16:56:43 RRSAgent has joined #tagmem 16:56:43 logging to http://www.w3.org/2005/09/06-tagmem-irc 16:56:49 zakim, this is tag 16:56:49 Norm, I see TAG_Weekly()12:30PM in the schedule but not yet started. Perhaps you mean "this will be tag". 16:56:53 zakim, this will be tag 16:56:53 ok, Norm; I see TAG_Weekly()12:30PM scheduled to start 26 minutes ago 16:57:49 noah has joined #tagmem 17:00:34 TAG_Weekly()12:30PM has now started 17:00:41 +Norm 17:00:45 zakim, please call ht-781 17:00:45 ok, ht; the call is being made 17:00:46 +Ht 17:00:59 Vincent has joined #tagmem 17:01:01 DanC has changed the topic to: TAG 6 Jun. scribe: Roy 17:01:50 zakim, who's here? 17:01:50 On the phone I see Norm, Ht 17:01:51 On IRC I see Vincent, noah, RRSAgent, Zakim, Roy, ht, Norm, ht_gone_to_work, DanC 17:02:01 +[IBMCambridge] 17:02:11 zakim, [IBMCambridge] is me 17:02:13 +noah; got it 17:02:20 Ed has joined #tagmem 17:02:44 +Tayeb/JeffB 17:02:46 +DanC 17:02:46 -DanC 17:02:56 +??P1 17:03:07 Zakim, Tayeb/JeffB is Vincent 17:03:07 +Vincent; got it 17:03:11 +DanC 17:03:11 zakim, ??P1 is Ed 17:03:11 +Ed; got it 17:03:13 -DanC 17:03:13 +Roy 17:03:15 zakim, who's here 17:03:15 Norm, you need to end that query with '?' 17:03:18 zakim, who's here? 17:03:18 On the phone I see Norm, Ht, noah, Vincent, Ed, Roy 17:03:20 On IRC I see Ed, Vincent, noah, RRSAgent, Zakim, Roy, ht, Norm, ht_gone_to_work, DanC 17:03:22 dorchard has joined #tagmem 17:03:41 +DOrchard 17:04:09 ScribeNick: Roy 17:04:24 Scribe: Roy Fielding 17:04:45 +DanC 17:05:50 Regrets for Sep 13: Noah 17:06:09 ... Henry, Tim 17:07:11 Topic: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/09/06-agenda.html 17:08:35 Plan for next week is discussion of GRID. Experts have been invited but we have not heard back yet. 17:09:07 Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/09/06-agenda.html 17:10:09 VQ: should we still schedule discussion for next week if we only have one person from GRID? 17:10:34 NW: yes 17:10:55 Ed: yes 17:11:33 NM: propose we take one round of discussion to get oriented and then perhaps take it further during the f2f 17:12:10 NW: will find out about other experts and send info to Vincent 17:12:41 Topic: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/09/06-agenda.html 17:12:46 no objections 17:12:55 -> http://www.w3.org/2005/08/30-tagmem-minutes 30 Aug minutes 17:13:30 ACTION Minutes of last meeting 30 Aug approved 17:14:12 Topic: Agenda for Edinburgh f2f 17:14:55 VQ: have made a pass through the issues list to prepare for a f2f agenda 17:15:12 Ed_ has joined #tagmem 17:15:23 ah... good... http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?type=1#httpRange-14 is now marked "agreed" 17:15:34 VQ: rough draft so far (where?) 17:16:19 VQ: I would like to make progress on several of the open issues, try to close them, and make progress where possible 17:16:49 VQ: I would also like to see some setting of priorities for the TAG 17:17:01 DC: okay 17:17:11 NW: that would be good 17:17:43 VQ: Henry, are there constraints on the schedule at F2F? 17:18:00 HT: No, we can go til midnight is desired. 17:18:36 -Ed 17:18:43 HT: dinner on Tuesday should be at 7:30 pm, time not yet confirmed 17:18:47 (let's see... europe is that funny place where I wake up at 3 or 4am, right? so I'm happy to start earlier than 9am... much earlier... and by 5pm, you'll be lucky to communicate with my conscious self.) 17:19:47 HT: do people have a preference for organizing a group meal on Wed or Thurs? 17:20:04 [all] Wed is better 17:21:11 VQ: anything else about the logistics? 17:22:20 Ed_ has joined #tagmem 17:22:25 this is all online right Henry? 17:22:34 HT: location is three-story row house with lots of doors. I will stand out on the sidewalk from 8:30 to 9 or so to let people in. If you are late, enter door 2, go upstairs one level, ... 17:23:22 it seems to be covered at http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/2005/09/edinburgh-meetings-info.html#location 17:23:37 ... ring bell marked "HCRC", secretary will let you in and take you to the meeting 17:23:40 Topic: Proposed errata for webarch 17:23:51 or call my cell phone: +44 7866 471 388 17:24:04 http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/webarch/proposed-errata.html#entries 17:24:19 Ed__ has joined #tagmem 17:25:12 NW: first entry is from Chris, suggests that we add an editorial correction and that looks fine to me 17:25:26 NW: anyone disagree (silence) 17:25:51 "Interpretation of prose in 3.3" 17:25:58 ^that's a pretty good name, for these minutes 17:26:14 RESOLVED that TAG agrees to CL errata 1, Interpretation of prose in 3.3 17:26:28 RESOLVED: TAG agrees to CL errata 1, Interpretation of prose in 3.3 17:27:00 Second errata is from Roy to update references to URI and IRI 17:27:27 RESOLVED: TAG agrees to RF errata for URI and IRI references 17:27:47 ACTION: NW to include items 1 and 2 in webarch errata 17:28:45 Topic: Interpretation of prose in 3.3 17:28:58 Topic: URNsAndRegistries-50 17:29:33 HT: document is not ready yet and unlikely to be able to spend more time on it before f2f 17:29:49 VQ: should we spend time on it during f2f? 17:30:04 HT: probably not 17:30:27 DC: this topic doesn't seem to be urgent at this point 17:31:02 http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/URNsAndRegistries-50.xml 17:31:19 Norm has joined #tagmem 17:31:41 Noah is talking about namespaceDocument-8 17:32:35 NM: there is concern about use of namespace names and http, may be worth f2f time 17:32:56 VQ: that is on the f2f agenda under namespaceDocument-8 17:34:25 DC: IETF stated practice currently is to use URNs for namespace names, for example in geopriv (geo privacy) specs. 17:35:31 DC: IETF using XML in various ways and recommending use of URNs, so there is some need to recommend dereferenceable identifiers instead 17:35:54 dorchard has joined #tagmem 17:36:31 Topic: standardizedFieldValues-51 17:36:53 http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#standardizedFieldValues-51 17:37:24 VQ: we have not done work on this since it was announced. does it make sense to discuss it at f2f? 17:39:18 DC: people working on protocols/formats tend to start with short names and then later encounter name collision 17:39:50 Roy: I suggest that DC take an action to write something up ;-) 17:40:02 DC: I could do that 17:40:19 NM: that would be valuable to me to get a handle on the issue 17:40:42 ACTION DanC: write an update on issue 51 and microformats 17:41:56 Roy: I agree with Dan's summary of the issue 17:42:33 "iptc:10112244" 17:42:39 Norm has joined #tagmem 17:42:47 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-html-wg/2005JulSep/0033 [ACTION] Send link to proposal for "Compact URI Syntax" 17:45:06 Topic: Reviewing a few pending actions 17:45:29 (I just sent mail about namespaceDocument-8, if we want to add that today's agenda) 17:45:36 VQ: http://www.w3.org/2005/02/22-tagmem-minutes#action04 17:45:48 VQ: any progress? 17:46:04 NW: no progress to report, we need to figure out who has the ball 17:46:13 q+ to ask who has the ball on c14n 17:46:28 ack danc 17:46:28 DanC, you wanted to ask who has the ball on c14n 17:47:11 HT: XML Core 17:47:12 NW: I will try to write something up for f2f 17:47:50 ACTION: Norm to provide something written for namespaceState for f2f 17:48:09 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-xml-schema-wg/2005Mar/att-0006/xml-schema-f2f-minutes-2005-03-03.html#p219 17:48:09 David Orchard to contextualize his scenarios, such as more on what is happening with SOAP and WSDL. [recorded in Minutes of the W3C XML Schema Working Group 4th (37th) F2F meeting] 17:48:33 that document is not public 17:49:22 [TP5-8: David Orchard to contextualize his scenarios, such as more on what is happening with SOAP and WSDL.] 17:50:36 DO: I have made significant progress on that action, should be resolved within a week or so 17:50:54 VQ: let us know when we should review something in the TAG 17:51:09 VQ: any more items to discuss? 17:51:16 DC: I sent email ... 17:51:24 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/06/23-rddl/ ns8 stuff 17:52:42 q+ 17:52:57 DC: last week we talked about ns8... afterwords, I remembered that if you take the whole URI and dereference (like a machine), what comes back does not have an id attribute that can be used to ground anchors 17:53:10 DC: in schema 17:54:38 DC: staightforward solution is to place anchor ids in the namespace document such that they are identifiable in the dereferenced resource 17:54:56 s/staightforward/straightforward/ 17:57:32 NM: has assumed that people would want to use RDDL as a form of indirection. Perhaps if RDDL had its own media type then it could define its own mechanism for indirect definition of anchors 17:58:00 ack 17:58:07 zakim, ack 17:58:07 I don't understand 'ack', Norm 17:58:11 ack norm 18:00:23 HT: with a namespace described by multiple schemas, one must acknowledge that there will be different names defined by different schemas, and therefore the namespace document needs to act as a union of names in a complex namespace [scribe interprtation] 18:00:56 [change that to schema documents, not schemas] 18:02:28 ACTION HT: track progress of #int in the XML Schema namespace document in the XML Schema WG 18:03:37 HT: in settling httpRange-14, we talked a great deal about regular URIs but not as much about URIs with fragment 18:05:04 NW: when we introduced "information resource", our definition distinguished between obvious things but left unclear whether a namespace falls under the category of "information resource" or not 18:05:12 s/NW/NM/ 18:06:06 DC: if it returns 200, then you have answered the question 18:06:55 DC: whether a namespace resource is an information resource or not is up to the namespace creator. 18:09:12 -DOrchard 18:09:13 -Norm 18:09:14 -noah 18:09:17 -DanC 18:09:19 -Vincent 18:10:36 The relevant Bugzilla entry for the Schema WG is 1974, so URL is http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=1974 18:10:41 NM: so, summary would be that it is okay for a namespace name to be an information resource provided that the URI is used consistently 18:12:01 -Roy 18:12:25 -Ht 18:12:26 TAG_Weekly()12:30PM has ended 18:12:27 Attendees were Norm, Ht, noah, DanC, Vincent, Ed, Roy, DOrchard 18:13:11 rrsagent, pointer? 18:13:11 See http://www.w3.org/2005/09/06-tagmem-irc#T18-13-11 18:13:30 RRSAgent, make logs world-access 18:13:46 ADJOURNED 18:20:32 DanC, you there? 18:20:46 who, me? no. surely not. ;-) 18:21:02 I'm struggling here, if there's a quick answer let me have it. . . 18:21:22 Trying to convert old RDFS http://www.w3.org/TR/xml-infoset-rdfs to OWL 18:21:32 No joy finding tools to do this 18:21:53 convert in what sense? in some sense, it already is OWL. meanwhile... 18:21:55 After much hacking finally got Portege to import the RDFS, but exporting it as OWL is very lossy. . . 18:22:41 my work on infoset-in-OWL is http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/infoset/ . it predates OWL, though; it uses what was called DAML+OIL at the time 18:22:46 Convert as in produce owl:Class where it used to have rdfs:class, and so on 18:23:37 I think there isn't a quick answer. 18:23:41 OK, thanks 18:23:58 it's reasonably straightforward to do with cwm and N3 rules. 18:24:13 or XSLT, for that matter 18:25:01 I never did write up 2000/10/swap/infoset , but I'm pretty happ with this UML-ish diagram: http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/infoset/infoset-diagram.png 18:26:01 I'll have a look -- I guess I think it would be good to update http://www.w3.org/TR/xml-infoset-rdfs at some point . . . 18:26:28 hey, that would be cool. 18:27:29 the main file in swap/infoset is http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/infoset/infoset-daml.n3 , which is a hand-transcription of the infoset spec into DAML (which is pretty close to OWL). 18:28:39 infoset-daml.n3 is the sort of thing that one should be able to model with protege (or swoop) straightforwardly, I think. 18:29:08 OK, thanks, I'll have a look. . . 18:29:14 Not today :-( 20:10:00 Zakim has left #tagmem 20:57:09 Norm has joined #tagmem