13:34:29 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #xhtml
13:34:29 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/04/30-xhtml-irc
13:36:17 <RolandMerrick> RolandMerrick has changed the topic to: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0080.html
13:37:33 <Roland> Zakim, this will be XHTML2
13:37:33 <Zakim> ok, Roland; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes
13:38:10 <Roland> Meeting: XHTML2 WG Weekly Teleconference
13:38:28 <Roland> Chair: Roland
13:38:42 <Roland> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0080.html
13:39:15 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes
13:39:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/30-xhtml-minutes.html Roland
13:39:27 <Roland> rrsagent, make log public
13:39:42 <Roland> Regrets: Steven
13:41:50 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started
13:41:56 <Zakim> +Roland
13:44:21 <yamx> yamx has joined #xhtml
13:44:32 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmaita
13:44:53 <markbirbeck> markbirbeck has joined #xhtml
13:45:06 <markbirbeck> zakim, code?
13:45:06 <Zakim> the conference code is 94865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck
13:46:01 <oedipus> Scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita
13:46:05 <oedipus> ScribeNick: oedipus
13:47:00 <oedipus> regrets+ Steven_Pemberton
13:47:10 <Zakim> +??P9
13:47:18 <Zakim> +??P10
13:47:22 <yamx> zakim, ??P9 is yamx
13:47:22 <Zakim> +yamx; got it
13:47:27 <markbirbeck> zakim, i am ??P10
13:47:27 <Zakim> +markbirbeck; got it
13:48:28 <Zakim> +??P11
13:49:30 <oedipus> zakim, Alesssio is ??P11
13:49:30 <Zakim> sorry, oedipus, I do not recognize a party named 'Alesssio'
13:50:17 <oedipus> zakim, ??P11 is Alessio_Cartocci
13:50:17 <Zakim> +Alessio_Cartocci; got it
13:50:30 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes
13:50:30 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/30-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
13:52:29 <oedipus> XML Base (Second Edition) - Steven not around to address
13:52:38 <oedipus> RM: face2face meeting -- any registrants?
13:52:45 <oedipus> RM: a lot of no answers so far
13:52:57 <oedipus> wiki : http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/2008-06-Minneapolis-FtF
13:53:03 <oedipus> registration: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/32107/xhtml2ftf200806/
13:53:11 <oedipus> RM: poll those on phone
13:53:16 <oedipus> Yam: no, don't think so
13:53:29 <oedipus> GJR: probable conflict
13:53:44 <oedipus> MB: still negotiating -- away most of may on business trips
13:54:01 <oedipus> AC: don't think can attend, but interested in doing so remotely
13:54:05 <oedipus> TOPIC: CURIES
13:54:43 <oedipus> RM: SP sent replies out to TAG; discovered earlier, unaddressed comment from TAG: talked with Shane about it, don't know where SM got to with thAt; same on Mime Types
13:55:42 <oedipus> Yam: 2 Minor comments: distinguish XHTML Basic 1.0 and 1.1 - remove ambiguity; CSS file for the W3C TR is very old, improper use -- says updated 2006, but much older than that
13:55:51 <oedipus> RM: send comments to list, please so on record
13:56:09 <oedipus> RM: last time talked to StevenP, still no feedback from Steve Bratt on either document
13:56:38 <oedipus> Yam; Basic 1.1 M12n - transition request pending, right?
13:56:40 <oedipus> RM: correct
13:56:41 <oedipus> TOPIC: Access Model
13:56:52 <oedipus> s/Access Model/Access Module
13:57:20 <oedipus> GJR: request for activate="inspect" dropped
13:59:10 <oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0083.html
14:00:26 <oedipus> GJR: awaiting Jim Allan post to public-xhtml2 -- GJR will ping him today -- hopefully get to list today
14:00:43 <oedipus> RM: once get material, will review and can vote next week to go to Last Call
14:00:49 <oedipus> TOPIC: Role Module
14:01:02 <oedipus> RM: comes out of second LC soon -- no comments thusfar
14:01:10 <oedipus> TOPIC: RDFa Feedback
14:01:31 <oedipus> MB: few comments on RDFa -- most of them resolved; nothing that affects things materially
14:02:20 <oedipus> TOPIC: RM Comments
14:02:47 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0066.html
14:03:31 <oedipus> RM: comments on MimeType
14:03:55 <oedipus> RM: Appendix A. Compatibility Guidelines comments:
14:04:06 <oedipus> s/MimeType/Mime draft
14:05:15 <oedipus> RM: looking for specificity; re: empty elements, helpful for authors to use this and not have to go off and find attributes that it effects; empty elements is a hsort list (included in email cited above) -- should list them in document
14:05:41 <oedipus> RM: document ought to make it  as easy as possible for reader to create a new document, rather than leave it to them to discover rules
14:05:47 <oedipus> RM: is that something people agree with?
14:05:51 <oedipus> MB: yes
14:05:53 <oedipus> GJR: yes
14:06:03 <oedipus> Yam: yes
14:06:37 <oedipus> RM: lang and xml:lang - says use xml:lang - does not say don't or should not use lang attribute; need to state use xml:lang and not lang
14:07:05 <oedipus> MB: given goal of this is to make it so html and xhtml interchangable, don't know if should be so strong on XML features
14:07:19 <oedipus> RM: agree good question -- encountered when drafting examples
14:07:51 <oedipus> GJR: have not been able to find AT that switches in response to xml:lang - still key off lang
14:07:56 <oedipus> RM: good example
14:08:39 <oedipus> MB: target renderer is XML renderer, not an HTML renderer; describe best practice for authors of XHTML document whose work will be served as HTML; should be stated other way around to get best results - use lang and xml:lang
14:09:12 <oedipus> RM: best answer i have is specify both -- should record which browsers and which versions support xml:lang -- shouldn't leave issue of use of other one dangling
14:09:22 <oedipus> MB: do use xml:lang or use lang or specify both
14:09:37 <oedipus> s/MB: do use/RM: do use
14:10:22 <oedipus> MB: generic XML feature use that has been the model, but if HTML feature available, why not use it?  if we tell people to use XSL rather than CSS will have problem -- can't load boath stylesheets; 
14:11:20 <oedipus> RM: aiming for those that work in browsers we are interested in -- likely will be HTML versions; finding a lot of HTML browsers do support XML features, but picked and chosen; develop sample documents to run against series of browsers, record results and report
14:11:53 <oedipus> MB: seems like a lot of work to gain very little; know UAs support HTML, so need to ensure that XHTML works
14:12:23 <oedipus> RM: features that only work in XML/XHTML are the issue -- what about them?  HTML browsers recognize limited set of XML features need to document
14:12:38 <oedipus> MB: if make assertion, have to prove it; someone's got to do this work
14:12:48 <oedipus> RM: good practices or recommendation -- this is the way to do it
14:13:16 <oedipus> MB: if start recommending things that aren't really necessary, then making more work for all involved -- reduce work to do verification by scaling down requirements
14:13:28 <Tina> Tina has joined #xhtml
14:13:56 <oedipus> RM: don't want reader to infer -- do use lang, use xml:lang -- should say "do this, and don't do that"
14:14:20 <oedipus> MB: fragment identifiers -- same thing -- use id attribute, do not use name attribute
14:14:52 <oedipus> RM: can't just say "do what HTML does" -- won't work with XHTML compact forms
14:15:38 <oedipus> RM: don't make distinctions between 1.0 and 1.1 -- clarify what Basic means -- going back to yam's point
14:15:50 <oedipus> RM: want document that is valid XHTML rendered by HTML
14:16:06 <oedipus> Yam: completely different in mobile -- some can support basic 1.0 and some basic 1.1
14:16:26 <oedipus> RM: like those to be XHTML Basic, rendered in a non-mobile UA that renders HTML
14:17:05 <oedipus> Yam: more interested in how UA can inform its capabilities using HTTP protocol; like to make very clear how will profile be used to identify basic 1.0 or basic 1.1
14:17:37 <oedipus> Yam: such notificiation is VERY important in mobile devices
14:17:58 <oedipus> RM: SM says Mime document follows these rules -- implements what says you should do
14:18:29 <oedipus> RM: additional comments, please send to list and we will work through them;
14:18:36 <oedipus> RM: other items for discussion?
14:19:01 <oedipus> Yam; send mime type comment to xhtml mailing list
14:19:42 <oedipus> s/Yam: send/Yam: will send
14:19:46 <oedipus> RM: adjourn
14:19:54 <Zakim> -Roland
14:19:56 <Zakim> -markbirbeck
14:19:59 <Zakim> -Alessio_Cartocci
14:20:00 <Zakim> -yamx
14:20:10 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes
14:20:10 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/30-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
14:20:14 <oedipus> zakim, bye
14:20:14 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were Roland, Gregory_Rosmaita, yamx, markbirbeck, Alessio_Cartocci
14:20:14 <Zakim> Zakim has left #xhtml
14:20:19 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes
14:20:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/30-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
14:20:51 <oedipus> regrets+ Tina
14:20:53 <oedipus> rrsagent, make minutes
14:20:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/30-xhtml-minutes.html oedipus
14:21:42 <oedipus> rrsagent, please part
14:21:42 <RRSAgent> I see no action items