14:46:32 RRSAgent has joined #lld 14:46:32 logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc 14:46:43 rrsagent, bookmark 14:46:43 See http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T14-46-43 14:46:53 zakim, this will be lld 14:46:53 ok, antoine; I see INC_LLDXG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 14 minutes 14:47:02 Meeting: LLD XG 14:47:13 Chair: Antoine 14:47:34 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Dec/0030.html 14:47:50 Previous: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html 14:48:19 rayd has joined #lld 14:48:45 karencoyle has joined #lld 14:49:28 Regrets: Peter, Tom, Joachim, Michael, Asaf, Kai, Gordon, Anette, Jon, Kim, Lars, Marcia 14:49:45 rrsagent, please make record public 14:50:04 rrsagent, please draft minutes 14:50:04 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-minutes.html antoine 14:50:51 emma has joined #lld 14:51:33 AlexanderH has joined #lld 14:53:17 zakim, who's here ? 14:53:17 INC_LLDXG()10:00AM has not yet started, emma 14:53:18 On IRC I see AlexanderH, emma, kcoyle, rayd, RRSAgent, Zakim, antoine, aconstan, edsu, ww, digikim 14:53:22 INC_LLDXG()10:00AM has now started 14:53:29 +[IPcaller] 14:53:44 zakim, IPcaller is me 14:53:44 +antoine; got it 14:53:52 +emma 14:54:44 +??P6 14:55:01 zakim, ??P6 is me 14:55:01 +aconstan; got it 14:55:01 zakim, ??P6 is aconstan 14:55:02 I already had ??P6 as aconstan, antoine 14:55:16 zakim, please mute me 14:55:16 aconstan should now be muted 14:55:19 jeff_ has joined #lld 14:58:42 +Jodi 14:58:53 jodi has joined #LLD 14:58:58 zakim, who is here? 14:58:58 On the phone I see antoine, emma, aconstan (muted), Jodi 14:58:59 On IRC I see jodi, jeff_, AlexanderH, emma, kcoyle, rayd, RRSAgent, Zakim, antoine, aconstan, edsu, ww, digikim 14:59:05 marcia has joined #lld 14:59:06 +michaelp 14:59:13 zakim, michaelp is me 14:59:13 +jeff_; got it 14:59:18 rsinger has joined #lld 14:59:38 zakim, who is here? 14:59:38 On the phone I see antoine, emma, aconstan (muted), Jodi, jeff_ 14:59:39 On IRC I see rsinger, marcia, jodi, jeff_, AlexanderH, emma, kcoyle, rayd, RRSAgent, Zakim, antoine, aconstan, edsu, ww, digikim 14:59:47 Asaf has joined #lld 15:00:13 +rsinger 15:00:50 Scribe: Jeff 15:00:55 scribenick: jeff_ 15:00:56 markva has joined #lld 15:01:00 +[IPcaller] 15:01:05 +??P19 15:01:13 zakim, IPcaller is AlexanderH 15:01:13 +AlexanderH; got it 15:01:19 zakim, IPCaller is AlexanderH 15:01:19 sorry, emma, I do not recognize a party named 'IPCaller' 15:01:45 zakim, ??P19 is asaf 15:01:45 +asaf; got it 15:01:52 +??P21 15:01:52 regrets- Asaf 15:02:02 rrsagent, please draft minutes 15:02:02 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-minutes.html antoine 15:02:02 Zakim, +??P21 is ww 15:02:02 sorry, ww, I do not recognize a party named '+??P21' 15:02:08 Zakim, ??P21 is ww 15:02:08 +ww; got it 15:02:22 Zakim, mute me 15:02:22 ww should now be muted 15:02:39 +??P25 15:02:39 zakim, who is here? 15:02:40 On the phone I see antoine, emma, aconstan (muted), Jodi, jeff_, rsinger, AlexanderH, asaf, ww (muted), ??P25 15:02:42 On IRC I see markva, Asaf, rsinger, marcia, jodi, jeff_, AlexanderH, emma, kcoyle, rayd, RRSAgent, Zakim, antoine, aconstan, edsu, ww, digikim 15:02:51 zakim, ??P25 is kcoyle 15:02:54 +kcoyle; got it 15:03:08 CaptSolo has joined #lld 15:03:14 TOPIC: ADMIN 15:03:29 zakim, [LC] is edsu 15:03:29 sorry, edsu, I do not recognize a party named '[LC]' 15:03:30 +[LC] 15:03:31 zakim, [LC] is edsu 15:03:31 +edsu; got it 15:03:35 kefo has joined #lld 15:03:48 previous call: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html 15:04:11 RESOLVED: accept minutes of previous meeting 15:04:38 ACTION: Remove PAUL WALK'S TOOL AND ANALYSIS from Agenda [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action02] 15:04:43 --DONE 15:04:45 +[LC] 15:04:56 zakim, LC is me 15:04:56 +kefo; got it 15:04:56 gneher has joined #lld 15:05:10 TOPIC: DRAFT OUTLINE FOR FINAL REPORT 15:05:26 ACTION: Antoine to add "LOD curriculum" into "recommendations" section of Outline, and benefits into an Introduction [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action03] 15:05:30 +[LC] 15:05:41 --DONE 15:05:47 -> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/index.php?title=RunningAgenda&oldid=2306 15:05:58 zakim, LC is rayd 15:05:59 +rayd; got it 15:06:12 TOPIC: USE CASES AND CASE STUDIES 15:06:19 +??P36 15:06:40 zakim, ??P36 is gneher 15:06:40 +gneher; got it 15:06:42 zakim, ??P36 is gneher 15:06:43 I already had ??P36 as gneher, antoine 15:06:44 zakim, mute me 15:06:44 kefo should now be muted 15:06:56 antoine: focus is on archives today 15:06:56 +??P39 15:07:08 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCases#Cluster:_Archives_and_heterogeneous_data 15:07:15 Zakim: ??39 is me 15:07:24 Zakim, ??39 is me 15:07:24 sorry, uldis, I do not recognize a party named '??39' 15:07:26 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Archives 15:07:28 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Archives 15:07:35 Zakim, ??P39 is me 15:07:35 +uldis; got it 15:07:52 fsasaki has joined #lld 15:07:57 karen: talk about cases first for archives 15:08:05 q+ 15:08:23 +??P30 15:08:41 present+ felix 15:08:49 monica has joined #lld 15:09:09 q+ 15:09:16 karen: goal is targeted for other intitutions as much as end users... bring together consortium 15:09:39 zakim, ack jeff_ 15:09:39 I see antoine on the speaker queue 15:10:10 q+ 15:10:12 antoine: is there overlap between library and archive data? 15:10:15 zakim, ack antoine 15:10:15 I see emma on the speaker queue 15:10:22 zakim, ack emma 15:10:22 I see no one on the speaker queue 15:11:06 emma: yes, linked data can be used to federate access data across library archives and museums 15:11:33 ... want to relate those items via "subject", "people", "places", etc. 15:12:18 ... archives linking heterogeneous materials 15:12:54 karen: topics, making connections between disperate things, but which are related in topical ways 15:13:38 context? 15:13:41 emma: this cluster is unique because it isn't concerned with common metadata vocabularies, it's more about context 15:14:19 +emma 15:14:20 archive people refer to "context" in a more formal way 15:14:38 karen: different kind of goals for archives 15:14:39 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Archives 15:15:27 emma: this link includes goals and discussion. from publisher and user POVs 15:15:40 ... DESCRIBE is about creating information 15:16:32 ... SHARE object descriptions. The idea is to share between insitutions as much as communicate with end users 15:16:58 ... Want to map or share common models 15:17:22 +1 FEDERATE as a kind of DISCOVER/SEARCH 15:18:05 ... MANAGE: is different from discovery 15:18:18 antoine: these goals seem to be higher level 15:18:29 karen: the goal of the cataloging function 15:18:56 ... DESCRIBE is broader than identification 15:19:23 q+ about FEDERATE vs. AGGREGATE 15:19:33 emma: DESCRIBE is seen as separate from relating 15:19:47 antoine: FEDERATE vs. AGGREGATE? 15:20:10 ... AGGREGATE is a "means" for FEDERATE 15:20:25 there's federate, and there's federated search. 15:20:29 karen: there are subtle differences in meaning 15:20:46 to me, federate is the one-time establishing of an interface between two data stores, which would facilitate future federated searches. 15:21:11 emma: specify clusters of related resources affects the perception 15:21:42 Asaf: FEDERATE puts interface in place 15:22:05 Asaf: could be a federated SPARQL query 15:22:10 ksclarke has joined #lld 15:23:12 karen: need to define these terms clearly 15:23:38 FEDERATE: offer search capability over mutiple data sources 15:23:46 ksclarke has left #lld 15:23:46 emma: FEDERATE assumes several stores and is thus different from AGGREGATE 15:24:45 karen: both fall under search and discovery? 15:25:15 antoine: AGGREGATE is an act on its own 15:25:40 federated seemed to target to make deep web documents searchable 15:25:41 karen: FEDERATE is performs an act on more than one store 15:25:54 zakim, who is here? 15:25:54 On the phone I see antoine, emma, aconstan (muted), Jodi, jeff_, rsinger, AlexanderH, asaf, ww (muted), kcoyle, edsu, kefo (muted), rayd, gneher (muted), uldis, felix (muted) 15:25:58 On IRC I see monica, fsasaki, gneher, kefo, uldis, markva, Asaf, rsinger, marcia, jodi, jeff_, AlexanderH, emma, kcoyle, rayd, RRSAgent, Zakim, antoine, aconstan, edsu, ww, digikim 15:26:01 those not on surface to be aggregated by, for example, search engines 15:26:48 emma: these goals may not align with general goals 15:26:56 ... these seem to be higher-level 15:27:51 one other way to define federate and aggregate is, federate is send a search term to remote source, and bring back only results, aggregate is to pool all possible metadata locally then do the search 15:27:55 antoine: it seems OK to add them and worry about merging them later 15:27:59 I am in meeting 15:28:20 *in meeting all day 15:28:42 that's a specific Z39.50 vs OAI-PMH distinction though so will probably apply to only a subset of our audiences 15:28:42 antoine: marcia is invited to follow up via email 15:29:01 * OK. 15:30:10 antoine: eureopeana may fall into several of these use cases 15:30:18 zakim, who is here? 15:30:18 On the phone I see antoine, emma, aconstan (muted), Jodi, jeff_, rsinger, AlexanderH, asaf, ww (muted), kcoyle, edsu, kefo (muted), rayd, gneher (muted), uldis, felix (muted) 15:30:23 On IRC I see monica, fsasaki, gneher, kefo, uldis, markva, Asaf, rsinger, marcia, jodi, jeff_, AlexanderH, emma, kcoyle, rayd, RRSAgent, Zakim, antoine, aconstan, edsu, ww, digikim 15:30:54 emma: want to go through the concrete use cases again to make sure they are covered in abstract use cases 15:31:39 *need to go now. Will folow up on email. 15:31:40 antoine: all are encourage to send feedback 15:31:57 emma: need a template for curating clusters? 15:32:29 see citation cluster http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Citations 15:32:34 antoine: citation cluster is well aligned to suggestion last week 15:32:43 ... 1) background 15:33:06 ... 2) extracted use cases and scenarios 15:33:14 3) relevant technologies and vocabularies 15:33:27 ... but allow for some freedom 15:33:53 ... it seems possible that all clusters could move in this direction 15:34:59 kai: thanks 15:35:00 ACTION: Citation cluster group to place Google Docs document into XG Wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action01] 15:35:03 --DONE 15:35:25 emma pasted above 15:35:35 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Citations 15:37:13 ed: tried to take Google docs and reformulate it into the Wiki 15:37:45 ... scenarios section and a use case section 15:37:57 ... vocabularies section 15:38:10 ... and a section at the end for miscellaneous 15:38:47 antoine: sections seem to align better with archives cluster 15:39:04 ed: feedback is welcome 15:39:31 ACTION: Monica and JISC colleagues to introduce and discuss JISC work on next call [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action02] 15:39:37 --CONTINUES 15:39:41 -aconstan 15:39:51 TOPIC: OTHER WIKI PAGES - LINKS, GLOSSARIES... 15:40:16 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] 15:40:20 q+ 15:40:27 antoine: what is the status? 15:40:28 Zakim, unmute me 15:40:28 ww should no longer be muted 15:40:33 zakim, ack ww 15:40:33 I see no one on the speaker queue 15:41:02 ww: when you make your account profile, fill in your name 15:41:05 +??P1 15:41:10 zakim, ??P1 is me 15:41:10 +aconstan; got it 15:41:15 zakim, please mute me 15:41:15 aconstan should now be muted 15:41:36 ... contact ww to be added as curator 15:41:54 antoine: need more volunteers 15:42:23 ... this is an important way to structure the community 15:42:31 Zakim, mute me 15:42:31 ww should now be muted 15:42:35 --CONTINUES 15:42:51 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] 15:42:56 --CONTINUES 15:43:08 q+ 15:43:47 kcoyle++ 15:43:50 karen: is there a tag to bring together bibliographic datasets 15:43:52 thanks karen, i was missing that too :-) 15:44:02 maybe it's in ww's instructions? 15:44:17 Zakim, unmute me 15:44:17 ww should no longer be muted 15:44:18 I'm not sure--but if we choose one, let's add i there! 15:44:21 it 15:44:23 ... way to connect "linked" and "bibliographic" datasets 15:44:41 ww: we need a convention 15:44:53 q+ 15:45:16 ww: the intersection between bibliographic and linked is LLD 15:46:06 ww: wrote a tool to check properties to see if they are dereferencable. It would be better to mark them as such. 15:46:31 twitter tag is lldata 15:46:37 ww: is the tool world-accessible? 15:46:45 http://ckan.net/group/lld 15:46:54 thanks 15:47:00 http://packages.python.org/curate/ 15:47:42 ww: tool is rough, but will get better 15:48:25 sorry i missed the wiki page for instructions, i see the ckan group page links to http://esw.w3.org/TaskForces/CommunityProjects/LinkingOpenData/DataSets/CKANmetainformation ? 15:49:41 http://esw.w3.org/TaskForces/CommunityProjects/LinkedLibraryData/Datasets/CKANmetainformation 15:49:55 http://esw.w3.org/TaskForces/CommunityProjects/LinkingOpenData/DataSets/CKANmetainformation 15:51:11 someone needs to be tasked with coming up with a tag, I guess 15:51:13 ww: suggestion is that CKAN should inherit general tags and develop more specific as needed 15:52:41 q+ 15:54:35 RESOLUTION: need to tag dataset with LLD in CKAN and add it to the LLD group 15:55:13 contact ww to become a member with details of open-id or set name in CKAN profile 15:55:25 zakim, ack kcoyle 15:55:25 I see edsu on the speaker queue 15:55:27 s/or set name/and set name/ 15:55:38 karen: how to take existing sets and add them to our group? 15:56:12 ww: need to add from the LLD page. Instructions to follow... 15:56:21 zakim, ack edsu 15:56:21 I see no one on the speaker queue 15:57:21 -AlexanderH 15:57:22 bye! 15:57:22 -rayd 15:57:24 cheers 15:57:25 -kcoyle 15:57:25 bye 15:57:26 -uldis 15:57:28 -ww 15:57:30 -Jodi 15:57:32 -kefo 15:57:34 -edsu 15:57:35 bye 15:57:38 -felix 15:57:42 -asaf 15:57:44 -aconstan 15:57:46 -rsinger 15:57:47 rrsagent, please draft minutes 15:57:47 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-minutes.html emma 15:57:50 uldis has left #lld 15:57:50 aconstan has left #lld 15:57:53 zakim, please list attendees 15:57:58 As of this point the attendees have been antoine, emma, aconstan, Jodi, jeff_, rsinger, AlexanderH, asaf, ww, kcoyle, edsu, kefo, rayd, gneher, uldis, felix 15:57:58 jodi has left #LLD 15:58:03 -gneher 15:59:06 rrsagent, please draft minutes 15:59:06 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-minutes.html emma 16:00:16 ACTION: Antoine to add "LOD curriculum" into "recommendations" section of Outline, and benefits into an Introduction [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action03] 16:00:19 --DONE 16:00:27 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] 16:00:29 --DONE 16:00:42 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] 16:00:44 --CONTINUEs 16:00:58 rrsagent, please draft minutes 16:00:58 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-minutes.html emma 16:04:14 -jeff_ 16:04:15 -antoine 16:04:16 -emma 16:04:18 INC_LLDXG()10:00AM has ended 16:04:20 Attendees were antoine, emma, aconstan, Jodi, jeff_, rsinger, AlexanderH, asaf, ww, kcoyle, edsu, kefo, rayd, gneher, uldis, felix 16:04:32 jeff_ has left #lld 16:04:40 zakim, bye 16:04:40 Zakim has left #lld 16:04:48 rrsagent, bye 16:04:48 I see 9 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-actions.rdf : 16:04:48 ACTION: Remove PAUL WALK'S TOOL AND ANALYSIS from Agenda [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action02] [1] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T15-04-38 16:04:48 ACTION: Antoine to add "LOD curriculum" into "recommendations" section of Outline, and benefits into an Introduction [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action03] [2] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T15-05-26 16:04:48 ACTION: Citation cluster group to place Google Docs document into XG Wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action01] [3] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T15-35-00 16:04:48 ACTION: Monica and JISC colleagues to introduce and discuss JISC work on next call [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action02] [4] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T15-39-31 16:04:48 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] [5] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T15-40-16 16:04:48 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] [6] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T15-42-51 16:04:48 ACTION: Antoine to add "LOD curriculum" into "recommendations" section of Outline, and benefits into an Introduction [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/02-lld-minutes.html#action03] [7] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T16-00-16 16:04:48 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] [8] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T16-00-27 16:04:48 ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid credentials) to William Waite to curate LLD group on CKAN [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04] [9] 16:04:48 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/12/09-lld-irc#T16-00-42