15:58:09 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #badtf
15:58:09 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/02/04-badtf-irc
15:58:16 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #badtf
15:58:23 <shadi> zakim, this will be bad
15:58:23 <Zakim> ok, shadi, I see WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM already started
15:58:25 <Michael> hi everybody, i'll be on the phone soon, have to finish a call first
15:58:38 <shadi> meeting: BAD TF
15:59:04 <shadi> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Feb/0005.html
15:59:17 <shadi> agenda+ Feedback on demo pages
15:59:19 <Wilco> am i first in the call or did i get the number wrong?
15:59:25 <shadi> agenda+  Feedback on In-Between pages
15:59:43 <shadi> agenda+ Additional demo updates
15:59:55 <shadi> agenda+  Next meetings
16:00:03 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:00:03 <Zakim> On the phone I see +03130239aaaa
16:00:14 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
16:00:14 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
16:00:17 <Zakim> + +1.781.662.aabb
16:00:30 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
16:00:30 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
16:00:31 <Zakim> +Shadi
16:00:36 <Zakim> - +1.781.662.aabb
16:00:43 <Zakim> + +49.173.673.aacc
16:00:53 <shadi> zakim, aaaa is Wilco
16:00:53 <Zakim> +Wilco; got it
16:00:59 <shadi> zakim, aacc is Eric
16:00:59 <Zakim> +Eric; got it
16:01:12 <Tom> Tom has joined #badtf
16:01:12 <eric> eric has joined #badtf
16:02:07 <maik_w> maik_w has joined #badtf
16:02:15 <Zakim> + +1.714.968.aadd
16:02:23 <Zakim> + +43.650.935.aaee
16:02:37 <shadi> zakim, aadd is Tom
16:02:37 <Zakim> +Tom; got it
16:02:44 <shadi> zakim, aaee is Michael
16:02:44 <Zakim> +Michael; got it
16:04:57 <shadi> scribe: Wilco
16:05:07 <shadi> zakim, take up agendum 1
16:05:07 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Feedback on demo pages" taken up [from shadi]
16:05:27 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Jan/0019
16:06:11 <maik_w> Sorry guys, got problems to get on the conference-Computer, just a second...
16:07:11 <Zakim> + +49.201.750.0.aaff
16:07:31 <Tom> q+
16:08:01 <shadi> zakim, aaff is Maik
16:08:01 <Zakim> +Maik; got it
16:08:44 <Wilco> tom: problem of sun image, alt 'sunny spells' doesn't  make much sence
16:09:03 <eric> q+
16:09:14 <shadi> ack t
16:09:19 <shadi> ack e
16:10:17 <Wilco> eric: leave the alt empty
16:10:27 <Michael> q+
16:10:47 <shadi> ack m
16:12:13 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/before/index
16:12:24 <Wilco> shadi: maybe the weather image can be dynamic
16:13:56 <Wilco> shadi: demo has been presented to the waiage tf
16:14:45 <eric> latest latest version: http://ericeggert.net/badtf-latest/info/
16:16:18 <shadi> http://ericeggert.net/badtf-latest/index/
16:16:34 <Wilco> tom: latest version looks great
16:17:55 <shadi> http://www.einfach-fuer-alle.de/biene-2008/gewinner/#bienen
16:19:26 <Wilco> wilco: there's a layout bug in the last version on font resizing in IE6
16:22:28 <Wilco> shadi: the background of the tab button makes the demo page look like a screenshot
16:23:39 <Wilco> shadi: we should save finetuning for later
16:23:59 <shadi> agenda?
16:24:09 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:24:09 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Feedback on In-Between pages" taken up [from shadi]
16:24:50 <shadi> scribe: maik_w
16:25:17 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Jan/0011
16:25:46 <shadi> http://www.wienfluss.net/BAD/inbetween/inbetween_after.html
16:26:48 <maik_w> wilko: screenreader users got the extra-elements always on their screen. Any idea?
16:27:59 <maik_w> wilko: sreenreaders focus always on the images how to focus on the title?
16:29:58 <maik_w> shadi: using a poup-box is a better solution?
16:30:30 <maik_w> shadi: better then jumping to the bottom?
16:32:03 <maik_w> wilco: maybe we can set the focus to the anchor
16:33:04 <maik_w> wilco: will prepare a proposal with a positioned icon at the annotation
16:33:51 <maik_w> shadi: the icons are to small?
16:34:37 <maik_w> tom: a page full of icons would be a visual desaster
16:35:40 <maik_w> michael: new idea: icon-collection besides the page
16:36:12 <maik_w> shadi: a legend is needed
16:38:01 <maik_w> shadi: we agreed: only two icons per page: "tick" and "information" at accessible version
16:38:39 <maik_w> shadi: "error" and "information" at the inaccessible version
16:40:08 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:40:08 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Additional demo updates" taken up [from shadi]
16:40:17 <shadi> scribe: Wilco
16:41:05 <Wilco> maik: all updates have been mailed
16:41:10 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/waiage
16:42:04 <eric> q+
16:42:23 <Wilco> tom: we should use relative units rather then pt for text size
16:42:54 <eric> q-
16:43:21 <Wilco> shadi: which of the wai-age requirements have we not shown yet that we want to show
16:44:24 <Wilco> maik: my idea was to make the before demo to show more problems
16:44:28 <shadi> http://www.mcwiwa.de/bad-tf/waiage_updated.htm
16:44:58 <Wilco> tom: sounds good
16:45:23 <maik_w> newer version: http://www.mcwiwa.de/bad-tf/waiage_updatedII.htm
16:46:19 <Wilco> maik: take the before page and make it worse
16:47:36 <Wilco> shadi: does anybody have comments on the updateed list?
16:47:50 <Wilco> tom: items looked good
16:48:45 <Wilco> shadi: no consence on if we should use font resize links, he suggests leaving it out
16:49:39 <Wilco> shadi: leave breadcrums and text resize out
16:50:22 <Wilco> tom: sounds like we agree on maik's list
16:52:23 <Wilco> maik: not sure how to demonstrate the problem of blue/green
16:54:05 <Wilco> maik: maybe use blue/gree in the before page as a contrast problem
16:54:46 <Wilco> shadi: many of the requirements do not mix with the demo
16:55:38 <Wilco> tom: stick with WCAG 2
16:56:45 <Wilco> tom: maybe if the table has an column showing bad and good example
16:57:46 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Jan/0007
16:58:17 <Wilco> shadi: some of the problems have been talked about by michael
16:58:37 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:58:37 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Next meetings" taken up [from shadi]
16:59:26 <Wilco> wilco: can get some things ready for the inbetween pages
16:59:43 <Wilco> maik: will get a list of proposals for worse bad page
16:59:55 <Wilco> shadi: think it will be good to have a meeting next week
17:00:54 <Zakim> -Tom
17:00:56 <Zakim> -Wilco
17:00:57 <Zakim> -Shadi
17:00:57 <Zakim> -Maik
17:00:59 <Zakim> -Eric
17:01:04 <Zakim> -Michael
17:01:06 <Zakim> WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has ended
17:01:09 <Zakim> Attendees were +03130239aaaa, +1.781.662.aabb, Shadi, +49.173.673.aacc, Wilco, Eric, +1.714.968.aadd, +43.650.935.aaee, Tom, Michael, +49.201.750.0.aaff, Maik
17:01:10 <Wilco> Wilco has left #badtf
17:01:56 <Michael> here is a IE6 screenshot for the minutes: http://www.wienfluss.net/BAD/ie6_screenshot.png
17:02:13 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
17:02:17 <shadi> rrsagent, make minutes
17:02:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/02/04-badtf-minutes.html shadi
17:02:18 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
17:02:22 <shadi> rrsagent, bye
17:02:22 <RRSAgent> I see no action items