14:44:44 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #xhtml
14:44:44 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-irc
14:44:46 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
14:44:46 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #xhtml
14:44:48 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be IA_XHTML2
14:44:48 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 1 minute
14:44:49 <trackbot> Meeting: XHTML2 Working Group Teleconference
14:44:49 <trackbot> Date: 25 February 2009
14:45:32 <Tina> I'm present on IRC, but in another phone meeting.
14:45:33 <alessio> alessio has joined #xhtml
14:45:37 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started
14:45:43 <Zakim> + +2
14:45:59 <Steven_> zakim, dial steven-617
14:45:59 <Zakim> ok, Steven_; the call is being made
14:46:00 <Zakim> +Steven
14:46:07 <Zakim> +McCarron
14:46:15 <ShaneM> zakim, McCarron is ShaneM
14:46:15 <Zakim> +ShaneM; got it
14:46:18 <Zakim> +Roland
14:47:04 <Steven> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Feb/0037.html
14:47:12 <Steven> Chair: Roland
14:47:33 <Zakim> +??P11
14:47:38 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
14:47:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-minutes.html Steven
14:47:43 <alessio> zakim, ??P11 is Alessio
14:47:43 <Zakim> +Alessio; got it
14:47:43 <Steven> zakim, who is here?
14:47:44 <Zakim> On the phone I see +2, Steven, ShaneM, Roland, Alessio
14:47:47 <Zakim> On IRC I see alessio, Zakim, RRSAgent, mgylling, ShaneM, Roland, Tina, Steven, trackbot
14:48:08 <Steven> zakim, +2 is mgylling
14:48:08 <Zakim> +mgylling; got it
14:49:35 <Steven> Previous: http://www.w3.org/2009/02/18-xhtml-minutes.html
14:49:41 <Steven> Scribe: Steven
14:50:00 <Steven> Topic: TPAC and FtFs
14:50:13 <Steven> Roland: We did have a FtF planned.
14:50:52 <Steven> ... But let's talk TPAC
14:51:00 <Steven> Steven: We've been asked if we will be going
14:51:26 <Steven> ... in our case, those of us who can go, and the rest do it by telephone
14:51:42 <Steven> Roland: So who will likely come?
14:52:07 <Tina> Where is it?
14:52:15 <Steven> Shane: California in November? I'd be happy to go
14:52:19 <Steven> Steven: I'll go
14:52:39 <Steven> Roland: Not if it were today; don't know yet about November
14:53:00 <Steven> Steven: November is a difficult time anyway for funding
14:53:24 <Steven> Markus: I have money for one W3C trip, so I could make it
14:53:35 <Steven> Tina?
14:53:55 <Tina> Steven: where is the FtF. California is out for me.
14:54:09 <Steven> OK, California it is
14:54:25 <Steven> Roland: If it is only 2 or 3 people, then most of us would be by phone anyway
14:54:57 <Steven> Steven: TPAC is a good opportunity to meet other WGs though
14:55:13 <Steven> Steven: Shall we give a lukewarm response to the request then?
14:55:19 <Steven> Roland: That's the best we can do
14:55:47 <Steven> Steven: And then FtFs (virtual)
14:57:19 <Steven> ... do we want to plan a long phone call?
14:57:44 <Steven> Roland: Yes, a couple of days, two 4 hour calls maybe, to break the back of some of the work
14:58:20 <Steven> ... that would make it easier to find timezone friendly slots
14:58:35 <Steven> ... so how about one in the next month?
14:58:47 <Steven> Steven: Suits me
14:59:55 <Steven> ... what are people's favoured times
15:00:04 <Steven> Shane: Honestly doesn't matter
15:00:22 <Steven> Steven: Anyone else?
15:00:44 <Steven> Roland: Tuesday and Thursday maybe, pm UTC
15:02:50 <Steven> Roland: How about one session on Tuesday 17 March?
15:02:56 <Steven> Markus: Not for me
15:03:04 <Steven> ... in LA the whole week at a conference
15:03:30 <Steven> ... hwo about 10th
15:03:35 <Steven> s/hwo/how/
15:03:49 <Steven> Steven: and the 12th I could do
15:04:16 <Tina> I can do most times/dates.
15:04:48 <Steven> Roland: Time?
15:05:13 <Steven> Shane: 13-17 UTC would be fine for me
15:05:22 <Steven> Steven: OK with me too
15:05:34 <alessio> +1
15:05:44 <Roland> +1
15:05:47 <mgylling> +1
15:06:50 <Steven> Markus: Preliminary date for the second?
15:07:36 <Zakim> -Alessio
15:07:53 <Steven> Steven: I can't make the 19th
15:08:53 <Steven> Topic: @lang
15:09:03 <Steven> Roland: We are happy to do it.
15:09:26 <Steven> ... I think it is already in HTML5
15:09:43 <Steven> Shane: Isn't that only in the XML Serialization?
15:10:08 <Steven> Roland: Is it in the current PERs?
15:10:12 <mgylling> xml:lang is now allowed in HTML when lang is also specified and they have the same value. In XML lang is allowed if xml:lang is also specified and they have the same value. 
15:10:13 <Steven> Shane: I thought so
15:10:23 <mgylling> http://www.w3.org/TR/2009/WD-html5-diff-20090212/
15:10:59 <alessio> zakim, code?
15:10:59 <Zakim> the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), alessio
15:11:01 <Steven> XHTML 1.1 - Module-based XHTML 
15:11:01 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11 
15:11:01 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/PER-xhtml11-20090206/ 
15:11:01 <Steven>      XHTML Basic 1.1 
15:11:01 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-basic 
15:11:01 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/PER-xhtml-basic-20090206/ 
15:11:03 <Steven>      XHTML Print 
15:11:05 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-print/ 
15:11:07 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/PER-xhtml-print-20090206/ 
15:11:09 <Steven>      XHTML 1.0 The Extensible HyperText Markup Language 
15:11:12 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1 
15:11:13 <Steven>           http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/PER-xhtml1-20090218/ 
15:11:16 <Steven>  
15:11:34 <Steven> Steven: Yes @lang is in there
15:11:55 <Steven> Roland: So it's in there, nothing we have to do
15:12:43 <Zakim> +??P11
15:13:00 <Tina> Zakim, P11 is Tina
15:13:00 <Zakim> sorry, Tina, I do not recognize a party named 'P11'
15:13:08 <Tina> Zakim, +??P11 is Tina
15:13:08 <Zakim> sorry, Tina, I do not recognize a party named '+??P11'
15:13:25 <alessio> zakim, ??P11 is TIna
15:13:27 <Zakim> +TIna; got it
15:13:36 <Tina> alessio: thank you :)
15:13:55 <alessio> :) 
15:14:47 <Zakim> +??P12
15:14:58 <alessio> zakim, ??P12 is Alessio
15:14:58 <Zakim> +Alessio; got it
15:15:24 <Zakim> -Alessio
15:15:59 <Steven> Topic: PERs
15:16:08 <Steven> Steven: They have been requested
15:16:18 <Steven> ... waiting for a reply basically
15:16:32 <Steven> Topic: Member survey
15:19:39 <_alessio> _alessio has joined #xhtml
15:20:20 <Steven> Steven: XHTML2 WG got quite a lot of support
15:20:26 <Zakim> +??P12
15:20:34 <_alessio> zakim, ??P12 is Alessio
15:20:34 <Zakim> +Alessio; got it
15:20:49 <Steven> Topic: WAI ARIA Last call
15:21:28 <Tina> Zakim, mute me
15:21:28 <Zakim> TIna should now be muted
15:21:47 <Steven> Roland: DEadline 24 March
15:21:51 <Steven> s?DE/De/
15:21:56 <Steven> s/DE/De/
15:22:41 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/2009/02/13-hcg-minutes.html
15:23:15 <Steven> Shane: How could HCG have agreed such a tight timeline?
15:23:23 <Steven> Steven: Wait, I don't think they did
15:23:42 <Steven> ... their decision to go to last call was after the last HCG meeting
15:26:56 <Tina> Zakim, unmute me
15:26:56 <Zakim> TIna should no longer be muted
15:27:04 <Steven> Shane: Tina, are you going to read it?
15:27:31 <Steven> Tina: I do plan to read, I can do a light review
15:29:04 <Steven> Shane: Let's talk about it in 3 weeks then
15:29:38 <Steven> ACTION: Tina to lightly review WAI ARIA by 18 March
15:29:38 <trackbot> Created ACTION-51 - Lightly review WAI ARIA by 18 March [on Tina Holmboe - due 2009-03-04].
15:29:51 <Steven> ACTION: Steven to read WAI ARIA by 18 march
15:29:54 <trackbot> Created ACTION-52 - Read WAI ARIA by 18 march [on Steven Pemberton - due 2009-03-04].
15:30:25 <Steven> TOPIC: AC MEeting
15:30:30 <Steven> s/ME/Me/
15:33:24 <Zakim> -Alessio
15:34:17 <alessio> alessio has joined #xhtml
15:35:17 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:35:29 <alessio> zakim, IPcaller is Alessio
15:35:29 <Zakim> +Alessio; got it
15:35:58 <ShaneM> http://www.w3.org/2007/03/HTML-WG-charter
15:36:03 <Steven> Steven: The HTML5 chater has been rolled back
15:36:38 <Steven> ... there are now two WGs with XHTML1.* in their charter
15:36:47 <Steven> s/chater/charter/
15:37:06 <Steven> Shane: I can see why this would be an issue for the AC then
15:42:07 <Steven> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2009Jan/0048.html
15:42:17 <Steven>   <http://webbackplane.com/mark-birbeck/blog/2009/01/rdfa-means-extensibility>
15:42:37 <Steven> Steven: So there are a number of possible solutions being proposed
15:43:08 <Steven> Roland: Steven, you were going to write a summary
15:43:25 <Steven> Steven: I published the url to a first draft last week
15:43:39 <Steven> ... Already had some good comments from Markus
15:44:05 <Steven> ... and he pointed me to the links above of commetns by Mark
15:44:28 <Steven> s/metns/ments/
15:45:02 <Steven> Roland: Extensibility is not the essence of XHTML2 as far as I can see
15:45:25 <Steven> ... it is more *intent*
15:45:41 <Steven> ... separation of concerns
15:46:00 <Steven> ... what goes over the wires is a rendering issue
15:46:18 <Steven> ... the degree of separation is the essence of XHTML2
15:46:32 <Steven> ... which is why it is beneficial to device independence
15:46:51 <Steven> ... we have the opposite view of what to do as HTML5
15:47:02 <Steven> ... not about pixel perfection at the authoring level
15:47:41 <Steven> [ADJOURN]
15:47:45 <Zakim> -Roland
15:47:46 <Zakim> -TIna
15:47:48 <Zakim> -ShaneM
15:47:50 <Zakim> -Alessio
15:47:53 <Zakim> -mgylling
15:48:04 <Zakim> -Steven
15:48:06 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended
15:48:07 <Zakim> Attendees were Steven, ShaneM, Roland, Alessio, mgylling, TIna
15:48:08 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
15:48:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-minutes.html Steven
15:49:16 <Roland> Roland has left #xhtml
15:50:05 <Steven> no
15:50:08 <Steven> just 1.*
15:50:19 <Steven> s/DE/De/
15:50:23 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
15:50:23 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-minutes.html Steven
15:51:01 <Steven> s|s?De/De/||
15:51:06 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
15:51:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-minutes.html Steven
15:53:24 <ShaneM> I do not believe that the AC voted on the charter that is currently at the html 5 charter URI.  BUt of course since I am not on the AC, I do not have the record of the mails that were sent asking for votes.
15:53:26 <Steven> Regrets: MarkB
15:53:42 <Steven> why do you think that Shane?
15:53:45 <Steven> I can check
15:54:07 <ShaneM> because I am relatively certain that at the time we pointed out the inconsistency between the charters and it got fixed
15:54:23 <Steven> I'll look later
15:57:52 <Tina> It sounds as if there is a procedure flaw somewhere. Has the issue of who, in general, maintain and develop XHTML Family documents been formally concluded on?
15:58:10 <ShaneM> no.  there is an AC meeting in a couple of weeks and I suspect that is on the agenda.
15:58:45 <Steven> rrsagent, bye
15:58:45 <RRSAgent> I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-actions.rdf :
15:58:45 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Tina to lightly review WAI ARIA by 18 March [1]
15:58:45 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-irc#T15-29-38
15:58:45 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Steven to read WAI ARIA by 18 march [2]
15:58:45 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/02/25-xhtml-irc#T15-29-51