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15:59:04 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/11-html-wg-irc
15:59:06 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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15:59:08 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be html_wg
15:59:08 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see HTML_WG()12:00PM scheduled to start in 1 minute
15:59:09 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Weekly Teleconference
15:59:09 <trackbot> Date: 11 August 2011
15:59:15 <janina> janina has joined #html-wg
15:59:28 <Zakim> HTML_WG()12:00PM has now started
15:59:34 <Zakim> +??P5
15:59:46 <janina> zakim, ??P5 is Janina
15:59:46 <Zakim> +Janina; got it
16:00:12 <Zakim> +mjs
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16:00:27 <Zakim> +Sam
16:00:33 <rubys> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2011JulSep/0011.html
16:00:34 <pimpbot> Title: {agenda} HTML WG telecon 2011-08-11: Issue progress, HTML.next from Maciej Stachowiak on 2011-08-10 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from July to September 2011) (at lists.w3.org)
16:00:36 <rubys> scribenick: rubys
16:00:42 <Zakim> +hober
16:00:48 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13759] New: Should define page load processing model for video/audio <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1297.html> 4** [Bug 13429] Section 7.5 contenteditable and designMode must make navigation consistent platform conventions <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1296.html>
16:00:49 <rubys> chair: mjs
16:01:15 <Zakim> +Radhika_Roy
16:01:45 <Zakim> +kimberlyblessing
16:01:51 <kimberlyblessing> kimberlyblessing has joined #html-wg
16:01:57 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
16:03:55 <adrianba> adrianba has joined #html-wg
16:04:35 <rubys> topic: ACTION items due by Thursday, August 11
16:04:39 <rubys> mjs: none
16:04:47 <rubys> topic: New Issues This Week
16:04:50 <rubys> mjs: none
16:05:00 <rubys> topic: Items Closed Last Week
16:05:05 <rubys> issue-164?
16:05:05 <trackbot> ISSUE-164 -- remove or modify hgroup -- open
16:05:05 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/164
16:05:06 <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-164: remove or modify hgroup - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:05:21 <rubys> mjs: call for counters closed august 2nd
16:05:24 <rubys> issue-168?
16:05:24 <trackbot> ISSUE-168 -- Remove typemustmatch -- closed
16:05:24 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/168
16:05:25 <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-168: Remove typemustmatch - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:05:30 <rubys> mjs: call for counters closed august 2nd
16:05:37 <rubys> issue-133?
16:05:37 <trackbot> ISSUE-133 -- Add a modal attribute to html5 to indicate a modal segment of the DOM (modal dialog) -- open
16:05:37 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/133
16:05:39 <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-133: Add a modal attribute to html5 to indicate a modal segment of the DOM (modal dialog) - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:06:01 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
16:06:03 <rubys> mjs: extended call for counters closed august 6
16:06:18 <rubys> mjs: issue 168 received no proposals, and was closed without prejudice
16:06:18 <adrianba> zakim, [Microsoft] is me
16:06:18 <Zakim> +adrianba; got it
16:06:37 <rubys> mjs: issue-133 received a proposal, and steve indicated that he may be willing to withdraw his proposal in favor of this one
16:06:43 <rubys> mjs: this likely will lead to a CfC
16:06:48 <rubys> mjs: any questions?
16:06:55 <rubys> topic: Items Closing This Week
16:07:00 <rubys> issue-165?
16:07:00 <trackbot> ISSUE-165 -- Drop rel=pingback -- open
16:07:00 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/165
16:07:01 <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-165: Drop rel=pingback - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:07:03 <Zakim> + +1.206.850.aaaa
16:07:12 <rubys> mjs: call for counters closed august 9th
16:07:19 <rubys> issue-153?
16:07:19 <trackbot> ISSUE-153 -- link type "external" either not useful or underspecified -- open
16:07:19 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/153
16:07:20 <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-153: link type "external" either not useful or underspecified - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:07:22 <rubys> issue-154?
16:07:22 <trackbot> ISSUE-154 -- "sidebar" might not be a proper use of a link relation -- open
16:07:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/154
16:07:23 <pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-154: "sidebar" might not be a proper use of a link relation - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
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16:07:36 <rubys> mjs: both of these closed on the 10th
16:08:09 <rubys> topic: Items Closing Next Week
16:08:12 <rubys> mjs: none
16:08:21 <rubys> topic: New Calls this week
16:08:23 <rubys> mjs: none
16:08:33 <rubys> topic: New Surveys this week
16:08:36 <rubys> mjs: none
16:08:48 <rubys> topic: Decisions this week
16:08:50 <rubys> mjs: none
16:09:13 <rubys> mjs: lull due to previous issues working through the process; and new new issues being raised recently
16:09:21 <rubys> topic: Other Business
16:09:31 <rubys> mjs: HTML.next and rechartering
16:09:46 <rubys> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Aug/0263.html
16:09:47 <pimpbot> Title: HTML.next and Rechartering from Maciej Stachowiak on 2011-08-10 (public-html@w3.org from August 2011) (at lists.w3.org)
16:10:21 <rubys> mjs: there is considerable interest in plotting out the next release of HTML after HTM5 as HTML5 goes into maintenance mode
16:11:02 <rubys> mjs: what we are soliciting is suggestions for new ideas which will go into a spec that is not in maintenance mode
16:11:48 <rubys> mjs: we are interested in editors drafts of new versions of existing documents or even new documents; from existing editors or any working group member
16:12:11 <rubys> mjs: doing so will require a charter update; and we are soliciting feedback on what would go into such a charter
16:12:31 <eliot> eliot has joined #html-wg
16:12:41 <rubys> mjs: two basic approaches, one with specific scope called out, or one that is open ended.
16:12:56 <rubys> mjs: any questions or comments?
16:13:12 <eliot> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:13:12 <Zakim> On the phone I see Janina, mjs, Sam, hober, Radhika_Roy, kimberlyblessing, Cynthia_Shelly, adrianba, +1.206.850.aaaa
16:13:40 <eliot> zakim, +1.206.850.aaaa is me
16:13:40 <Zakim> +eliot; got it
16:13:43 <rubys> mjs: I encourage everyone to participate in the email thread
16:13:53 <rubys> mjs: any other Other Business?
16:14:03 <rubys> janina: two items...
16:14:39 <rubys> janina: what is the status of the editor for the 2D spec?  should the former editor being processing bugs against this spec?
16:15:36 <rubys> mjs: the chairs privately had a discussion with the editor and got his commitment to let the decision stand on issue 133, and we are proceeding with him as the editor of that draft.  He should be processing the bugs.
16:15:58 <rubys> janina: so to be clear, he is still the editor of that draft
16:16:06 <rubys> mjs: yes
16:16:38 <rubys> janina: there is some discussion of pulling editing content from the HTML5 spec and not submitting this content to the W3C.
16:16:56 <rubys> mjs: it certainly would be valuable for this to go through the process at some point
16:17:45 <rubys> mjs: as far as removing significant chunks of content... if that reduced consensus, we would provide full opportunity for the WG to have input on that decision
16:18:11 <rubys> cynthia: a bug was resolved as "out of scope" as it would be addressed by a spec that is not under the W3C process.
16:18:19 <rubys> mjs: a link to the bug would be helpful
16:19:09 <rubys> rubys: another option would simply be to mark this as an issue that you would like to have raised
16:19:33 <rubys> mjs: any other topics?
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16:19:43 <rubys> topic: Scribe for next meeting
16:20:03 <rubys> mjs: Sam will chair as Paul is on vacation... any volunteers for scribes?
16:20:13 <rubys> ted: I will scribe
16:20:24 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
16:20:24 <rubys> topic: Adjournment
16:20:29 <Zakim> -hober
16:20:31 <Zakim> -mjs
16:20:32 <Zakim> -Janina
16:20:33 <Zakim> -Sam
16:20:34 <Zakim> -kimberlyblessing
16:20:34 <Zakim> -eliot
16:20:34 <janina> janina has left #html-wg
16:20:35 <Zakim> -adrianba
16:21:00 <rubys> rrsagent, publish minutes
16:21:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/11-html-wg-minutes.html rubys
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16:27:44 <Zakim> -Radhika_Roy
16:27:46 <Zakim> HTML_WG()12:00PM has ended
16:27:47 <Zakim> Attendees were Janina, mjs, Sam, hober, Radhika_Roy, kimberlyblessing, Cynthia_Shelly, adrianba, eliot
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17:33:36 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13625] There is no way to pass audio and video content metadata to the user agent that is required in some cases for playback. <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1298.html>
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18:00:24 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * c5e1a238d8fa r6416 10/ (index complete.html source): 
18:00:24 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) Attr is moving away from being a Node
18:00:24 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12927
18:00:26 <pimpbot> 1112927: bzbarsky, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13Define what "content attribute's document" means
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18:04:33 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 12927] Define what "content attribute's document" means <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1300.html> 4** [Bug 12927] Define what "content attribute's document" means <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1299.html>
18:10:45 <pimpbot> changes: hixie: Attr is moving away from being a Node (whatwg r6417) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0078.html>
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19:37:24 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 12897] In some parsers, UTF-8 BOM trumps the HTTP charset attribute (Encoding sniffing algorithm) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1304.html> 4** [Bug 13429] Section 7.5 contenteditable and designMode must make navigation consistent platform conventions <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1303.html> 4** [Bug 13429] Section 7.5 contenteditable and designMode must make na
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20:09:03 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13429] Section 7.5 contenteditable and designMode must make navigation consistent platform conventions <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1306.html> 4** [Bug 13429] Section 7.5 contenteditable and designMode must make navigation consistent platform conventions <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1305.html>
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20:30:22 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * d4d0e279f297 r6417 10/ (index complete.html source): 
20:30:22 <CIA-1> html-spec: [] (0) Consistency with HTMLFormControlsCollection
20:30:22 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12865
20:30:23 <pimpbot> 1112865: cam, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13HTMLFormElement getter return types should be more specific
20:39:37 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13429] Section 7.5 contenteditable and designMode must make navigation consistent platform conventions <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1310.html> 4** [Bug 12865] HTMLFormElement getter return types should be more specific <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1309.html> 4** [Bug 12865] HTMLFormElement getter return types should be more specific <11http://lists.w3.org/Ar
20:41:19 <pimpbot> changes: hixie: This seems to be a common mistake, so let's call it out. (whatwg r6419) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0080.html> 4** hixie: Consistency with HTMLFormControlsCollection (whatwg r6418) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0079.html>
20:45:19 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * 33fbc3005a98 r6418 10/ (index complete.html source): 
20:45:19 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) This seems to be a common mistake, so let's call it out.
20:45:19 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12141
20:45:20 <pimpbot> 1112141: jfoliot, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13<video> Specifically state that all <track> options be exposed to the end user
21:11:15 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13171] Status boxes overlap <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1315.html> 4** [Bug 12964] <video>: Declarative linking of full-text transcripts to video and audio elements <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1314.html> 4** [Bug 12141] <video> Specifically state that all <track> options be exposed to the end user <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla
21:15:20 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * 0719bb0ef513 r6419 10/ (index complete.html source): 
21:15:20 <CIA-1> html-spec: [giow] (1) fix dir=auto for <textarea> and <input> text fields.
21:15:20 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13482
21:15:21 <pimpbot> 1113482: aharon.lists.lanin, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13dir=auto needs to work on value of input and textarea elements
21:41:35 <pimpbot> changes: hixie: fix dir=auto for <textarea> and <input> text fields. (whatwg r6420) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0081.html>
21:41:52 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 12664] Warn about the perils of registering event handlers after <video> <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1322.html> 4** [Bug 12868] Allow placeholder for color and date+ types <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1320.html> 4** [Bug 13482] dir=auto needs to work on value of input and textarea elements <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/
21:45:26 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * 9d4a7b7f046e r6420 10/ (index complete.html source): 
21:45:26 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) An intro section on avoiding common pitfalls with scripts. File bugs if you have ideas of other things to mention here.
21:45:26 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12664
21:45:26 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * a74320d07a5e r6421 10/ (index complete.html source): 
21:45:27 <pimpbot> 1112664: contributor, P3, RESOLVED FIXED, 13Warn about the perils of registering event handlers after <video>
21:45:30 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) be more positive
21:45:32 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13157
21:45:33 <pimpbot> 1113157: tink, P4, RESOLVED FIXED, 134.5.13. Div element text change
22:00:33 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * eca36bdd86ee r6422 10/ (index complete.html source): 
22:00:33 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) DOM Core convergence (cloning)
22:00:33 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13612
22:00:33 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * 80f0a7282270 r6423 10/ (index complete.html source): 
22:00:33 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) Somehow missed these? weird.
22:00:34 <pimpbot> 1113612: contributor, P3, RESOLVED FIXED, 13Per DOM Core this should use "cloning steps" (concept-node-clone-ext) instead.
22:00:37 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13225
22:00:38 <pimpbot> 1113225: glenn, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13missing elements from list of interfaces for elements table
22:11:43 <pimpbot> changes: hixie: Clarify that the default rules are just defaults. They're really just intended to provide a baseline for testing and for users with no particular accessibility needs or preferences. (whatwg r6425) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0086.html> 4** hixie: Somehow missed these? weird. (whatwg r6424) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0085.html> 4** hixie: DOM Core convergence (
22:13:35 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 12930] Update CSS references (CSS 2.1 and CSS3 Color now a recommendation) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1335.html> 4** [Bug 12658] "the x element" is normally given with x within <code>. Here it isn't. <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1334.html> 4** [Bug 13225] missing elements from list of interfaces for elements table <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/pub
22:15:19 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * f72ed038f57f r6424 10/ (index complete.html source): 
22:15:19 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) Clarify that the default rules are just defaults. They're really just intended to provide a baseline for testing and for users with no particular accessibility needs or preferences.
22:15:19 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13489
22:15:19 <pimpbot> 1113489: kelly.ford, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 132.2.1 Conformance Classes: Add supporting sentence to paragraph on visual user agents and default rendering to enhance concept that override of default rendering is acceptable for certain user experiences
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22:30:20 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * 05e4da8ab6d8 r6425 10/ (index complete.html source): 
22:30:20 <CIA-1> html-spec: [e] (0) Enumerate the many ways you can make video accessible now.
22:30:20 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13400
22:30:22 <pimpbot> 1113400: silviapfeiffer1, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13Audio: Change note on accessibility for the audio element
22:39:26 <mjs> mjs has joined #html-wg
22:41:51 <pimpbot> changes: microdata; hixie: Drop the algorithm that describes how to convert microdata to RDF. The only people who want to do this seem to want to do it for specific vocabularies so they all define vocabulary-specific conversions instead of using owl:sameAs. (whatwg r6427) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2011Aug/0088.html> 4** hixie: Enumerate the many ways you can make video accessible now. (whatwg r6426) <11http://lists.w3.org/
22:44:09 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 12662] <video> Add a section with suggestions for the 'chapters' text track kind, demonstrating how nested time ranges can be used for hierarchical chapters. <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1348.html> 4** [Bug 13184] Allow nested chapters by having nested (time range-wise) cues <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1347.html> 4** [Bug 12887] DataTransfer.getData("text/ur
22:45:21 <CIA-1> html-spec: 03ianh@340c8d12-0b0e-0410-8428-c7bf67bfef74 * 3011b2c924ca r6426 10/ (index complete.html source): 
22:45:21 <CIA-1> html-spec: [] (0) Drop the algorithm that describes how to convert microdata to RDF. The
22:45:21 <CIA-1> html-spec: only people who want to do this seem to want to do it for specific vocabularies
22:45:21 <CIA-1> html-spec: so they all define vocabulary-specific conversions instead of using owl:sameAs.
22:45:21 <CIA-1> html-spec: Fixing http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13314
22:45:22 <pimpbot> 1113314: ian, P2, RESOLVED FIXED, 13Drop RDF conversion algorithm
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23:15:47 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13176] The bounds of canvas fallback content, as rendered on the canvas, are not provided by the user agent to an assistive technology. <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1349.html>
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23:46:14 <pimpbot> bugmail: [Bug 13400] Audio: Change note on accessibility for the audio element <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1351.html> 4** [Bug 12658] "the x element" is normally given with x within <code>. Here it isn't. <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla/2011Aug/1350.html>