15:58:53 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rdfa
15:58:53 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc
15:58:57 <Ralph> zakim, this will be rdfa
15:58:57 <Zakim> ok, Ralph; I see SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
15:59:24 <Ralph> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Dec/0116.html
15:59:33 <Ralph> Meeting: RDF-in-XHTML Task Force
15:59:55 <Ralph> ->  http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html previous 2007-12-13
16:00:21 <Zakim> SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has now started
16:00:26 <Zakim> +Ralph
16:00:44 <Zakim> +??P15
16:00:47 <Zakim> -Ralph
16:00:48 <Zakim> +Ralph
16:00:57 <Ralph> zakim, ??p15 is Manu
16:00:57 <Zakim> +Manu; got it
16:02:54 <Ralph> Regrets: Michael, Mark
16:03:04 <ShaneM> ShaneM has joined #rdfa
16:03:18 <Zakim> +ShaneM
16:03:50 <benadida> benadida has joined #rdfa
16:04:49 <benadida> hmmm, having trouble dialing in
16:05:34 <Zakim> +benadida
16:06:13 <Ralph> Regrets+ Steven
16:06:22 <Ralph> Chair: Ben
16:06:26 <Ralph> Scribe: Ralph
16:06:54 <Ralph> Ben: I don't think we have a new draft to give to the WGs yet :(
16:10:24 <Ralph> Next telecon in 2 weeks; 3 Jan
16:12:25 <Ralph> Ben: can we read the latest editor's draft to understand Mark's current thinking?
16:13:48 <Ralph> Shane: we haven't updated the public editor's draft yet, but can do so right now
16:15:53 <Ralph> Ben: can we review test cases usefully today?
16:16:08 <Ralph> Manu: with Mark's new interpretation, we'll have to review every case
16:16:21 <Ralph> Ben: I don't think Mark is intending to change the interpretation of current cases
16:16:29 <Ralph> ... it's just floating @resource that would change
16:17:01 <benadida> oh
16:17:07 <Zakim> -benadida
16:17:24 <benadida> is something odd with Zakim? It's the only call where I get these issues
16:17:40 <Zakim> +benadida
16:19:26 <Ralph> Ben: I think Mark isn't proposing to change the cases with @about
16:20:17 <Ralph> Topic: Action
16:20:37 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Ben to write up example and explanation of @src as subject for IMG [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
16:21:04 <Ralph> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Dec/0115.html Rethinking @src in the context of chaining rules [Ben 19-Dec]
16:21:18 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Manu create an additional test case where @instanceof on head is used to set the global document type. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
16:21:31 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Manu to add test cases to ensure URLs are resolved relative to base correctly against @about, @resource, and @href. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action13]
16:21:41 <Ralph> ACTION: Ralph to check with Libby and make sure it is okay for us to use her address. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]
16:21:42 <Ralph> -- continues
16:21:58 <Ralph> Manu: I changed it to my and Michael's addresses instead
16:22:17 <Ralph> ... should we do this throughout?
16:22:23 <Ralph> ... we'd have to update the Syntax doc
16:22:53 <Ralph> -- drop Ralph's action
16:23:06 <benadida> ACTION: Manu to change Libby's email address to Michael's in all test cases
16:23:28 <benadida> ACTION: Ben to update primer to remove Libby's email address
16:23:48 <benadida> ACTION: Shane to update syntax doc to remove Libby's email address (and replace it with Michael's)
16:24:23 <Ralph> ACTION: Shane to add anchors to rdfa-syntax spec for element and attribute definitions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action10]
16:24:25 <Ralph> -- continues
16:24:38 <Ralph> ACTION: Ben followup with Fabien on getting his RDFa GRDDL transform transferred to W3C [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/11/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action01]
16:24:39 <Ralph> -- continues
16:25:32 <Ralph> Ben: I've received a response from Fabien.  It's currently under a French open source license and he plans to put it under W3C license when it's done.
16:25:39 <Ralph> ACTION: Ben to add status of various implementations on rdfa.info [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/04-rdfa-minutes.html#action06]
16:25:40 <Ralph> -- continues
16:25:51 <Ralph> ACTION: Ben to respond to comment on follow-your-nose [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/06-rdfa-minutes.html#action02]
16:25:52 <Ralph> -- continues
16:26:30 <Ralph> ACTION: Ben to set up a proper scribe schedule [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action01]
16:26:32 <Ralph> -- continues
16:26:42 <Ralph> ACTION: Michael to create "Microformats done right -- unambiguous taxonomies via RDF" on the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html#action06]
16:26:43 <Ralph> -- continues
16:26:54 <Ralph> ACTION: Ralph followup with Dublin Core on what's going on with their namespace URI [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/06-rdfa-minutes.html#action01]
16:26:55 <Ralph> -- continues
16:27:32 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/2007/12/18-swd-minutes.html#ActionSummary SWD WG action summary
16:28:26 <Ralph> [] ACTION: Ben and Michael to address comments by Tom [regarding maintenance of wiki document http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action05]
16:29:01 <Ralph> [] ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action03]
16:29:23 <Ralph> Ben: I was planning to wait until Last Call to do implementation report
16:30:07 <Ralph> [] ACTION: Ben to update RDFa schedule in wiki http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa#RDFa_schedule  [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action04]
16:31:08 <Ralph> Ben: I keep updating it but it keeps getting out of date
16:33:49 <Ralph> Ben: note that several of us will be at WWW2008 the end of April
16:34:05 <Ralph> ... that's a good opportunity for publicity
16:36:10 <ShaneM>  There is an updated rdfa-syntax draft at http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-rdfa-syntax-20071220/
16:37:34 <Ralph> Shane: I had raised a question about adding a value for GRDDL to @rel and @rev namespaces
16:37:49 <Ralph> Ben: GRDDL considered that to be in their namespace, not the HTML namespace
16:38:04 <Ralph> ... so I think that's "above" us in the stack
16:38:22 <Ralph> Shane: ok with me
16:38:25 <Ralph> Topic: Test Case review
16:38:28 <msporny> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Dec/0110.html
16:38:42 <msporny> http://rdfa.digitalbazaar.com/rdfa-test-harness/
16:39:37 <Ralph> -- test 47
16:39:56 <Ralph> ... @instanceof not applying to @resource
16:40:30 <Ralph> Manu: the N3 comes from Ivan's parser which is not up-to-date, so ignore it for now
16:40:41 <Ralph> ... focus on the XHTML and SPARQL
16:41:44 <Ralph> Ben, Manu, Ralph: test 47 looks ok to us
16:42:02 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 47 accepted, with a flag to recheck after Mark's latest rules
16:42:07 <Ralph> -- test 48
16:42:45 <ShaneM>  +1
16:42:48 <Ralph> +1
16:43:09 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 48 accepted
16:43:20 <Ralph> Ben: we don't expect 48 to change with Mark's rules
16:43:36 <Ralph> -- test 62
16:43:55 <Ralph> Manu: test 62 is @rev in HEAD
16:44:46 <Ralph> +1
16:45:37 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 62 accepted
16:45:58 <Ralph> -- test 52
16:46:07 <TomB> TomB has joined #rdfa
16:46:27 <Ralph> Ben: 52 is definitely affected by Mark's latest rules
16:47:13 <Ralph> +1 per my expectation
16:47:32 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 52 accepted, to be revisited after Mark's proposed changes
16:48:39 <Ralph> -- test 53
16:48:52 <Ralph> Ben: this isn't the kind of markup someone would like write
16:49:29 <Ralph> ... but if there were an @rel it would generate the given triples (plus another)
16:49:32 <Ralph> ... so it's right
16:49:52 <Ralph> Ralph: I'm ok with 53
16:50:15 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 53 accepted, to be revisited after Mark's proposed changes
16:51:01 <Ralph> -- test 66
16:51:17 <Ralph> @instanceof in HEAD
16:51:51 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 66 accepted
16:52:27 <Ralph> test 66 not affected by Mark's changes
16:52:33 <Ralph> -- test 67
16:52:48 <ShaneM>  +1
16:52:48 <Ralph> defaulting subject in HEAD
16:53:10 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 66 accepted, not affected by Mark's rules
16:53:15 <Ralph> -- test 68
16:53:39 <Ralph> @about with relative URI
16:54:18 <Ralph> Shane: how would I run these tests locally?
16:54:34 <Ralph> Ben: could add BASE in HEAD
16:56:31 <benadida> ACTION: Manu to check for BASE test cases
16:57:46 <benadida> ACTION: Ben to propose a solution for running tests locally
16:58:30 <Ralph> Ralph: test 4 is on hold, using xml:base
16:58:55 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 67 accepted, not affected by Mark's rules
16:59:00 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 68 accepted, not affected by Mark's rules
16:59:56 <Ralph> -- test 69
17:00:32 <Ralph> like test 68 with @rel and @href
17:01:39 <Ralph> Shane: calling these test ".xhtml" will cause IE to not deal with them the way we want
17:02:02 <Ralph> ... will talk about this off-line with Michael and Manu
17:02:29 <Ralph> Ben: what does @about="" do in this case?
17:02:40 <Ralph> ... is it necessary
17:03:08 <Ralph> Manu: I'm not sure we have a test that defaults @about in the body -- I'll add one
17:03:48 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 69 accepted, not affected by Mark's rules
17:03:51 <Ralph> -- test 70
17:04:55 <Ralph> Manu: like 69 but with @resource
17:04:59 <Ralph> RESOLVED: test 70 accepted, not affected by Mark's rules
17:06:15 <Ralph> Topic: @src
17:06:49 <Ralph> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Dec/0115.html Rethinking @src in the context of chaining rules
17:07:15 <Ralph> Manu: my only concern is that it would be simpler for developers to ignore @src
17:07:21 <Ralph> ... but that violates DRY
17:08:00 <Ralph> Ben: I'm proposing that @src behaves just like @about, if both are present then @about supercedes
17:08:28 <Ralph> Manu: are there other HTML elements to which this would apply?
17:08:31 <Ralph> Ben: OBJECT
17:08:44 <Ralph> ... but we care mostly about IMG
17:09:06 <Ralph> Manu: we're making a special case for IMG and OBJECT
17:09:35 <Ralph> ... that's OK because folks do use IMG heavily
17:09:59 <Ralph> ... but I wonder if there are other elements we should look at in the same way?
17:10:06 <Ralph> Shane: in XHTML2, @src works everywhere
17:10:20 <Ralph> ... @longdesc might be another special case to consier
17:10:25 <Ralph> s/consier/consider/
17:10:50 <Ralph> Ben: Mark had proposed that @longdesc become a [dc:]description
17:11:04 <Ralph> ... which would argue in favor of @src being subject
17:11:27 <Ralph> ... also, it's probably a good thing to have a story for inline OBJECTs
17:12:31 <Ralph> [adjourned]
17:12:33 <Zakim> -ShaneM
17:12:35 <Zakim> -Manu
17:12:35 <Zakim> -benadida
17:12:37 <Zakim> -Ralph
17:12:38 <Zakim> SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has ended
17:12:40 <Zakim> Attendees were Ralph, Manu, ShaneM, benadida
17:12:43 <Ralph> rrsagent, please draft minutes
17:12:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-minutes.html Ralph
17:13:05 <Ralph> rrsagent, please make record public
17:13:17 <Ralph> zakim, bye
17:13:17 <Zakim> Zakim has left #rdfa
17:13:59 <Ralph> rrsagent, bye
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> I see 13 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-actions.rdf :
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph to check with Libby and make sure it is okay for us to use her address. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action14] [1]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-21-41
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to change Libby's email address to Michael's in all test cases [2]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-23-06
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to update primer to remove Libby's email address [3]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-23-28
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to update syntax doc to remove Libby's email address (and replace it with Michael's) [4]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-23-48
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to add anchors to rdfa-syntax spec for element and attribute definitions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action10] [5]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-24-23
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben followup with Fabien on getting his RDFa GRDDL transform transferred to W3C [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/11/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action01] [6]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-24-38
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to add status of various implementations on rdfa.info [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/04-rdfa-minutes.html#action06] [7]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-25-39
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to respond to comment on follow-your-nose [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/06-rdfa-minutes.html#action02] [8]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-25-51
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to set up a proper scribe schedule [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action01] [9]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-26-30
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Michael to create "Microformats done right -- unambiguous taxonomies via RDF" on the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html#action06] [10]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-26-42
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph followup with Dublin Core on what's going on with their namespace URI [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/06-rdfa-minutes.html#action01] [11]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-26-54
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to check for BASE test cases [12]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-56-31
17:13:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to propose a solution for running tests locally [13]
17:13:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/12/20-rdfa-irc#T16-57-46