14:42:03 RRSAgent has joined #badtf 14:42:03 logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-badtf-irc 14:42:08 Zakim has joined #badtf 14:42:15 zakim, this will be bad 14:42:15 ok, shadi; I see WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 18 minutes 14:42:19 chair: Shadi 14:42:32 meeting: BAD TF 14:43:29 agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Oct/0010.html 14:43:37 agenda+ EOWG comments 14:43:47 agenda+ Next steps 14:43:55 agenda+ Next meetings 14:49:55 Wilco has joined #badtf 14:56:30 eric has joined #badtf 14:59:34 Michael has joined #badtf 14:59:53 WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has now started 15:00:02 + +1.617.588.aaaa - is perhaps mauro 15:00:10 zakim, call shadi-617 15:00:10 ok, shadi; the call is being made 15:00:11 +Shadi 15:00:42 zakim, aaaa is Eric 15:00:56 sorry, shadi, I do not recognize a party named 'aaaa' 15:01:10 zakim, who is on the call? 15:01:10 +Wilco 15:01:20 On the phone I see mauro, Shadi, Wilco 15:01:29 zakim, mauro is really Eric 15:01:29 +Eric; got it 15:01:48 zakim, who is eric? 15:01:48 I don't understand your question, shadi. 15:02:08 sorry, i can't get into call. does not accept my conference code 15:02:23 22383? 15:02:26 zakim, code? 15:02:28 the conference code is 22383 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), shadi 15:02:48 +Michael 15:03:37 scribe: Eric 15:03:56 zakim, take up next 15:03:56 agendum 1. "EOWG comments" taken up [from shadi] 15:06:10 Shadi agrees that the project takes longer then planned, but the iterative process takes time, don’t confuse it with client work w/ well-defined deliverables… 15:08:07 Shadi: We added a lot of stuff to our scope, so we shouldn’t be frustrated by additional comments. We are on the way to finish it. 15:10:04 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Oct/0002 15:10:06 Eric: That is okay, we should now plan it very good. 15:10:14 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Oct/0006 15:11:05 Shadi: We had a really clear seperation between sample pages and demo pages, because the navigation was more subtle… 15:11:33 Shadi: There was the suggestion to put everything into the demo format… 15:12:14 http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/after/home/ 15:13:31 Shadi: Michael, any ideas on the page design? 15:14:15 Michael: We could use some kind of browser frame, and include the w3c logo. A heading and going on with the report… 15:14:40 Shadi: Some ideas were about jumping between the reports… 15:15:39 Shadi: We got 10 reports… one for before and after for every page… 15:16:21 Michael: Use the current navigation but with different wording… 15:17:37 Eric: Browser chrome and tabs are not an option, I think. 15:18:46 Wilco: We shouldn’t push the design any further, probably redesign the meta page to be more consistent and have more like a separate website. 15:18:52 Eric: I second that… 15:20:31 Eric: I like that, you could use a navigation which fits exactly. 15:20:45 Michael: We have two seperate parts, demo and report pages. 15:21:47 Michael: Probably we could reorganize it into the current navigation… 15:23:33 -Michael 15:23:38 Wilco: I don’t think it should belong there, it will clutter the page up, too. 15:23:42 Michael has left #badtf 15:25:11 Eric: I agree… 15:25:58 Shadi: It is very confusing, if you click on the evaluation and you land on another site. 15:26:32 Shadi: I think the project would benefit to have it for the download. 15:27:47 http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/Overview 15:29:22 action: add to wishlist a BAD look&feel overview page for the download version of the Demo 15:31:24 action: Eric look into a complete BAD design (including reports, beyond the Demo pages, etc) http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Oct/0006 15:31:40 After some discussion the group thinks it is a good idea to have a somewhat consistent design for the meta pages. 15:36:05 http://fiers.name/badtf/report/report.htm 15:36:25 The group goes through the further comments and agrees on them, looking into some points. 15:37:57 Shadi: Discussion about the evaluation pages, Principles should be page headings, says EOWG, which makes the tables more manageable, reduce the need for more colors ect. 15:39:04 Wilco: That would take several hours to reconstruct the script… even though it is built reasonably flexible. I’m not exactly sure how much work it is but it will be some. 15:40:31 Wilco: I like one table, because it is from one source and structure. I think that would complicate navigation somewhat. 15:41:42 Eric: I’m in favor for the headings and separate tables… 15:42:19 Wilco: We could use headings in the table. 15:44:31 Shadi: Do we want to try that compromise? 15:45:36 The group agrees that we want to try that solution… 15:47:42 Shadi: There is no n/a in WCAG 2.0… it is actually a pass… 15:48:04 Wilco: I think n/a means there was no test run… 15:48:14 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-eo/2009OctDec/0006 15:49:33 Shadi: Another thing is pass and fail, we can only meet a guideline… EO proposed a fraction… 15:52:01 Wilco: Do we count all guidelines together and use that for our fraction or what? That will make things more complicated depending on which level you test… 15:52:29 Shadi: They would change depending on what level you test… 15:54:38 Eric: So how do we handle n/a? 15:55:09 Shadi: If we use it, we should use a grey, but they suggested to not use it at all. 15:55:48 Shadi: We should ask for clarification. 15:57:26 http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/report/before/home.html 15:58:02 Eric: Fraction on guideline level, success criteria just passed/fail 15:59:54 Agreement: fraction on the guideline level, pass/fail (and probably n/a) on the success criteria level 16:00:39 Shadi: Diskussion on met instead on pass, and on using text instead of icons 16:05:24 Wilco: Inverting colors on the principles level may be a way to highlight it. 16:05:45 zakim, take up next 16:05:45 agendum 2. "Next steps" taken up [from shadi] 16:06:35 http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/after/home/annotations 16:06:35 Shadi: Populating report and annotations… do the annotations always appear on the left hand side? 16:06:43 Wilco: Yes, they do! 16:08:47 http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/documentation/ 16:10:23 http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/annotations 16:10:24 Wilco: Positioning annotations is quite difficult… 16:11:23 zakim, take up next 16:11:23 agendum 3. "Next meetings" taken up [from shadi] 16:11:28 Shadi: I’ll have another look at the annotation… 16:12:50 Next meeting: next week or the week after. 16:13:04 -Wilco 16:13:05 -Shadi 16:13:08 -Eric 16:13:09 WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has ended 16:13:11 Attendees were +1.617.588.aaaa, Shadi, Wilco, Eric, Michael 16:18:39 rrsagent, make logs world 16:18:43 rrsagent, make minutes 16:18:43 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-badtf-minutes.html shadi 16:18:44 rrsagent, make logs world 16:18:51 rrsagent, bye 16:18:51 I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-badtf-actions.rdf : 16:18:51 ACTION: add to wishlist a BAD look&feel overview page for the download version of the Demo [1] 16:18:51 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-badtf-irc#T15-29-22 16:18:51 ACTION: Eric look into a complete BAD design (including reports, beyond the Demo pages, etc) http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Oct/0006 [2] 16:18:51 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-badtf-irc#T15-31-24 16:18:55 zakim, bye 16:18:55 Zakim has left #badtf