14:59:15 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #badtf
14:59:15 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-irc
14:59:20 <shadi> zakim, this will be bad
14:59:20 <Zakim> ok, shadi; I see WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute
14:59:27 <shadi> meeting: BAD TF
14:59:28 <eric> eric has joined #badtf
14:59:57 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
14:59:58 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
14:59:59 <Zakim> WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has now started
14:59:59 <Zakim> +Shadi
15:00:22 <shadi> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009May/0019.html
15:00:32 <shadi> agenda+ Meta navigation
15:00:42 <shadi> agenda+ Report format
15:00:47 <Zakim> + +03130239aaaa
15:00:49 <shadi> agenda+ Survey pages
15:00:56 <Zakim> - +03130239aaaa
15:01:01 <shadi> agenda+ Status check and action items
15:01:08 <Zakim> +eric
15:01:09 <shadi> agenda+ Next meetings
15:01:46 <shadi> regrets: Thomas, Marco
15:02:26 <Zakim> + +03130239aabb
15:02:37 <Michael> Michael has joined #badtf
15:02:49 <shadi> zakim, aabb is Wilco
15:02:49 <Zakim> +Wilco; got it
15:04:25 <Zakim> -eric
15:04:47 <eric> eric has joined #badtf
15:05:09 <Zakim> +eric
15:05:13 <Zakim> +??P20
15:05:31 <shadi> zakim, ? is Michael
15:05:31 <Zakim> +Michael; got it
15:05:48 <shadi> zakim, code?
15:05:48 <Zakim> the conference code is 22383 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), shadi
15:06:40 <shadi> scribe: Michael
15:06:58 <shadi> agenda?
15:07:21 <shadi> zakim, drop agendum 2
15:07:21 <Zakim> agendum 2, Status check and further work, dropped
15:07:30 <shadi> zakum, take up next
15:07:38 <shadi> zakim, take up next
15:07:38 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Meta navigation" taken up [from shadi]
15:07:47 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009May/0016
15:07:55 <Michael> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009May/0016
15:08:06 <shadi> http://ericeggert.net/badtf-latest/v2/
15:09:10 <Michael> wikco: color changes are very obvious
15:10:50 <Michael> Michael: color contrast is not sufficien
15:11:10 <Michael> Shadi: likes the design more and more
15:11:40 <Michael> Wilco: the annotation button does not feel right. has a different function / purpose
15:11:47 <Michael> zakim, mute me
15:11:47 <Zakim> Michael should now be muted
15:12:26 <Michael> ... looks more like a different page than the same page with additional information 
15:12:52 <Michael> Wilco: will the annotations be turned on by default?
15:13:05 <Michael> Shadi: not yet decided
15:13:25 <Michael> Shadi: should the button concept be different? 
15:13:47 <Michael> eric: feel very unsure about the issue.
15:14:25 <shadi> http://ericeggert.net/badtf-latest/index/index.html
15:15:03 <Michael> eric: maybe we should move the annotation button out of the box 
15:15:10 <Michael> wilco: possibly
15:15:31 <Michael> wilco: maybe beneath the meta-nav
15:15:55 <Michael> zakim, unmute me
15:15:55 <Zakim> Michael should no longer be muted
15:17:16 <Michael> Michael: maybe below the meta-nav, right hand side. maybe without a button, but with a kind of post-it icon.
15:18:39 <Michael> Shadi: maybe we can take the "show annotation" toggle from the old draft and include it in the new one. 
15:18:44 <Michael> zakim, mute me
15:18:44 <Zakim> Michael should now be muted
15:20:06 <Michael> action, eric will try another redesign
15:20:30 <Michael> zakim, unmute me
15:20:30 <Zakim> Michael should no longer be muted
15:22:06 <Michael> wilco: do we need an unannotated version?
15:22:25 <Michael> michael: the annotations mix up with the original code
15:23:01 <Michael> shadi: an unannotade download might be a solution
15:23:25 <Michael> eric: do not agree with that idea.
15:26:09 <Michael> shadi agrees, that there is a need for an unannotated version online. different audiences might need different versions. 
15:26:28 <Michael> zakim, mute me
15:26:28 <Zakim> Michael should now be muted
15:26:37 <shadi> zakim, take up next
15:26:37 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Report format" taken up [from shadi]
15:26:45 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009May/0015
15:26:57 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/report
15:28:28 <Michael> Shadi: progressive disclosure for SC and TECH might be helpful. more information step by step.
15:28:40 <Michael> Wilco: agrees
15:28:44 <Michael> zakim unmute me
15:28:50 <Michael> zakim, unmute me
15:28:50 <Zakim> Michael should no longer be muted
15:29:43 <Michael> Michael / Shadi: two cols might be sufficient
15:30:07 <Michael> zakim, mute me
15:30:07 <Zakim> Michael should now be muted
15:30:51 <Michael> Shadi: show details / hide details clear enough? icon?
15:30:56 <Michael> eric: clear
15:31:11 <Michael> wilco: icon, mybe in a seperate col might be helpful
15:31:31 <Michael> shadi: we must not mix between data and layout
15:31:44 <Michael> eric: the hierarchy is missing
15:31:51 <Michael> zakim, unmute me
15:31:51 <Zakim> Michael should no longer be muted
15:31:53 <Michael> q+
15:32:05 <Michael> eric: we might insert headings
15:32:16 <Michael> ack m
15:35:05 <Michael> Michael: might be possible to remove the table structure? might make the structure simpler
15:38:03 <Michael> shadi: multidimensional table, breaking the table, nested lists
15:38:09 <Michael> wilco: single table
15:38:19 <Michael> ... with additional structure
15:39:09 <Michael> shadi: a lot of people will reuse the format. we need a more generic format. let's go for the single table approach
15:40:25 <Michael> wilco: separate col for the extra level?
15:41:51 <Michael> wilco: can show the report they made
15:42:43 <Michael> action: shadi reworks the report format
15:43:04 <Michael> action: eric will rework meta-nav+#
15:43:12 <Michael> zakim, mute me
15:43:12 <Zakim> Michael should now be muted
15:43:16 <shadi> zakim, take up next
15:43:16 <Zakim> agendum 5. "Survey pages" taken up [from shadi]
15:43:25 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009May/0018
15:43:33 <Michael> zakim, unmute me
15:43:33 <Zakim> Michael should no longer be muted
15:43:43 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/tmp/survey_before
15:43:51 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/tmp/survey_after
15:46:19 <Michael> shadi: the problems and solutions of the versions described in the email
15:47:22 <Michael> shadi: remving all the combo boxes might be misunderstood
15:47:43 <Michael> eric: dont likes the accessible version
15:48:30 <Michael> eric does not like radiobuttons, no possibility to remove a selected option.
15:48:48 <Michael> eric: would prefer select boxes
15:48:54 <Michael> wilco: agrees
15:49:43 <Michael> wilco: label behind the radio button is a mistake
15:50:11 <Michael> wilco select makes more sense to select a number.
15:50:36 <Michael> residence is a good solution
15:51:09 <Michael> shadi: select vs. radio: for many users combos an issue.
15:53:24 <Michael> shadi: radio are better for less options than select
15:53:53 <Michael> michael: maybe its just the layout
15:54:40 <Michael> eric: we might need a N/A option
15:54:53 <Michael> wilco sees no relation to wcag
15:55:03 <Michael> michael: its a usability issue
15:55:19 <Michael> shadi: maybe there is an advisiory thecnique on that
15:56:25 <Michael> shadi: for q2 and q3 i might reduce the items and implement that as radio buttons and improve layout. 
15:57:33 <Michael> Action: shadi will rework that and prepare several solutions for a decision.
15:57:40 <Michael> eric: remove the reset button
15:59:06 <Michael> michael: leave the submit button one side and don't open the discussion which is the right(TM) one
15:59:58 <Michael> shadi: reduced the news page.
16:00:07 <Michael> eric and wilco like that
16:00:42 <Michael> wilco: are there plans to include video?
16:00:49 <Michael> shadi: its on the wishlist
16:01:20 <Michael> action: wilco writes a proposal how to implement it.
16:01:34 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:01:34 <Zakim> agendum 6. "Status check and action items" taken up [from shadi]
16:01:41 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009May/0017
16:01:53 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/demos/bad/draft/2009/after/home/
16:02:33 <Michael> shadi: please send comments to the list.
16:02:47 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:02:47 <Zakim> agendum 7. "Next meetings" taken up [from shadi]
16:03:21 <Michael> next meeting next week
16:03:24 <Zakim> -eric
16:03:26 <Zakim> -Wilco
16:03:28 <Michael> Michael has left #badtf
16:03:28 <Zakim> -Michael
16:03:37 <Zakim> -Shadi
16:03:39 <Zakim> WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has ended
16:03:39 <Wilco> Wilco has left #badtf
16:03:43 <Zakim> Attendees were Shadi, +03130239aaaa, eric, +03130239aabb, Wilco, Michael
16:16:49 <eric> eric has left #badtf
16:17:21 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
16:17:26 <shadi> rrsagent, make minutes
16:17:26 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-minutes.html shadi
16:17:27 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
16:17:31 <shadi> rrsagent, bye
16:17:31 <RRSAgent> I see 4 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-actions.rdf :
16:17:31 <RRSAgent> ACTION: shadi reworks the report format [1]
16:17:31 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-irc#T15-42-43
16:17:31 <RRSAgent> ACTION: eric will rework meta-nav+# [2]
16:17:31 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-irc#T15-43-04
16:17:31 <RRSAgent> ACTION: shadi will rework that and prepare several solutions for a decision. [3]
16:17:31 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-irc#T15-57-33
16:17:31 <RRSAgent> ACTION: wilco writes a proposal how to implement it. [4]
16:17:31 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/05/13-badtf-irc#T16-01-20
16:17:38 <shadi> zakim, bye
16:17:38 <Zakim> Zakim has left #badtf