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14:46:58 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #sparql 14:46:58 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/01/26-sparql-irc 14:47:00 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world 14:47:00 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #sparql 14:47:02 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 77277 14:47:02 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 13 minutes 14:47:03 <trackbot> Meeting: SPARQL Working Group Teleconference 14:47:03 <trackbot> Date: 26 January 2010 14:47:12 <ivanh> Chair: IvanH 14:47:31 <ivanH> Regrets: Lee, Axel, Alex 14:47:47 <bglimm> bglimm has joined #sparql 14:51:24 <tommik> tommik has joined #sparql 14:52:52 <tommik> yes i'm ready 14:53:06 <ivanH> thanks! 14:53:11 <ivanH> scribe: Tommi 14:53:16 <ivanH> scribenick: tommik 14:53:55 <ivanH> Regrets+ Souri 14:56:05 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started 14:56:12 <Zakim> +[IPcaller] 14:56:22 <AndyS> zakim, [IPcaller] is me 14:56:22 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it 14:56:36 <ivanH> zakim, dial ivanH-voip 14:56:36 <Zakim> ok, ivanH; the call is being made 14:56:37 <Zakim> +IvanH 14:57:36 <MattPerry> MattPerry has joined #sparql 14:57:37 <Zakim> +bglimm 14:57:44 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me 14:57:44 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted 14:57:52 <Zakim> +dcharbon2 14:58:13 <dcharbon2> Zakim, mute me 14:58:13 <Zakim> dcharbon2 should now be muted 14:58:55 <Zakim> +??P17 14:59:16 <ivanH> zakim, ??P17 is MattPerry 14:59:16 <Zakim> +MattPerry; got it 14:59:37 <Zakim> +pgearon 15:00:12 <Zakim> +tommik 15:00:45 <ivanH> Topic: admin 15:00:47 <ivanH> -> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2010-01-12 last week's minutes 15:01:52 <AndyS> Next meeting - 2 Feb 2010 15:01:59 <bglimm> yes 15:02:03 <bglimm> I hear you 15:03:08 <Zakim> +??P30 15:03:12 <SteveH> Zakim, ??P30 is SteveH 15:03:12 <Zakim> +SteveH; got it 15:03:13 <ivanH> Topic: f2f meeting 15:03:38 <bglimm> I thought we had decided 15:03:42 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me 15:03:42 <Zakim> bglimm should no longer be muted 15:03:45 <tommik> ivanH: where does meeting takes place in europe? 15:04:53 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/F2F3 15:05:02 <Zakim> +[IPcaller] 15:05:18 <AndyS> I thought we'd decided on Oxford. 15:05:51 <SteveH> me too 15:06:21 <tommik> ???: will provide information about hotels etc. in website 15:06:28 <ivanH> s/???/Birte/ 15:06:37 <ivanH> Topic: comments 15:06:45 <ivanH> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Comments 15:07:29 <Zakim> +Sandro 15:07:45 <sandro> (Sorry, another meeting ran late.) 15:08:30 <AndyS> Can chase ldodds for LD-1 15:08:57 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me 15:08:57 <Zakim> bglimm was not muted, bglimm 15:09:26 <tommik> ivanH: kindly responses needed to be sent open questions 15:11:18 <ivanH> Topic: Test suite 15:13:01 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me 15:13:01 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted 15:15:43 <tommik> O 15:15:57 <tommik> I'm sorry not hearing very well 15:18:27 <SteveH> typing noise 15:18:53 <SteveH> who's typing? 15:19:01 <AndyS> 440 tests in the DAWG test suite 15:19:06 <tommik> ivanH: it will take time to get tests 15:19:28 <tommik> ivanH: how many tests in current implementations? 15:19:30 <tommik> ???: none 15:19:39 <SteveH> ???=pgearon 15:19:46 <tommik> s/???/pgearon/ 15:19:47 <AndyS> 199 are syntax tests 15:19:48 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me 15:19:48 <Zakim> bglimm should no longer be muted 15:20:13 <SteveH> Zakim, who's speaking 15:20:13 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who's speaking', SteveH 15:20:16 <tommik> bglimm: one could convert some owl test cases 15:21:16 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me 15:21:16 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted 15:21:23 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/r2 15:21:41 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/README.html 15:21:57 <SteveH> Document Editor Lee Feigenbaum 15:22:23 <AndyS> Test available via CVS and HTTP: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/ 15:22:29 <AndyS> + a download 15:22:51 <tommik> ivanH: are these done by hand or automatically? 15:23:13 <SteveH> can we take a moment to find out where the typing noise is coming from, it's making it hard to hear 15:23:21 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/impl-report-ql 15:23:33 <SteveH> before that 15:25:54 <pgearon> I'd like to note that the SPARQL 1 tests were not linked off the SPARQL Query pages 15:26:10 <pgearon> I only ever found them via Google searches 15:26:19 <AndyS> "SPARQL Query pages" = ?? 15:28:15 <pgearon> The original tests have several result formats. Some of them are extensible, so I think it should be useable for the next round 15:28:15 <tommik> sandro: the workflow is irrelevant issue, big question is who does them 15:29:49 <AndyS> q+ 15:30:34 <ivanH> ack AndyS 15:30:34 <tommik> ivanH: to talk to eric and lee about this topic and find somebody who organizes this work 15:31:56 <tommik> ivanH: can andy post about the format to maillist 15:32:03 <tommik> andy: yes 15:32:16 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/README.html 15:32:22 <tommik> ivanH: a wikipage for pointers 15:32:57 <ivanH> Topic: publication 15:33:12 <tommik> ivanH: not sure where we are now exactly 15:34:08 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestingQuery 15:34:54 <AndyS> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Category:Testing 15:35:44 <tommik> ???: many manual steps, coordination between axel and the editors 15:36:12 <Prateek> Prateek has joined #sparql 15:36:13 <Zakim> -[IPcaller] 15:37:04 <Zakim> + +1.937.775.aaaa 15:37:17 <Prateek> Zakim, +1.937.775.aaaa is Prateek 15:37:17 <Zakim> +Prateek; got it 15:37:56 <bglimm> Hm, it seems I better only use references to SPARQL 1.0 to not get broken links/fragments 15:39:42 <bglimm> I think you have to work on the gen.html file, right? 15:40:33 <dcharbon2> yes 15:40:41 <dcharbon2> yes 15:41:12 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me 15:41:12 <Zakim> bglimm should no longer be muted 15:42:43 <sandro> Broken fragments: 15:42:43 <sandro> * http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/update-1.1/gen.html#sec-cvsLog-meat (line 96) 15:43:18 <tommik> ivanH: editors will do what they can for these 15:43:54 <bglimm> I'll check the entailment doc now 15:45:35 <pgearon> I've done it. I'm just checking to see which are false positives 15:46:23 <tommik> sandro: not sure whether publication takes place tomorrow 15:47:26 <bglimm> Do I have to fix: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/entailment/gen.html#sec-cvsLog-meat? 15:48:47 <AndyS> Some of the query broken links are in the CVS log. 15:48:56 <ivanH> rrsagent, draft minutes 15:48:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/01/26-sparql-minutes.html ivan 15:49:10 <AndyS> ADJOURNED 15:49:14 <Zakim> -MattPerry 15:49:24 <Zakim> -Sandro 15:49:26 <Zakim> -IvanH 15:49:30 <Zakim> -Prateek 15:49:32 <Zakim> -bglimm 15:49:38 <Zakim> -pgearon 15:49:42 <Zakim> -tommik 15:51:04 <Zakim> -dcharbon2 15:52:58 <dcharbon2> Ivan, looking at some of the broken links for Protocol - I wonder if they should be fixed or not. For example, this link is broken: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/query-1.1/#grammar and the fix, I guess, would be http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/query-1.1/rq25.xml#grammar 15:53:48 <dcharbon2> however, shouldn't http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/query-1.1/ be the same as http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/docs/query-1.1/rq25.xml? 15:54:09 <bglimm> I have the same problem, but I thought I just point to the old SPARQL spec for now because rq25.xml will be renamed 15:54:30 <sandro> when in doubt, don't change anything. 15:54:42 <sandro> ... since we don't know what the scripts do. 15:54:54 <Zakim> -AndyS 15:54:58 <Zakim> -SteveH 15:54:59 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has ended 15:55:00 <Zakim> Attendees were AndyS, Ivan, bglimm, dcharbon2, MattPerry, pgearon, tommik, SteveH, [IPcaller], Sandro, Prateek 15:56:01 <bglimm> Well, the problem is, how can I reference the SPARQL 1.1 query spec that is published in this round because in the current document is only the new stuff, whereas in this round the draft is merged with the old spec and Axel suggested that I refer to the 1.1 spec throughout 15:56:54 <sandro> Sorry, I have no idea. E-mail Axel, cc the group. 15:57:22 <sandro> (this is all stuff I solved for RIF and OWL, using my own publication tools, but SPARQL chose not to use them.) 15:58:33 <AndyS> What is the W3C normal way of doing this? We were informed that the xmlspec route was the common practice in W3C. What did RIF and OWL use? 15:59:15 <sandro> They used something I wrote, which involved keeping the documents on a wiki. I understand some folks prefer not to do that, which I can understand. 16:00:54 <sandro> I'm afraid I don't know how folks maintain links between documents using xmlspec. 16:16:41 <LukeWM> LukeWM has joined #sparql 16:41:42 <LukeWM> LukeWM has joined #sparql 16:44:08 <AndyS> Should we move to using the wiki? I have no experience of either process. 16:47:53 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has joined #sparql 16:48:14 <AxelPolleres> hi all 16:48:24 <bglimm> In the beginning the wiki was apparently painful because it was very slow. 16:48:27 <AxelPolleres> (was caught in univ meetings) 16:48:53 <AxelPolleres> did sandro raise the editorial issues/broken links in tha call? 16:48:53 <bglimm> After a server update it seemed to have worked much better, but not all OWL people I know liked it. 16:48:57 <bglimm> yes 16:49:26 <bglimm> Managing common bib entries and such was very nice with the wiki Boris said. 16:50:00 <bglimm> Axel, I've send an email about which links I fixed, but I don't know what to do with the links to SPARQL Query 1.1 16:50:39 <AndyS> I've done what I can. 16:50:50 <AxelPolleres> ok. will check now. thanks all 16:52:24 <pgearon> bglimm, I've gone with links back to Query 1.0 for the time being. Once the anchors appear again I'll update the links to Query 1.1 16:53:45 <bglimm> Ok, I could do the same. Axel, do you want m to go back to Query 1.0 links? 16:57:06 <AxelPolleres> yeah, maybe that's the easiest for now, if it's just for the links. 16:57:29 <AxelPolleres> you work all directly on the transformed html files, yes? 16:58:20 <AxelPolleres> (I added some boilerplate text which wasn't yet there in the XML versions... we should port that to the XML for the next versions. 16:58:22 <AxelPolleres> ) 16:59:04 <AndyS> I edited the XML version - rq25.xml. 17:06:56 <bglimm> I work on the gen.html, but try to also do the changes on the xml version, so that I don't have to fix the next generated file all over again. 17:16:49 <bglimm> I tried to run xmlproc on my xml file to generate test.html, but once I upload test.html I get a "you don't have sufficient rights to view this file" error, when I want to see it in the browser or validate it. I didn't want to just overwrite gen.html, so I then decided to just edit gen.html directly 17:18:25 <bglimm> Axel, I now only have http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-sparql11-entailment-20100126/ not found (that is from the W3C header and points to the then published spec) and http://www.websemanticsjournal.org is still unavailable. I could remove the link from the references to get that fixed. 17:46:19 <Zakim> Zakim has left #sparql 17:53:59 <AxelPolleres> hmmm, I find this a bit overpicky by the checker... to be honest. I mean, it complains about 403 from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiset 17:59:27 <AxelPolleres> I whatever, I just removed the link. maybe just do the same, Birte. THe http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-sparql11-entailment-20100126/ can of course stay, that will be fixed. 18:03:15 <bglimm> Ok, I removed that link. Now I only have the broken link to the published spec itself, which is ok as you say 18:06:03 <AxelPolleres> yup. 18:08:21 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has joined #sparql 18:13:45 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has joined #sparql 18:15:18 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has left #sparql 20:16:47 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has joined #sparql 20:21:18 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has left #sparql 21:40:45 <SteveH> SteveH has joined #sparql 21:48:16 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has joined #sparql 21:51:55 <LukeWM_> LukeWM_ has joined #sparql 22:20:50 <AxelPolleres> AxelPolleres has joined #sparql # SPECIAL MARKER FOR CHATSYNC. DO NOT EDIT THIS LINE OR BELOW. SRCLINESUSED=00000193