IRC log of ua on 2008-10-21
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 06:31:10 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #ua
- 06:31:10 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-ua-irc
- 06:31:12 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 06:31:14 [trackbot]
- Zakim, this will be WAI_UAWG
- 06:31:14 [Zakim]
- ok, trackbot, I see WAI_UAWG()2:00AM already started
- 06:31:15 [trackbot]
- Meeting: User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
- 06:31:15 [trackbot]
- Date: 21 October 2008
- 06:31:19 [jeanne]
- zakim, call room_136
- 06:31:21 [Zakim]
- ok, jeanne; the call is being made
- 06:31:21 [Zakim]
- +Room_136
- 06:31:57 [jeanne]
- zakim, Room_136 has Jan, jeanne, jallan
- 06:31:57 [Zakim]
- +Jan, jeanne, jallan; got it
- 06:33:25 [jeanne]
- present: Jim_Allan, Jan_Richards, Jeanne_Spellman, Kelly_Ford, Mark_Hakkinen
- 06:33:29 [jeanne]
- zakim, code?
- 06:33:29 [Zakim]
- the conference code is 8224 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), jeanne
- 06:35:00 [KFord]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 06:35:00 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-ua-minutes.html KFord
- 06:36:14 [KFord]
- Chair: Jim, Judy
- 06:36:24 [KFord]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 06:36:24 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-ua-minutes.html KFord
- 06:37:58 [KFord]
- scribe: kford
- 06:39:30 [Jan]
- Jan has joined #ua
- 06:39:40 [Jan]
- New Draft: http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2008/WD-UAAG20-20081021/WD-UAAG20-20081021.html
- 06:41:26 [KFord]
- Agenda: http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2008/10f2f
- 06:41:39 [KFord]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 06:41:39 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-ua-minutes.html KFord
- 06:42:46 [jeanne]
- present+ Anna_Zhueng(observer)
- 06:42:58 [KFord]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 06:42:58 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-ua-minutes.html KFord
- 06:44:33 [KFord]
- JAllan: Goes over plan for the day.
- 06:45:06 [KFord]
- JAllan: Hard stop at 5:30P. One hour before stop and priortize action items with timelines and such.
- 06:47:32 [KFord]
- group continues to look at newest draft at http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2008/WD-UAAG20-20081021/WD-UAAG20-20081021.html
- 06:49:02 [KFord]
- Topic: PRINCIPLE 3: Ensure that the user interface is perceivable
- 06:49:17 [KFord]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 06:49:17 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-ua-minutes.html KFord
- 06:50:48 [KFord]
- JAllan: Anyone have any general problems with the wording?
- 06:50:55 [jeanne]
- jeanne has joined #ua
- 06:50:56 [KFord]
- none heard.
- 06:52:08 [KFord]
- Now looking at Guideline 3.1 Provide text alternatives for non-text components
- 06:53:03 [KFord]
- group is ok with general wording.
- 06:53:38 [KFord]
- JR: I wanted to comment on something we found in ATAG. The item one that says you need to cover the accessibility of your platform is likely to cover this.
- 06:55:25 [KFord]
- Jeanne: I wanted to ensure we covered the accessibility of documentation.
- 06:56:21 [KFord]
- q+
- 06:57:03 [KFord]
- From my mail 10. Principle 3, in particular 3.1 needs to be more clear. I’ve mentioned on a few calls how the user interface does a lot visually to convey meaning. I don’t think these guidelines give enough detail on what needs to happen or the expectation around accessibility. User agents today do a lot to convey state from security to page functionality with unique UI elements. AT jumps around loads of hoops today to convey this info.
- 06:58:22 [jallan]
- KF: should keep, need to be a bit explicit, to make sure the point gets across
- 06:59:46 [KFord]
- q+
- 07:00:37 [KFord]
- More discussion about whether 3.1 is covered in guideline 1.
- 07:04:24 [jallan]
- KF: user interface everything is labeled and available programatically
- 07:04:45 [jallan]
- ... the UA could do more to make the information available.
- 07:07:32 [jallan]
- JA: 3.1.1 does not say make information available programatically
- 07:07:43 [jallan]
- JR: should be in Principal 2
- 07:08:30 [jallan]
- JA: information is available passively, the user must request the security state, rss feed, etc.
- 07:09:04 [KFord]
- kford more discussion about this.
- 07:09:13 [jallan]
- ... do we need some SC to allow option to provide overview of current states in the UA
- 07:09:25 [KFord]
- JR: I think principle two would cover most of this.
- 07:09:31 [jallan]
- JS: this is needed for low vision people.
- 07:09:48 [KFord]
- kford: kford and Jeanne think principle three needs to be strengthened.
- 07:09:54 [jallan]
- ... ARIA has section on passive alerts, perhaps we need something like that
- 07:10:44 [KFord]
- JAllan: we've talked a lot about screen readers. Visually you glance around.
- 07:11:05 [KFord]
- JAllan: if this is all available programatically, isn't it then the AT's job to grab this info.
- 07:12:47 [jallan]
- KF: what is the state, what is important, the UA has gone through the effort to provide an icon. How is the user to decide what is important
- 07:13:44 [jallan]
- ... I am missing the gestalt of the information
- 07:14:43 [KFord]
- Action: kford jeanne to add guideline in 3.1 around improving perceivability
- 07:14:43 [trackbot]
- Sorry, couldn't find user - kford
- 07:15:49 [jeanne]
- action: KF to KF and JS to write proposal for Guideline 3.1 improving perceivability of user interface and passive status.
- 07:15:49 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-48 - KF and JS to write proposal for Guideline 3.1 improving perceivability of user interface and passive status. [on Kelly Ford - due 2008-10-28].
- 07:17:21 [jallan]
- JR: add to examples, kinds of important state information
- 07:17:22 [KFord]
- JR: I think we need to add to examples, some of what kford was saying about important state in modern browsers.
- 07:18:09 [KFord]
- JAllan: 3.1.1 needs to reveal info programatically and there needs to be some mechanism to provide a overview of important state items.