IRC log of ua on 2009-05-14

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:22:27 [RRSAgent]: RRSAgent has joined #ua
16:22:27 [RRSAgent]: logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc
16:22:29 [trackbot]: RRSAgent, make logs public
16:22:29 [Zakim]: Zakim has joined #ua
16:22:31 [trackbot]: Zakim, this will be WAI_UAWG
16:22:31 [Zakim]: ok, trackbot; I see WAI_UAWG()1:00PM scheduled to start in 38 minutes
16:22:32 [trackbot]: Meeting: User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
16:22:32 [trackbot]: Date: 14 May 2009
16:22:53 [KFord]: Chair: Jim_Allan
16:26:39 [KFord]: Agenda+ Logistics (Regrets, agenda requests, comments)?
16:26:39 [KFord]: Agenda+ Survey Results from 5/7 survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/
16:26:39 [KFord]: Agenda+ new survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/
16:29:35 [KFord]: Agenda+ 3.6.2 rewrite http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2009AprJun/0058.html
16:29:44 [KFord]: rrsagent, make logs public
16:29:56 [KFord]: rrsagent, make minutes
16:29:56 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-minutes.html KFord
16:32:08 [KFord]: zakim, save agenda
16:32:15 [Zakim]: ok, KFord, the agenda has been written to http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-agenda.rdf
16:32:26 [KFord]: rrsagent, make minutes
16:32:26 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-minutes.html KFord
16:40:04 [jeanne]: jeanne has joined #ua
16:42:04 [jeanne]: http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/Overview.html
16:42:28 [jeanne]: instructions for scribing http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/scribing.html
16:52:18 [Zakim]: WAI_UAWG()1:00PM has now started
16:52:25 [Zakim]: +[Microsoft]
16:52:34 [KFord]: zakim, microsoft is KFord
16:52:34 [Zakim]: +KFord; got it
16:56:08 [sharper]: sharper has joined #ua
16:56:39 [sharper]: zakim, code?
16:56:39 [Zakim]: the conference code is 82941 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), sharper
16:58:57 [Zakim]: +Jeanne
16:59:00 [Zakim]: -KFord
16:59:01 [Zakim]: +KFord
16:59:20 [Zakim]: +Greg_Lowney
17:00:11 [Henny]: Henny has joined #ua
17:01:41 [AllanJ]: AllanJ has joined #ua
17:01:59 [Zakim]: +??P13
17:02:17 [KFord]: regrets: Jan, MH
17:02:25 [KFord]: rrsagent, make minutes
17:02:25 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-minutes.html KFord
17:02:40 [Zakim]: +Allanj
17:05:23 [KFord]: Scribe: JALLAN
17:05:26 [jeanne]: scribe: jeanne
17:05:33 [jeanne]: trackbot, start meeting
17:05:35 [trackbot]: RRSAgent, make logs public
17:05:37 [trackbot]: Zakim, this will be WAI_UAWG
17:05:37 [Zakim]: ok, trackbot, I see WAI_UAWG()1:00PM already started
17:05:38 [trackbot]: Meeting: User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
17:05:39 [trackbot]: Date: 14 May 2009
17:05:49 [AllanJ]: zakim, who is here
17:05:49 [Zakim]: AllanJ, you need to end that query with '?'
17:05:54 [AllanJ]: zakim, who is here?
17:05:54 [Zakim]: On the phone I see KFord, Jeanne, Greg_Lowney, ??P13, Allanj
17:05:54 [jeanne]: chair: KFord and AllanJ
17:05:55 [Zakim]: On IRC I see AllanJ, Henny, sharper, jeanne, Zakim, RRSAgent, KFord, Greg, trackbot
17:06:14 [jeanne]: regrets+ Mark_Hakkinen, Jan_Richards
17:06:39 [AllanJ]: zakim, P13 is really HennyS
17:06:39 [Zakim]: sorry, AllanJ, I do not recognize a party named 'P13'
17:06:45 [jeanne]: rrsagent, make minutes
17:06:45 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-minutes.html jeanne
17:06:59 [AllanJ]: zakim, ??P13 is really Henny
17:07:00 [Zakim]: +Henny; got it
17:07:02 [jeanne]: zakim, take up item 1
17:07:02 [Zakim]: agendum 1. "Logistics (Regrets, agenda requests, comments)?" taken up [from KFord]
17:07:11 [jeanne]: zakim, close item 1
17:07:11 [Zakim]: agendum 1, Logistics (Regrets, agenda requests, comments)?, closed
17:07:12 [Zakim]: I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:07:13 [Zakim]: 2. Survey Results from 5/7 survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/ [from KFord]
17:07:19 [KFord]: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/results
17:07:19 [jeanne]: zakim, take up item 2
17:07:19 [Zakim]: agendum 2. "Survey Results from 5/7 survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/" taken up [from KFord]
17:07:57 [jeanne]: topic: #53
17:08:21 [jeanne]: KF: We finished discussion of #53 with an action item for KFord that he will have for next week's survey.
17:08:34 [jeanne]: topic: #55 from Greg
17:08:44 [Zakim]: +Kim_Patch
17:09:20 [KimPatch]: KimPatch has joined #ua
17:09:56 [jeanne]: KF: Last week we agreed that it needed more work but there are no proposals. Would anyone take an action item to draft a proposal.
17:10:21 [jeanne]: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/results#xq5
17:12:15 [AllanJ]: action: Jim to clean up Greg#55 (4.1.10 & 11) make proposal
17:12:15 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-183 - Clean up Greg#55 (4.1.10 & 11) make proposal [on Jim Allan - due 2009-05-21].
17:14:41 [AllanJ]: Q+ to say keystroke to reveal, like word ribbon
17:15:03 [jeanne]: KP: For speech input users, it is important to have a central listing of all keyboard commands.
17:15:29 [jeanne]: JS: We have a requirement for a central listing of all keyboard commands.
17:16:10 [jeanne]: KF: Do we think an option to surface the keyboard abilities is a level 2.
17:16:27 [AllanJ]: +1 to KS have level 2 option to reveal keys
17:16:45 [Henny]: + 1
17:17:38 [jeanne]: GL: It would be useful to separate out the keyboard shortcuts in the user interface from the keyboard shortcuts i nthe content.
17:18:51 [jeanne]: ...I think it is useful to have a level A that shows all the recognized shortcuts in the content, and then a AA requirement for the user interface, because it is a greater cognitive load to expect the user to remember the keyboard shortcuts for every site.
17:19:44 [jeanne]: ...by splitting it up, we get the advantages of the content, but without the load on the developer
17:20:11 [AllanJ]: ack Allanj
17:20:11 [Zakim]: AllanJ, you wanted to say keystroke to reveal, like word ribbon
17:21:57 [jeanne]: action: Greg to take #63 and turn it into a proposal for next week.
17:21:57 [trackbot]: Sorry, couldn't find user - Greg
17:22:35 [jeanne]: KF: As a group we need to commit to taking the action items and turn it around as a proposal within a week, otherwise we are getting too bogged down and not accomplishing what we need to.
17:22:56 [jeanne]: action: JS to work with Greg to take #63 and turn it into a proposal for next week.
17:23:19 [AllanJ]: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/results
17:23:32 [sharper]: sharper has joined #ua
17:23:52 [sharper]: zakim, code?
17:23:52 [Zakim]: the conference code is 82941 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), sharper
17:23:58 [jeanne]: topic: #65
17:24:03 [AllanJ]: Proposed: Standard text area keyboard conventions: Views that render text support the standard text area conventions for the platform including, but not necessarily limited to: character keys, backspace/delete, insert, "arrow" key navigation (e.g., "caret" browsing), cut, copy, paste, delete, select all, undo, navigate to start/end, navigate by paragraph, shift-to-select mechanism, etc. (Level A)
17:24:32 [AllanJ]: +1 to proposed wording
17:25:03 [Zakim]: +??P5
17:25:08 [sharper]: zakim, ??P5 is sharper
17:25:08 [Zakim]: +sharper; got it
17:25:12 [mhakkinen]: mhakkinen has joined #ua
17:26:21 [Greg]: Re Simon's propsed wording of 4.1.6, to make the title make sense out of context, I'd modify slightly to "Standard Text Area Keyboard Conventions".
17:27:39 [jeanne]: KP: I had comments that I put in about standard wordings, and I would like to expand the examples.
17:27:44 [KFord]: Kim's answers/comments are at http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/results
17:29:42 [jeanne]: JA: 4.1.6 applies to text area boxes
17:30:24 [jeanne]: KF: We have a guideline that tells the agent that the user gets to specify the precedence of the processing order of the keys.
17:30:42 [jeanne]: KP: Only Undo seems to apply.
17:31:10 [jeanne]: GL: I recommend that we don't try to make it an exhaustive list of examples, but rather give an example of categories.
17:31:31 [jeanne]: ... a lot of platforms aren't going to have standards for these.
17:31:47 [jeanne]: JA: but that is covered by "avavilable on the platform"
17:32:06 [jeanne]: GL: because it is a long list, it appears to be exhaustive.
17:32:24 [Greg]: That's a very good point: if there is keyboard access to static, rendered text, then the UA should support platform keyboard conventions there, too. Not just text input fields.
17:33:22 [jeanne]: JS: I would like to standardize our wording, either "such as" or "including, but not limited to,"
17:33:47 [jeanne]: KF: we need to get the gestalt of what we want to say and look for the small wording changes later.
17:33:52 [Greg]: I'm fine either way on standardizing the wording of "including but not limited to" or "such as".
17:33:56 [AllanJ]: Proposed: Standard text area keyboard conventions: Views that render text support the standard text area conventions for the platform including, but not necessarily limited to: character keys, backspace/delete, insert, "arrow" key navigation (e.g., "caret" browsing), cut, copy, paste, delete, select all, undo/redo, navigate to start/end, navigate by paragraph, shift-to-select mechanism,...
17:33:58 [AllanJ]: ...etc. (Level A)
17:35:50 [jeanne]: GL: Does this only apply to text input or interactive fields, or does it apply to all text fields? Do we need to make it more specific?
17:36:15 [Greg]: It seems that there are two basic types of text field: interactive and non-interactive, and interactive can be read-write or read-only.
17:37:11 [Greg]: For all interactive fields, the functionality is already required to be available via the keyboard, but we need to make sure it follows standard keyboard conventions.
17:37:21 [jeanne]: KF: Interactive text areas also apply to rendered content if you support carat browsing to that text. But it does not apply to the title bar of the user interface.
17:39:31 [jeanne]: GL: THere is an example of a web application that is emulating MS WOrd, and using the Word keyboard conventions, and is not supporting the user platform standards.
17:39:59 [KFord]: Q+
17:40:09 [jeanne]: JA: the author can make the user interface do whatever it wants, but the browser is not aware of what the author has remapped how the keys are supposed to work.
17:40:48 [jeanne]: ...if the author alters that, the user agent can't be responsible for what the author has done.
17:41:19 [Greg]: However...what about content like a text editor that intentionally provides its own keyboard UI. For example, EmacSpeak is UA that doesn't support platform standard keyboard UI, does it fail level A?
17:41:44 [jeanne]: GL: Use EMAC-speak as an example. It uses a different keyboard shortcuts than Mac or PC or Gnome.
17:41:57 [jeanne]: KF: THis is only referring to editable text fields.
17:42:32 [AllanJ]: scribe: allanj
17:42:50 [Greg]: It is not currently written so as to apply only to editable text fields.
17:42:58 [AllanJ]: KF: good understanding of what 4.1.6 means
17:43:14 [AllanJ]: ...can we defer and say technical note will clarify
17:43:27 [AllanJ]: ...concerned we are going to deep
17:43:56 [AllanJ]: JS: change views thta render text support the rendered editable text areas
17:44:44 [AllanJ]: views that render text, support the editable text area conventions
17:45:43 [AllanJ]: KF: If you have a text box, do what is expected to support as keyboard accessible.
17:46:01 [Greg]: Perhaps "rendered text that can be selected or modified...follow platform keyboard conventions" such as editing, navigation, copy and paste, etc."
17:48:11 [AllanJ]: GL: Emacs speak uses different UI form the platforms on which it works. does it fail this SC
17:48:24 [AllanJ]: All: discussion
17:48:59 [AllanJ]: GL: at least put in ability to not use standard keyboard
17:49:23 [Greg]: Need to at least provide escape clause for cases where the user wants to use keyboard UI that differs from the platform standard.
17:49:49 [Greg]: E.g. VIM using Ctrl+V to start selection vs. Windows using Ctrl+V for paste.
17:50:30 [AllanJ]: Action: Greg to rework 4.1.6
17:50:30 [trackbot]: Sorry, couldn't find user - Greg
17:50:35 [jeanne]: action: JS to assist GL to write a proposal for 4.1.6 to address concerns of this survey
17:50:35 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-184 - Assist GL to write a proposal for 4.1.6 to address concerns of this survey [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2009-05-21].
17:51:09 [AllanJ]: JA: 4.1.6 is supposed to apply to only editable areas in content - iniput, textarea, etc.
17:51:21 [AllanJ]: ...does not apply to entire viewport
17:52:37 [AllanJ]: JS: one way to address...platform or platform emulation
17:53:41 [AllanJ]: topic: #69 http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/results
17:57:19 [Greg]: On Jim's 4.1.8 wording, I'd remove "unmodified keystrokes" to "a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations"
17:57:43 [AllanJ]: proposed: 4.1.8 Important Command Functions: Important command functions (e.g. related to navigation, display, content, information management, etc.) are available using a single keystroke, key combination, or a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations. (Level AA)
17:58:54 [AllanJ]: proposed: 4.1.8 Important Command Functions: Important command functions (e.g. related to navigation, display, content, information management, etc.) are available using a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations. (Level AA)
17:59:27 [AllanJ]: +1
17:59:30 [sharper]: +1
17:59:31 [Greg]: That looks good to me (except of course "Important" is vague, but that's another issue.)
17:59:38 [Greg]: +1
17:59:45 [KimPatch]: +1
17:59:52 [AllanJ]: Resolved: 4.1.8 Important Command Functions: Important command functions (e.g. related to navigation, display, content, information management, etc.) are available using a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations. (Level AA)
18:01:16 [Greg]: Are we going to drop the issue of key sequences being memorizable?
18:01:25 [jeanne]: action: JS to update the draft with the updated text for 4.1.8: 4.1.8 Important Command Functions: Important command functions (e.g. related to navigation, display, content, information management, etc.) are available using a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations. (Level AA)
18:01:25 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-185 - Update the draft with the updated text for 4.1.8: 4.1.8 Important Command Functions: Important command functions (e.g. related to navigation, display, content, information management, etc.) are available using a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations. (Level AA) [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2009-05-21].
18:02:25 [AllanJ]: GL: memorized, user can enter without having to review or read to see the next command, alternate
18:02:55 [AllanJ]: ...huge cognitive issue
18:03:29 [AllanJ]: ...may not belong in 4.1.8, but we don't want it to be unusable
18:04:02 [AllanJ]: ...select files from a list, rather than enter whole file.
18:05:02 [AllanJ]: ...need to find wording. If take away wording specifics. Do we need something to address - efficiency.
18:05:21 [AllanJ]: KP: applies to speech as well
18:06:27 [KFord]: zakim, take up item 3
18:06:27 [Zakim]: agendum 3. "new survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/" taken up [from KFord]
18:06:30 [jeanne]: zakim, close this item
18:06:30 [Zakim]: I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, jeanne
18:06:38 [jeanne]: q+
18:06:44 [jeanne]: ack kford
18:06:45 [AllanJ]: Issue: keyboard efficiency, for screenreaders and speech users. cognitive load from GL comments (micorsoft wordding)
18:06:45 [trackbot]: Created ISSUE-36 - Keyboard efficiency, for screenreaders and speech users. cognitive load from GL comments (micorsoft wordding) ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/tracker/issues/36/edit .
18:06:47 [mhakkinen]: lurking comment: use of mnemonics where possible, taking into consideration localization issues
18:06:51 [jeanne]: ack je
18:06:58 [AllanJ]: ack kf
18:07:03 [jeanne]: zakim, close item 2
18:07:03 [Zakim]: agendum 2, Survey Results from 5/7 survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090505/, closed
18:07:05 [Zakim]: I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
18:07:06 [Zakim]: 3. new survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/ [from KFord]
18:07:17 [jeanne]: zakim, take up item 3
18:07:17 [Zakim]: agendum 3. "new survey http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/" taken up [from KFord]
18:07:35 [AllanJ]: topic: #64 http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/results#xq3
18:08:53 [AllanJ]: *KEYBOARD OPERATION*
18:08:55 [AllanJ]: The functions provided to operate a user interface using only *keyboard
18:08:56 [AllanJ]: commands*, without any need for pointer actions. Examples include:
18:08:58 [AllanJ]: sequential keyboard navigation through a GUI, keyboard shortcuts, and
18:08:59 [AllanJ]: command line interfaces.
18:09:01 [AllanJ]: =============================================
18:09:02 [AllanJ]: *KEYBOARD COMMANDS*
18:09:04 [AllanJ]: The set of signals that a user interface will accept from a keyboard or
18:09:06 [AllanJ]: keyboard emulator in a given context (e.g., with focus in a document vs.
18:09:07 [AllanJ]: with focus in the menus). Signals may be composed of one keyboard event
18:09:09 [AllanJ]: (e.g., the "Tab" key") or multiple keyboard events that occur either
18:09:11 [AllanJ]: simultaneously (e.g., "ctrl"+"S") or sequentially (e.g. "alt","F","S").
18:09:12 [AllanJ]: For the purposes of UAAG 2.0, several types of keyboard commands are
18:09:14 [AllanJ]: identified:
18:09:16 [AllanJ]: (a) *Sequential Commands* are those that are not tied to any particular
18:09:17 [AllanJ]: UI controls or application functions, but rather support traversal of
18:09:19 [AllanJ]: sets of controls (e.g., repeating "Tab" to move between all active
18:09:21 [AllanJ]: controls, "arrow" keys to move focus through items in a list).
18:09:22 [AllanJ]: Sequential commands help users explore what is available.
18:09:24 [AllanJ]: (b) *Direct Commands* (also called "keyboard shortcuts" or "accelerator
18:09:25 [AllanJ]: keys") are those tied to particular UI controls or application
18:09:27 [AllanJ]: functions, allowing the user to navigate-to or activate them without
18:09:28 [AllanJ]: traversing any intervening controls (e.g., "ctrl"+"S" to save a
18:09:30 [AllanJ]: document). It is sometimes useful to distinguish direct commands that
18:09:31 [AllanJ]: are associated with controls that are rendered in the current context
18:09:33 [AllanJ]: (e.g., "alt"+"D" to move focus to the address bar) from those that may
18:09:35 [AllanJ]: be able to activate program functionality that is not associated with
18:09:37 [AllanJ]: any currently rendered controls (e.g., "F1" to open the Help system).
18:09:39 [AllanJ]: Direct commands help users accelerate their selections.
18:09:42 [AllanJ]: (c) *Spatial Commands* are those in which the keyboard is used to
18:09:43 [AllanJ]: control the position of controls in space (e.g., using the arrow keys to
18:09:45 [AllanJ]: move a mouse pointer by set numbers of pixels). ACCESSIBILITY NOTE:
18:09:48 [AllanJ]: Spatial commands do not typically enhance exploration or acceleration of
18:09:50 [AllanJ]: selection of selection and should not be considered an alternative to
18:09:53 [AllanJ]: direct or sequential commands.
18:09:54 [AllanJ]: above from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008AprJun/0004.html
18:11:11 [AllanJ]: GL: def of Direct commands looks good.
18:11:57 [AllanJ]: ...replace in document "direct keyboard command' with 'direct commands'
18:12:16 [AllanJ]: JS: important to keep 'keyboard'
18:13:55 [AllanJ]: KF: proposal is to use this as definition for 'keyboard command"
18:15:02 [Greg]: I recommend tha t the glossary entry explicitly include any synonyms used in the document (e.g. include "Direct KEYBOARD Command" along with "Keyboard Commands" so that a user doing a text search for the string used in the guidelines will find the glossary entry.
18:15:16 [AllanJ]: all: discussion of glossary structure
18:15:58 [AllanJ]: JS: have a protocol for covering this - definitions, synonyms, etc.
18:16:50 [AllanJ]: Resolved: use Keyboard Commands defintion at http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2008AprJun/0004.html
18:17:01 [jeanne]: action: JS to update the glossary entry for Keyboard commands to include the synonyms.
18:17:01 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-186 - Update the glossary entry for Keyboard commands to include the synonyms. [on Jeanne Spellman - due 2009-05-21].
18:17:21 [AllanJ]: HS: question about definitions and incorporating new defintions
18:17:48 [AllanJ]: ...still some missing. see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2009AprJun/0052.html
18:19:21 [AllanJ]: topic: #71 http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090513/results#xq5
18:20:27 [AllanJ]: KF: reviews survey comments
18:22:17 [AllanJ]: GL: this is not a Level A priority in general software guidelines
18:23:06 [AllanJ]: KF: as I read 4.1.9, does not allow rebinding of platform keybindings (alt, etc.)
18:23:29 [Greg]: Sounds like there are two issues: (1) should this be level A, and (2) confusion about which keyboard UI the UA is required to let the user redefine, and what if any it prohibits the user from redefining?
18:23:46 [AllanJ]: KF: what to we want UA to do with this requirement.
18:24:08 [AllanJ]: GL: UA, minimally accessible. ??? thinking...
18:24:38 [AllanJ]: KF: in IE* add hot key for private browsing - ctrl shhift p
18:24:51 [AllanJ]: ...but if conflict, user should be alble to change that key
18:25:11 [Greg]: Why allow someone to remap keyboard commands? (a) make it something easier for them to enter, (b) make it something that doesn't conflict with assistive technology.
18:25:20 [AllanJ]: ...but not allow user to change cntl+o which opens page.
18:25:28 [AllanJ]: ...if UA wants ... fine
18:26:00 [AllanJ]: KP: speech user, trouble speaking, certain key strokes may be difficult
18:26:32 [AllanJ]: KF: should the UA allow more accessibility that the platform on which it is running
18:27:01 [AllanJ]: ...are we asking too much?
18:27:27 [Greg]: I feel it shouldn't be level A because (a) most software doesn't allow this, thus pretty much all UA would fail to meet Level A (b) because most assistive technology allows (or should allow) their commands to be remapped, (c) ISO 9241-141/ANSI 200.2 make this lower priority than the highest priority, and I don't think it makes sense for the requirements for UA to be higher than general...
18:27:29 [Greg]: ...software in this regard.
18:27:55 [AllanJ]: KP: having the option is good. not sure if it is too much.
18:28:25 [AllanJ]: SH: problem conflating UA and platform accessibility.
18:29:42 [AllanJ]: GL: rationale, make it easier to use, remove conflictions.
18:30:01 [AllanJ]: KF: 2 questions - 1. which level
18:30:34 [AllanJ]: ...2. override ALL, or not allowed to override 'platform
18:30:41 [AllanJ]: ...keys.
18:30:55 [AllanJ]: ...perhaps needs to be rewritten.
18:31:34 [AllanJ]: KF: lower priority, leave workding
18:31:55 [AllanJ]: agree: SH, HS, JA, JS, KF
18:32:41 [AllanJ]: GL: concern: "except" - not prohibiting the overriding of Ctrl+o
18:33:23 [KimPatch]: agree as well
18:33:35 [AllanJ]: Action: KF to minor edit 4.1.9 "does not prohibit' overriding of platform keys
18:33:35 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-187 - Minor edit 4.1.9 "does not prohibit' overriding of platform keys [on Kelly Ford - due 2009-05-21].
18:34:12 [Zakim]: -Henny
18:34:13 [Zakim]: -sharper
18:34:16 [Zakim]: -Kim_Patch
18:34:19 [Zakim]: -Greg_Lowney
18:37:23 [AllanJ]: zakim, please part
18:37:23 [Zakim]: leaving. As of this point the attendees were KFord, Jeanne, Greg_Lowney, Allanj, Henny, Kim_Patch, sharper
18:37:23 [Zakim]: Zakim has left #ua
18:37:56 [AllanJ]: rrsagent, draft minutes
18:37:56 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-minutes.html AllanJ
18:38:33 [AllanJ]: rrsagent, please part
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: I see 8 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-actions.rdf :
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Jim to clean up Greg#55 (4.1.10 & 11) make proposal [1]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T17-12-15
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Greg to take #63 and turn it into a proposal for next week. [2]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T17-21-57
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: JS to work with Greg to take #63 and turn it into a proposal for next week. [3]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T17-22-56
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Greg to rework 4.1.6 [4]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T17-50-30
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: JS to assist GL to write a proposal for 4.1.6 to address concerns of this survey [5]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T17-50-35
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: JS to update the draft with the updated text for 4.1.8: 4.1.8 Important Command Functions: Important command functions (e.g. related to navigation, display, content, information management, etc.) are available using a single or sequence of keystrokes or key combinations. (Level AA) [6]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T18-01-25
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: JS to update the glossary entry for Keyboard commands to include the synonyms. [7]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T18-17-01
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: KF to minor edit 4.1.9 "does not prohibit' overriding of platform keys [8]
18:38:33 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/14-ua-irc#T18-33-35