IRC log of svg on 2011-06-09
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 20:00:04 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #svg
- 20:00:04 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/06/09-svg-irc
- 20:00:06 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 20:00:06 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #svg
- 20:00:08 [trackbot]
- Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG
- 20:00:08 [Zakim]
- ok, trackbot, I see GA_SVGWG(SVG1)4:00PM already started
- 20:00:09 [trackbot]
- Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference
- 20:00:09 [trackbot]
- Date: 09 June 2011
- 20:00:09 [Zakim]
- + +1.206.675.aaaa
- 20:00:34 [Zakim]
- +??P5
- 20:00:37 [heycam]
- Zakim, ??P5 is me
- 20:00:37 [Zakim]
- +heycam; got it
- 20:01:03 [Zakim]
- +Doug_Schepers
- 20:02:39 [shepazu]
- http://www.w3.org/News/2011#entry-9122
- 20:03:30 [ChrisL]
- ChrisL has joined #svg
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- +ChrisL
- 20:08:13 [heycam]
- Chair: Cameron
- 20:08:15 [heycam]
- Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011AprJun/0137.html
- 20:08:34 [heycam]
- ScribeNick: cabanier
- 20:10:37 [heycam]
- CM: let's get started
- 20:10:37 [cabanier]
- topic: SVG 1.1 Second Edition
- 20:10:37 [cabanier]
- DS: did you catch the out of date recommendation?
- 20:10:49 [heycam]
- s/recommendation/reference/
- 20:10:57 [cabanier]
- CL: I did not. didn't think it was prudent to change
- 20:11:12 [cabanier]
- CL: can you still change?
- 20:11:20 [cabanier]
- DS: yes you can
- 20:11:35 [ChrisL]
- can change in response to ac review comments
- 20:13:15 [heycam]
- CM: I saw philippe mentioned our CSS2.0 reference, did you explain that to him?
- 20:13:16 [heycam]
- CL: yes
- 20:14:24 [cabanier]
- CM: there are 4 weeks to comment and then will become recommended
- 20:15:20 [cabanier]
- there weren't too many people commenting. There is a culture where if people don't comment, they imply yes
- 20:15:34 [cabanier]
- don't panic if there are no comments but it would be better if people do
- 20:16:01 [cabanier]
- (that was doug schepers)
- 20:16:14 [cabanier]
- topic: Seattle F2F form
- 20:17:33 [cabanier]
- CM: form is supposed to be done at the end of the mont
- 20:17:52 [cabanier]
- CM: send a reminder to get topics for the venue
- 20:18:23 [cabanier]
- CM: one of the agenda items is the FX topics but we will wait until Vincent calls in
- 20:18:38 [cabanier]
- topic: CSS WG testing
- 20:18:40 [heycam]
- http://www.w3.org/mid/4DDA7888.6030707@w3.org
- 20:20:07 [shepazu]
- public-test-infra@w3.org
- 20:20:43 [cabanier]
- DS: in the testing taskforce there is a consensus to use the stuff that Peter Linss has done for CSS
- 20:21:23 [cabanier]
- DS: he wrote a framework to aggregate the tests
- 20:22:19 [cabanier]
- the framework allows to run a subset of the tests. when running test you can run all tests or just a couple
- 20:23:15 [cabanier]
- DS: I want him to come talk to us because we feel strongly to have unified testing
- 20:23:28 [cabanier]
- CM: should one of us call in?
- 20:23:41 [cabanier]
- DS: I'll follow up with him
- 20:25:18 [cabanier]
- DS: he responded off-list that he wanted more information
- 20:26:22 [cabanier]
- action: shepazu to follow up with Peter Linss about testing
- 20:27:27 [cabanier]
- topic: Text layout
- 20:28:15 [cabanier]
- ds: we have to wait for Vincent to be here
- 20:28:37 [cabanier]
- CM: I made a recent proposal for positioning
- 20:28:58 [cabanier]
- CM: I didn't read Rik's email reply yet
- 20:29:11 [heycam]
- RC: it seems that svg is trying to do two things at once
- 20:29:21 [heycam]
- ... it's doing layout for you, but also wants to provide you with the ability to position glyphs yourself
- 20:29:26 [heycam]
- ... it's a little bit the same thing with ligatures
- 20:29:38 [heycam]
- ... it'll create ligatures for you, but then also wants to give you the ability with positioning not to create ligatures
- 20:29:42 [heycam]
- ... so it seems a bit messy
- 20:29:56 [heycam]
- ... I propose that maybe we should have a new type of text, more like pdf, specifying individual glyphs taht you want to use
- 20:29:59 [heycam]
- ... so you can choose the ligatures
- 20:30:04 [heycam]
- ... and you always specify glyph positions
- 20:30:14 [heycam]
- ... and the existing <text> will be automatically laid out text
- 20:30:17 [ChrisL]
- sounds like a glyphlist rather than text - so would need an 'alt' for accessibility
- 20:30:20 [heycam]
- ... and it can create ligatures on the fly for you
- 20:30:37 [heycam]
- ... so people who want a simple interface can still have that, but people like us, who want more control over glyph selection and positioning can have that as well
- 20:31:48 [shepazu]
- q+
- 20:32:17 [heycam]
- CM: we may need to have glyph positioning
- 20:32:20 [ChrisL]
- the interaction between altglyph and opentype layout tables is underspecified
- 20:32:21 [heycam]
- s/positioning/indexing/
- 20:32:47 [heycam]
- CM: but we do have <altGlyph> and <glyphDef>
- 20:33:26 [cabanier]
- DS: do we have properties to control if ligatures are formed?
- 20:33:37 [ChrisL]
- CSS3 has a way to disable discretionary ligatures
- 20:33:52 [cabanier]
- CM: true
- 20:34:15 [cabanier]
- CM: but, I don't think that turns of mandatory ones
- 20:34:18 [cabanier]
- DS: ok
- 20:34:50 [cabanier]
- CM: I'm not completely well versed in the area.
- 20:34:57 [cabanier]
- DS: seems like a pain
- 20:35:21 [cabanier]
- CL: I understand that the idea behind the 2 modes
- 20:36:09 [cabanier]
- CM: do we want 'abc' or indexes into the font file
- 20:36:16 [cabanier]
- CL: not sure
- 20:37:00 [cabanier]
- RC: going the PDF way might be very difficult
- 20:37:14 [cabanier]
- CM: not if just using glyph ids
- 20:37:18 [cabanier]
- RC: true
- 20:37:58 [cabanier]
- CM: SVG is not ideal for absolute position but there is a need for positioning on character based input.
- 20:38:12 [cabanier]
- CM: Rik do you have an opinion
- 20:38:32 [cabanier]
- RC: I was looking at it from absolute positioning
- 20:39:04 [cabanier]
- CM: we need to keep allowing positioning in the current SVG text
- 20:39:30 [cabanier]
- CM: and make it as accessible as possible
- 20:40:01 [cabanier]
- CL: one of the reasons that was added was for adding more complicated text on a path
- 20:40:26 [cabanier]
- RC: and every glyph could have its own matrix
- 20:40:37 [cabanier]
- CM: yes by specifiying a rotation
- 20:41:00 [cabanier]
- CM: maybe we should present this at the face-to-face
- 20:41:21 [cabanier]
- CM: I need to implement it anyway and I will start off with my proposal
- 20:41:33 [cabanier]
- CM: I will give more detail at the F2F
- 20:42:28 [cabanier]
- CM: for the use case of absolute positioning, we should try to support better and someone should start on a proposal
- 20:42:57 [cabanier]
- CM: rik, do you want to take this on?
- 20:43:22 [cabanier]
- RC: I will discuss with Vincent but Adobe's interested.
- 20:43:38 [cabanier]
- CM: using glyph indices is probably a good way
- 20:44:07 [cabanier]
- RC: using glyph indices requires you have the font
- 20:44:23 [cabanier]
- CM: I think that is reasonable.
- 20:44:51 [cabanier]
- CM: that the font is always there when you do absolute positioning
- 20:47:02 [cabanier]
- topic: FX taskforce
- 20:48:10 [cabanier]
- DS: want to discuss the CSS and SVG charters
- 20:48:24 [cabanier]
- CM: should we wait for vincent
- 20:48:50 [cabanier]
- DS: we'll talk about it via email
- 20:49:08 [Zakim]
- -ChrisL
- 20:49:09 [Zakim]
- -Doug_Schepers
- 20:49:31 [cabanier]
- RRSAgent make minutes
- 20:49:45 [cabanier]
- RSSAgent, make minutes
- 20:50:00 [cabanier]
- RRSAgent, make minutes
- 20:50:00 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/06/09-svg-minutes.html cabanier
- 20:50:57 [heycam]
- http://www.w3.org/2011/06/09-svg-minutes.html,text
- 20:51:56 [Zakim]
- -heycam
- 20:52:31 [Zakim]
- - +1.206.675.aaaa
- 20:52:32 [Zakim]
- GA_SVGWG(SVG1)4:00PM has ended
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- Attendees were +1.206.675.aaaa, heycam, Doug_Schepers, ChrisL