15:51:32 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #svgig
15:51:32 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/11/20-svgig-irc
15:51:34 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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15:51:36 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be SVGIG
15:51:36 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see GA_SVGIG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes
15:51:37 <trackbot> Meeting: SVG Interest Group Teleconference
15:51:37 <trackbot> Date: 20 November 2008
15:53:43 <stelt> stelt has joined #svgig
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15:54:54 <JeffSchiller> shepazu
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15:57:29 <Zakim> GA_SVGIG()11:00AM has now started
15:57:29 <Zakim> +Shepazu
15:57:37 <Zakim> +??P5
15:57:39 <Zakim> -??P5
15:57:39 <Zakim> +??P5
15:58:27 <Zakim> + +1.713.851.aaaa
15:58:30 <shepazu> Christophe, it depends upon the WG
15:58:35 <Manuel> Manuel has joined #svgig
15:58:44 <shepazu> I think most of them are
15:58:52 <Zakim> + +1.312.540.aabb
16:00:14 <JeffSchiller> Zakim, aabb is JeffSchiller
16:00:14 <Zakim> +JeffSchiller; got it
16:00:15 <Zakim> +Christophe_Strobbe
16:00:47 <Zakim> +Rob_Russell
16:01:43 <Manuel> i'm here, but, as mentioned, not in reach of a phone
16:02:21 <stelt> me
16:02:34 <Christophe> Previous minutes are at http://www.w3.org/2008/11/06-svgig-minutes.html
16:03:16 <JeffSchiller> JeffSchiller has joined #svgig
16:04:43 <Christophe> Scribe: Christophe
16:04:48 <Christophe> Meeting: SVG IG
16:05:04 <Christophe> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-ig/2008OctDec/0087.html
16:05:25 <Christophe> Chair: Jeff, Doug
16:06:04 <Christophe> Topic: SVG Spec
16:07:26 <Christophe> DS: SVG 1.2 has entered PR phase (yesterday). Announcement: http://www.w3.org/News/2008#item192
16:08:10 <shepazu> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVGTiny12/
16:08:38 <Christophe> DS: Notable change: URL is no longer 'SVGMobile' etc but 'SVGTiny': http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/PR-SVGTiny12-20081117/
16:09:10 <Christophe> DS: Sort of important: clarify the message of SVG. Want to work on marketing.
16:09:32 <Christophe> JS: I.e. the spec is not only aimed at the mobile space.
16:09:47 <shepazu> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/1.2/Tiny/ImpReport.html
16:09:49 <Rob_Russell> Rob_Russell has joined #svgig
16:09:54 <stelt> SVG counting in mobile space: http://www.visionmobile.com/blog/2008/11/the-100-million-club-the-bigger-picture-of-mobile-software/
16:10:06 <Christophe> DS: See also implementation report at http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/1.2/Tiny/ImpReport.html
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16:10:35 <Christophe> DS: New version of the test suite does not rely on XML ID.
16:11:14 <Christophe> DS: Desktop browsers were not interested in implementing XML ID, and there were other issues related to XML ID.
16:11:21 <Zakim> +Don_Doherty
16:11:32 <Christophe> DS: Basically say: "only use XML ID if you are in a non-browser environment"
16:13:00 <Christophe> DS: Only risk now would be if W3C member companies now said they don't want to publish it. (Not very likely.)
16:13:31 <Christophe> DS: Companies interested in seeing SVG 1.2 published are asked to support it.
16:13:46 <Christophe> DS: Possibly REC in mid December.
16:13:51 <stelt> woot!!
16:14:54 <Christophe> DS: SVG GI web site would be a good promotion tool. The book, too.
16:15:25 <Christophe> rrsagent, make logs world
16:15:40 <Christophe> DS: also ask more people to implement SVG
16:16:36 <Christophe> DS: Convince people in Safari and Firefox to take SVG 1.2 as an implementation target by saying X is better defined in SVG 1.2; it's a better reference for resolving bugs.
16:17:02 <Christophe> JS: Pushback microDOM?
16:17:18 <Christophe> DS: That was one of the less populart parts in SVG, but it's very useful.
16:17:40 <Bruce_> Bruce_ has joined #svgig
16:17:53 <Christophe> JS: In terms of implementation, microdom is easier that full SVG 1.1 DOM. Another DOM might be expensive.
16:18:05 <Christophe> DS: Much of it is convenience methods.
16:18:33 <Christophe> DS: Anything that can be implemented as it stands: encourage vendors to implement.
16:19:08 <Christophe> JS: Future? SVG 2.0 Core mentioned in places
16:19:20 <Christophe> DS: Not yet 100% certain about path forward.
16:19:52 <Christophe> DS: Current plan: build modules that describe specific pieces of functionality. you could plug them into SVG Tiny 1.2.
16:20:29 <Christophe> DS: SVG 1.2 has most of the features of SVG 2.0; the modules ... Other modules would introduce new features.
16:21:07 <Christophe> DS: SVG 2 would be a major rewrite of the spec but not necessarily much new functionality. tighthening up the spec and changes things to make it more adaptable. Integration with HTML content.
16:21:51 <Christophe> DS: Make it a more stable platform. E.g. allowing non-namespaced href on outgonig links as well as ... etc.
16:23:18 <Manuel> I'd like to see mentioning of text format handling in SVG 2.0via XHTML *or* XSL-FO, that would be great.
16:23:25 <Christophe> DS: We resolved to work on modules. In the near future, there would be a path to follow before a single profile ...
16:23:52 <Christophe> Topic: SVG IG Japan
16:24:59 <Christophe> DS: Japanese chapter - Japanese market is not comfortable communicating through the same channels as rest of W3C. They're more comfortable discussing technical matters in japanese.
16:25:24 <Christophe> DS: Try to see how they can promote SVG in Japan, find use cases and requirements and bring the back to the SVG IG.
16:25:35 <Christophe> DS: Two main things going one:
16:26:35 <Christophe> DS: (1) KDDI (service provider) is working on a "map module": module for mapping uses. Have a prototype. Not necessarily a general SVG viewer, but works on mobiles.
16:26:53 <stelt> LOD
16:27:28 <Christophe> DS: They're working on things like level of detail (e.g. when you zoom in, blocks resolve into individual buildings etc)
16:28:06 <Christophe> DS: Range of zoom - e.g. from zoom level 5 - 10 show X, from 10 - 15 show X details etc
16:28:22 <Christophe> JS: At the highest zoom level, you dont want all the details in your document.
16:28:56 <Christophe> DS: See the 'discard' element; also need 'add' element: add something to the DOM when useful.
16:29:41 <Zakim> + +33.1.77.11.aacc
16:29:49 <Christophe> DS: Also tile mechanism so you don't need whole map.
16:29:55 <darobin> Zakim: aacc is me
16:30:05 <darobin> Zakim, aacc is me
16:30:05 <Zakim> +darobin; got it
16:30:42 <Christophe> DS: (2) Also working on making SVG 1.2 Tiny ratify in JISC. Until it is a JISC standard, Japanese companies won't implement it.
16:31:13 <Christophe> DS: More a formalization thing. If they decide that it is a good time to have this spec, they'll translate it.
16:31:40 <Christophe> DS: They're also interested in making the mapping module a JISC standard.
16:31:53 <Christophe> DS: Not aware of changes that they would want to make.
16:32:04 <darobin> q+
16:32:24 <Christophe> Topic: SVG Open 2009
16:32:42 <Christophe> JS: Google no sponsor for SVG Open 2009
16:33:38 <Christophe> RB: Liaison statement from ITU (?) to SVG about standardizing SVG for interactive TV.
16:34:53 <Christophe> RB: The statement was sent by one of the ITU groups; a group that has to do with interactivity.
16:35:08 <Christophe> DS: Discuss off-line.
16:36:04 <Christophe> DS: JSR-287 : up for ratification as well.
16:36:32 <Christophe> JS: One of the companies there is NVidia.
16:36:46 <Christophe> Topic: SVG Open 2009
16:37:09 <Christophe> XX: someone had good contacts with NVidia.
16:37:19 <darobin> s/XX/RB/
16:37:30 <darobin> s/someone/Nandini/
16:38:17 <stelt> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicon_Valley shows loads of parties to maybe contact
16:38:29 <Christophe> JS: Conference: can work that out on the mailing list.
16:38:40 <Christophe> JS: Robin Berjon: first time on IG call.
16:38:57 <Christophe> RB: Independent consultant. Was member of SVG WG for a few years.
16:39:11 <shepazu> http://www.w3.org/TR/ElementTraversal/
16:39:14 <Christophe> RB: Also editor on the community site.
16:39:37 <Christophe> DS: Element traversal spec: really useful for SVG.
16:40:28 <Christophe> DS: Was moved out of SVG and moved to Web Apps WG and is going to PR.
16:40:36 <shepazu> http://www.w3.org/2008/webapps/ElementTraversal/index.html
16:40:50 <Christophe> DS: There is an implementation report at http://www.w3.org/2008/webapps/ElementTraversal/index.html
16:41:20 <Christophe> RB: Same interface as in HTML 5?
16:41:20 <stelt>  SVG Open 2009: Enschede city has economical relation with Palo Alto city. Thin, but looking into it for leads
16:42:34 <Christophe> DS: Already planning Element Traversal 2.0.
16:42:59 <Rob_Russell> http://ejohn.org/blog/element-traversal-api/
16:43:46 <Christophe> DS: Element Traversal 2.0 already being implemented; could be published next year.
16:43:55 <Christophe> Topic: SVG Community Website
16:44:10 <Christophe> RR: Working on a theme.
16:44:54 <Christophe> RR: Looks good graphically, but ... Will be uploaded to the site later; either default or optional.
16:45:49 <Christophe> RR: Also turned on the update check .... Drupal updated.
16:46:15 <stelt> the sooner to have something other than the default Drupal the better IMHO. We can perfect later
16:46:38 <shepazu> q+ to ask about RSS feed for news
16:46:51 <Manuel> i'm working on how the forums page could look, but it will last a bit (weekend?)
16:46:55 <stelt> I've figured out how moderating works :-)
16:48:00 <JeffSchiller> http://www.planetsvg.com/news
16:48:05 <Christophe> RR: list items - new: need to get URL at bottom of the blurb.
16:48:15 <stelt> make NEWS index ?
16:48:25 <Christophe> s/new/news/
16:49:13 <Christophe> RR: Need to work on news feed and global feed for articles (RSS or Atom)
16:50:10 <Christophe> RS: currently site looks like nothing is happening.
16:50:46 <Christophe> RR: (...) In the theme we can filter which types of content go into which boxes.
16:51:32 <Christophe> JS: News and latest stories and articles should be major focus.
16:53:01 <Christophe> RR: Manuel working on ... theme.
16:54:57 <Christophe> DS: Worried about input and output. Would like this as source of info for SVG WG page. RSS feed for news available?
16:55:21 <Christophe> RR: No feed for news yet. There will also be other feeds.
16:56:11 <stelt> raw feed is what editors get
16:56:22 <Christophe> DS: Also interested in raw feed with Google news alerts etc where SVG is mentioned .
16:56:49 <Christophe> RR: The editors get that feed and approve things for publication.
16:57:16 <gwadej> Apologies, but I have a meeting and have to go. Bye.
16:57:30 <Zakim> - +1.713.851.aaaa
16:58:11 <Christophe> Zakim, +1.713 was gwadej
16:58:11 <Zakim> I don't understand '+1.713 was gwadej', Christophe
16:59:15 <Christophe> DS: Would like to be notified. Would rather have a feed from SVG than one from Google.
16:59:28 <Christophe> s/SVG/PlanetSVG/
17:00:25 <stelt> to get "SVG Capital", StaVanGer, etc. filtered out
17:00:31 <Christophe> DS: Forums: when building community site, they noticed that "old folks" like e-mail while "young folks" prefer forums.
17:01:21 <Christophe> RR: We need a "Frankenstein's monster" for mail and forums.
17:01:45 <stelt> Jon Cruz said he wanted to help on that
17:02:01 <Christophe> RB: There are modules for sending mails to people when there's a new post on the forum etc.
17:02:28 <Christophe> RB: You ca't reply via the e-mail, but there's a link to the forum.
17:02:46 <Christophe> s/ca't/can't/
17:03:06 <Christophe> DS: That would not be as good as replying to a thread via e-mail.
17:03:23 <Christophe> RB: You would need to integrate with a mail module on the back end.
17:03:24 <Manuel> have to leave, bye
17:03:45 <Christophe> DS: If we get simply the notification, that would satisfy the "old fogeys".
17:05:13 <stelt> i'll bill an extra hour then :-)
17:06:49 <Christophe> DS: Would also like to see old news stories from SVG.org. Should be possible to get a dump of the news stories, maybe also the blogs.
17:06:58 <Christophe> RR: Legal ramifications?
17:07:14 <Rob_Russell> (that was js)
17:08:01 <stelt> i'd like my diary from there as well
17:09:07 <Christophe> DS: Get tutorials and/or fresh materials ("instant tricks" etc) on the site.
17:09:36 <Christophe> JS: Would like to get one or two tutorials. Anyone else who can write something up?
17:10:18 <Christophe> XX: We could get content from xml.com that is more than one year odl - see A. Quint's articles?
17:10:22 <stelt> there are many inkscape tuts on Youtube
17:10:27 <darobin> s/XX/RB/
17:12:20 <Christophe> (...)
17:13:00 <Christophe> DS: go through tutorials sites elsewhere. E.g. Photoshop tutorial -> how do the same thing in SVG.
17:13:49 <darobin> http://vectortuts.com/
17:14:05 <darobin> http://psdtuts.com/
17:14:06 <Christophe> DS: Also simpler things e.g. what is the simplest way to do a gradient, markers, etc.
17:14:23 <stelt> http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/how-to-do-photoshop-like-effects-in-svg/
17:14:58 <Zakim> -Don_Doherty
17:15:08 <Zakim> -??P5
17:15:09 <Zakim> -JeffSchiller
17:15:09 <Zakim> -darobin
17:15:12 <Zakim> -Rob_Russell
17:15:32 <Zakim> -Christophe_Strobbe
17:15:34 <Zakim> -Shepazu
17:15:35 <Zakim> GA_SVGIG()11:00AM has ended
17:15:36 <Zakim> Attendees were Shepazu, +1.713.851.aaaa, +1.312.540.aabb, JeffSchiller, Christophe_Strobbe, Rob_Russell, Don_Doherty, +33.1.77.11.aacc, darobin
17:16:34 <Christophe> Present: Doug_Schepers, Jeff_Schiller, Bruce_Rindahl, Rob_Russel, Ruud_Steltenpool, Donald_Doherty, Robin_Berjon, Anthony_Grasso, Christophe_Strobbe
17:16:42 <Christophe> rrsagent, generate minutes
17:16:42 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/20-svgig-minutes.html Christophe
17:17:59 <Christophe> regrets: David_Dailey, Dominic_DePasquale, David_Porter, Andreas_Neumann, Manuel_Strehl
17:18:13 <Christophe> rrsagent, generate minutes
17:18:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/20-svgig-minutes.html Christophe
17:18:49 <Christophe> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-ig/2008OctDec/0087.html
17:18:51 <Christophe> rrsagent, generate minutes
17:18:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/20-svgig-minutes.html Christophe
17:19:21 <Christophe> zakim, bye
17:19:21 <Zakim> Zakim has left #svgig
17:20:30 <Christophe> Present: Doug_Schepers, Jeff_Schiller, Bruce_Rindahl, Rob_Russel, Ruud_Steltenpool, Donald_Doherty, Robin_Berjon, Anthony_Grasso, Christophe_Strobbe, G_WadeJohnson
17:20:32 <Christophe> rrsagent, generate minutes
17:20:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/20-svgig-minutes.html Christophe
17:20:42 <stelt> stelt has left #svgig
17:21:00 <Christophe> rrsagent, bye
17:21:00 <RRSAgent> I see no action items