14:59:21 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
14:59:21 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/10/06-html-a11y-irc
14:59:23 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
14:59:23 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #html-a11y
14:59:25 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 2119
14:59:25 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute
14:59:26 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
14:59:26 <trackbot> Date: 06 October 2011
14:59:31 <Zakim> WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has now started
14:59:44 <janina> zakim, who's here?
14:59:49 <Zakim> On the phone I see no one
15:00:00 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, janina, paulc, Judy, MikeSmith, Joshue, davidb, [tm], trackbot
15:00:04 <Zakim> +??P52
15:00:12 <janina> zakim, ??P52 is Janina
15:00:32 <JF> JF has joined #html-a11y
15:00:35 <MikeSmith> Zakim, call Mike
15:00:38 <Zakim> +Janina; got it
15:01:02 <Zakim> ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made
15:01:04 <Zakim> +Mike
15:01:07 <janina> Meeting: HTML-A11Y Task Force Teleconference
15:01:07 <janina> Chair: Janina_Sajka
15:01:07 <janina> Scribe: TBD
15:01:07 <janina> agenda: this
15:01:07 <janina> agenda+ follow-up from last week on canvas status
15:01:08 <janina> agenda+ review bugzilla a11y-tf "needs info" bugs
15:01:10 <janina> agenda+ review other bugzilla a11y-tf bugs
15:01:11 <janina> agenda+ Subteam Reports: Media; Bug Triage; Canvas; ARIA Mapping; Text;
15:01:13 <janina> agenda+ Other Business
15:01:15 <janina> agenda+ Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
15:01:18 <janina> agenda+ Identify Scribe for 13 October http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
15:01:34 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
15:01:34 <richardschwerdtfe> richardschwerdtfe has joined #html-a11y
15:01:42 <paulc> zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc
15:02:07 <Zakim> +paulc; got it
15:02:16 <Zakim> +John_Foliot
15:02:40 <Zakim> +Judy
15:04:00 <Zakim> +Rich_Schwerdtfeger
15:06:10 <richardschwerdtfe> scribe: Rich
15:06:30 <Stevef> Stevef has joined #html-a11y
15:06:41 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Canvas
15:06:49 <JF> scribe: JF
15:07:00 <JF> zakim, take up item 1
15:07:12 <JF> zakim, take up agendum 1
15:07:23 <Zakim> +??P29
15:07:28 <Judy> q+
15:07:30 <Zakim> agendum 1. "follow-up from last week on canvas status" taken up [from janina]
15:07:32 <JF> Rich: waiting to hear from Maciej on proposal, has been a long time
15:07:42 <Zakim> agendum 1. "follow-up from last week on canvas status" taken up [from janina]
15:07:55 <JF> Rich: will start implementing things without his response
15:08:08 <JF> JB: wondering how long you have been waiting on the response for
15:08:13 <JF> ack judy
15:08:23 <JF> Rich: it is approaching 4 weeks
15:08:27 <Stevef> zakim, ??P29 is me
15:08:33 <paulc> What is the link of the message to maciej?
15:08:33 <Judy> zakim, who's here?
15:08:36 <Zakim> +Stevef; got it
15:08:47 <Zakim> On the phone I see Janina, Mike, [Microsoft], John_Foliot, Judy, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Stevef
15:08:50 <Zakim> [Microsoft] has paulc
15:08:56 <Zakim> On IRC I see Stevef, richardschwerdtfe, JF, Zakim, RRSAgent, janina, paulc, Judy, MikeSmith, Joshue, davidb, [tm], trackbot
15:09:04 <JF> JB: asking paul if Maciej is aware of this
15:09:21 <JF> PC: this has not been discussed by the chairs
15:09:43 <LeonieWatson> LeonieWatson has joined #html-a11y
15:09:43 <JF> PC: looking through emails and see no note of this. is it in archives?
15:09:53 <JF> Rich: Is in a11yTF archives
15:10:02 <JF> JB: asks Paul to follow up with Maciej
15:10:53 <JF> Rich: will forward note to Paul and archive
15:11:11 <JF> Paul: will react to this as soon as I get it
15:11:40 <Zakim> +??P16
15:12:02 <JF> JS: part of the urgency is that Moz is anxious to get started on this
15:12:12 <JF> zakim, take up item 2
15:12:12 <Zakim> agendum 2. "review bugzilla a11y-tf "needs info" bugs" taken up [from janina]
15:13:27 <richardschwerdtfe> scribe: Rich
15:14:04 <richardschwerdtfe> Leonie: we have gone through all the bugs that have come int. We are ensuring that the priorities are appropriate
15:14:21 <richardschwerdtfe> Leonie: we should finish this by next Tuesday
15:14:40 <richardschwerdtfe> Leonie: if there are ways that the bug triage team can help best let me know
15:15:07 <richardschwerdtfe> Leonie: the default on filing is P3. We should raise this to the chairs
15:15:19 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?product=HTML+WG&keywords=a11ytf&bug_status=RESOLVED&resolution=NEEDSINFO
15:15:23 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: I thought I change this but someone changed it back
15:15:59 <Joshue> Joshue has joined #html-a11y
15:16:08 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: Let's look back at the ones assigned to Hixie
15:16:27 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: We know nothing will happen unless someone posts a response
15:16:31 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13623
15:16:38 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: bug 13623
15:16:50 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: this was filed by Greg Lowney
15:17:00 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: Hixie provided a response
15:17:08 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: we are waiting on Greg to respond
15:17:42 <richardschwerdtfe> MIke: the spec. should UI should respond to system settings. 
15:18:03 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: Hixie asked where does it require this in the spec.
15:18:18 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: does someone know Greg and can contact him?
15:18:32 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: Put Greg's name on it
15:19:42 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: it came from Greg's reading from something so I need to touch base with him
15:20:03 <richardschwerdtfe> Action: Janina follow up with Greg Lowney on bug 13623
15:20:03 <trackbot> Created ACTION-132 - Follow up with Greg Lowney on bug 13623 [on Janina Sajka - due 2011-10-13].
15:20:21 <richardschwerdtfe> chair: MikeSmith
15:21:00 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: The spec. needs to support drag and drop with something other than the mouse
15:21:13 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13591
15:21:43 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: What if the only input device device on the computer is a mouse
15:21:57 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: that comment was from Ian
15:22:14 <richardschwerdtfe> Rich: What if no device came with a screen Ian?
15:23:06 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: for these kinds of bugs it would be useful to have in the bug comment the part of the spec. that is problematic
15:23:19 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: The action is the same for just that reason
15:23:41 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: We need to go back to the matrix to see what part of the read was assigned to Gregg
15:24:16 <richardschwerdtfe> Action: Janina get with Gregg Lowney on bug 13591
15:24:16 <trackbot> Created ACTION-133 - Get with Gregg Lowney on bug 13591 [on Janina Sajka - due 2011-10-13].
15:24:32 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Input type=Color
15:24:35 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13570
15:24:45 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: this was filed by Cynthia
15:25:23 <JF> Q+
15:25:40 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: there was a comment from Tab controling the autocomplete is as difficult as other autocompletes
15:25:57 <JF> ack JF
15:26:05 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: if you use the same color picker at that site it may save the information
15:26:15 <richardschwerdtfe> MIke: on the face it seems to make sense
15:27:02 <Zakim> -??P16
15:27:21 <richardschwerdtfe> Action: Cynthia follow up on bug 13570
15:27:21 <trackbot> Created ACTION-134 - Follow up on bug 13570 [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2011-10-13].
15:27:37 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
15:28:33 <Judy> agenda?
15:29:12 <Zakim> +??P1
15:29:26 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13564
15:29:34 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Bug 13564
15:30:31 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: anyone can go in and provide descriptions and pointers
15:31:46 <Zakim> -Mike
15:32:19 <richardschwerdtfe> Rich: I think Greg is referring to an <embed> or <object> tag
15:33:03 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: if the embedded object steals a key that the browser uses who wins?
15:33:10 <MikeSmith_> MikeSmith_ has joined #html-a11y
15:33:34 <MikeSmith_> Zakim, call Mike
15:33:34 <Zakim> ok, MikeSmith_; the call is being made
15:33:35 <Zakim> +Mike
15:33:51 <MikeSmith_> RRSAgent, make minutes
15:33:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/06-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith_
15:34:23 <MikeSmith> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:34:44 <richardschwerdtfe> Rich: some browsers are implementing embedded objets as separate processes and the events would not be propagated to the browser but it needs to be stated.
15:35:10 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: Greg put a lot of work into this 
15:35:25 <MikeSmith> i/scribe: Rich/scribenick: richardschwerdtfe/
15:35:32 <MikeSmith> RRSAgent, make minutes
15:35:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/06-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
15:35:54 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: Action: Jaina get with Greg Lowney on bug 13564
15:37:25 <richardschwerdtfe> Action: Janina get with Gregory Rosmaita and Greg Lowney on 13564
15:37:26 <trackbot> Created ACTION-135 - Get with Gregory Rosmaita and Greg Lowney on 13564 [on Janina Sajka - due 2011-10-13].
15:37:46 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13550
15:37:53 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: bug 13550
15:38:24 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: The comment was adding the list attribute to the input states that supported changes the control from a text box to a combo box
15:38:38 <richardschwerdtfe> Ian: wanted to know how a combo box is not a text box
15:39:46 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13437
15:40:00 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Bug 13437
15:40:16 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: This was filed on behalf of the task force and it was an editorial change
15:40:53 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: the content or the video tracks are handled by the page author
15:41:18 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: The control of this should not impact the rendering unless control exposed in the UI
15:41:36 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: John Foliot please respond to question from Phillip
15:41:50 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: this was from Geoff reid from NCAM
15:41:53 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13273
15:42:03 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Topic 13273
15:42:14 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Bug 13273
15:42:23 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: this was filed by Shelley Powers
15:42:44 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: can I safely leave off the controls attribute ...? 
15:43:01 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: you leave it on unless you create your own custom controls and then you disable it
15:43:19 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: it needs to be there for people that don't have JavaScript turned on
15:43:35 <richardschwerdtfe> q+
15:43:46 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: this is potentially an issue
15:43:56 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: if you don't declare controls you don't get them
15:44:50 <richardschwerdtfe> Mike: if the attribute is present or scripting is disabled for the media element ... then even if the controls attribute is not there the browser should render its own controls if script is disabled
15:45:06 <richardschwerdtfe> Cynthia: can we have controls on by default? that seems the logical solution
15:45:25 <JF> q+
15:45:32 <richardschwerdtfe> Cynthia: it would be far more elegant to have a no controls attribute
15:46:10 <richardschwerdtfe> ack
15:46:22 <MikeSmith> q?
15:46:42 <richardschwerdtfe> Rich: over 95% of all web sites have JavaScript. if you disabled it then you would be in trouble. Is this really a problem?
15:47:11 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: the default would be that controls is false
15:47:25 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: Those selector attributes don't have value in HTML 5
15:48:14 <richardschwerdtfe> Action: John Foliot revisit controls vs. no controls
15:48:14 <trackbot> Created ACTION-136 - Foliot revisit controls vs. no controls [on John Foliot - due 2011-10-13].
15:48:19 <LeonieWatson> Q+ to ask whether there is anything bug triage can do to help the TF work through the tagged bugs?
15:48:27 <JF> ack jf
15:48:55 <richardschwerdtfe> Leonie: is there anything the web triage team can start to move through next week to help the task force?
15:48:59 <paulc> Has the email about maciej's review been sent?
15:49:23 <Stevef> q+
15:49:29 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
15:49:37 <janina> aack r
15:49:41 <janina> ack s
15:49:41 <richardschwerdtfe> q?
15:49:44 <richardschwerdtfe> ack
15:49:45 <janina> ack l
15:49:45 <Zakim> LeonieWatson, you wanted to ask whether there is anything bug triage can do to help the TF work through the tagged bugs?
15:49:46 <richardschwerdtfe> q?
15:49:47 <janina> ack j
15:49:54 <richardschwerdtfe> ack richardschwerdtfe
15:50:19 <richardschwerdtfe> Topic: Text Subteam
15:50:20 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
15:50:27 <Judy> http://www.w3.org/2011/10/04-text-minutes.html
15:50:30 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: the team met Tuesday
15:51:02 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: we welcome feedback despite the time shift to Tuesdays
15:51:09 <JF> http://www.w3.org/wiki/A11yTF/longdescresponse
15:51:14 <Judy> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Oct/0029.html
15:51:22 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: on longdesc there is a response that John Foliot had posted
15:51:33 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
15:51:34 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: this is a fairly detailed response
15:51:46 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: I have a few other things to mention
15:52:15 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: need to check with Paul to get some discussion around JF's response to Jonas
15:52:51 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: any thoughts about what would be useful about getting s discussion going on this
15:52:59 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: I think the latter
15:53:26 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: In response to Steve's question about change proposals
15:53:42 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: Chairs to review proposals. we have about 10
15:54:06 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: when it goes to survey we don't uncover the problems we covered in the last pre-last call effort
15:54:21 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: It made our decisions more difficult
15:54:48 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: I am not answering your question directly but I am indirectly answering Judy's queston
15:54:56 <richardschwerdtfe> s/queston/question/
15:55:09 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
15:55:11 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: on meta generator I have something from the text subteam
15:55:47 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: Since the chairs are reviewing things. Send us a note to place a change proposal for issue X higher up in the change proposals
15:55:59 <richardschwerdtfe> JF: a prioritized list
15:56:02 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: yes'
15:56:26 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: I am trying to deflect the detailed response to your question as I don't know the answer
15:56:46 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: put the subteam reports at the top of the agenda
15:57:12 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: On Summary Janina and Lynn are providing use cases.
15:57:31 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: On alt for images that has had a point per point  clear up and that is closed
15:57:54 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: meta name generator, that returned to the group for further work. 
15:57:57 <Judy> http://www.w3.org/2011/10/04-text-minutes.html#item07
15:58:15 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: Steve you should look at the feedback on that item. Also, could you hook up with Janina on that
15:58:33 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: provide more context
15:58:47 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: for the alt image on title what happened with that?
15:58:52 <Judy> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=8645%3E
15:59:04 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: this is one of the things we were doing in our call. 
15:59:18 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: let me check before our meeting next Tuesday
15:59:34 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: I think I updated the change proposal, people seemed happy. 
15:59:40 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: that is ready for the chairs
15:59:55 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: Janina please push this to the top of the list for the chairs
16:00:14 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: we have had all this time and no changes have been made wrt. title
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16:00:31 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: this has been sitting around for years
16:00:40 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: the change proposal is ready to go?
16:00:44 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: yeah
16:00:54 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: Let's do next week
16:01:08 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: was there a version problem?
16:01:18 <Judy> s/version/reversion/
16:01:28 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: there was a second one I have asked for reversion
16:01:48 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: this is significant
16:02:04 <Zakim> -??P1
16:02:13 <paulc> The Chairs are processing the second revert request via email.  I started the Chairs-only thread this morning.  
16:02:30 <richardschwerdtfe> Rich: Ian is opening defects and makeing edits on things that already have been addressed by the chairs
16:02:56 <richardschwerdtfe> Janina: The first issue has already been reverted
16:03:23 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: this is in violation of an existing working group decision
16:03:52 <richardschwerdtfe> Paul: the chairs are aware of the systematic nature here
16:04:01 <paulc> Going to WG meeting.
16:04:31 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: for next month I am being funded 2 days a month to work on the HTML mapping guide
16:04:36 <Zakim> -[Microsoft]
16:04:41 <richardschwerdtfe> janina: Excellent!!!!!!!!!!
16:05:15 <richardschwerdtfe> Steve: my buddies at Adobe have agreed to provide funding for this for a year (2 days a month). TPG is also funding so this is 3 days a month
16:05:24 <richardschwerdtfe> Judy: that is excellent
16:05:33 <richardschwerdtfe> RRSAgent, make log public
16:05:52 <richardschwerdtfe> Meeting: HTML 5 Accessibility Task Force
16:05:56 <richardschwerdtfe> chair: Rich
16:06:04 <richardschwerdtfe> Zakime, bye, 
16:06:10 <Zakim> -Judy
16:06:16 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
16:06:17 <richardschwerdtfe> chair next week is Janina!
16:06:26 <Zakim> -Stevef
16:06:27 <richardschwerdtfe> Zakim, bye
16:06:30 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were Janina, Mike, paulc, John_Foliot, Judy, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Stevef, Cynthia_Shelly
16:06:33 <Zakim> Zakim has left #html-a11y
16:06:37 <richardschwerdtfe> RRSAgent make minutes
16:06:45 <richardschwerdtfe> RRSAgent, draft minutes
16:06:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/06-html-a11y-minutes.html richardschwerdtfe
16:07:05 <richardschwerdtfe> RRSAgent, make minutes
16:07:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/06-html-a11y-minutes.html richardschwerdtfe
16:07:27 <janina> janina has left #html-a11y
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17:09:01 <richardschwerdtfe> chair: MikeSmith
17:09:08 <richardschwerdtfe> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:09:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/06-html-a11y-minutes.html richardschwerdtfe
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