IRC log of forms on 2007-04-25

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:54:29 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #forms
13:54:29 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-irc
13:54:36 [Steven]
rrsagent,make log public
14:03:50 [markbirbeck]
markbirbeck has joined #forms
14:54:19 [John_Boyer]
John_Boyer has joined #forms
14:54:43 [John_Boyer]
Hi Steven, you there?
14:54:56 [Steven]
yes, on XHTML call
14:55:16 [John_Boyer]
Somehow the agenda I sent isn't getting through.
14:55:26 [John_Boyer]
I sent it to you; could you post to group please?
14:55:27 [Steven]
urgh
14:55:32 [John_Boyer]
agreed!
14:55:50 [John_Boyer]
My apologies for the interruption...
14:56:01 [Steven]
Didn't get it
14:56:24 [John_Boyer]
Hmm, that seems to suggest my mail isn't working
14:57:07 [Steven]
yep
14:57:14 [Steven]
not still in your outbox?
14:57:35 [John_Boyer]
No
14:58:04 [John_Boyer]
I'm using Lotus Notes, which does DB replication. That replication appears to be succeeding
14:59:33 [Blake]
Blake has joined #forms
14:59:48 [lars]
lars has joined #forms
15:00:12 [lars]
zakim, code please
15:00:12 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'code', lars
15:00:19 [John_Boyer]
zakim, this will be forms
15:00:19 [Zakim]
ok, John_Boyer, I see HTML_Forms()11:00AM already started
15:00:52 [jan]
jan has joined #forms
15:01:06 [John_Boyer]
Meeting: Weekly Forms WG Teleconference
15:01:19 [Nick]
Nick has joined #Forms
15:01:23 [Steven]
zakim, code?
15:01:23 [Zakim]
the conference code is 36767 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), Steven
15:01:26 [John_Boyer]
Chair: John
15:01:45 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
15:02:11 [Zakim]
+Blake
15:02:14 [Charlie]
Charlie has joined #forms
15:02:25 [Charlie]
zakim, who is here?
15:02:25 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Raman, John_Boyer, [IBM], Blake
15:02:27 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Charlie, Nick, jan, lars, Blake, John_Boyer, markbirbeck, RRSAgent, Zakim, Steven
15:02:28 [John_Boyer]
Regrets: David, Ulrich, Joern, Rafael, Susan, Erik, Leigh
15:02:30 [jan]
zakim, [ibm is jan
15:02:30 [Zakim]
+jan; got it
15:02:31 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
15:02:32 [Charlie]
zakim, [IBM] is Charlie
15:02:32 [Zakim]
+Charlie; got it
15:02:42 [Zakim]
+lars
15:02:47 [John_Boyer]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2007Apr/0033.html
15:02:54 [Charlie]
zakim, who is here?
15:02:56 [John_Boyer]
John_Boyer has changed the topic to: Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2007Apr/0033.html
15:03:08 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Raman, John_Boyer, jan, Blake, Charlie, lars
15:03:12 [Zakim]
+Nick_van_den_Bleeken
15:03:18 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Charlie, Nick, jan, lars, Blake, John_Boyer, markbirbeck, RRSAgent, Zakim, Steven
15:03:43 [Steven]
John, your mails just arrived
15:03:46 [Schnitz]
Schnitz has joined #forms
15:03:50 [Steven]
zakim, dial steven-617
15:03:52 [Zakim]
ok, Steven; the call is being made
15:03:52 [John_Boyer]
yes I saw that!
15:03:55 [Schnitz]
zakim, code?
15:03:56 [Zakim]
+Steven
15:04:02 [Zakim]
the conference code is 36767 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), Schnitz
15:05:09 [John_Boyer]
zakim, who is here?
15:05:23 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Raman, John_Boyer, jan, Blake, Charlie, lars, Nick_van_den_Bleeken (muted), Steven
15:05:43 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Schnitz, Charlie, Nick, jan, lars, Blake, John_Boyer, markbirbeck, RRSAgent, Zakim, Steven
15:05:59 [Zakim]
+??P7
15:06:10 [Schnitz]
zakim, ??p7 is me
15:06:13 [Zakim]
+Schnitz; got it
15:06:17 [Schnitz]
zakim, mute me
15:06:23 [Zakim]
Schnitz should now be muted
15:07:45 [Schnitz]
zakim, unmute me
15:07:45 [Zakim]
Schnitz should no longer be muted
15:07:55 [Schnitz]
I will try to remain unmuted
15:08:21 [Schnitz]
if I happen to make too much noise, which shouldn't happen, please mute me
15:08:56 [Zakim]
+Mark_Birbeck
15:09:39 [markbirbeck]
Scribe: Mark Birbeck
15:10:00 [Steven]
scribenick: 10markbirbeck01
15:10:15 [Steven]
scribenick: markbirbeck
15:10:43 [markbirbeck]
Note that Darryl hasn't rejoined the group.
15:11:05 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Coming calls
15:11:48 [markbirbeck]
John said that the next call is during the web conference.
15:12:07 [John_Boyer]
John says May 9 (two calls from now) is during the web conference
15:12:11 [markbirbeck]
Does this mean there should be no call?
15:13:12 [markbirbeck]
John said that unless anyone is speaking at 9am on the Wednesday, it should be possible to make the call.
15:14:06 [markbirbeck]
John asked if Steven could chair on the 16th.
15:14:34 [markbirbeck]
Steven said he probably couldn't make it, due to XTech.
15:14:50 [markbirbeck]
Steven agreed to the 23rd, though.
15:15:04 [markbirbeck]
Sebastian volunteered to chair on the 16th.
15:15:13 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2003Aug/0000.html
15:15:40 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Test suite issues
15:16:09 [markbirbeck]
John asked Jan if the issues Bjoern raised are out of date now.
15:16:55 [markbirbeck]
ACTION: Jan to send a response to Bjoern on the issues raised in email http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2003Aug/0000.html
15:17:41 [Nick]
Nick has joined #Forms
15:18:55 [markbirbeck]
It should be noted that this email only came to light recently, because it was sent directly to the archives, without going via any of the XForms lists.
15:19:53 [markbirbeck]
s/, because it was/; it had been/
15:21:26 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2002Nov/0002
15:21:34 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Alphabetise the glossary
15:21:45 [Steven]
04 01http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms-testsuite/ existed in Feb 2003
15:21:45 [markbirbeck]
ACTION: John to alphabetise the glossary.
15:21:56 [Steven]
that was the place to send the message
15:22:59 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms/2007Apr/0064.html
15:23:20 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Loading instance as .XML page
15:24:02 [markbirbeck]
ACTION: Mark Birbeck to reply to email http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms/2007Apr/0064.html
15:24:29 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Managing the implementations list on the wiki
15:26:20 [jan]
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Forms/wiki/XForms_Implementations ... MozzIE is 3rd implementation listed
15:27:41 [markbirbeck]
There seems to be support for moving items like news, implementations and so on, to the wiki.
15:27:56 [Zakim]
-Raman
15:28:18 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/
15:28:38 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/
15:28:51 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Last call issues
15:29:01 [Nick]
Nick has joined #Forms
15:29:44 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0003.html
15:30:59 [Steven]
It is possible to make the wiki editable by WG only
15:31:05 [Steven]
I am requesting it now
15:31:35 [markbirbeck]
David's email says that it is not clear when the calculation should be recalculated.
15:32:07 [markbirbeck]
He says that therefore calculated nodes should always be readonly.
15:34:03 [John_Boyer]
zakim, who is here?
15:34:03 [Zakim]
On the phone I see John_Boyer, jan, Blake, Charlie, lars, Nick_van_den_Bleeken (muted), Steven, Schnitz, Mark_Birbeck
15:34:05 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Nick, Schnitz, Charlie, jan, lars, Blake, John_Boyer, markbirbeck, RRSAgent, Zakim, Steven
15:35:00 [markbirbeck]
John asked if we need to have a different approach to handling LC comments.
15:39:16 [lars]
zakim, mute me
15:39:19 [Zakim]
lars should now be muted
15:44:11 [markbirbeck]
It seems that the issues are (a) any changes that a user makes will be overwritten and (b) that since '.' will not create a dependency in the dependency graph, not all calculations will be recalculated in recalculate(), unless there was a rebuild first.
15:46:39 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0003.html
15:46:59 [markbirbeck]
ACTION: John will start a thread on the list so as to arrive at a LC response to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0003.html
15:47:30 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0004.html
15:48:09 [John_Boyer]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0006.html
15:48:28 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Last call comment that XForms 1.1 is missing a string compare capability.
15:48:57 [Nick]
Nick has joined #Forms
15:49:46 [Nick]
but if we add that we in europe can't use it
15:50:47 [Steven]
Wiki is now writeable only for group members
15:51:26 [Nick]
zakim, unmute me
15:51:26 [Zakim]
Nick_van_den_Bleeken should no longer be muted
15:51:49 [markbirbeck]
Mark raised Michael Kay's email, and said that if we are considering this kind of functionality, we should consider doing it in an XPath 2.0 way.
15:53:41 [markbirbeck]
Nick said that the string-compare() function would not be as useful to his use-cases without the collation features that XPath 2.0 has.
15:54:20 [markbirbeck]
It was agreed that we would try to create something that was as close as possible to XPath 2.0 as possible.
15:57:17 [markbirbeck]
Topic: Manage the implementations list on the wiki
15:57:35 [Nick]
zakim, mute me
15:57:36 [Zakim]
Nick_van_den_Bleeken should now be muted
15:58:35 [Nick]
Nick has joined #Forms
15:59:37 [Nick]
mark my irc client is crashing constantly so I'm not sure but did you created the two action items for the reponses wit 'ACTION:'?
15:59:53 [markbirbeck]
Nick, I didn't...sorry.
16:00:40 [Nick]
can you still create them, that otherwise it is hard for me to create them in 'my' system
16:00:49 [markbirbeck]
Nick, yes, will do.
16:00:58 [Nick]
thanks
16:03:12 [Nick]
the system that we have now has more information
16:03:26 [Nick]
I've looked to the database tables
16:03:27 [markbirbeck]
ACTION: Nick to to look at the string-compare() proposal from John, and see whether we can bring this into line with XPath 2.0's compare() function. This should form the basis of a response to John's LC commment http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0004.html
16:03:37 [Zakim]
-Charlie
16:03:38 [Zakim]
-jan
16:03:39 [Nick]
bye
16:03:40 [Zakim]
-Steven
16:03:42 [Zakim]
-lars
16:03:43 [Zakim]
-Mark_Birbeck
16:03:45 [Zakim]
-Blake
16:03:48 [Zakim]
-Nick_van_den_Bleeken
16:03:50 [Nick]
Nick has left #Forms
16:03:52 [Zakim]
-John_Boyer
16:03:52 [Blake]
Blake has left #forms
16:05:33 [Steven]
zakim, who is here?
16:05:33 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Schnitz
16:05:34 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Schnitz, lars, John_Boyer, markbirbeck, RRSAgent, Zakim, Steven
16:05:42 [Steven]
zakim, drop sc
16:05:42 [Zakim]
Schnitz is being disconnected
16:05:44 [Zakim]
HTML_Forms()11:00AM has ended
16:05:45 [Zakim]
Attendees were Raman, John_Boyer, Blake, jan, Charlie, lars, Nick_van_den_Bleeken, Steven, Schnitz, Mark_Birbeck
16:05:49 [John_Boyer]
rrsagent, make log public
16:05:59 [Steven]
rrsagent, make minutes
16:05:59 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-minutes.html Steven
16:06:12 [John_Boyer]
rrsagent, bye
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-actions.rdf :
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Jan to send a response to Bjoern on the issues raised in email http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2003Aug/0000.html [1]
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-irc#T15-16-55
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: John to alphabetise the glossary. [2]
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-irc#T15-21-45-1
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Mark Birbeck to reply to email http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms/2007Apr/0064.html [3]
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-irc#T15-24-02
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: John will start a thread on the list so as to arrive at a LC response to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0003.html [4]
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-irc#T15-46-59
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Nick to to look at the string-compare() proposal from John, and see whether we can bring this into line with XPath 2.0's compare() function. This should form the basis of a response to John's LC commment http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-forms-editor/2007Mar/0004.html [5]
16:06:12 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/25-forms-irc#T16-03-27