasingly interested in using these services because it allows us to bring services on line without investing in hardware 13:27:29 JH: Personally I do think it's part of the eGov space 13:27:46 ... but we don't have an agenda item of infrastructure issues. Do you think we should? 13:27:49 -HadleyBeeman 13:27:54 q+ 13:28:11 Cloud computing has huge policy implications. 13:28:12 -??P5 13:28:17 +HadleyBeeman 13:28:30 edsu: I think so. You could argue that it's independent of the Web and perhaps therefore W3C but doing some of this online means putting it on the Web 13:28:57 Security, commercial control of citizen/govt resources 13:29:19 JH: Departments could be victims of their own success if they're not able to manage the traffic etc. 13:29:36 ack olyerickson 13:29:37 John +1 13:30:09 olyerickson: +1 to edsu as that class of topics is outside the GLD WG group scope but it's an issue for eGov 13:30:09 q+ 13:30:12 q+ 13:30:13 PhilA2: would love to, but having trouble getting travel funding at the moment 13:30:33 ... where do we talk about evangelism? 13:30:48 JH: Good stuff, yes,. Come of that is on E&O which is in our charter 13:31:17 ... there are pieces that don't fall into a tech area but that are of interest to the same participants 13:31:30 ... so it's about how to maintain an eGov activity 13:31:46 ?? I'd be happy to lead that section of the f2f 13:32:19 s/??/John/ 13:33:02 JH: SO Hadley and John have stepped forward to lead a session - feel free to put your hand up please 13:33:47 DanielBennett: On the cloud computing, an issue I think is that we may need some sort of policy on what we produce so that we don't use too much jargon (like Cloud Computing) 13:34:15 ... need to make sure that when they look at things like accessibility or provenance, people can do so tech-neutrally 13:34:29 JH: People do tend to jump on a band wagon 13:34:36 Will add area to TPAC eGov agenda on Infrastructure to include policy issues 13:35:00 DanielBennett: One of the great things that was done when the terms of service were re-written for a government audience cf. a tech one 13:35:21 JH: Are you coming to TPAC? 13:35:26 -HadleyBeeman 13:35:33 DanielBennett: I can't show up but I can be helpful on the phone/writing stuff 13:35:43 +HadleyBeeman 13:35:45 edsu: I can't either but I'd be happy to work on something 13:35:59 JH: And we will have an opp for virtual participation 13:36:13 .. so maybe you can dial in for at least a portion of the meeting 13:36:16 I'd be willing to stan in front of the room and facilitate the discussion on "Policy" if needed 13:36:18 ack me 13:36:23 q? 13:36:34 ack DanielBennett 13:36:40 q- 13:37:01 + +1.202.270.aaff 13:37:21 WHo just joined the call? 13:37:36 PhilA2: i do i have a new action item to look at the whole issue of big data, which would include big data sets and cloud computing, it's not an area that the w3c has been involved in to date, if cloud computing is your area we are looking at what the w3c might do. 13:37:59 hi AnneW 13:38:01 s/i have/have/ 13:38:09 zakim, aaff is AnneW 13:38:09 +AnneW; got it 13:38:29 JH: So we'll include a section on infrastructure on the f2f agenda 13:39:11 + +1.509.464.aagg 13:39:15 JH: Anyone have any other suggestions? 13:40:01 Rachel has joined #egov 13:40:05 olyerickson: I think we have to work on the social media one. We need to figure out some way that we can bring in somebody specifically for that. There's so much going on in the world that's of relevance to eGiv 13:40:12 s/eGiv/eGov/ 13:40:24 +1 to Olyerickson - there's lots to cover on social media 13:40:27 olyerickson: we should be more deliberate about how we use that time 13:40:29 (and to learn from) 13:40:31 #occupysocialmedia ? 13:41:00 +1 @DanielBennett 13:41:02 JH: Social Media is close to my heart so I'm all for that. Is there someone in the Valley who could come and talk to us I wonder?#] 13:41:16 somnath has left #egov 13:41:22 JH: I don't want the location to be an issue if possible 13:41:43 It would be ironic of location wqas an issue, esp for "social media" ;) 13:41:54 q+ 13:41:54 JH: Any areas here that someone is interested in chairing/co-chairing 13:42:16 Jeanne, if you have a hole I can chair or speak to Data licensing from the UK. 13:42:31 (but I don't want to take up the spot if someone else wants it!) 13:42:40 Thanks Hadley. 13:42:48 PhilA: if you are going to TPAC http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35125/TPAC2011/ 13:43:03 ack DanielBennett 13:43:08 "If you're going to San Fransisco..." ;) 13:43:22 DanielBennett: Is there going to be a session on trying to work out ongoing projects for the group - a planning session? 13:44:02 JH: Yes. I'm trying to set up integrated activities and we'll be setting that up at the meeting, yes 13:44:32 JH: My intention is to walk away from the meeeting with a 6 month plan 13:44:49 ... trying to understand what people want and what people are prepared to do 13:45:02 JH: Anything else on the TPAC meeting? 13:45:08 13:45:09 -1 to more on #TPAC 13:45:22 Topic: Resources on the wiki 13:45:40 JH: If you have resources that you use or have then it would be good to see them on the wiki please 13:45:51 ... we're doing a lot of talk in the US on FOI and privacy 13:46:08 ... those are policies that aren't managed by the open data folk but they impact us 13:46:24 ... I think it's going to be useful for new folks when they jump in 13:46:33 ... thoughts on building that resource? 13:46:37 A singalong would be nice ;-) 13:46:38 +1 to contibuting 13:46:45 I'd be happy to contribute... 13:46:54 JH: I'll just keen bugging people 13:47:02 q+ 13:47:05 ... a little bit from a lot of people is good 13:47:12 q- 13:47:24 JH: Want to look at possible action items 13:48:16 AnnW: I think we should follow TimBL's 5* model for GLD 13:48:24 q+ 13:48:28 ... if we do some sort of maturity model then we should follow along those lines 13:48:46 bhyland has joined #egov 13:48:51 q+ 13:49:01 PhilA: offers this example of adpating the 5* to a specific domain http://opencitations.wordpress.com/2011/10/17/the-five-stars-of-online-journal-articles-3/ 13:49:05 q+ 13:49:29 AnneW: It doesn't have to be LOD, just a 5 level hieracrhy 13:49:40 ... LOD may be unatainable for some people 13:49:58 ack bdhandspicker 13:50:02 I think that HTML5 is going to revolutionize web data and we should have a paper that goes over the opportunities and policy implications 13:50:17 I'll be a chamption of getting people to 1 or 2 starts so that we can build on it 13:50:33 bdhandspicker: Also human-accessible data, XML schema etc 13:50:50 with human readable data, accessibility, data friendly graphics and video/mixed media, 13:50:50 ... a lot of the info needs to be exchanged between agencies 13:51:04 ack DanielBennett 13:51:19 indeed, I work out of Albany in the Office of Children and Family Services 13:51:40 DanielBennett: I was going to say that along with LOD, Could computing and Soc media is HTML5 and its usefulness for presenting data/graphics etc. 13:51:50 My job is to enable interoperability between OCFS systems and Education, Health, and Justice systems 13:52:15 DanielBennett: Maybe we can help with Best Practices around that area 13:52:38 JH: It might be good to have someone from the HTML5 WG to talk about it and its possible impact on gov data 13:52:50 DanielBennett: Yes, but some best practices and examples 13:52:56 q? 13:52:56 JH: That sounds like our research area 13:53:03 John: email me at bd@handspicker.net 13:53:03 ack olyerickson 13:53:37 olyerickson: There's been a lot of discussion about technology (e.g. HTML5). I haven't heard a lot of focus on governments etc 13:53:45 big +1 13:54:04 olyerickson: we haven't talked about the notion of gov data per se 13:54:06 ^- for more discussion about participatory government 13:54:10 olyerickson: Participatory government could be a useful topic for us (+1 from me) 13:54:28 JH: I think the whole area around challenges and engaging the developer community 13:54:37 .. is interesting and relevant 13:54:44 +1 participation, but perhaps to map out the ecology of what that means 13:55:18 DanielBennett: pull, rather than push 13:55:18 Topic: Open Mike 13:55:25 including laws that can be cited, ways to communicate with govt, how to moderate or aggregate 13:55:56 JH: Summarises next steps (Warsaw, TPAC, wiki population) 13:56:07 q+ 13:56:16 ack DanielBennett 13:56:41 DanielBennett: Maybe we could talk about how to move forward on the subjects we've already idnetified. 13:56:51 ... is it going to be HTML5, Soc Media etc. 13:57:00 ... some sort of roadmap/deadline 13:57:23 JH: Yes, that's what we're going to do. As an IG we don't do recommendations, but we can do white papers etc 13:57:44 PhilA: (we call then Notes, but white paper works) 13:57:54 JH: and we can suggest things to/liaise with other W3C Groups 13:58:04 DanielBennett: Yes, that's what I'm hopjng to see 13:58:06 Thanks, Phil. Notes. 13:58:43 DanielBennett: We need input from a larger audience 13:59:09 JH: Yes. And we may end up doing someething sdpecific between specific cities/govs etc. 13:59:16 ... which could be an example of BP 13:59:28 ... I've been reaching out to the LinkedIn group 13:59:45 +1 to LinkedIn usage... 13:59:50 JH: that's given me some good connections 13:59:57 ... obviously there's a variety of commitemnt levels 14:00:18 edsu: Do we have another half an hour? 14:00:36 ... I'd like to know about some of those discussions 14:01:14 JH: I've had 30-40 mails and I've connected people, asking people to tell me what their suggestions for the group are. I'll have them collated ahead of TPAC abd will try and put them out before then 14:01:29 rrsagent, make logs public 14:01:34 -1 to "Else" ;) 14:01:35 nope. thanks 14:01:41 No, this has been great 14:01:45 JH: Any more? 14:01:50 14:01:54 safe travels 14:02:07 See you all soon 14:02:08 -kliehm 14:02:09 -edsu 14:02:09 -AnneW 14:02:11 -HadleyBeeman 14:02:12 -olyerickson 14:02:13 - +1.509.464.aagg 14:02:15 -Jeanne 14:02:21 -bdhandspicker 14:02:21 olyerickson has left #egov 14:02:23 -MacTed 14:02:28 how do we register for virtual participation? 14:02:29 -PhilA2 14:02:33 -Owen 14:02:49 -Daniel 14:02:49 There will be full instructions, DanielBennett 14:02:57 T&S_EGOV()9:00AM has ended 14:02:57 rrsagent, create minutes 14:02:57 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-minutes.html kliehm 14:03:01 Attendees were +1.843.682.aaaa, +1.818.434.aabb, kliehm, olyerickson, PhilA2, +1.440.389.aacc, HadleyBeeman, Owen, Jeanne, edsu, MacTed, +1.413.652.aadd, +1.202.684.aaee, Daniel, 14:03:06 ... bdhandspicker, +1.202.270.aaff, AnneW, +1.509.464.aagg 14:03:31 rrsagent, set logs world-visible 14:03:33 rrsagent, create minutes 14:03:33 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-minutes.html kliehm 14:03:44 regrets+ Bernadette Hyland 14:03:55 rrsagent, geneate minutes 14:03:55 I'm logging. I don't understand 'geneate minutes', PhilA2. Try /msg RRSAgent help 14:04:11 rrsagent, create minutes 14:04:11 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-minutes.html kliehm 14:04:16 HadleyBeeman has left #egov 14:05:28 zakim, please part 14:05:28 Zakim has left #egov 14:05:34 rrsagent, create minutes 14:05:34 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-minutes.html kliehm 14:05:35 And there's me trying to do it from memory ;-) 14:07:00 rrsagent, dismiss 14:07:00 I'm logging. I don't understand 'dismiss', PhilA2. Try /msg RRSAgent help 14:07:10 rrsagent, please leave 14:07:10 I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-actions.rdf : 14:07:10 ACTION: PhilA2 to make sure he know how to grant write access to the wiki before TPAC [1] 14:07:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-irc#T13-25-26 14:07:10 ACTION: Phil Archer to make sure he know how to grant write access to the wiki before TPAC [2] 14:07:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/18-egov-irc#T13-25-35-1