14:20:10 RRSAgent has joined #dawg 14:20:10 logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc 14:20:14 zakim, this will be dawg 14:20:14 ok, LeeF; I see SW_DAWG()10:30AM scheduled to start in 10 minutes 14:20:19 Meeting: RDF Data Access Weekly 14:20:28 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/0051.html 14:20:31 Regrets: 14:20:34 Chair: LeeF 14:20:39 LeeF has changed the topic to: Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/0051.html 14:20:48 agenda + convene 14:20:52 agenda + action items 14:20:59 agenda + test URIs 14:21:02 agenda + test suite 14:21:07 agenda + facets and test coverage 14:21:18 agenda + test harness 14:22:55 ACTION: ericP to eyeball the list of uncovered facets and prune ones that are covered [DONE] 14:23:01 CTION: LeeF mark construct tests approved [DONE] 14:23:12 ACTION: LeeF mark dataset and graphs tests approved [DONE] 14:23:14 ACTION: LeeF mark construct tests approved [DONE] 14:23:20 ACTION: LeeF mark i18n tests as approved [DONE] 14:23:25 ACTION: LeeF to propose a grouping of facets into higher level features [DONE] 14:23:32 ACTION: LeeF to write a ?o/$o test [DONE] 14:23:38 ACTION: AndyS to write a BASE test [DONE] 14:23:59 agenda + invalid numeric literals 14:24:49 chimezie has joined #dawg 14:25:06 ACTION: chimezie to eyeball the algebraic forms and find any that do not have corresponding tests, attempt to do it by Aug 7 [DONE] 14:25:16 ACTION: ericP to run ASK tests 1, 4, and 7 by Aug 7 [DONE] 14:26:01 ericP, full facets coverage thing is _still_ running 14:26:04 take that long for you too? 14:26:29 AndyS has joined #dawg 14:26:51 LeeF, AndyS, can you remind me of the UK dialup number? 14:27:30 zakim, code? 14:27:30 the conference code is 7333 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), LeeF 14:27:35 one of those, I presume? 14:27:54 SW_DAWG()10:30AM has now started 14:28:01 +LeeF 14:28:42 cheers 14:29:35 +??P16 14:29:42 zakim, ??P16 is SteveH 14:29:42 +SteveH; got it 14:31:05 +??P17 14:31:12 zakim, ??P17 is me 14:31:12 +AndyS; got it 14:32:10 +Chimezie_Ogbuji 14:32:22 Zakim, who is on the phone? 14:32:22 On the phone I see LeeF, SteveH, AndyS, Chimezie_Ogbuji 14:32:44 Scribe: chimezie 14:32:51 ericP, joining? 14:34:03 zakim, take up next agendum 14:34:03 agendum 1. "convene" taken up [from LeeF] 14:34:05 Souri has joined #dawg 14:34:28 AndyS sends regrets for Aug 14 meeting 14:34:41 Chimezie sends regrets for Aug 14 as well 14:34:43 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/att-0047/31-dawg-minutes minutes from 31 July 14:35:22 approved, chimezie seconding 14:35:54 +Souri_Das 14:36:00 zakim, take up agendum 3 14:36:00 agendum 3. "test URIs" taken up [from LeeF] 14:36:27 LeeF: we need canonical URIs for test reporting 14:36:30 .../manifest.ttl#test-name 14:36:40 .../tests/r2#test-name 14:36:59 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/r2#construct-4 14:37:17 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/construct/manifest.ttl#construct-4 14:37:44 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/construct/manifest#construct-4 14:38:07 Zakim, please dial ericP-office 14:38:07 ok, ericP; the call is being made 14:38:09 +EricP 14:38:52 ericP: It would be akward not to provide RDF/XML formats for manifest files 14:39:27 LeeF: should this apply to all our files in turtle format? 14:39:30 ericP: yes 14:39:53 qt:data 14:40:10 LeeF: that would be a large refactoring effort 14:40:24 Transform is <#testfrag> to base:test. 14:41:10 AndyS: we only need to change the name of the test not the query or the data 14:42:29 AndyS: what does it dereference to? 14:43:27 ericP: suggestion: keep ttl files. Have a copy of manifest.rdf served from manifest# with fragments for test names 14:44:18 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/df1/ 14:45:32 ericP: would like to have manifest.ttl point to foo.ttl and manifest.rdf point to foo.rdf 14:46:21 AndyS: precedent for not going down turtle route 14:47:09 I think the DAWG is in a better position to use turtle since there is a close relationship between SPARQL and Turtle 14:47:26 Data examples in the spec are all in Turtle 14:47:47 ... conversation with Phillip (sp?) .. 14:47:55 absolutely! 14:48:31 I also think that maybe it's worthwhile to note that we're not trying to pub;lish our test suite as a /TR/ path doc 14:48:49 (unlike RDF, OWL, GRDDL, ...) 14:50:06 Could use N-TRIPLES which is what RDF-core developed so is more W3C, if still sub-REC. 14:50:56 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/construct/manifest#construct-4 14:51:15 LeeF: we are in agreement that we prefer the latter test URI convention 14:52:48 14:53:03 <#spoo-1> 14:53:10 basic/manifest.ttl#spoo-1 14:53:18 basic/manifest 14:53:55 AndyS: super manifest can name manifest.ttl and use consistent test URI convention throughout 14:54:08 @prefix base: 14:54:24 base:spoo-1 14:55:06 Will break running from CVS (file:) 14:55:47 ... ongoing conversation of modifying manifests to comply with test name convention ... 14:57:40 AndyS: could we convert manifests to RDF/XML as a final process 14:58:51 AndyS: turn <#...> into prefix names 14:59:20 cat /home/eric/WWW/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/distinct/manifest.ttl | perl -pe "s/.ttl/.rdf/g" | ./algae -i turtle -d - --sClass rdfxml "SELECT * { ?s ?p ?o }" 15:00:01 ACTION: LeeF to update the EARL document and all manifest files to use manifest#testname URIs 15:01:53 zakim, agenda? 15:01:53 I see 7 items remaining on the agenda: 15:01:56 1. convene [from LeeF] 15:01:58 2. action items [from LeeF] 15:01:59 3. test URIs [from LeeF] 15:02:00 4. test suite [from LeeF] 15:02:03 6. test harness [from LeeF] 15:02:04 7. invalid numeric literals [from LeeF] 15:02:19 LeeF: Schedule worries if we try to provide parallel test suite in RDF/XML world 15:03:46 ACTION: LeeF to ask CG about RDF/XML version of test suite 15:03:48 LeeF: it can still be useful to the community to ask for implementors to use the test framework (as it is) 15:04:12 zakim, take up agendum 4 15:04:12 agendum 4. "test suite" taken up [from LeeF] 15:05:02 zakim, take up agendum 5 15:05:02 agendum 5. "facets and test coverage" taken up [from LeeF] 15:05:16 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/0056.html missing algebraic forms 15:06:32 ACTION: chimezie to write tests to cover missing algebraic forms as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/0056.html 15:06:53 zakim, take up agendum 4 15:06:53 agendum 4. "test suite" taken up [from LeeF] 15:07:05 -Chimezie_Ogbuji 15:07:10 scribenick: ericP 15:07:19 qwejklasdf;lkjsfda 15:09:36 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/0054.html eric's ASK results 15:10:51 PROPOSE: Approve tests ask-1, ask-4, ask-7 in http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/ask/ 15:11:37 resolved, AndyS seconding 15:11:48 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/basic/ basic tests 15:12:12 PROPOSE: Approve all the tests in http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/basic/ 15:12:28 resolved, SteveH seconding 15:12:50 #distinct-start-1 15:12:53 #distinct-star-1 15:13:23 PROPOSE: Approve http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data-r2/distinct/manifest#distinct-star-1 15:13:45 resolved, ericP seconding 15:14:02 ACTION: LeeF to mark all tests approved in the 2007-08-07 meeting as approved 15:14:16 zakim, close this agendum 15:14:16 agendum 4 closed 15:14:17 I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 15:14:18 1. convene [from LeeF] 15:14:24 zakim, take up agendum 1 15:14:24 agendum 1. "convene" taken up [from LeeF] 15:14:30 zakim, close this agendum 15:14:30 agendum 1 closed 15:14:31 I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 15:14:31 agenda? 15:14:32 2. action items [from LeeF] 15:16:02 zakim, close agendum 3 15:16:02 agendum 3, test URIs, closed 15:16:03 I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 15:16:04 2. action items [from LeeF] 15:17:16 zakim, take up agendum 5 15:17:16 agendum 5. "facets and test coverage" taken up [from LeeF] 15:17:35 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/facets-coverage#coverage updated coverage 15:18:15 LeeF: down to 16 facets not covered 15:18:50 ... ericP, did you find anything in the shadows? 15:18:59 ericP: nope, just got to ASK last night 15:19:34 LeeF: anyone who's concearned about coverage should propose test areas by next week 15:19:56 ericP: second 15:20:10 AndyS: always want more tests, but more important to give the implementors more time 15:20:20 Souri: by 14th? sounds good 15:20:59 SteveH: hope to compare DAWG tests to our internal tests by tomorrow 15:21:11 zakim, close this agendum 15:21:11 agendum 5 closed 15:21:12 I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 15:21:13 2. action items [from LeeF] 15:21:16 ... will notifiy list of something comes up 15:21:20 agenda? 15:21:51 zakim, take up agendum 7 15:21:51 agendum 7. "invalid numeric literals" taken up [from LeeF] 15:22:16 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2007Aug/0004.html JJC on invalid numeric literals 15:23:16 LeeF: boolean value of ill-typed boolean is TRUE. prolly not intentional 15:24:42 Example FILTER ("foo"^^:myNumericType < 5 ) 15:24:55 ... seems like a bug that is fixable without another LC 15:25:22 -> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-sparql-query/#OperatorMapping operator mapping 15:25:49 "Xyz"^^xsd:integer is not a number. 15:27:06 """ 15:27:06 If the argument is a numeric type or a typed literal with a datatype derived from a numeric type, the EBV is false if the operand value is NaN or is numerically equal to zero; otherwise the EBV is true. 15:27:06 """ 15:27:44 http://www.w3.org/TR/xquery/#id-ebv 15:27:51 """ 15:27:51 # 15:27:51 15:27:51 If its operand is a singleton value of any numeric type or derived from a numeric type, fn:boolean returns false if the operand value is NaN or is numerically equal to zero; otherwise it returns true. 15:27:53 """ 15:30:42 seven 15:30:52 fn:boolean(//age) 15:36:25 (!"yep"^^my:boolean) 15:36:33 type error 15:39:14 [[If the argument is a numeric type or a typed literal with a datatype derived from a numeric type, the EBV is false if the operand value is NaN or is numerically equal to zero; otherwise the EBV is true.]] 15:41:36 ACTION: ericP to incorporate text to fix EBV of illformed numeric literals bug in spec 15:41:53 zakim, close this agendum 15:41:53 agendum 7 closed 15:41:54 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 15:41:56 2. action items [from LeeF] 15:41:59 zakim, take up agendum 2 15:41:59 agendum 2. "action items" taken up [from LeeF] 15:43:30 ACTION: ericP to poke IETF folks about registering SPARQL media types (esp. application/sparql-query) [CONTINUES] 15:44:20 ACTION: ericP to write explanatory text saying that, like xsd:inteter and xsd:dateTime, the relative order of simple literals and xsd:strings is not defined here [CONTINUES] 15:44:38 ACTION: ericP to answer "EBV of invalid numeric literals" email from Arjohn [CONTINUES] 15:45:07 -SteveH 15:45:31 ACTION: ericP to requisition /TR/SPARQL as a switcher document pointing to the real specs [CONTINUES] 15:45:38 ACTION: EliasT to come up with feature list for protocol testing [CONTINUES] 15:45:48 ACTION: LeeF and ericP to write tests for uncovered facets [CONTINUES] 15:46:10 ACTION: ericP to write a test showing that langMatches doens't do extended matching [CONTINUES] 15:46:26 ACTION: AndyS or LeeF to mark non-SELECT tests using :QueryForm classes, and to move those URIs to the qt: namespace [CONTINUES] 15:46:33 ACTION: Eric+Andy to identify and collect mf:requires URIs and put in documentation [CONTINUES] 15:46:50 ACTION: ericP, AndyS to add the mf:requires labels to the manifest namespace document [CONTINUES] 15:48:43 I got to go too, bye 15:48:45 LeeF: what do we do with XML results format? 15:48:54 zakim, close this anendum 15:48:54 I don't understand 'close this anendum', LeeF 15:48:56 -Souri_Das 15:49:04 zakim, close this agendum 15:49:04 agendum 2 closed 15:49:05 I see 1 item remaining on the agenda: 15:49:06 6. test harness [from LeeF] 15:49:16 zakim, close agendum 6 15:49:16 agendum 6, test harness, closed 15:49:17 I see nothing remaining on the agenda 15:49:57 ACTION: LeeF to get rid of any distinct and ordered attributes 15:50:43 ericP: Ralph: best to publish XML Results Format as a CR when we tell the world that we are done with the tests 15:51:20 LeeF: how would you feel about a decision to release the test suite while you aren't around? 15:51:25 AndyS: that's fine 15:52:33 adjourned. 15:52:43 RRSAgent, please draft minutes 15:52:43 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-minutes.html LeeF 15:52:54 RRSAgent, make logs world-access 15:54:17 -LeeF 15:54:23 -EricP 15:54:24 SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended 15:54:25 Attendees were LeeF, SteveH, AndyS, Chimezie_Ogbuji, Souri_Das, EricP 17:12:06 Zakim, bye 17:12:06 Zakim has left #dawg 17:12:13 RRSAgent, bye 17:12:13 I see 25 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-actions.rdf : 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to eyeball the list of uncovered facets and prune ones that are covered [DONE] [1] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-22-55 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF mark dataset and graphs tests approved [DONE] [2] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-23-12 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF mark construct tests approved [DONE] [3] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-23-14 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF mark i18n tests as approved [DONE] [4] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-23-20 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF to propose a grouping of facets into higher level features [DONE] [5] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-23-25 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF to write a ?o/$o test [DONE] [6] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-23-32 17:12:13 ACTION: AndyS to write a BASE test [DONE] [7] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-23-38 17:12:13 ACTION: chimezie to eyeball the algebraic forms and find any that do not have corresponding tests, attempt to do it by Aug 7 [DONE] [8] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-25-06 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to run ASK tests 1, 4, and 7 by Aug 7 [DONE] [9] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T14-25-16 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF to update the EARL document and all manifest files to use manifest#testname URIs [10] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-00-01 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF to ask CG about RDF/XML version of test suite [11] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-03-46 17:12:13 ACTION: chimezie to write tests to cover missing algebraic forms as per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JulSep/0056.html [12] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-06-32 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF to mark all tests approved in the 2007-08-07 meeting as approved [13] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-14-02 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to incorporate text to fix EBV of illformed numeric literals bug in spec [14] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-41-36 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to poke IETF folks about registering SPARQL media types (esp. application/sparql-query) [CONTINUES] [15] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-43-30 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to write explanatory text saying that, like xsd:inteter and xsd:dateTime, the relative order of simple literals and xsd:strings is not defined here [CONTINUES] [16] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-44-20 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to answer "EBV of invalid numeric literals" email from Arjohn [CONTINUES] [17] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-44-38 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to requisition /TR/SPARQL as a switcher document pointing to the real specs [CONTINUES] [18] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-45-31 17:12:13 ACTION: EliasT to come up with feature list for protocol testing [CONTINUES] [19] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-45-38 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF and ericP to write tests for uncovered facets [CONTINUES] [20] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-45-48 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP to write a test showing that langMatches doens't do extended matching [CONTINUES] [21] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-46-10 17:12:13 ACTION: AndyS or LeeF to mark non-SELECT tests using :QueryForm classes, and to move those URIs to the qt: namespace [CONTINUES] [22] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-46-26 17:12:13 ACTION: Eric+Andy to identify and collect mf:requires URIs and put in documentation [CONTINUES] [23] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-46-33 17:12:13 ACTION: ericP, AndyS to add the mf:requires labels to the manifest namespace document [CONTINUES] [24] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-46-50 17:12:13 ACTION: LeeF to get rid of any distinct and ordered attributes [25] 17:12:13 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/07-dawg-irc#T15-49-57