15:01:50 RRSAgent has joined #tt 15:01:50 logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/01/23-tt-irc 15:01:52 RRSAgent, make logs public 15:01:52 Zakim has joined #tt 15:01:54 Zakim, this will be DFXP 15:01:55 ok, trackbot, I see IA_(DFXP)10:00AM already started 15:01:55 Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference 15:01:55 Date: 23 January 2009 15:02:00 +Plh 15:02:32 + +0147383aaaa 15:03:12 zakim, ??p15 is Glenn 15:03:12 +Glenn; got it 15:03:18 zakim, aaaa is John 15:03:18 +John; got it 15:05:25 + +0154558aabb 15:05:43 zakim, aabb is Sean 15:05:43 +Sean; got it 15:06:02 +??P2 15:06:29 zakim, ??p2 is David 15:06:29 +David; got it 15:06:50 Regrets: Andrew 15:10:17 + +04179827aacc 15:11:53 zakim, aacc is Franz 15:11:53 +Franz; got it 15:12:27 scribe: plh 15:12:37 Chair: Sean 15:12:40 david has joined #tt 15:12:48 Sean: question 1: 15:12:50 ... 15:13:04 ... we have 2 yes, 2 no 15:13:27 ... the goal was to required the ttm: namespace elements to be nested 15:13:54 Glenn: I believe they should be allowed outside the metadata elements 15:14:19 Sean: the reason for this to come up: it's just easier if all the metadata is in one place 15:14:31 ... having it all over the place makes it more complex 15:15:06 Glenn: the rationale was to support farm metadata as well. 15:16:05 Sean: because the metadata element is called "metadata", I assumed that all metadata will go there 15:17:00 Glenn: part of the reasons for having the metadata element was to support transformation processor to group metadata 15:17:16 ... ie having some grouping mechanisms 15:17:31 ... if a transformation combines metadata from two sources into one source 15:17:51 ... it might group them by origin in the result document 15:18:18 Sean: it's not about having the metadata grouping element 15:18:32 ... if title is metadata, they should be in the metadata element 15:18:48 ... if not, then it should be moved out of the metadata namespace 15:19:30 Glenn: it creates work to make a change now and it doesn't seem a significant issue to change now 15:19:49 Sean: that's a cognitive issue. I'd expect to find all the metadata would be in the metadata element 15:20:15 ... how much work is it to move title out of the metadata namespace or within the metadata element 15:20:39 Glenn: probably not that complex. change in the schema. that's substantive change, but it wouldn't be that difficult 15:20:57 David: I don't have a strong feeling one way or the other 15:21:34 ... if we're going to put title in ttm, we identified it as metadata already, why moving it into metadata? 15:21:49 Sean: since no one feels strongly, let's leave as-is 15:22:26 Resolution: ISSUE-3 to be closed without change 15:22:53 Topic: ISSUE-5 15:23:56 Sean: ISSUE-3 was about more than one metadata element, and ISSUE-5 is about direct children 15:24:43 Topic: ISSUE-4 15:25:15 Resolution: we should allow the ttm attributes on the region element 15:26:29 s/ISSUE-3 and ISSUE-5 to be closed if no objection from Geoff/ 15:26:51 Topic: ISSUE-6 15:28:42 Sean: the idea here is that we define fixed set of roles and if we want to extend, we would need to add values 15:29:08 ... agent is fairly complicated structure and you can point to that 15:29:21 ... having a role element would allow the same 15:29:28 ... there is no user defined role in the spec 15:30:07 Glenn: there is an extension mechanism. 15:30:26 Resolution: close ISSUE-6 without changes 15:31:05 David: peharps we could simplify the actors as well... 15:31:32 Glenn: are you suggesting a ttm:actor attribute? 15:32:08 David: yes, ttm:agent is an IDREF that has to refer to the agent element 15:32:27 Sean: should we wait on this and revisit issue-6 later? 15:32:49 ... let's keep close and reopen it later if necessary 15:33:11 Topic: ISSUE-7 15:33:31 Sean: we inherited it from SMIL. that's the only abbrev form we have 15:33:53 Glenn: we have an appendix that describe where our vocabulary comes from 15:34:08 ... ttm:desc comes from svg:desc 15:34:16 Sean: why from svg? 15:34:39 Glenn: we took a couple from them: metadata, set, desc, title comes from SVG 15:35:06 ... for the attributes, we referenced SMIL for some of them 15:35:21 Sean: I prefer to have full word when we can 15:35:39 ... it would be cleaner to have a full word 15:35:51 David: don't have a strong feeling. it's easier if it's full word 15:36:06 ... in this case, it's in metadata namespace. 15:36:45 Glenn: SMIL, SMIL and XHTML are all consistent in using desc 15:36:58 Resolution: ISSUE-7 is closed with no change 15:37:08 Topic: ISSUE-8 15:37:21 skipped (needs Geoff around) 15:37:33 Topic: ISSUE-10 15:37:44 skipped (needs Geoff around) 15:37:51 Glenn: who proposed it? 15:37:54 Sean: I did 15:38:36 Glenn: we made design choice not to allow linking to external media 15:39:18 Sean: we had a long discussion about that a while ago, fonts, images, audio, ... we decided we did not want that 15:39:29 s/Sean/Glenn/ 15:39:48 Sean: I'm doing it in a private namespace right now, so not an issue 15:40:00 Resolution: ISSUE-10 is postponed to v.next 15:40:11 Topic: ISSUE-11 15:40:54 Resolution: we'll make the change 15:41:41 ACTION: Glenn to fix inconsistency with regard to time container defaults 15:41:41 Created ACTION-29 - Fix inconsistency with regard to time container defaults [on Glenn Adams - due 2009-01-30]. 15:43:29 Topic: ISSUE-18 15:43:48 Glenn: I could add an editorial note to clarify the semantic from SMIL 15:44:15 ACTION: Glenn add an editorial note to clarify the semantic from SMIL for dur and end 15:44:15 Created ACTION-30 - add an editorial note to clarify the semantic from SMIL for dur and end [on Glenn Adams - due 2009-01-30]. 15:44:37 Topic: ISSUE-19 15:44:45 Resolution: ISSUE-19 closed. no change. 15:45:11 Topic: ISSUE-20 15:45:27 David: that seems late to make a change now 15:46:18 Sean: we may reopne them if it's a major problem 15:46:35 ... happy to postpone to v.next 15:47:07 ACTION: Philippe to foward CEA communication to the list 15:47:07 Created ACTION-31 - Foward CEA communication to the list [on Philippe Le Hégaret - due 2009-01-30]. 15:47:50 Sean: check to make sure it's ok to make it public 15:48:24 Topic: ISSUE-26 15:49:54 Glenn: [...] it's specified in the definition of overflow in the spec 15:50:06 ... [citing the spec] 15:50:44 Sean: sounds reasonable. can we add a note on the scroll value to point to that text? 15:51:24 Glenn: the scroll value is under the definition of the overflow, so it's already there 15:51:36 Sean: we will remove that if we don't have dynamic flow? 15:51:39 Glenn: yes 15:51:51 Resolution: ISSUE-26 is closed. no change. 15:52:20 Topic: ISSUE-27 15:52:36 Glenn: we have some inconsistency indeed with XSL... 15:52:59 ... looks like we tried to make it more consistent with naming instead of XSL 15:53:21 Sean: everybody said we should be consistent with XSL or we should document why not 15:53:32 Glenn: I'm happy to make it consistent with XSL 15:53:42 Resolution: ISSUE-27 to make it consistent with XSL 15:54:20 Topic: Next steps 15:54:33 Philippe: we look into creating a new questionnaire 15:56:28 Topic: Namespace style 15:58:58 -Glenn 16:06:22 -Sean 16:06:23 -Franz 16:06:25 -John 16:06:25 -David 16:06:52 Glenn: we never fixed the namespace in the spec 16:07:11 -Plh 16:07:13 IA_(DFXP)10:00AM has ended 16:07:14 Attendees were Plh, +0147383aaaa, Glenn, John, +0154558aabb, Sean, David, +04179827aacc, Franz 16:07:28 Philippe: other groups usually fix it at CR by respect for implementators, unless they make significant changes 16:07:45 Sean: we can be lenient for now in the test suite and fix it later 16:08:27 Philippe: ok. as long as we demonstrate interop at the end of CR. We could a short version for namespace btw, e.g. http://www.w3.org/ns/dfxp 16:08:39 Sean: would very much like to switch to that indeed 16:09:01 Resolution: we'll use a short namespace (ie no year/month) by the end of CR 16:09:06 [adjourned] 16:09:11 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/01/23-tt-minutes.html plh 17:40:07 Zakim has left #tt