IRC log of rdfa on 2007-08-23

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:52:52 [RRSAgent]

RRSAgent has joined #rdfa

14:52:52 [RRSAgent]

logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc

14:52:57 [Zakim]

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14:53:03 [mhausenblas]

zakim, this will be SW_SWD(RDFa)

14:53:03 [Zakim]

ok, mhausenblas; I see SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM scheduled to start in 7 minutes

14:53:30 [mhausenblas]

Meeting: W3C RDF-in-XHTML TF - Telecon 2007-08-23, 15:00 UTC

14:53:52 [mhausenblas]

Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Aug/0158.html

14:53:59 [mhausenblas]

Chair: Ben

14:54:29 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

14:54:29 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html mhausenblas

14:54:35 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, make logs public

14:58:29 [ShaneM]

ShaneM has joined #rdfa

14:59:13 [RalphS]

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14:59:45 [Zakim]

SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has now started

14:59:52 [Zakim]

+Ralph

14:59:54 [ShaneM]

zakim, code

14:59:54 [Zakim]

I don't understand 'code', ShaneM

15:00:01 [ShaneM]

zakim, what is the code

15:00:03 [Zakim]

I don't understand 'what is the code', ShaneM

15:00:39 [Zakim]

+Michael_Hausenblas

15:01:28 [benadida]

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15:01:54 [mhausenblas]

Zakim, what is the conference code?

15:01:54 [Zakim]

the conference code is 7332 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), mhausenblas

15:02:01 [Zakim]

+benadida

15:02:08 [Steven]

zakim, dial steven-617

15:02:08 [Zakim]

ok, Steven; the call is being made

15:02:10 [Zakim]

+Steven

15:02:27 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

15:02:27 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html mhausenblas

15:02:29 [benadida]

zakim, who is on the call?

15:02:29 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Ralph, Michael_Hausenblas, benadida, Steven

15:03:02 [RalphS]

-> http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html previous 2007-08-16

15:03:30 [Zakim]

+ShaneM

15:04:04 [markbirbeck]

markbirbeck has joined #rdfa

15:04:18 [markbirbeck]

zakim, code?

15:04:18 [Zakim]

the conference code is 7332 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck

15:04:45 [Zakim]

+markbirbeck

15:05:22 [markbirbeck]

Scribe: markbirbeck

15:06:34 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

15:06:34 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html mhausenblas

15:07:09 [markbirbeck]

Ben pointed out that the key thing now is to get a new draft of the syntax document out.

15:07:22 [ShaneM]

I have a question about: http://htmlwg.mn.aptest.com/htmlwg/rdfa-syntax/Overview.html#s_rules

15:07:24 [markbirbeck]

Steven, Shane and Mark are working on this now.

15:08:03 [markbirbeck]

Steven said that a lot has changed, so we do need to be careful about coordinating.

15:08:31 [markbirbeck]

Shane replied that although it is true that there are changes, the fundamentals remain.

15:08:59 [markbirbeck]

Other than things like 'meta and link everywhere' a lot is similar.

15:09:36 [ShaneM]

sorry - here: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-rdfa-syntax-20070812/#s_rules

15:10:49 [markbirbeck]

Shane was asking about the section called 'Rules'...i;e., what is it for?

15:11:16 [markbirbeck]

Mark said that 'very old' versions of the document did have a rules section, but we've not bothered keeping it up to date until everything is final.

15:11:30 [markbirbeck]

Action items.

15:12:01 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: Ben to update the bookmarklet to handle img@src

15:12:05 [markbirbeck]

--done

15:13:17 [Steven]

rrsagent, make minutes

15:13:17 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html Steven

15:14:00 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: Ben to work test cases 31 and 32 into primer [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]

15:14:10 [markbirbeck]

--continues

15:14:29 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: mh to add a test case for @src [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action10]

15:15:06 [markbirbeck]

--continues

15:15:16 [mhausenblas]

<img about="http://sw-app.org/mic.xhtml#i" rel="foaf:image" src="http://sw-app.org/img/mic_2007_01.jpg" />

15:15:24 [mhausenblas]

<http://sw-app.org/mic.xhtml#i> foaf:image <http://sw-app.org/img/mic_2007_01.jpg> .

15:16:33 [mhausenblas]

Michael: I'll add another TC with @resource overwrites @src

15:16:45 [markbirbeck]

Ben pointed out that there is no reason not to add additional 'tests' for the single feature.

15:17:12 [markbirbeck]

...there can't be too many test cases. :)

15:17:56 [markbirbeck]

mh to write an img@src test case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]

15:18:00 [markbirbeck]

--drop

15:18:13 [Steven]

ACTION: mh to write an img@src test case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]

15:18:16 [Steven]

--dropped

15:18:21 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: mh to create best practices wiki page [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action13]

15:18:33 [Steven]

rrsagent, make minutes

15:18:33 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html Steven

15:18:34 [mhausenblas]

-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Aug/0142.html

15:20:01 [RalphS]

Mark: I'm concerned that we may be getting too many sources of information; stick to just a couple of documents

15:20:20 [RalphS]

Michael: I don't care where we put best practices information but I think we should have it

15:20:39 [RalphS]

Mark: I worry that we'll have too many things floating around

15:21:38 [markbirbeck]

Ben, can see the point, but Bob's comment about showing how to do microformats with RDFa is a good idea.

15:24:17 [markbirbeck]

Mark: Would just point out that the problem with microformats is that they don't always correspond to a vocabulary, so we'd have to first find the 'underlying' vocabulary that they've mapped to.

15:24:28 [markbirbeck]

...not saying we shouldn't do it, just that it is not so easy.

15:26:15 [markbirbeck]

Ben: Sees support from Shane and Steven for showing how to do microformats with RDFa.

15:26:52 [markbirbeck]

Mark: Why not just focus on microformat users for now?

15:27:28 [markbirbeck]

Ben: Ok...so let's withdraw MH's action item and change to "RDFa for Microformats authors".

15:28:28 [markbirbeck]

--dropped

15:29:29 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: mh to create "Microformats done right -- unambiguous taxonomies via RDF" on the wiki

15:32:02 [markbirbeck]

I'm just pasting the old actions. :)

15:33:47 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04]

15:33:51 [markbirbeck]

--continues

15:34:08 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: Steven to check test cases 29-33 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]

15:34:10 [markbirbeck]

--done

15:34:23 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: Ben to recontact implementors Elias, MarkB, triplr [and Fabien] and post their implementations to http://esw.w3.org/topic/RDFa#Implementations [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]

15:34:30 [markbirbeck]

--continues

15:34:42 [markbirbeck]

ACTION: Ben to work through xml:lang issue with Ivan [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]

15:35:00 [markbirbeck]

--dropped

15:35:40 [benadida]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Aug/0149

15:37:06 [markbirbeck]

Discussion on @xml:lang.

15:37:15 [markbirbeck]

Topic: @xml:lang

15:37:23 [RalphS]

Shane: Karl's message says that you may only use xml:lang in the XML serialization of HTML5

15:38:00 [markbirbeck]

Ben: Summarising the situation in relation to @lang and @xml:lang.

15:38:20 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

15:38:20 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html mhausenblas

15:38:21 [benadida]

PROPOSE to resolve: lang is not part of XHTML1.1, xml:lang is, thus XHTML1.1+RDFa supports only xml:lang.

15:38:40 [mhausenblas]

+1

15:38:46 [Steven]

+1

15:39:41 [markbirbeck]

RESOLUTION: @lang is not part of XHTML1.1, @xml:lang is, so we resolve that XHTML1.1+RDFa will only support @xml:lang.

15:40:10 [benadida]

ACTION: Ben, Mark, Elias, and other implementors to add xml:lang support

15:41:02 [mhausenblas]

Q: Does datatype hold a CURIE or a CURIE/URI?

15:42:01 [mhausenblas]

implicit: CURIE only

15:43:20 [markbirbeck]

Ben: PROPOSE that @datatype holds a basic_curie, rather than a safe_curie.

15:43:25 [ShaneM]

+q

15:43:37 [mhausenblas]

ack ShaneM

15:43:44 [markbirbeck]

...to use the terminology in the latest edits of CURIE syntax.

15:44:24 [RalphS]

Shane: in the latest CURIE editors' draft we removed square brackets

15:44:35 [RalphS]

Mark: we didn't actually remove them, we moved them to a different level

15:44:41 [mhausenblas]

+q ot ask about definition of basic vs. safe

15:44:59 [RalphS]

... the author can make a reference to a "basic CURIE" or to a "safe CURIE"

15:45:28 [markbirbeck]

s/the author/the author of a language using CURIEs/

15:46:12 [mhausenblas]

+1 to Ben's datatype proposal

15:46:58 [markbirbeck]

RESOLUTION: @datatype holds a basic_curie, rather than a safe_curie. (I.e., it does not need to have square brackets around it, and is essentially the same behaviour as @rel, @rev and @property.)

15:47:08 [RalphS]

agenda+ SWD WG face-to-face 8-9 Oct

15:47:33 [RalphS]

-> http://www.few.vu.nl/~aisaac/swd/ SWD WG face-to-face, 8-9 Oct, Amsterdam

15:47:48 [RalphS]

zakim, take up agendum 1

15:47:48 [Zakim]

agendum 1. "SWD WG face-to-face 8-9 Oct" taken up [from RalphS]

15:48:14 [markbirbeck]

Ralph: The WG has decided to have a meeting on 8 and 9 October.

15:48:31 [markbirbeck]

...we started to put together the agenda.

15:48:40 [markbirbeck]

...question is whether RDFa 'wants' to be on the agenda.

15:48:49 [markbirbeck]

Ben: We need to be on the agenda.

15:48:54 [markbirbeck]

...who else is going?

15:49:05 [markbirbeck]

Steven: It's a holiday week, so won't be there.

15:49:49 [markbirbeck]

Ralph: Think we should involve others from the SW Deployment WG.

15:50:20 [markbirbeck]

...because we (Ralph, Ben) haven't been pushing RDFa onto the agenda then it hasn't often been raised.

15:50:39 [markbirbeck]

...if we think that there are contributions that we want from people then we should try to be on the agenda.

15:51:43 [markbirbeck]

Mark: Asked if it was worth being on the agenda so as to do some RDFa marketing.

15:51:54 [markbirbeck]

Ralph: Thinks it may well be worth it.

15:52:59 [markbirbeck]

Ben: Thinks it would be worth promoting RDFa too.

15:53:26 [markbirbeck]

...if we had mature documents by then, and good implementations, perhaps Mark could present 'the package'.

15:54:05 [RalphS]

-> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/AmsterdamAgenda [draft] SWD WG f2f agenda

15:55:03 [markbirbeck]

Ralph: So it looks like Ben, Michael and Shane could be there remotely, and Mark might be able to attend in person.

15:57:16 [RalphS]

Topic: Documents

15:57:18 [markbirbeck]

Topic: Documents

15:58:14 [RalphS]

Mark: Shane and I were working on CURIEs the past week

15:58:30 [RalphS]

... I'm interested in the Rules section of the syntax document

15:58:32 [Steven]

Correction: I am in Amsterdam that week

15:58:37 [Steven]

I can attend

15:59:07 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

15:59:07 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html mhausenblas

15:59:22 [RalphS]

... if I focus on the Rules section that might be a way to manage editing conflicts

15:59:43 [RalphS]

Ben: can the editors find a time for an hour telecon?

16:00:15 [Steven]

I have posted to rdfa.info about Joost

16:01:27 [RalphS]

Ben: I'm planning to revamp the Primer completely, focus on the important attributes

16:01:43 [mhausenblas]

-> http://esw.w3.org/topic/SweoIG/TaskForces/CommunityProjects/LinkingOpenData/EuroSta

16:02:13 [mhausenblas]

-> http://esw.w3.org/topic/SweoIG/TaskForces/CommunityProjects/LinkingOpenData/EuroStat

16:03:07 [Zakim]

-markbirbeck

16:03:09 [Zakim]

-ShaneM

16:03:10 [Zakim]

-Steven

16:03:11 [Zakim]

-Ralph

16:03:13 [Zakim]

-Michael_Hausenblas

16:03:15 [Zakim]

-benadida

16:03:17 [Zakim]

SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has ended

16:03:18 [Zakim]

Attendees were Ralph, Michael_Hausenblas, benadida, Steven, ShaneM, markbirbeck

16:03:22 [mhausenblas]

Michael: any input for riese welcome ;)

16:03:25 [markbirbeck]

mmm...what's the magic again?

16:03:32 [markbirbeck]

"zakim, make minutes"?

16:03:43 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

16:03:43 [markbirbeck]

or do I do something else first?

16:03:48 [mhausenblas]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

16:03:48 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html mhausenblas

16:06:59 [mhausenblas]

mhausenblas has left #rdfa

16:08:33 [benadida]

benadida has left #rdfa

17:01:54 [RalphS]

zakim, bye

17:01:54 [Zakim]

Zakim has left #rdfa

17:02:00 [RalphS]

rrsagent, bye

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

I see 11 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-actions.rdf :

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ben to update the bookmarklet to handle img@src [1]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-12-01

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ben to work test cases 31 and 32 into primer [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action14] [2]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-14-00

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: mh to add a test case for @src [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action10] [3]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-14-29

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: mh to write an img@src test case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action11] [4]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-18-13

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: mh to create best practices wiki page [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action13] [5]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-18-21

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: mh to create "Microformats done right -- unambiguous taxonomies via RDF" on the wiki [6]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-29-29

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [7]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-33-47

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Steven to check test cases 29-33 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/16-rdfa-minutes.html#action09] [8]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-34-08

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ben to recontact implementors Elias, MarkB, triplr [and Fabien] and post their implementations to http://esw.w3.org/topic/RDFa#Implementations [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action09] [9]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-34-23

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ben to work through xml:lang issue with Ivan [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action07] [10]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-34-42

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ben, Mark, Elias, and other implementors to add xml:lang support [11]

17:02:00 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-irc#T15-40-10