15:02:02 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #xproc
15:02:02 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/05/29-xproc-irc
15:02:04 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #xproc
15:02:07 <Norm> Zakim, this is xproc
15:02:07 <Zakim> ok, Norm; that matches XML_PMWG()11:00AM
15:02:09 <Norm> Meeting: XML Processing Model WG
15:02:09 <Norm> Date: 29 May 2008
15:02:09 <Norm> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2008/05/29-agenda
15:02:09 <Norm> Meeting: 113
15:02:10 <Norm> Chair: Norm
15:02:12 <Norm> Scribe: Norm
15:02:14 <Norm> ScribeNick: Norm
15:02:54 <Norm> Regrets: Vojtech, Paul
15:04:53 <Norm> Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:04:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see Norm
15:05:00 <ht> zakim, please call ht-781
15:05:00 <Zakim> ok, ht; the call is being made
15:05:01 <Zakim> +Ht
15:05:09 <richard> richard has joined #xproc
15:05:37 <Zakim> +??P4
15:05:38 <richard> zakim, ? is me
15:05:38 <Zakim> +richard; got it
15:05:41 <Zakim> +Murray_Maloney
15:06:19 <Zakim> +??P12
15:06:22 <ruilopes> Zakim, ? is me
15:06:22 <Zakim> +ruilopes; got it
15:06:26 <MoZ> MoZ has joined #xproc
15:06:28 <Norm> Regrets: Vojtech, Paul, Andrew
15:06:34 <Norm> Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:06:34 <Zakim> On the phone I see Norm, Ht, richard, Murray_Maloney, ruilopes
15:08:06 <Zakim> +Alex_Milows
15:08:18 <Norm> Present: Norm, Henry, Richard, Murray, Rui, Alex
15:08:27 <MSM> zakim, please call MSM-617
15:08:27 <Zakim> ok, MSM; the call is being made
15:08:29 <Zakim> +MSM
15:08:34 <Norm> Topic: Accept this agenda?
15:08:34 <Norm> -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2008/05/29-agenda
15:08:42 <Norm> Present: Norm, Henry, Richard, Murray, Rui, Alex, Michael
15:08:44 <Norm> Accepted
15:08:46 <Zakim> -Alex_Milows
15:08:59 <alexmilowski> alexmilowski has joined #xproc
15:09:06 <Norm> Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting?
15:09:08 <Norm> -> http://www.w3.org/2008/05/15-xproc-minutes.html
15:09:18 <Zakim> +Alex_Milows
15:09:29 <Norm> Norm: The substance was PSVI support which I think we sorted as best we can before a new draft.
15:09:41 <MoZ> Zakim, what is the code ?
15:09:41 <Zakim> the conference code is 97762 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), MoZ
15:10:17 <Norm> Henry: My action is still outstanding, but I don't think that should get in the way.
15:10:24 <Norm> ...To look for things that point outside the subtree.
15:10:46 <Norm> Accepted.
15:10:57 <Zakim> +??P5
15:11:33 <Norm> Topic: Next meeting: telcon 5 June 2008
15:11:42 <Norm> Regrets from Paul.
15:11:56 <Norm> Topic: Last call status
15:12:12 <Norm> Norm: We need to decide when we're ready.
15:12:21 <Norm> ...I think we're just about there, just the PSVI stuff I think.
15:12:25 <MoZ> Zakim, ??P5 is me
15:12:25 <Zakim> +MoZ; got it
15:12:50 <Norm> Present: Norm, Henry, Richard, Murray, Rui, Alex, Michael, Mohamed
15:13:02 <Norm> Norm: Can anyone think of anything we need to deal with first?
15:13:06 <Norm> None heard.
15:14:20 <Norm> Henry: It wouldn't be a bad idea to solicit feedback from our readers.
15:15:19 <Norm> ACTION: Henry to setup an xproc developers list at w3.org
15:15:55 <Norm> Murray: The GRDDL WG is finished, I made a point of ensuring that there was a comment in the GRDDL spec that pointed to XProc.
15:16:18 <Norm> ...I wonder whether in of this groups work there is an example of an XProc script that takes an XML document and turns it into triples.
15:16:38 <Norm> Norm: I don't think we have one, but there's nothing to prevent us from creating one.
15:16:54 <Norm> Alex: Do you have a specific example in mind?
15:17:01 <Norm> Murray: No, but I think it should be as simple as possible.
15:17:33 <Norm> Norm: It would be nice if it did more than XSLT.
15:17:45 <Norm> Murray: All it has to do is some validation and run some RDFy kind of tool over the result.
15:18:06 <Norm> Is there an example in the GRDDL speck?
15:18:08 <Norm> s/speck/spec/
15:18:20 <Norm> Murray: Yes, there are a few.
15:18:25 <Norm> s/Is there/Alex: Is there/
15:19:05 <Norm> Norm: There's certainly room for more examples in the spec, and that would be a good one.
15:19:19 <Norm> Norm: So, coming back to last call.
15:20:59 <Norm> ...I was thinking along these lines: LC mid June, CR late July, PR in mid September?
15:21:31 <Norm> Topic: p:filter
15:22:16 <Norm> Mohamed: Today we can have select on p:input, which is static.
15:22:37 <Norm> ...I have some use cases where I need to pass an XPath expression to a step where the expression is constructed by the pipeline.
15:24:11 <Norm> ...p:load is symmetric with p:document, it would be nice to have p:filter symetric to select on input.
15:24:54 <Norm> Norm: And this is a select expression not a match because if you wanted a match you'd just use split-sequence and ignore the non-matched parts.
15:25:36 <Norm> Henry: I'm confused. In what sense is p:input static, if I had an expression in a variable why wouldn't that work?
15:26:28 <ht> HST: What is wrong with <p:input select="$foo"/>
15:27:14 <Norm> Mohamed: That gives you the string of $foo, but doesn't use it to select parts of the document.
15:28:37 <ht> Right, what you want is, as it were, <p:input><p:option name="select" value="$foo"/></p:input>
15:29:50 <Norm> Richard: $foo is a string which isn't a node set so it's an error.
15:30:00 <Norm> ...We don't require the node set to come from the document, which is a little surprising.
15:30:17 <Norm> Murray: So $foo in an argument should be evaluated to what it is.
15:30:21 <Zakim> -MSM
15:30:41 <Norm> Richard: The select expression si $foo, and its value is teh value of $foo and it must be a string.
15:30:47 <Norm> ...And that's an error.
15:31:47 <Norm> Some discussion of the meaning of evaulated select expressions.
15:33:06 <Norm> Henry: We could make select into an option.
15:33:29 <Norm> Norm: I think that would be really confusing.
15:34:01 <richard> we could just add a function to our xpath extensions, like exslt's dyn:evaluate
15:34:57 <Norm> Mohamed: The only thing that bothers me about that is, what's the context of the evaluation.
15:35:48 <Norm> Mohamed: I think the simplest, most compatible thing is to add p:filter.
15:36:14 <Norm> Murray: In a bourne shell, you can put something you want evaluated inside single quotes.
15:36:20 <richard> (backquotes)
15:36:28 <Norm> ...I wonder whether a simple syntax solution would be a result.
15:37:55 <Norm> Proposal: add p:filter as Mohamed suggests
15:38:12 <Norm> Accepted.
15:38:27 <Norm> Richard: Required or optional?
15:38:35 <Norm> Mohamed: p:load is required, right?
15:38:36 <Norm> Norm: yes.
15:39:05 <Norm> Norm: I think this is small enough and providing fairly core functionality, I'd make it required.
15:39:09 <Norm> Proposal: required?
15:39:17 <Norm> Accepted.
15:39:36 <Norm> Topic: Changes to p:hash
15:40:42 <Norm> Norm attempts to summarize the hash changes.
15:41:05 <Norm> Mohamed: It's an optional step, so we can make it a bit stronger. For security reasons, sha1 and md5 are on the way out.
15:41:18 <Norm> ...Security considerations will require more options.
15:41:49 <Norm> ...And it's also valuable to provide crc even though it's not secure, it's widely used.
15:42:35 <Norm> Norm: I'm sympathetic because I had reservations about the particularly narrow slice I made when I first proposed p:hash.
15:42:47 <Norm> Proposal: change p:hash along the lines suggested by Mohamed
15:42:56 <Norm> Accepted.
15:43:19 <Norm> Topic: C14N
15:43:38 <Norm> Norm: Mohamed proposoes a c14n step, we could also do it on serialization.
15:44:57 <Norm> Henry: C14N specifies what a string looks like.
15:45:17 <Norm> ...It seems like we'd need this on the serialization options.
15:45:31 <Norm> ...Otherwise you can't output a C14N string form an XProc processor.
15:47:05 <Norm> ...You could have p:c14n, but it would be too limiting.
15:49:39 <Norm> ACTION: Mohamed to propose serialization changes to support C14N.
15:50:02 <Norm> Topic: XSLTMatchPattern clarifications
15:50:21 <Norm> Norm: We need to say something about id(), key() the namespace axis, etc.
15:51:25 <Norm> Richard: key() is added by XSLT.
15:51:37 <Norm> ...The namespace axis isn't a problem for XPath 1 processors because they must implement it.
15:52:15 <Norm> ...The other things are the functions added by XSLT. 
15:53:06 <Norm> Norm: On further consideration, I think id() is probably ok
15:53:49 <Zakim> -Murray_Maloney
15:54:24 <Norm> Richard: I would have thought that none of these things would be expected to work.
15:54:33 <Norm> Norm: Well, match patterns come from XSLT, so you might expect them to work there
15:56:05 <Norm> ACTION: Norm to investigate the functions added by XSLT and draft some prose for the spec
15:57:30 <Norm> Topic: Add a limit option to p:count
15:57:33 <Norm> Mohamed summarizes.
15:59:14 <Norm> Proposed: add a limit option to p:count along the lines Mohamed suggested
15:59:29 <Norm> Accepted.
15:59:36 <Norm> Topic: Any other business
15:59:56 <Norm> Adjourned.
16:00:00 <Zakim> -MoZ
16:00:01 <Zakim> -richard
16:00:01 <Norm> RRSAgent, set logs world-visible
16:00:02 <Zakim> -Ht
16:00:03 <Zakim> -Alex_Milows
16:00:04 <Zakim> -ruilopes
16:00:06 <Zakim> -Norm
16:00:09 <Zakim> XML_PMWG()11:00AM has ended
16:00:11 <Zakim> Attendees were Norm, Ht, richard, Murray_Maloney, ruilopes, Alex_Milows, MSM, MoZ
16:00:11 <Norm> RRSAgent, draft minutes
16:00:11 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/05/29-xproc-minutes.html Norm
17:32:45 <Zakim> Zakim has left #xproc
17:35:04 <Norm> RRSAgent, bye
17:35:04 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/29-xproc-actions.rdf :
17:35:04 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Henry to setup an xproc developers list at w3.org [1]
17:35:04 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/29-xproc-irc#T15-15-19
17:35:04 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Mohamed to propose serialization changes to support C14N. [2]
17:35:04 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/29-xproc-irc#T15-49-39
17:35:04 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Norm to investigate the functions added by XSLT and draft some prose for the spec [3]
17:35:04 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/29-xproc-irc#T15-56-05