21:58:42 RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
21:58:42 logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/03/02-html-a11y-irc
21:58:44 RRSAgent, make logs world
21:58:44 Zakim has joined #html-a11y
21:58:46 Zakim, this will be 2119
21:58:46 ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(A11Y)5:00PM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
21:58:47 Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
21:58:47 Date: 02 March 2011
21:59:57 SeanH has joined #html-a11y
22:06:11 chair: John
22:06:30 agenda?
22:07:56 scribe: silvia
22:08:10 Meeting: HTML-A11Y telecon
22:08:10 Chair: John_Foliot
22:08:10 agenda: this
22:08:10 agenda+ Identify Scribe
22:08:10 agenda+ Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
22:08:11 agenda+ Face to Face--Please Register http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/201103_ftf/
22:08:13 agenda+ Issue-152 Multitrack API http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011Feb/0079.html
22:08:15 agenda+ Bug 10693 - Need a means for navigating between related timed tracks of media elements
22:08:17 agenda+ Poster
22:08:19 agenda+ Other Business?
22:08:21 agenda+ be done
22:09:52 zakim, list conferences
22:09:53 I see Team_(svg)21:37Z, Team_(cgbg)21:27Z, WAI_PFWG(A11Y)5:00PM active
22:09:54 also scheduled at this time are XML_QueryWG(QTF2F)11:00AM, Team_(svg)21:26Z, IA_(OWEA XG)5:00PM
22:11:57 topic: Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
22:12:09 nothing open other than Janina's item, which continues
22:12:19 topic: Face to Face--Please Register http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/201103_ftf/
22:12:34 silvia requested breakout for media
22:13:02 JF: ongoing discussions on list will help get towards a resolution on media multitrack api
22:13:13 .. we may still need to have final discussions there
22:14:42 .. I'll follow up with Mike and Michael
22:15:44 Judy: I was not planning to attend, but since we will do intensive media work, I have changed my flights
22:15:57 frankolivier has joined #html-a11y
22:16:23 Topic: Issue-152 Multitrack API http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011Feb/0079.html
22:16:38 JF: we now have 8 possible options in the wiki
22:17:32 silvia: discussions are ongoing
22:17:47 … Eric posted the 8th option today, which we are now discussing in detail
22:18:18 .. Philip was strongly advocating separate elements mostly because or rendering issues
22:18:45 .. I think we have to look at the different options as to their different approaches/requirements on rendering next
22:18:55 JF: has the CSS working group looked at this
22:19:20 Eric: no, but there are probably not many concerns for the CSS WG
22:20:16 silvia: I don't think it's a CSS side issue - it's more about how we expose the elements to CSS from the HTML side
22:20:47 JF: we'll just keep working on it on list, since we seem to be making progress
22:21:05 Topic: Bug 10693 - Need a means for navigating between related timed tracks of media elements
22:21:49 JF: is there any overlap with Issue-152?
22:28:12 silvia: yes, since we do need tracks first before we can specify the navigation between tracks
22:28:14 SeanH has joined #html-a11y
22:29:50 .. I am mostly concerned about the book chapter / article / word kind of navigation
22:31:56 (discussion about different technical ways of achieving this)
22:32:36 silvia proposes to have the navigation between explicit tracks of the video element
22:33:17 sean proposes that the markup could be within the loaded resource within a track
22:34:00 JF thinks it would be easier on authors if the different hierarchical navigation levels would be within a single chapter track file
22:34:14 plainly we need more on-list discussion
22:34:32 JF proposes this issue has to be addressed and solved by CR
22:34:40 I suggested that a DAISY NCX file is an existence proof
22:34:59 JF: we need to set up a wiki page
22:36:54 .. am hoping we can progress this to an issue before May 22nd
22:38:59 timeline: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Sep/0074.html
22:40:50 .. it is a post-LC bug
22:40:52 q+
22:42:06 Judy: it might be worth getting additional input on what is happening after the 22nd May and whether issues will still be addressed after this
22:43:14 .. I am interested in how we would progress towards an implementation of this
22:43:25 Eric: it is likely to have a fairly large impact on implementation
22:43:58 .. we are very far away from being available, since there is a non-trivial amount of implementation necessary
22:45:26 JF: so the first non-trivial amount of implementation will be the solution to multitrack API
22:45:33 .. I see the navigation as equally important
22:45:42 .. I just want to make sure it doesn't slip
22:46:11 .. is it realistic that we can work on this once we have finalized the multitrack API
22:46:50 Eric: to large amount the issues are orthogonal, but we only have this much bandwidth to deal with spec changes
22:47:16 silvia: yes, I would think it makes sense to attack this bug after issue-152
22:49:12 JF: this is an acknowledge issue and we need to get it into the spec - probably before CR
22:51:08 Judy: should we bring it other people that can have the time to deal with this issue?
22:52:35 Eric: it is important to understand how this issue interacts with all the other issues and we've tried to get other interested to help in this field - I think it's unrealistic to try and bring in new blood and expect them to be faster in solving this than taking the sequential approach
22:53:42 JF: there is Mark from Netflix now included also in the multitrack discussion, which is great
22:54:03 .. is it realistic to say that this is the next issue we tackle?
22:54:45 Judy: we also need to talk with Janina about this
22:55:03 Topic: Poster
22:55:55 JF: let's not discuss this now
22:56:26 silvia: as a related issue, I am concerned about non-time-aligned text replacements for video, e.g. short text that is being announced as you tab onto the video
22:56:39 .. is this something we need to analyse in a focused way>
22:56:41 ?
22:57:07 JF: if you can't see it, you need the fallback
22:57:29 Eric: it is the same issue whether the poster is an element or not
22:57:45 .. this probably needs a bug in the tracker
22:59:00 ACTION: John register a bug on "all media elements should have short and long text replacements associated with them"
22:59:00 Created ACTION-107 - Register a bug on "all media elements should have short and long text replacements associated with them" [on John Foliot - due 2011-03-09].
23:00:29 silvia: note that there is also issue-9 open
23:00:40 .. and will be closed today if we don't speak up
23:01:04 Sean: are there open change proposals to this issue that would be closed with it?
23:01:24 JF: as long as the derivative bugs and issues are not closed, it's probably ok to close issue-9
23:01:54 .. it's probably not the intention of the chairs to close other open issues just because this issue is closed
23:03:24 silvia: since we now have derivative bugs, it's probably ok to close it
23:03:46 eric: we got more concrete now and are dealing with the individual issues, it would be good to close issue-9
23:04:13 sean: the original multitrack change proposal was against issue-9, but that's mostly accepted now
23:04:28 JF: I also think we can take the scaffolding down now
23:04:39 Topic: Other Business
23:05:04 Sean: I've been doing some implementation work on the event model around track API
23:05:43 .. the way that cues get added to the cue list, it's impossible to get the handlers in place in time for them to be executed
23:05:58 .. it would be good it people looked at this before the F2F
23:08:05 silvia: is onchange not sufficient
23:08:23 sean: probably not - we need information on the incoming and outgoing cue list
23:08:41 .. it it was on the event rather than a list in the element, that would be easier to deal with
23:08:54 .. I've created a list around this and would appreciate it being discussed at the F2F
23:09:03 JF: is this worthwhile filing it as a bug
23:09:36 Sean: I'd like to have a discussion before filing a specific bug
23:10:11 JF: let's keep discussing and note that it's something we want to talk about at the F2F
23:10:26 No more other business
23:10:48 We won't have a meeting on the 16th March
23:11:17 Given the F2F for the 19th and there is CSUN
23:11:26 But next week will be an active meeting
23:11:35 Meeting finished
23:13:42 rssagent, make minutes
23:13:55 RRSAgent, make minutes
23:13:55 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/02-html-a11y-minutes.html silvia
23:15:01 rrsagent, make minutes public
23:15:01 I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minutes public', silvia. Try /msg RRSAgent help