15:00:15 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/01/24-sparql-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/01/24-sparql-irc ←
15:00:17 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world ←
15:00:19 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 77277
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be 77277 ←
15:00:19 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start now
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start now ←
15:00:20 <trackbot> Meeting: SPARQL Working Group Teleconference
15:00:21 <trackbot> Date: 24 January 2012
15:00:27 <swh> Zakim, who's on the call?
Steve Harris: Zakim, who's on the call? ←
15:00:27 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has not yet started, swh
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has not yet started, swh ←
15:00:28 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, cbuilara, swh, MacTed, AndyS, bglimm, SteveH, iv_an_ru, LeeF, Andrei, kasei, trackbot, pgearon, NickH, ya, ericP, sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see RRSAgent, cbuilara, swh, MacTed, AndyS, bglimm, SteveH, iv_an_ru, LeeF, Andrei, kasei, trackbot, pgearon, NickH, ya, ericP, sandro ←
15:00:31 <LeeF> zakim, this will be SPARQL
Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, this will be SPARQL ←
15:00:31 <Zakim> ok, LeeF, I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM already started
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, LeeF, I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM already started ←
15:00:35 <Zakim> +??P13
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P13 ←
15:00:38 <swh> Zakim, who's on the call?
Steve Harris: Zakim, who's on the call? ←
15:00:39 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P12, ??P13
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see ??P12, ??P13 ←
15:00:39 <AndyS> zakim, ??P13 is me
Andy Seaborne: zakim, ??P13 is me ←
15:00:41 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS; got it ←
15:00:45 <swh> Zakim, ??P12 is me
Steve Harris: Zakim, ??P12 is me ←
15:00:47 <Zakim> +swh; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +swh; got it ←
15:00:49 <Zakim> +??P19
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P19 ←
15:00:52 <LeeF> phone is frozen
Lee Feigenbaum: phone is frozen ←
15:00:54 <LeeF> nice
Lee Feigenbaum: nice ←
15:00:55 <bglimm> Zakim, ??P19 is me
Birte Glimm: Zakim, ??P19 is me ←
15:00:57 <Zakim> +bglimm; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bglimm; got it ←
15:00:59 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me
Birte Glimm: Zakim, mute me ←
15:00:59 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should now be muted ←
15:01:03 <Zakim> +kasei
Zakim IRC Bot: +kasei ←
15:01:21 <Zakim> +Lee_Feigenbaum
Zakim IRC Bot: +Lee_Feigenbaum ←
15:01:29 <LeeF> zakkim, Lee_Feigenbaum is me
Lee Feigenbaum: zakkim, Lee_Feigenbaum is me ←
15:01:32 <LeeF> zakim, Lee_Feigenbaum is me
Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, Lee_Feigenbaum is me ←
15:01:35 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +LeeF; got it ←
15:01:55 <Zakim> +??P29
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P29 ←
15:02:01 <cbuilara> zakim, ??P29 is me
Carlos Buil Aranda: zakim, ??P29 is me ←
15:02:07 <Zakim> +cbuilara; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +cbuilara; got it ←
15:02:09 <Zakim> +MattPerry
Zakim IRC Bot: +MattPerry ←
15:02:25 <LeeF> zakim, who's on the phone?
Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, who's on the phone? ←
15:02:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see swh, AndyS, bglimm (muted), kasei, LeeF, cbuilara, MattPerry
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see swh, AndyS, bglimm (muted), kasei, LeeF, cbuilara, MattPerry ←
15:02:58 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me
Birte Glimm: Zakim, unmute me ←
15:03:09 <AndyS> scribenick: AndyS
(Scribe set to Andy Seaborne)
15:03:13 <Zakim> bglimm should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should no longer be muted ←
15:03:17 <AndyS> scribe: Andy Seaborne
15:03:41 <LeeF> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2012JanMar/0075.html
15:03:45 <Zakim> + +1.540.841.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.540.841.aaaa ←
15:03:47 <LeeF> topic: Admin
15:04:10 <LeeF> PROPOSED: Approve last week's minutes from http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-01-17
PROPOSED: Approve last week's minutes from http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-01-17 ←
15:04:17 <pgearon> Zakim, aaaa is me
Paul Gearon: Zakim, aaaa is me ←
15:04:17 <Zakim> +pgearon; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +pgearon; got it ←
15:04:27 <LeeF> Regrets: Axel, Olivier
15:04:40 <LeeF> RESOLVED: Approve last week's minutes from http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-01-17
RESOLVED: Approve last week's minutes from http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2012-01-17 ←
15:04:49 <chimezie> Zakim, what is the passcode?
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, what is the passcode? ←
15:04:52 <Zakim> the conference code is 77277 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), chimezie
Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 77277 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), chimezie ←
15:04:53 <LeeF> Next meeting is on 1/31
Lee Feigenbaum: Next meeting is on 1/31 ←
15:05:28 <Zakim> + +1.216.368.aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.216.368.aabb ←
15:05:38 <chimezie> Zakim +1.216.368.aabb is me
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim +1.216.368.aabb is me ←
15:05:51 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me ←
15:05:51 <Zakim> sorry, chimezie, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, chimezie, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you ←
15:05:58 <LeeF> Lee: RDF WG?
Lee Feigenbaum: RDF WG? [ Scribe Assist by Lee Feigenbaum ] ←
15:06:05 <LeeF> AndyS: pretty quiet, discussing graph use cases
Andy Seaborne: pretty quiet, discussing graph use cases [ Scribe Assist by Lee Feigenbaum ] ←
15:06:11 <LeeF> ...small point around turtle and hex binary
Lee Feigenbaum: ...small point around turtle and hex binary ←
15:06:19 <chimezie> Zakim, 1.216.368.aabb is me
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, 1.216.368.aabb is me ←
15:06:19 <Zakim> sorry, chimezie, I do not recognize a party named '1.216.368.aabb'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, chimezie, I do not recognize a party named '1.216.368.aabb' ←
15:06:22 <LeeF> ...about whitespace, but I don't think there will be progress on that
Lee Feigenbaum: ...about whitespace, but I don't think there will be progress on that ←
15:06:50 <AndyS> topic: tests
15:07:10 <LeeF> implementation report is here: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/implementations/
Lee Feigenbaum: implementation report is here: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/implementations/ ←
15:08:07 <chimezie> Zakim, +1.216.368.aabb is me
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, +1.216.368.aabb is me ←
15:08:07 <Zakim> +chimezie; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +chimezie; got it ←
15:08:12 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me ←
15:08:12 <Zakim> chimezie should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: chimezie should now be muted ←
15:08:40 <AndyS> kasei:chnages Update syntax shortcuts, qname escapes, a few other things
Gregory Williams: chnages Update syntax shortcuts, qname escapes, a few other things ←
15:08:50 <LeeF> zakim, who's on the phone?
Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, who's on the phone? ←
15:08:50 <Zakim> On the phone I see swh, AndyS, bglimm, kasei, LeeF, cbuilara, MattPerry, pgearon, chimezie (muted)
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see swh, AndyS, bglimm, kasei, LeeF, cbuilara, MattPerry, pgearon, chimezie (muted) ←
15:08:53 <AndyS> ... last run Oct 2011.
... last run Oct 2011. ←
15:09:03 <AndyS> ... despite CVS timestamp.
... despite CVS timestamp. ←
15:09:20 <chimezie> I can do all of the above but just for some entailment tests
Chimezie Ogbuji: I can do all of the above but just for some entailment tests ←
15:09:20 <AndyS> Leef: anyone else in a position to run the test suite?
Lee Feigenbaum: anyone else in a position to run the test suite? ←
15:09:24 <pgearon> not me at all
Paul Gearon: not me at all ←
15:09:35 <MattPerry> We use ARQ, so our results will basically be the same
Matthew Perry: We use ARQ, so our results will basically be the same ←
15:09:43 <bglimm> Hopefully I can run the tests in a few weeks (entailment tests mainly though)
Birte Glimm: Hopefully I can run the tests in a few weeks (entailment tests mainly though) ←
15:10:30 <AndyS> LeeF:want to batch approve all tests in two impls.
Lee Feigenbaum: want to batch approve all tests in two impls. ←
15:11:19 <bglimm> Michael Schneider wanted to implement ent. regimes. I haven't talked to him recently to see where he stands
Birte Glimm: Michael Schneider wanted to implement ent. regimes. I haven't talked to him recently to see where he stands ←
15:11:24 <AndyS> AndyS: Reach out to other implementations.
Andy Seaborne: Reach out to other implementations. ←
15:11:45 <AndyS> LeeF: Will go outbound soon so we get feedback on mechanisms ASAP.
Lee Feigenbaum: Will go outbound soon so we get feedback on mechanisms ASAP. ←
15:12:05 <LeeF> ACTION: Lee to post about test suite on public-sparql-dev and -comments list and reach out to implementors
ACTION: Lee to post about test suite on public-sparql-dev and -comments list and reach out to implementors ←
15:12:05 <trackbot> Created ACTION-579 - Post about test suite on public-sparql-dev and -comments list and reach out to implementors [on Lee Feigenbaum - due 2012-01-31].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-579 - Post about test suite on public-sparql-dev and -comments list and reach out to implementors [on Lee Feigenbaum - due 2012-01-31]. ←
15:12:29 <AndyS> LeeF: Query first
Lee Feigenbaum: Query first ←
15:13:33 <AndyS> Mechanism -- approve all but specific tests based on last report.
Mechanism -- approve all but specific tests based on last report. ←
15:14:08 <LeeF> agg-err-{01,02}
Lee Feigenbaum: agg-err-{01,02} ←
15:16:29 <AndyS> ARQ runs the agg tests and functions all OK (from CVS)
ARQ runs the agg tests and functions all OK (from CVS) ←
15:19:16 <AndyS> ARQ runs the update silent test all successesfully
ARQ runs the update silent test all successesfully ←
15:19:35 <LeeF> close ACTION-575
Lee Feigenbaum: close ACTION-575 ←
15:19:35 <trackbot> ACTION-575 Propose tests for ADD, MOVE, and COPY closed
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-575 Propose tests for ADD, MOVE, and COPY closed ←
15:19:50 <AndyS> LeeF: newer tests from Matt. ARQ reports running them OK.
Lee Feigenbaum: newer tests from Matt. ARQ reports running them OK. ←
15:19:56 <LeeF> close ACTION-574
Lee Feigenbaum: close ACTION-574 ←
15:19:56 <trackbot> ACTION-574 Propose tests for positive use of EXISTS closed
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-574 Propose tests for positive use of EXISTS closed ←
15:20:15 <AndyS> .. EXISTS tests look OK (2 impls pass the tests)
.. EXISTS tests look OK (2 impls pass the tests) ←
15:21:16 <LeeF> ACTION: Greg to re-run the implementation report and check in an updated one
ACTION: Greg to re-run the implementation report and check in an updated one ←
15:21:17 <trackbot> Created ACTION-580 - Re-run the implementation report and check in an updated one [on Gregory Williams - due 2012-01-31].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-580 - Re-run the implementation report and check in an updated one [on Gregory Williams - due 2012-01-31]. ←
15:22:59 <kasei> q+
Gregory Williams: q+ ←
15:23:02 <LeeF> ack kasei
Lee Feigenbaum: ack kasei ←
15:23:02 <AndyS> LeeF: For CR - snapshot place and fixed report place
Lee Feigenbaum: For CR - snapshot place and fixed report place ←
15:24:55 <AndyS> kasei: SHA384 still there
Gregory Williams: SHA384 still there ←
15:25:00 <AndyS> AndyS: I'll remove them.
Andy Seaborne: I'll remove them. ←
15:25:05 <AndyS> topic: protocol
15:26:23 <AndyS> LeeF: Easier to start again - need an online service that will poke a server with the protocol.
Lee Feigenbaum: Easier to start again - need an online service that will poke a server with the protocol. ←
15:26:33 <AndyS> ... service description testing ...
... service description testing ... ←
15:27:05 <AndyS> kasei: Online form, for a URL, get back a report of SD conformance 9(3 tests currently)
Gregory Williams: Online form, for a URL, get back a report of SD conformance 9(3 tests currently) ←
15:27:11 <kasei> http://kasei.us/2009/09/sparql/sdvalidator.cgi?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmyrdf.us%2Fsparql11&submit=Submit
Gregory Williams: http://kasei.us/2009/09/sparql/sdvalidator.cgi?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmyrdf.us%2Fsparql11&submit=Submit ←
15:27:30 <AndyS> ... conneg -> EARl if RDF.
... conneg -> EARl if RDF. ←
15:28:38 <AndyS> LeeF: coverage page says we will have 2+ impls. We may need to encourage people to put up SD's
Lee Feigenbaum: coverage page says we will have 2+ impls. We may need to encourage people to put up SD's ←
15:29:50 <AndyS> ... mildly related ... anyone at SemTech presenting SPARQL 1.1?
... mildly related ... anyone at SemTech presenting SPARQL 1.1? ←
15:30:18 <AndyS> LeeF: want similar set up for protocol - something that poke a service.
Lee Feigenbaum: want similar set up for protocol - something that poke a service. ←
15:30:38 <AndyS> .. drive by the examples in the protocol doc.
.. drive by the examples in the protocol doc. ←
15:30:53 <AndyS> ... one new thing - query as application/sparql-query
... one new thing - query as application/sparql-query ←
15:31:50 <LeeF> ACTION: Lee to work changes to protocol TR publication back into editor's draft
ACTION: Lee to work changes to protocol TR publication back into editor's draft ←
15:31:50 <trackbot> Created ACTION-581 - Work changes to protocol TR publication back into editor's draft [on Lee Feigenbaum - due 2012-01-31].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-581 - Work changes to protocol TR publication back into editor's draft [on Lee Feigenbaum - due 2012-01-31]. ←
15:32:35 <AndyS> LeeF: Overall next week, approve all that is green x2 impls
Lee Feigenbaum: Overall next week, approve all that is green x2 impls ←
15:33:04 <LeeF> ACTION-580?
15:33:04 <trackbot> ACTION-580 -- Gregory Williams to re-run the implementation report and check in an updated one -- due 2012-01-31 -- OPEN
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-580 -- Gregory Williams to re-run the implementation report and check in an updated one -- due 2012-01-31 -- OPEN ←
15:33:04 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/track/actions/580
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/track/actions/580 ←
15:33:11 <AndyS> Topic: TSV/CSV formats
15:35:16 <LeeF> http://www.w3.org/2011/05/sparql-charter
Lee Feigenbaum: http://www.w3.org/2011/05/sparql-charter ←
15:36:40 <AndyS> LeeF: Concern is that it is two different formats.
Lee Feigenbaum: Concern is that it is two different formats. ←
15:37:07 <AndyS> ... CSV is string forms, TSV is full Turtle terms.
... CSV is string forms, TSV is full Turtle terms. ←
15:37:10 <swh> q+
Steve Harris: q+ ←
15:37:32 <AndyS> ... found this strange - not the way I'd do it.
... found this strange - not the way I'd do it. ←
15:37:57 <AndyS> ... but not an issue to hold up over. Still want some discussion on it though.
... but not an issue to hold up over. Still want some discussion on it though. ←
15:38:05 <LeeF> ack swh
Lee Feigenbaum: ack swh ←
15:39:13 <AndyS> swh: Understand the concern; CSV in excel often does not want Turtle details (experience); TSV is for programs. No user feedback againt it.
Steve Harris: Understand the concern; CSV in excel often does not want Turtle details (experience); TSV is for programs. No user feedback againt it. ←
15:39:17 <AndyS> q+
q+ ←
15:39:22 <LeeF> ack Andrei
Lee Feigenbaum: ack Andrei ←
15:39:25 <LeeF> ack AndyS
Lee Feigenbaum: ack AndyS ←
15:39:37 <swh> AndyS: experience is that TSV is quite popular
Andy Seaborne: experience is that TSV is quite popular [ Scribe Assist by Steve Harris ] ←
15:39:46 <swh> … people use CSV but a little bit
Steve Harris: … people use CSV but a little bit ←
15:39:53 <swh> … and it's very fast to produce
Steve Harris: … and it's very fast to produce ←
15:40:10 <swh> … get the why does ntriples parse faster than turtle effect
Steve Harris: … get the why does ntriples parse faster than turtle effect ←
15:40:18 <swh> … don't see much use of CSV
Steve Harris: … don't see much use of CSV ←
15:40:31 <swh> … people dont see it in the wild as being different formats, lots of confusion
Steve Harris: … people dont see it in the wild as being different formats, lots of confusion ←
15:40:40 <swh> … there's a lot of confusion in the wild
Steve Harris: … there's a lot of confusion in the wild ←
15:41:09 <AndyS> LeeF: can be explained
Lee Feigenbaum: can be explained ←
15:41:35 <swh> AndyS: which ones does Anzo use
Andy Seaborne: which ones does Anzo use [ Scribe Assist by Steve Harris ] ←
15:41:36 <AndyS> ... Anzo does the string form (CSV)
... Anzo does the string form (CSV) ←
15:42:39 <kasei> I'm in agreement with Lee. Seems weird, but think it can be explained.
Gregory Williams: I'm in agreement with Lee. Seems weird, but think it can be explained. ←
15:43:23 <AndyS> LeeF: Consensus on two formats - issue of confusion recognized as possible.
Lee Feigenbaum: Consensus on two formats - issue of confusion recognized as possible. ←
15:44:03 <AndyS> AndyS: Needs more examples
Andy Seaborne: Needs more examples ←
15:44:37 <AndyS> LeeF: Seems better to make it REC track.
Lee Feigenbaum: Seems better to make it REC track. ←
15:44:58 <AndyS> ... next step - complete doc and then move forward through process.
... next step - complete doc and then move forward through process. ←
15:45:36 <AndyS> Topic: AOB
15:45:44 <chimezie> Zakim, unmute me
Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, unmute me ←
15:45:44 <Zakim> chimezie should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: chimezie should no longer be muted ←
15:46:00 <AndyS> LeeF: Chime - anything about graph store?
Lee Feigenbaum: Chime - anything about graph store? ←
15:46:00 <kasei> q+ to ask about ACTION-573 (aggregate errors)
Gregory Williams: q+ to ask about ACTION-573 (aggregate errors) ←
15:46:13 <AndyS> chime: next time please
Chimezie Ogbuji: next time please ←
15:46:23 <LeeF> ack kasei
Lee Feigenbaum: ack kasei ←
15:46:23 <Zakim> kasei, you wanted to ask about ACTION-573 (aggregate errors)
Zakim IRC Bot: kasei, you wanted to ask about ACTION-573 (aggregate errors) ←
15:47:02 <AndyS> kasei: need more agg-error tests?
Gregory Williams: need more agg-error tests? ←
15:47:06 <LeeF> close ACTION-573
Lee Feigenbaum: close ACTION-573 ←
15:47:06 <trackbot> ACTION-573 Propose tests for aggregate evaluation errors closed
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-573 Propose tests for aggregate evaluation errors closed ←
15:47:07 <AndyS> LeeF: No - it's done.
Lee Feigenbaum: No - it's done. ←
15:47:48 <AndyS> ADJOURNED
ADJOURNED ←
Formatted by CommonScribe
This revision (#1) generated 2012-01-24 15:51:34 UTC by 'aseaborne', comments: None