15:55:12 RRSAgent has joined #webid 15:55:12 logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-irc 15:55:14 RRSAgent, make logs world 15:55:14 Zakim has joined #webid 15:55:14 gaedke has joined #webid 15:55:16 Zakim, this will be WEBID 15:55:16 ok, trackbot, I see INC_WEBID(WEBID)11:00AM already started 15:55:17 Meeting: WebID Incubator Group Teleconference 15:55:17 Date: 07 February 2011 15:55:23 Chair: Henry 15:55:35 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-webid/2011Feb/0057.html 15:56:09 + +3539149aabb 15:56:27 Zakim, aabb is me 15:56:27 +mhausenblas; got it 15:56:41 http://www.w3.org/2011/01/25-webid-minutes.html 15:57:12 +??P12 15:57:22 zakim, who's here? 15:57:22 On the phone I see +1.510.931.aaaa, mhausenblas, ??P12 15:57:24 On IRC I see gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 15:57:24 Zakim, aaaa is bblfish 15:57:24 +bblfish; got it 15:57:31 + +1.805.416.aacc 15:57:44 Zakim, ??P12 is me 15:57:44 +domel; got it 15:57:48 thanks 15:57:58 + +39.011.228.aadd 15:58:13 Zakim, aadd is me 15:58:13 +claudio; got it 15:58:16 + +44.114.222.aaee 15:59:12 Zakim, who's here? 15:59:12 On the phone I see bblfish, mhausenblas, domel, +1.805.416.aacc, claudio, +44.114.222.aaee 15:59:15 On IRC I see gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 15:59:32 -bblfish 15:59:34 Zakim, aaee is gburel 15:59:34 +gburel; got it 15:59:48 + +1.781.866.aaff 16:00:02 Zakim, aacc is PeterW 16:00:02 +PeterW; got it 16:00:11 me 16:00:12 +[IPcaller] 16:00:19 Zakim, i am [IPCaller] 16:00:19 ok, webr3, I now associate you with [IPcaller] 16:00:24 Zakim, aaff is scor 16:00:24 +scor; got it 16:00:30 thanks 16:00:33 Zakim, who's here? 16:00:33 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, [IPcaller] 16:00:35 On IRC I see gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:01:07 csarven has joined #webid 16:01:08 Zakim, i am IPcaller 16:01:08 ok, webr3, I now associate you with [IPcaller] 16:01:16 Zakim, who is here? 16:01:16 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, [IPcaller] 16:01:18 On IRC I see csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:01:20 + +1.760.705.aagg 16:01:22 +bblfish 16:01:25 Zakim, i am [IPcaller] 16:01:26 ok, webr3, I now associate you with [IPcaller] 16:01:28 Zakim, who is here? 16:01:30 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, [IPcaller], +1.760.705.aagg, bblfish 16:01:36 +??P18 16:01:38 On IRC I see csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:01:51 Hi 16:02:01 Zakim, who's here? 16:02:01 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, [IPcaller], +1.760.705.aagg, bblfish, ??P18 16:02:03 On IRC I see csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:02:11 -[IPcaller] 16:02:16 Hi 16:02:21 Zakim, ??P18 is gaedke 16:02:21 +gaedke; got it 16:02:41 Zakim, mute gaedke 16:02:41 gaedke should now be muted 16:02:50 +??P45 16:02:56 Zakim: mute scor 16:02:57 Zakim, i am ?? 16:02:58 +webr3; got it 16:03:04 Zakim, who is here? 16:03:04 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, +1.760.705.aagg, bblfish, gaedke (muted), webr3 16:03:06 Zakim, mute scor 16:03:07 On IRC I see csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:03:10 scor should now be muted 16:03:14 Zakim, ??P45 is csarven 16:03:14 I already had ??P45 as webr3, mhausenblas 16:03:17 Ok, will try another phone line 16:03:20 bheitman has joined #webid 16:03:25 Zakim, unmute scor 16:03:25 scor should no longer be muted 16:03:51 Zakim, who's here? 16:03:51 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, +1.760.705.aagg, bblfish, gaedke (muted), webr3 16:03:54 On IRC I see bheitman, csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:04:18 hi all 16:04:20 Zakim, I am +1.760.705.aagg 16:04:20 +csarven; got it 16:04:40 Zakim, who's here? 16:04:40 On the phone I see mhausenblas, domel, PeterW, claudio, gburel, scor, csarven, bblfish, gaedke (muted), webr3 16:04:42 On IRC I see bheitman, csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 16:04:49 scribenick: mhausenblas 16:04:52 + +49.724.720.aahh 16:04:55 yngve has joined #webid 16:04:55 -gaedke 16:05:08 Hi 16:05:13 pchampin has joined #webid 16:05:17 Zakim, aahh is gaedke 16:05:17 +gaedke; got it 16:05:22 perfect 16:05:26 Topic: Admin 16:05:42 PROPOSAL: Accept minute from last meeting http://www.w3.org/2011/01/25-webid-minutes.html 16:05:42 osacco has joined #webid 16:05:52 +1 16:06:02 +1 16:06:10 +1 16:06:11 +1 16:06:23 +1 16:06:46 Zakim, osacco is with mhausenblas 16:06:46 +osacco; got it 16:06:51 +[IPcaller] 16:06:56 RESOLUTION: Accept minute from last meeting http://www.w3.org/2011/01/25-webid-minutes.html 16:07:05 Zakim, IPcaller is yngve 16:07:05 +yngve; got it 16:07:11 RRSAgent, draft minutes 16:07:11 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-minutes.html mhausenblas 16:07:17 RRSAgent, make logs public 16:07:37 bblfish: are people happy with the time slot? 16:07:44 q+ 16:07:53 ack 16:07:58 q? 16:08:01 ack mhausenblas 16:08:12 \me is OK with the slot 16:08:36 for anyone who wants more info about processes etc, see http://www.w3.org/Guide/ (auth required, iirc) 16:08:41 Michael: bi-weekly is fine 16:08:57 bi-weekly fine with me 16:09:25 bblfish: Ok, then let's do it bi-weekly 16:09:33 Zakim, bheitman is with mhausenblas 16:09:33 +bheitman; got it 16:09:38 peterw has joined #webid 16:09:44 Topic: Introduction 16:10:16 I thin peterw wanted to remain muted 16:10:50 bblfish: I think there are still few Invited Experts pending 16:10:55 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/track/ 16:11:22 domel introduces himself 16:11:33 regrets+ Jeff 16:12:11 q+ 16:12:11 people who are not on that list but think they should be, let me know 16:12:15 University of Bialystok http://www.uwb.edu.pl/lang.php?lang=eng 16:12:22 q? 16:12:25 homepage http://domel.bgul.org/ 16:12:30 ack 16:12:39 q? 16:12:39 interested in triplestores, authorization, authentication, semi-structured data and RDF serializations 16:12:47 work on REST framework for access to document-triplestores 16:13:21 Zakim, Who's muted? 16:13:21 I see csarven muted 16:13:22 ack mhausenblas 16:13:36 q? 16:13:44 ack gburel 16:13:45 gburel: I'm Greg from Sheffied 16:13:52 ack mhausenblas 16:14:15 mhausenblas, ack re regrets+ - just thought you may want to do it in logs 16:14:49 Topic: Deliverables 16:15:03 Gregoire burel, I am a Research Assistant ant the University of SHeffield 16:15:12 bblfish: we have quite some traffic on the list, hope it's not overwhelming for people 16:15:30 ... Working on personnal intelligence in FP7 project WeKnowiT 16:15:44 bblfish: see deliverables at http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/wiki/Main_Page#Deliverables 16:15:53 ... Developping a WebID implementation called AsterID 16:16:13 bblfish: we have three focused deliverables 16:16:16 ... WEbiD interrests include authorization and delegation 16:16:39 bblfish: a Use Case deliverable, an implementation report and the final report 16:17:13 http://pulsar.dcs.shef.ac.uk/asterid (the server down at the moment) 16:18:16 Michael: would be great if we have people who commit to writing/driving deliverables 16:18:35 bblfish: test cases are very important 16:19:19 bblfish: we have to be careful what we can do in the XG in terms of available time 16:20:18 bblfish: related things include write-up about X500 history 16:20:35 q? 16:21:03 I am interested in contributing to Use Cases and Requirements doc 16:21:06 I'm happy to drive use-cases 16:21:18 (and contrib) 16:21:24 Michael: I'm also for the UC 16:21:49 i am also interested in use cases 16:22:10 Same, UC :) 16:22:12 I think we all want that ;) 16:22:25 Which is good! 16:22:26 ACTION Nathan to create draft doc for use cases 16:22:26 Created ACTION-7 - Create draft doc for use cases [on Nathan Rixham - due 2011-02-14]. 16:23:04 bblfish: ok, great, UC seem to be covered 16:23:12 ... anyone up for the test cases? 16:23:22 + +33.9.51.77.aaii 16:24:46 -> http://esw.w3.org/WebID_Protocol_Implementations 16:25:50 I'm volunteering for implementation 16:26:01 me too 16:26:16 yes 16:26:36 and pestering people to keep that table up to date 16:26:54 ACTION: stephane create draft for Implementation report. space on wiki 16:26:54 Sorry, couldn't find user - stephane 16:27:12 bblfish: use scor 16:27:18 ACTION: scor create draft for Implementation report. space on wiki 16:27:18 Created ACTION-8 - Create draft for Implementation report. space on wiki [on Stéphane Corlosquet - due 2011-02-14]. 16:28:51 guido has joined #webid 16:29:12 bblfish: well, we can start the TC and sync with the spec 16:30:24 RRSAgent, draft minutes 16:30:24 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-minutes.html mhausenblas 16:30:51 we could do integration tests with javascript on the client side, but we can't test specifics of the protocols in that way.. 16:30:55 for TC, wouldn't selenium work? 16:31:17 selenium rc == integrationt ests from client side 16:31:19 Web App testing system 16:31:25 http://seleniumhq.org/ 16:31:27 s/t ests/tests 16:31:44 though I think it's Firefox only 16:32:15 ACTION: bblfish to explore test case options 16:32:15 Created ACTION-9 - Explore test case options [on Henry Story - due 2011-02-14]. 16:32:54 bblfish: there are many issues, indeed http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/track/issues 16:33:10 bblfish: anyone from Opera here? 16:33:14 yngve: yes 16:33:50 yngve: ATM I'm working into it, so can't really tell in detail 16:34:15 ... but I think what we need is a spec with usability in mind 16:34:44 bblfish: yes, there must be a layer for the 'browser usability' 16:35:17 q? 16:35:28 security context wg? 16:35:39 yngve: the closest thing I can think of is Web Security Context WG 16:35:56 http://www.w3.org/2006/WSC/ 16:36:31 Michael: notes the WG has been closed with last year 16:36:55 yngve: also, how much user interaction is required 16:37:09 bblfish: what we can do is put some suggestions on the Wiki 16:37:33 ... there are a couple of places (blog posts, etc.) where things are partially described 16:37:44 yngve, do you feel we need a technical protocol spec /or/ an abstract protocol flow spec + options and ui considerations? 16:37:46 yngve: not yet time to look into it 16:37:54 issue http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/track/issues/14 16:38:08 RRSAgent, draft minutes 16:38:09 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-minutes.html mhausenblas 16:39:08 yngve: ok, will take a look at that 16:40:14 yngve: which other browser vendors have joined? 16:40:43 bblfish: for now, Opera - note that we're ATM rather Europe-centric, need to extend that 16:41:08 yngve: have contacts for Mozilla 16:41:31 (scribe didn't catch the names) 16:41:54 I also have contacts for Mozilla 16:42:29 yngve: there might also be some people from Apple interested, will let you know 16:43:16 Topic: AOB 16:43:24 q+ 16:43:35 acl gaedke 16:43:40 ack gaedke 16:44:08 gaedke: regarding electronic IDs, there is something going on in Germany 16:44:18 ... also in other countries ongoing 16:44:25 like the US too 16:45:30 http://www.epass.de/ 16:45:43 bblfish: also a good read is Bruce Sneier re security 16:46:22 http://www.schneier.com/ 16:46:23 Schneier Bruce "Secrets and Lies" 16:46:24 bruce schneier 16:46:28 http://www.personalausweisportal.de/ 16:46:33 s/Sneier/Schneier 16:46:41 s/Bruce Sneier/Bruce Schneier 16:46:58 jeffsayre has joined #webid 16:47:10 The new e ID deals with certificates and PKI 16:47:37 wonders: prioritise issues, or vote for importance on them so we can discuss? 16:47:38 gaedke: I think it's worth bringing it up on the mailing list 16:47:40 + +1.574.277.aajj 16:48:11 xsparql transform for ontologies 16:48:15 bblfish: we might need some other ontologies 16:48:24 http://code.google.com/p/neologism/ 16:48:28 http://neologism.deri.ie/ 16:48:29 mhausenblas: too late :D 16:48:32 scor: ok, will try to summarize the current status about it 16:48:43 http://vocab.deri.ie/ 16:49:24 Zakim, aajj is jeffsayre 16:49:24 +jeffsayre; got it 16:49:30 Michael: I'd suggest to use Neologism 16:49:33 present+ jeffsayre 16:49:41 q? 16:50:39 bblfish: next meeting is in two weeks time (21 Feb) - we continue discussion on the mailing list 16:50:49 ... work through issues 16:51:02 Michael: have to send regrets for next meeting in advance, sorry 16:51:28 bblfish: we have a git repo for the spec 16:51:31 not the only editor, Manu, Reto, Henry, Bruno has contributed a lot too! 16:51:53 https://github.com/webid-community/webid-spec 16:52:07 Michael: and alos please explain how it makes it into http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/spec/ 16:52:13 s/alos/also 16:52:54 scor: I think we want to keep the github repo? 16:54:20 Zakim, ACTION scor to explain how to contribute to the WebID spec 16:54:21 I don't understand you, scor 16:54:42 ACTION: scor to explain how to contribute to the WebID spec 16:54:42 Created ACTION-10 - Explain how to contribute to the WebID spec [on Stéphane Corlosquet - due 2011-02-14]. 16:54:57 do we have hg on dev.? 16:55:04 yes, webr3 16:55:10 webr3: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/WebID 16:55:56 q+ 16:56:08 ack gaedke 16:56:20 gaedke: what about a F2F meeting? 16:56:34 bblfish: yes, we should organise a F2F meeting 16:56:41 q+ 16:56:56 ACTION: mhausenb to propose F2F meeting 16:56:56 Created ACTION-11 - Propose F2F meeting [on Michael Hausenblas - due 2011-02-14]. 16:57:00 q? 16:57:08 ack jeffsayre 16:57:39 jeffsayre: sorry for being late, but one suggestion for now 16:58:15 ... we should be more specific, not use AUTH - can be either authentication or authorisation 16:58:18 Michael: +1 16:58:22 +q 16:58:26 +q 16:58:26 +1 16:58:30 +1 16:58:37 +1 16:58:40 +1 16:58:40 +1 16:58:49 +1 16:58:49 q- bblfish 16:58:50 authn for authentication and authz for authorization 16:59:13 jeffsayre: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/webid/wiki/Main_Page 17:00:12 peter has joined #webid 17:00:20 ACTION jeff to start a wiki page detailing vocabulary of terminology for us to use in discussion 17:00:20 Created ACTION-12 - Start a wiki page detailing vocabulary of terminology for us to use in discussion [on Jeff Sayre - due 2011-02-14]. 17:00:30 jeffsayre: great, thanks, will write up on the Wiki 17:00:38 q? 17:00:48 [meeting adjourned] 17:00:53 -yngve 17:00:55 -PeterW 17:00:56 -mhausenblas 17:00:57 bye 17:00:57 -claudio 17:00:59 -webr3 17:01:00 -jeffsayre 17:01:00 -gburel 17:01:01 bye 17:01:01 -scor 17:01:03 -domel 17:01:03 -gaedke 17:01:08 -csarven 17:01:18 -bblfish 17:01:47 RRSAgent, draft minutes 17:01:47 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-minutes.html mhausenblas 17:01:56 -pchampin 17:01:58 INC_WEBID(WEBID)11:00AM has ended 17:01:59 Attendees were +1.510.931.aaaa, +3539149aabb, mhausenblas, bblfish, +1.805.416.aacc, domel, +39.011.228.aadd, claudio, +44.114.222.aaee, gburel, +1.781.866.aaff, PeterW, scor, 17:02:04 ... +1.760.705.aagg, gaedke, webr3, csarven, +49.724.720.aahh, osacco, yngve, bheitman, +33.9.51.77.aaii, pchampin, +1.574.277.aajj, jeffsayre 17:02:32 RRSAgent, draft minutes 17:02:32 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-minutes.html mhausenblas 17:02:43 peterw has left #webid 17:03:01 Zakim, who's here? 17:03:01 apparently INC_WEBID(WEBID)11:00AM has ended, mhausenblas 17:03:02 On IRC I see peter, guido, pchampin, csarven, gaedke, Zakim, RRSAgent, claudio, gburel, domel, mhausenblas, bblfish, scor, MacTed, webr3, trackbot, sandro 17:03:09 trackbot, end telecon 17:03:09 Zakim, list attendees 17:03:09 sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is 17:03:10 RRSAgent, please draft minutes 17:03:10 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-minutes.html trackbot 17:03:11 RRSAgent, bye 17:03:11 I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-actions.rdf : 17:03:11 ACTION: stephane create draft for Implementation report. space on wiki [1] 17:03:11 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-irc#T16-26-54 17:03:11 ACTION: scor create draft for Implementation report. space on wiki [2] 17:03:11 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-irc#T16-27-18 17:03:11 ACTION: bblfish to explore test case options [3] 17:03:11 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-irc#T16-32-15 17:03:11 ACTION: scor to explain how to contribute to the WebID spec [4] 17:03:11 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-irc#T16-54-42 17:03:11 ACTION: mhausenb to propose F2F meeting [5] 17:03:11 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/07-webid-irc#T16-56-56