Jul 31 11:04:02 --> You are now talking on #xproc Jul 31 11:04:40 --> AndrewF (c66c3bcb@128.30.52.43) has joined #xproc Jul 31 11:04:43 Zakim, who's on the phone? Jul 31 11:04:45 Zakim, ??P27 is Vojtech Jul 31 11:04:45 On the phone I see Alex_Milows, Norm, ??P27, MoZ Jul 31 11:04:46 +Vojtech; got it Jul 31 11:04:56 Zakim, ??P27 is Vojtech2 Jul 31 11:04:56 I already had ??P27 as Vojtech, Norm Jul 31 11:05:05 Zakim, Vojtech is Vojtech2 Jul 31 11:05:06 +Vojtech2; got it Jul 31 11:05:14 Meeting: XML Processing Model WG Jul 31 11:05:14 Date: 31 July 2008 Jul 31 11:05:14 Agenda: http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2008/07/31-agenda Jul 31 11:05:14 Meeting: 120 Jul 31 11:05:14 Chair: Norm Jul 31 11:05:14 Scribe: Norm Jul 31 11:05:14 ScribeNick: Norm Jul 31 11:05:19 +??P58 Jul 31 11:05:27 zakim, ? is Andrew Jul 31 11:05:27 +Andrew; got it Jul 31 11:05:29 --- Norm has changed the topic to: XProc meets 31 July http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2008/07/31-agenda Jul 31 11:07:07 -Alex_Milows Jul 31 11:08:14 Zakim, who's on the phone? Jul 31 11:08:14 On the phone I see Norm, Vojtech2, MoZ, Andrew Jul 31 11:09:15 alexmilowski: are you joining Jul 31 11:09:50 alexmilowski, come back :-) Jul 31 11:10:01 Zakim, who's on the phone? Jul 31 11:10:02 On the phone I see Norm, Vojtech2, MoZ, Andrew Jul 31 11:10:03 please start... Jul 31 11:10:05 phone problems... Jul 31 11:10:39 Topic: Accept this agenda? Jul 31 11:10:39 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2008/07/31-agenda Jul 31 11:10:45 Present: Norm, Andrew, Mohamed, Vojtech Jul 31 11:10:46 Accepted Jul 31 11:10:52 Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting? Jul 31 11:10:52 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2008/07/17-minutes Jul 31 11:10:59 Accepted. Jul 31 11:11:18 Topic: Summer vacation plans Jul 31 11:11:18 +Alex_Milows Jul 31 11:11:22 Norm: Skip it, we'll take it to email Jul 31 11:11:27 Present: Norm, Andrew, Mohamed, Vojtech, Alex Jul 31 11:11:40 Topic: Next meeting 7 Aug 2008 Jul 31 11:11:50 Alex gives regrets Jul 31 11:12:27 Topic: Review of latest editor's draft Jul 31 11:13:05 Norm: Any comments on my draft of two weeks ago? Jul 31 11:15:43 Mohamed: I made some small comments that don't seem to be addressed. Jul 31 11:15:51 Norm: I thought I did them all, but I'll investigate. Jul 31 11:16:52 <-- Vojtech has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF)) Jul 31 11:16:55 Alex: I'm looking at p:file Jul 31 11:17:45 Alex: p:file is an awful name Jul 31 11:17:54 Norm: Yeah. Ok, what's better? Jul 31 11:18:01 Alex: I think p:resource is better Jul 31 11:18:05 Norm: Ok. Jul 31 11:18:17 Alex: If you point to a resource and it returns an XML media type. Jul 31 11:19:56 ...Does it get escaped? Jul 31 11:20:03 Norm: Yes, it does. But maybe that should be made more clear. Jul 31 11:20:28 Mohamed: How about p:unparsed-text? Jul 31 11:21:30 Alex: But binaries do get parsed Jul 31 11:21:35 Mohamed: How about p:data? Jul 31 11:23:39 Norm: Anyone who can't live with data? Jul 31 11:23:50 Norm: Ok, let's float that one for the next draft and see what happens. Jul 31 11:24:30 Mohamed: You didn't put the content-type attribute in the examples Jul 31 11:24:32 Norm: Oops. Jul 31 11:25:38 Alex: We also need to change the name of the wrapper. Jul 31 11:25:55 ...If we return a default, then it's content-type without a namespace. If it's in your namespace then we can put content-type in the c: namespace Jul 31 11:26:28 Norm: I'm happy with that. Jul 31 11:26:56 ACTION: Norm to change p:/c:file to p:/c:data and make the content-type attribute appear in the c: namespace if a non-c:* wrapper is used. Jul 31 11:27:29 Topic: p:import-schema Jul 31 11:27:38 Norm: Let's not. Jul 31 11:27:58 <-- Vojtech2 has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF)) Jul 31 11:29:26 Alex: Not in V1 works for me. Jul 31 11:29:31 Mohamed: Me too. Jul 31 11:29:35 Vojtech: I agree. Jul 31 11:30:04 Norm: I propose to take it out of the next draft. Jul 31 11:30:13 Alex: What are we losing? Jul 31 11:30:41 Norm: You won't be able to write XPath expressions in your pipeline that refer to schema datatypes other than the builtin/predefined ones. Jul 31 11:31:01 ...You won't be able to refer to "x:hatsize". Jul 31 11:31:15 Alex: I don't think it will hurt us to wait until V.next Jul 31 11:31:15 --> Vojtech2 (983e6da4@128.30.52.43) has joined #xproc Jul 31 11:32:39 ...If we do it now, we could paint ourselves into a corner. Jul 31 11:33:08 ACTION: Norm to remove p:schema-import. Jul 31 11:33:38 Topic: $p:index vs. position() Jul 31 11:35:57 Norm expresses his misgivings. Jul 31 11:36:15 Alex: Nope, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect implementors to be able to change the dynamic context. Jul 31 11:36:27 Norm: Ok, I'm content. Jul 31 11:36:54 Alex: But shouldn't they be consistent? Jul 31 11:37:11 Mohamed: I think for label-elements we used $p:index instead of position() because we didn't need last() at all. Jul 31 11:37:25 ...For split-sequence, we do need last sometimes. Jul 31 11:37:31 Norm: Right, so we'd need $p:last. Jul 31 11:38:13 Mohamed: I think the way it is is consistent. Jul 31 11:39:07 Norm: I don't hear any motivation to make this change. Jul 31 11:40:05 ACTION: Norm to clarify that position() and last() are expected to work in p:split-sequence Jul 31 11:40:35 Topic: p:param name="x:foo" namespace="http://..."/> Jul 31 11:41:35 Norm: I think the current situation is a bit odd, shouldn't we make it an error to specify both a prefix and a namespace? Jul 31 11:41:38 Alex: yes Jul 31 11:42:23 Mohamed: Can we give an exception if the namespace binding for the prefix is the same as the URI? Jul 31 11:42:56 Norm: I'm ok with that. Jul 31 11:44:33 Mohamed: I thought the point of using a prefix and a URI was to *request* that binding. Jul 31 11:46:40 Scribe struggles to keep track of the thread Jul 31 11:47:15 Vojtech: If you're reading parameters from a file, then you might use QNames, but if you're generating them then you can use the namespace attribute and use NCNames in names. Jul 31 11:48:06 Mohamed: The attribute namespace appears only on c:param. Jul 31 11:48:56 Norm: Right. So this is only about c:param. Jul 31 11:49:14 Mohamed: So I thought that this was for establishing that binding. Jul 31 11:51:23 Norm: I don't think the prefix is *ever* relevant on parameter names, they're only used by the implementation. Jul 31 11:52:16 Alex: The bug is the namespace consistency problem; the answer is just to say they have to match. Jul 31 11:54:39 Norm: We're running out of time, is anyone uncomfortable with adopting at least a temporary resolution that says they have to be consistent. Jul 31 11:54:41 Accepted. Jul 31 11:54:56 Mohamed: Could Vojtech provide an example where it's troubling to not use @namespace. Jul 31 11:55:21 Vojtech: If you want to generate a c:param in XProc, then you'd have to be able to create an xmlns: declaration. Jul 31 11:55:26 Mohamed: Could you send it in email? Jul 31 11:55:28 Vojtech: Sure. Jul 31 11:56:03 Topic: Any other business? Jul 31 11:56:07 Face to face? Jul 31 11:56:23 Norm: We're planning to meet at the technical plenary Jul 31 11:57:22 Norm: Who's going? Jul 31 11:57:30 Mohamed: I'm going. Jul 31 11:57:38 Alex: I'll try to. Jul 31 11:57:42 Norm: I'm going. Jul 31 11:58:57 Norm: With luck, we'll be able to go to Last Call next week. Jul 31 11:59:31 ACTION: Norm to send mail to the WG about the plenary (including dates of our meeting) Jul 31 11:59:42 -MoZ Jul 31 11:59:43 -Vojtech2 Jul 31 11:59:46 No other business heard Jul 31 11:59:46 -Andrew Jul 31 11:59:48 -Norm Jul 31 11:59:49 XML_PMWG()11:00AM has ended Jul 31 11:59:50 Attendees were Alex_Milows, Norm, MoZ, Vojtech2, Andrew