15:55:06 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #hcls
15:55:06 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/11/16-hcls-irc
15:55:21 <eneumann> rrsagent, set logs public
15:55:28 <eneumann> zakim, this is hcls
15:55:28 <Zakim> ok, eneumann; that matches SW_HCLS()11:00AM
15:55:40 <samwaldmatthias> No, there still is no change-log, I will start logging changes from now on. However, the ontology should be quite stable for the next time (i.e. no big changes that are not backwards-compatible)
15:56:09 <chimezie> okay
15:57:34 <eneumann> chimezie, Matthias, is there any summary of DOLCE or Biozen that this group could refer to? I'm not sure most of us know enough about it.
15:57:51 <Don> Don has joined #HCLS
15:59:10 <samwaldmatthias> At the time, there is only the 'manual' at http://neuroscientific.net/res/semsyn/biozen-manual-oct-06.pdf
15:59:11 <Zakim> +Don_Doherty
15:59:14 <Zakim> -Eric_Neumann
15:59:15 <chimezie> Mathias has a very nice writeup
15:59:16 <Zakim> +Eric_Neumann
15:59:35 <samwaldmatthias> And there should be a publication in the Journal of Web Semantics
15:59:42 <samwaldmatthias> in the next months.
15:59:58 <Marja> Marja has joined #hcls
16:00:01 <BillBug> BillBug has joined #hcls
16:00:17 <Zakim> +Helen_Chen
16:01:11 <Zakim> +Bill_Bug
16:01:26 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:01:29 <Tonya> Tonya has joined #hcls
16:01:35 <Zakim> + +1.443.538.aaaa
16:01:54 <Helen> Helen has joined #hcls
16:02:12 <Zakim> +??P8
16:02:21 <samwaldmatthias> I'm probably [IPcaller]
16:02:24 <Zakim> +Chimezie_Ogbuji
16:02:31 <Zakim> +Tanya_Hongsermeier
16:02:35 <Zakim> +Marja
16:02:49 <chimezie> Zakim, +??P8 is samwaldmathias
16:02:49 <Zakim> sorry, chimezie, I do not recognize a party named '+??P8'
16:02:54 <eneumann> zakim, samwaldmatthias is IPcaller
16:02:54 <Zakim> sorry, eneumann, I do not recognize a party named 'samwaldmatthias'
16:03:19 <eneumann> zakim, IPcaller  is samwaldmatthias
16:03:19 <Zakim> +samwaldmatthias; got it
16:05:32 <Zakim> + +46.3.17.06.aabb
16:05:47 <chimezie> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:05:47 <Zakim> On the phone I see Eric_Neumann, Don_Doherty, Helen_Chen, Bill_Bug, samwaldmatthias, +1.443.538.aaaa, ??P8, Chimezie_Ogbuji, Tanya_Hongsermeier, Marja, +46.3.17.06.aabb
16:07:44 <samwaldmatthias> I have added the writeup of my proposal on http://esw.w3.org/topic/MatthiasSamwald/DOLCE_bio-zen_patient-record_proposal
16:07:58 <eneumann> Thanks Matthias
16:08:07 <Susie> Susie has joined #hcls
16:08:09 <Zakim> + +1.301.435.aacc
16:09:26 <eneumann> zakim, 46.3.17.06.aabb is Kerstin
16:09:26 <Zakim> sorry, eneumann, I do not recognize a party named '46.3.17.06.aabb'
16:09:35 <BillBug> BIRN: General tools and data sets (http://www.nbirn.net/downloads/index.shtm)
16:09:57 <eneumann> zakim, +46.3.17.06.aabb is Kerstin
16:09:57 <Zakim> +Kerstin; got it
16:10:07 <chimezie> scribe: Tonya
16:10:10 <eneumann> zakim, +1.443.538.aaaa is AJ
16:10:10 <Zakim> +AJ; got it
16:11:03 <BillBug> Mouse BIRN Integrated Atlasing Environment (http://www.nbirn.net/downloads/mbat/index.shtm) - visual presentation of spatially-specified neuro data sets (e.g., mRNA expression)
16:12:16 <eneumann> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HCLS/F2F/Actions
16:15:40 <Zakim> +??P2
16:16:40 <eneumann> zakim, +1.301.435.aacc is Olivier
16:16:40 <Zakim> +Olivier; got it
16:16:53 <BillBug> BIRN: General downloads list the BIRN ontology - BIRNLex.  We're in the process of moving this into Oracle RDF/XML and use it as the core semantic framework for ALL mediated datasets (60+ BIRN participating labs) - these site RDBMS stores are already registered with the BIRN RDBMS Mediator - currently in heavy use for intra-BIRN collaboration - ultimate goal is to expose all this data for...
16:16:55 <BillBug> ...open, public consumption
16:19:04 <eneumann> ACTION: Eric to get Draft Notes template from Ivan
16:19:23 <BillBug> SKOS: extremely detailed discussion of use of SKOS & RDF - contrast with FOAF - use for RDF representation of WordNet (http://www.nabble.com/SKOS-Core-enquiry-tf2495152.html)
16:21:16 <samwaldmatthias> Regarding SKOS: I have already converted many OBO ontologies to SKOS. However, you are limited to is-a and part-of properties between concepts. However, this might suffice for many parts of the UMLS, if completeness of the RDF version is not a major concern.
16:24:12 <chimezie> W3C Best Practices note on representing values in OWL: http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-specified-values/
16:24:18 <chimezie> not sufficient for the original question
16:24:22 <BillBug> I think that constraint is probably OK for a first pass on UMLS.  Given the specific support for lexical resources SKOS was designed to support (one reason for expression WordNet using it), I think UMLS --> RDF will be well support using SKOS (again, as a first pass).
16:24:42 <BillBug> (that was a followup to Matthias's comment)
16:26:41 <samwaldmatthias> In that case, I would strongly recommed SKOS instead of coming up with yet-another new RDF or OWL ontology.
16:27:01 <BillBug> ditto
16:28:19 <BillBug> agree with Eric's need to put a hold on action item - but it appears it would be very helpful to discuss this issue off-line with Matthias (and those who've worked on SKOS - see discussion thread cited above)
16:30:08 <BillBug> (issue was Helen's discussion of formalizing use of controlled lexicons in the ACPP - and links to CVs by other standards such as HL7)
16:31:43 <chimezie> My attempt to clarify the issue with an example: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-semweb-lifesci/2006Oct/0065.html
16:33:19 <samwaldmatthias> Regarding the example query we came up with in Amsterdam (I think it was my idea): unfortunately, the MeSH annotation of PubChem is rather lacking and hacky -- so PubChem does not seem as good as it seemed back then.
16:35:32 <BillBug> BioRDF - additional Use Cases from BIRN - this public BIRNLex page has an attempt review all the many use cases from throughout BIRN (http://xwiki.nbirn.net:8080/xwiki/bin/view/%20BIRN-OTF-Public/Home#Use+Cases)
16:37:14 <BillBug> (nearly all relate to defining requirements to support complex semantic queries on the topic of neurodegenerative disease)
16:39:31 <BillBug> ? (reminder) regarding use of OWL 1.1 and RDF
16:42:49 <BillBug> (relevant both to BioRDF & bioONT TFs - and likely all other TFs)
16:44:50 <BillBug> Helen & Chimezie: for issues you both have brought up - weren't there extensive discussions on the HCLSIG list back in Aug-Sep on these issues?
16:45:06 <chimezie> Not towards a concrete solution, however.. had more to do with HL7
16:46:49 <BillBug> absolutely - but also on the issue you brought up - more related to EPR issues related to roles - discussion about use of FOAF - etc. - isn't there something in those discussions that could lay the foundation for a position paper - that would review some of the papers you, Helen, & Eric have mentioned?
16:49:07 <chimezie> Harry Halpin is interested in making a HCLS usecase for GRDDL within the Primer document
16:50:00 <chimezie> John Madden is quite interested
16:50:02 <chimezie> as well
16:50:39 <eneumann> ACTION: draft of problem statement for computer-based patient records (Chimezie, Tonya, Helen, Susie)
16:52:24 <chimezie> BillBug: yes, sorry I misunderstood the context.  I do recall that discussion thread and yes current efforts to ratify FOAF do not include concepts important to this community such as rules, etc..
16:52:55 <chimezie> s/rules/roles
16:54:54 <Helen> Helen has joined #hcls
16:58:05 <eneumann> see: http://lists.mindswap.org/pipermail/owl/2005-December/000097.html
16:59:37 <chimezie> there is big resistance to OWL 1.1 for this particular reason (modulo RDF) with folks such as Jim Hendler
17:00:07 <chimezie> http://www.mindswap.org/blog/2006/11/13/11-alternative/
17:00:22 <eneumann> also... http://owl1_1.cs.manchester.ac.uk/rdf_mapping.html
17:00:57 <chimezie> thx, i wasn't aware of that one
17:04:08 <Zakim> -Kerstin
17:04:30 <Zakim> -??P8
17:04:35 <Zakim> -Chimezie_Ogbuji
17:04:38 <Zakim> -Bill_Bug
17:04:45 <Zakim> -Helen_Chen
17:04:48 <eneumann> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:04:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/11/16-hcls-minutes.html eneumann
17:04:49 <Zakim> -Don_Doherty
17:04:55 <Zakim> -Olivier
17:04:57 <Zakim> -AJ
17:04:59 <Zakim> -??P2
17:05:01 <Zakim> -Tanya_Hongsermeier
17:05:03 <Zakim> -Marja
17:05:05 <Zakim> -Eric_Neumann
17:05:06 <samwaldmatthias> Chimezie? 
17:05:09 <Zakim> -samwaldmatthias
17:05:11 <Zakim> SW_HCLS()11:00AM has ended
17:05:13 <Zakim> Attendees were Eric_Neumann, Don_Doherty, Helen_Chen, Bill_Bug, Chimezie_Ogbuji, Tanya_Hongsermeier, Marja, samwaldmatthias, Kerstin, AJ, Olivier
17:05:17 <eneumann> rrsagent, bye
17:05:17 <RRSAgent> I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2006/11/16-hcls-actions.rdf :
17:05:17 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Eric to get Draft Notes template from Ivan [1]
17:05:17 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/11/16-hcls-irc#T16-19-04
17:05:17 <RRSAgent> ACTION: draft of problem statement for computer-based patient records (Chimezie, Tonya, Helen, Susie) [2]
17:05:17 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/11/16-hcls-irc#T16-50-39